Should a white supremacist child-murderer be worthy of the death penalty?

[Jhhnn]

If it's a cakewalk and overall not considered a punishment for wrong-doing, then why do you call it "justice" ?

So, life w/o parole is a cakewalk?

Wow. I did not know that. Learn something every day, huh?

 

[DisarmedDespot]

Progressives are happy to punch a Nazi but when coming across actual murdering racists like Dylan Roof (shot up a black church) or Timothy McVeigh, then they get all misty eyed about how they deserve to live and how "that's a worse fate than death" for them.

Thankfully we fought WW2 when progressives were better men, else they'd have let Hitler just have Europe.

Ah, yes, the quintessential Libertarian position: the right of the state to decide who lives and dies is absolute. /s

No one's saying this guy doesn't deserve a bullet, they're arguing that any process set up to decide when the death penal;ty should be applied will be flawed and eventually cause an innocent person to get executed.

 

[Jhhnn]

Yeah but even the best mathematical models that look at how effective the death penalty is on addressing crime and which can identify even minor improvements in risk reduction suggest no noticeable effect across society. Criminals just don't factor it in.

Abortion policy on the other hand has probably had the largest impact on crime actually something that people on both the left and the right hate to admit.

Why bothsides? Unwanted children often don't get the nurturing they need to become conscientious citizens. It's good that women can direct their lives in another direction, if they want.

 

[K1052]

Yeah but even the best mathematical models that look at how effective the death penalty is on addressing crime and which can identify even minor improvements in risk reduction suggest no noticeable effect across society. Criminals just don't factor it in.

The only real deterrent factor seems to be the likelihood of apprehension. If people think they're going to be caught then it appears they are less likely to commit crime...which seems logical. The sentence imposed itself doesn't seem to have any effect.

 

[Paladin3]

This isn't about justice or revenge. It's about taking a piece of shit off the street and protecting society from any further harm.

If life in prison without possibility of parole accomplishes that goal then so be it, but I'm not opposed to a bullet to the head out behind the courthouse for someone who kills children and the like.

 

[Challenger]

AINT THAT THE TRUTH!

PS: Bernie Sanders and some of the kooks here think this guy should be able to vote. Democrats, the party of protecting convicted terrorists and child murderer's voting rights.

 

[Paladin3]

Ah, yes, the quintessential Libertarian position: the right of the state to decide who lives and dies is absolute. /s

No one's saying this guy doesn't deserve a bullet, they're arguing that any process set up to decide when the death penal;ty should be applied will be flawed and eventually cause an innocent person to get executed.

I can't think of any system that would guarantee we never execute an innocent. But I'm wondering if modern DNA testing is lowing that oft-quoted 4.1% wrongful execution rate. Many of the wrongful execution cases I'm reading about were tried prior to DNA testing becoming common.

But "reasonableness," compassion and good judgement will always be essential in our criminal justice system. We need reasonable judges to decide if our modern DNA and other evidence not only meets the beyond a reasonable doubt criteria, but if the evidence is so solid and the crime so heinous that the death penalty is warranted.

 

[Sheik Yerbouti]

The question is not, "Does this person deserve death?", it is rather , "Do we entrust the state with the power to take a person's life?" The answer to the latter question is, "no." In a world of perfect laws, perfect prosecutors, perfect evidence, and perfect juries, the answer is still, "no". We should not entrust the state with such power, period.

There's really no better answer than this.

 

[Bitek]

If it's a cakewalk and overall not considered a punishment for wrong-doing, then why do you call it "justice" ?

The number of times I've seen people arrested with a "don't give a fuck" attitude" tells you that the system doesn't work. Punishments are meant to deter behavior - FIN. It's not meant to be a response, it's strictly meant to be something that deters particular behaviors. If it doesn't deter the behavior, then it fails in achieving the goal. You must find something different that does deter the behavior.

I already found beers. If you lived local I would buy you one

And yes, I do hold myself to higher standards. If there is one thing I ensure of in life it's that I do not impede other people in life. Seems pretty simple, no?

Cheers on the beer.

I will say if these people already had functional judgement they wouldn't be criminals in the first place. For child rapists, imprisonment is essentially a death sentence due to the prison code.

If a lifetime of imprisonment in a PMITA federal penitentiary, with the highly likelyhood of having to live your days in solitary else suffer a shiv or fatal beating isn't enough of a disincentive, the additional added threat of maybe being executed by the feds after several decades isn't going to do shit.

Lock em away and their threat to society is over. They are simply a walking dead man running out the clock at that point. IDGAF about them.

If the feds lied or fked the case up, nobody spent extra millions executing an innocent person.
Done.

 

[umbrella39]

AINT THAT THE TRUTH!

The only truth is that you are a MEAT PUPPET.

Challengers pulls out Special Victims Unit card in 3.....2.....1.... see what he means Perk...

 

[Challenger]

The only truth is that you are a MEAT PUPPET.

Challengers pulls out Special Victims Unit card in 3.....2.....1.... see what he means Perk...

You don't have a clue what that means so shut the fuck up!

 

[TheVrolok]

Yeah but even the best mathematical models that look at how effective the death penalty is on addressing crime and which can identify even minor improvements in risk reduction suggest no noticeable effect across society. Criminals just don't factor it in.

Abortion policy on the other hand has probably had the largest impact on crime actually something that people on both the left and the right hate to admit.

Totally agreed, just pointing out extreme logic fail.

 

[JEDIYoda]

Fuck off, fascist.

WINNER!!!WINNER!!!! Chicken Dinner!!!!

 

[JEDIYoda]

double post

 

[BoomerD]

double post

Loser, looser...what a snoozer!

 

[brycejones]

You don't have a clue what that means so shut the fuck up!

LOL some snowflake got triggered

 

[umbrella39]

You don't have a clue what that means so shut the fuck up!

Whaaa Go cry to the mods some more MEAT PUPPET or go cry to someone who can come help bail you out here.

You are outgunned here son. Now run along and PLONK triggered snowflake victim...

 

[pmv]

I don't feel it's worth sacrificing a principle for one particular psychopath. Some people possibly do deserve to die, I'm not a Christian and so don't believe all life is sacred on general principle. To be honest, if I were somewhere where the death penalty existed I would find it hard to motivate myself to campaign for certain individuals to be spared, and there are plenty of people whose deaths I would not feel upset about,...but I'd still be against the death penalty in general.

I just believe that in practice having the death penalty, everything considered, does more harm than good. It's a pragmatic conclusion, not an absolute moral principle for me.

Though I do sometimes wonder if it works out differently in different societies. Some societies might be so screwed-up that the best they can do is cull the maniacs it regularly produces. But if I were in such a society I might be tempted to just leave.

 

[Challenger]

Whaaa Go cry to the mods some more MEAT PUPPET or go cry to someone who can come help bail you out here.

You are outgunned here son. Now run along and PLONK triggered snowflake victim...

You still don't have a clue what that means so shut the fuck up!

 

[Victorian Gray]

You still don't have a clue what that means so shut the fuck up!

Go back to your drawer.

 

[HomerJS]

https://kfor.com/2014/01/10/white-supremacist-convicted-murderer-wants-death-sentence-changed/

This guy murdered a family of 3 including an 8 year old girl in service to the goal of establishing a white ethno-state. William Barr thinks it is just that he die for this, and I'm inclined to agree. Is the man's guilt substantially in doubt?

Democrats like Ilhan Omar, Elizabeth Warren, and Bernie Sanders (among others) think otherwise.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1154516409512280071

https://twitter.com/x/status/1154436814146609154

If you (1) can't blame racism or some other prejudicial animosity nor (2) validly claim that he's not guilty, then on what basis should this man be permitted to keep his life after depriving an 8 year old girl and her parents of theirs?

I don't say that Omar and Warren are specifically defending this man, but rather that I don't understand a carte blanche ban on capital punishment. Some crimes are sufficiently heinous as to justly merit it.

Omar has a fundamental disagreement with the death penalty. IT doesn't matter the crime.

Tell you what, just put him in prison in the general populous. The other prisoners will take care of him

 

[Indus]

You still don't have a clue what that means so shut the fuck up!

Guess what Trump dick sucker.. no one forces you to be here. Fuck off to some Russian Trump dick sucking forum.

 

[senseamp]

What doresident pro-lifers have to say?

 

[Jaskalas]

Why do we get a pass on doing the forbidden? If it is wrong to murder then it is wrong to take any life.

A fallacy. The murderer is not innocent.

I understand the concept of innocence may be subjective, but we can make an objective standard in Law, so that a torturous or mass murderer is fit for execution.

 

[Paratus]

So just so I understand and to make my point absolutely clear - You are fine with capital punishment if it fits the crime (e.g. cereal rapist/murderer of underage children, etc..) - and that it has been clearly proven. Confessed. 100% No question. No argument from the murderer. Correct?

This kid has raped more cereal than anyone

While I can agree in principle that there are people who’ve committed crimes so heinous and who will remain remorseless about the crime that they deserve death I still can’t approve of the death penalty in the real world.


There is no way for the state to be 100% certain in all cases that defendant is guilty. It will always be cheaper to keep them locked up for life than pay for the trials and appeals, unless we restrict due process unacceptably.

So lock em up. They won’t harm anyone in society and the government stops accidentally executing innocent people.

Voting form prison is not the same as voting after one serves a sentence and pays their debt to society. Bernie wants them to vote from prison. Rapists' voices matter, ya know.

We know. It’s why you keep voting rapists into office.