I know! Its fun though.. I enjoy it.. because the macro seems to get more and more angry as time goes on.
I know! Its fun though.. I enjoy it.. because the macro seems to get more and more angry as time goes on.
I know! Its fun though.. I enjoy it.. because the macro seems to get more and more angry as time goes on.[/quote]
Laugh while you can. Are you too much of a pathetic, sniveling coward to reply to my more recent reply to you?
Hey... As long as you're not trying to tell us that some wrong you perceive justifies another, all you have to do is prove your claims, instead of spewing a bunch of smoke.
If you think Obama has violated your Constitutional rights, follow eskimospy's suggestion. Check out the Constitution, and come back to tell us which article or amendment you believe has been violated by whom.
Hell!! If can you make your point based on the facts, I'll stand with you against whoever's guilty.
You can search for my posts detailing names, dates, facts and statutes George W. Bush and his gang have violated. If it's important enough for you, I can bore the regulars with another posting of one or more of my "macros," stored text files formatted with links, fonts, etc.
Or you can take my word for it.
We're still waiting for you to prove Obama violated your Constitutional rights or any laws. You made the charges. I even said I would support you if you could prove any of them. Do it, or STFU. :thumbsdown: :|
The Secretary-General of the UN is part of the Secretariat, not a member of the Security Council whose decisions are actually binding. The argument against the war in Iraq is that UN Resolution 1441 did not automatically authorize force in event of its material breach. I suppose you could argue that it does authorize force, but I think that most people would agree (and the US and UK at the time of 1441) that it was not.
No, the Supreme Court has ruled that the President doesn't have such broad executive power to detain US citizens, etc. under the MCA and AUMF as authorized by Congress. They basically did not give the President deference.
Steeplerot
Lifer
- Mar 29, 2004
- 13,051
- 6
- 81
You ever think this is because he actually investigates and takes the time to refute you guys bullshit in depth to be brushed off by small-minded pricks who too busy goose-stepping to talk radio crap to use their heads when evidence is provided?
Nah, this would upset your little fundamentalist right-wing alter-universe you guys live in.
I am glad I am no moderator in this place, I would have banned most of the idiots in here for being so intellectually dishonest playing stupid on purpose thus logjamming any real debate, I do not see why he bothers with people so lost they cannot even use their own critical thinking skills. You all are so wrapped up in right-wing media sounding board bullshit talking points even when evidence is presented it has become like a new coming of Roman Catholicism. (not dissing Catholics)
Have a day.
Zebo
Elite Member
- Jul 29, 2001
- 39,398
- 19
- 81
Since you asked. http://rrojasdatabank.info/agf...o_kosovo/msg00096.html
The senate actually voted against his intrusion into the Balkans and he did it anyway in direct violation of const unlike when senate allowed Bush to invade Iraq. starving and bombing half a million Iraqis also could be construed as illegal.
As far as torture. I like most Americans don't care which is why it has no traction. I'm a member of the eye for and eye school. We should actually be feeding them to pigs to reciprocate the decapitations.
How do you know it's in direct violation of the Constitution? That's a pretty serious constitutional issue that the Court rarely ever touches and they didn't address it in this case.
Zebo
Elite Member
- Jul 29, 2001
- 39,398
- 19
- 81
Originally posted by: Harvey
You are one sick fuck.
Fair enough. Now that we got that out of the way where is your replusion for Clintons various international law and US constitutional law violations. Not pointing this to make Bush's excusable just saying we have had imperial unaccountable presidency for a long while.
Originally posted by: Zebo
Originally posted by: Harvey
You are one sick fuck.
Fair enough. Now that we got that out of the way where is your replusion for Clintons various international law and US constitutional law violations. Not pointing this to make Bush's excusable just saying we have had imperial unaccountable presidency for a long while.
Do you even know what international law consists of? Or do you know of these constitutional issues?
What specifically did Clinton violate and why do you feel that such actions violated international law and the Constitution?
We Succumbed To Our Need For Revenge...
The attacks that occurred on 9/11 drove us to believe that any action against our enemies was justified. To hell with the Geneva Convention and to hell with our democratic ideals. This is war, folks, and any means justifies the ends. The point is that a line was crossed. Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld and others suspended civil protections and laws in the belief that such action was justified.
Having said that, This brings us to the war Crimes accountability enigma..
Many here feel that those responsible for Bush administration war crimes should at least be investigated, and more preferably, prosecuted for their transgressions.
However, hard-core Bush supporters have been busy creating a ?Don?t Go There? recommendation for Obama to follow during the early portion of his administration. Stuart Taylor, a Brookings Institute fellow and Bush apologist, recently emphasized this "warning" in his December 9th Slate article:
?First, such investigations and prosecutions would tear apart the country and blow up Obama's hopes of lifting us out of our multiple crises.?
Taylor goes on to explain that people can't be held responsible for committing crimes if a lawyer told them it was legal and you can't hold lawyers responsible for telling them it was legal if they used a crackpot, untested legal theory to support it. So, heck - all any president needs is a creative lawyer like Yoo and it's get out of jail free.
Though I disagree with some of Taylor?s assumptions, but I do agree with him on these type of trails hurting the Obama Administration and the hopes of bringing the country together. I do think he has brought up an interesting concept in regard to the ?legality? of the torture, wiretapping, and detention issues that were presented to Congress by the Bush administration shortly after 9/11. One has to assume that the early push by the Cheney team to convince members of Congress, most notably the intelligence committee members, as well as key Senate and House leadership on both sides of the aisle had to include documented support of legality from the OLC. These people were emphatically told that these acts were legal.
Does that mean they were in fact legal? Common sense says no. But, Taylor argues that the grey area of legality is large enough that a court may find it hard to accept, and hence it?s not worth putting the public through such an ordeal.
I have to agree about puting the American public through trails such as Nuremburg (remember how look they took!) is not worth it.
A lot of heads would roll if we got caught up in this "war crimes" business. Trials such as these were fraught with complexity and moral nuance and all kinds of suspect qualities. It would demoralize the very people that we need right now at the helm of the ship of state, carefully guiding us through the treacherous waters of our uncertain and dangerous times.
Not now...
The attacks that occurred on 9/11 drove us to believe that any action against our enemies was justified. To hell with the Geneva Convention and to hell with our democratic ideals. This is war, folks, and any means justifies the ends. The point is that a line was crossed. Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld and others suspended civil protections and laws in the belief that such action was justified.
Having said that, This brings us to the war Crimes accountability enigma..
Many here feel that those responsible for Bush administration war crimes should at least be investigated, and more preferably, prosecuted for their transgressions.
However, hard-core Bush supporters have been busy creating a ?Don?t Go There? recommendation for Obama to follow during the early portion of his administration. Stuart Taylor, a Brookings Institute fellow and Bush apologist, recently emphasized this "warning" in his December 9th Slate article:
?First, such investigations and prosecutions would tear apart the country and blow up Obama's hopes of lifting us out of our multiple crises.?
Taylor goes on to explain that people can't be held responsible for committing crimes if a lawyer told them it was legal and you can't hold lawyers responsible for telling them it was legal if they used a crackpot, untested legal theory to support it. So, heck - all any president needs is a creative lawyer like Yoo and it's get out of jail free.
Though I disagree with some of Taylor?s assumptions, but I do agree with him on these type of trails hurting the Obama Administration and the hopes of bringing the country together. I do think he has brought up an interesting concept in regard to the ?legality? of the torture, wiretapping, and detention issues that were presented to Congress by the Bush administration shortly after 9/11. One has to assume that the early push by the Cheney team to convince members of Congress, most notably the intelligence committee members, as well as key Senate and House leadership on both sides of the aisle had to include documented support of legality from the OLC. These people were emphatically told that these acts were legal.
Does that mean they were in fact legal? Common sense says no. But, Taylor argues that the grey area of legality is large enough that a court may find it hard to accept, and hence it?s not worth putting the public through such an ordeal.
I have to agree about puting the American public through trails such as Nuremburg (remember how look they took!) is not worth it.
A lot of heads would roll if we got caught up in this "war crimes" business. Trials such as these were fraught with complexity and moral nuance and all kinds of suspect qualities. It would demoralize the very people that we need right now at the helm of the ship of state, carefully guiding us through the treacherous waters of our uncertain and dangerous times.
Not now...
Originally posted by: Zebo
Originally posted by: Harvey
You are one sick fuck.
Fair enough. Now that we got that out of the way where is your replusion for Clintons various international law and US constitutional law violations. Not pointing this to make Bush's excusable just saying we have had imperial unaccountable presidency for a long while.
The Senate Armed Services Committee Report documents Federal and international crimes committed by your Traitor In Chief and his gang. It specifies names, dates and actions that constitute the most horrific of crimes, crimes that bring to mind the most reviled names in human history, including Hitler, Stalin, Pol Pot and more. :|
The saddest part about thier crimes is that they committed these crimes in OUR name. In doing so, they dishonored and debased each of us, individually, and the crediblity of all of us as a once respected, once honored nation.
You said "most Americans" don't care whether they commited torture. You are wrong. "Most Americans" I know would agree that your belief about THEIR views are what makes you one sick fuck.
Then, you try to divert attention from the Bushwhackos' horrific, inhuman crimes against humanity by pointing to other alleged crimes by Clinton, and you try to weasel out of responsibility for doing so by saying Clinton's alleged crimes don't excuse those committed by your Traitor In Chief and his gang.
Stay with that thought for awhile because that IS the point. If you can prove charges against Clinton, pursue them. However, NO crime committed by anyone else excuses what the George W. Bush and his gang of thugs have done, and NO failure to pursue those who have committed other crimes and prosecute other criminals excuses what they have done.
Your entire statement has no place in this discussion, and the fact that you would even attempt to divert attention from the Bushwhackos' crimes is further evidence that you are one sick fuck.
I disagree with you about putting the American public through trials. If we cannot do so, we mock our entire system of justice. The most certain way to demoralize ourselves is to ignore the horrific crimes George W. Bush and his murderous gang have commited. If we cannot them responsible for the crimes they have committed, we betray the values defined by our Declaration of Independence and our Constitution and prove to ourselves and the world that our alleged "nation of laws" is a sham.
We cannot allow that to happen. George W. Bush, Dick Cheney, Donald Rumsfeld, Alberto Gonzales and every member of the Bush administration involved in committing torture MUST be held accountable.
RIGHT NOW!
"crimes that bring to mind the most reviled names in human history, including Hitler, Stalin, Pol Pot and more."
Congrats!!! You've reached Moonbeam land!!! Say Hi to him for us here on Earth, have a good time chatting.... :thumbsup:
Chuck
Congrats!!! You've reached Moonbeam land!!! Say Hi to him for us here on Earth, have a good time chatting.... :thumbsup:
Chuck
blackangst1
Lifer
- Feb 23, 2005
- 22,902
- 2,359
- 126
Congrats back at you!!! You've joined the heard of inhuman monsters and vile creatures with no conscience, no ethics, no morals and no humanity. :|
Please enjoy an extra large helping of FOAD! :thumbsdown:
Weird...the API between Moonbeamland where Macro is at, and Earth, must not support the Trifecta...is this true about the API, or, are you slipping?
We should be seeing 3 Emoticons, not 2....
Chuck
We should be seeing 3 Emoticons, not 2....
Chuck
Zebo
Elite Member
- Jul 29, 2001
- 39,398
- 19
- 81
Originally posted by: Harvey
Originally posted by: Zebo
Originally posted by: Harvey
You are one sick fuck.
Fair enough. Now that we got that out of the way where is your replusion for Clintons various international law and US constitutional law violations. Not pointing this to make Bush's excusable just saying we have had imperial unaccountable presidency for a long while.
The Senate Armed Services Committee Report documents Federal and international crimes committed by your Traitor In Chief and his gang. It specifies names, dates and actions that constitute the most horrific of crimes, crimes that bring to mind the most reviled names in human history, including Hitler, Stalin, Pol Pot and more. :|
The saddest part about thier crimes is that they committed these crimes in OUR name. In doing so, they dishonored and debased each of us, individually, and the crediblity of all of us as a once respected, once honored nation.
You said "most Americans" don't care whether they commited torture. You are wrong. "Most Americans" I know would agree that your belief about THEIR views are what makes you one sick fuck.
Then, you try to divert attention from the Bushwhackos' horrific, inhuman crimes against humanity by pointing to other alleged crimes by Clinton, and you try to weasel out of responsibility for doing so by saying Clinton's alleged crimes don't excuse those committed by your Traitor In Chief and his gang.
Stay with that thought for awhile because that IS the point. If you can prove charges against Clinton, pursue them. However, NO crime committed by anyone else excuses what the George W. Bush and his gang of thugs have done, and NO failure to pursue those who have committed other crimes and prosecute other criminals excuses what they have done.
Your entire statement has no place in this discussion, and the fact that you would even attempt to divert attention from the Bushwhackos' crimes is further evidence that you are one sick fuck.
I disagree with you about putting the American public through trials. If we cannot do so, we mock our entire system of justice. The most certain way to demoralize ourselves is to ignore the horrific crimes George W. Bush and his murderous gang have commited. If we cannot them responsible for the crimes they have committed, we betray the values defined by our Declaration of Independence and our Constitution and prove to ourselves and the world that our alleged "nation of laws" is a sham.
We cannot allow that to happen. George W. Bush, Dick Cheney, Donald Rumsfeld, Alberto Gonzales and every member of the Bush administration involved in committing torture MUST be held accountable.
RIGHT NOW!
I didn't know death penalty for terrorist was so controversial. If I'm a 'sick fuck' in your eyes so be it, I won't lose any sleep over it. Clinton's 'crimes' are documented in link I provided you just won't take the time to read them too busy frothing at the mouth w/ regards to Bush whom I've already said actions are inexcusable. But unimpeachable and unaccountable which is reason for highlting presidential history.
As far as the public does not care, hell, even Black Bush does not care! After Googling extensively it's impossible to find Black Bush?s reaction to the Rumsfeld Report. Might the lack of response to this report be for reasons related to the fact that Obama is not a transformative or challenging personality we were lead to believe? Might it be because he would do the same thing?
Zebo
Elite Member
- Jul 29, 2001
- 39,398
- 19
- 81
Cheney loudly admits authorizing detainees torture. Have to go to "raw story" to hear about it though since major pubs are basically ignoring it or relegating it to back page but Harvey thinks it's big, I mean HUGE, news.
http://rawstory.com/news/2008/...nees_torture_1215.html
http://rawstory.com/news/2008/...nees_torture_1215.html
Before you start handing out death sentences, you may want to start by convicting and sentencing them under the law. The only American court that would do either based on "confessions" obtained under torture is one of the sham kangaroo courts established by your Traitor In Chief and his cabal of traitors, torturers and war criminals, the same lying pieces of shit who committed torture to obtain those "confessions."
If you're so gung ho to kill them without a fair trial, I can only hope YOU are the next one to be falsely accused of being a terrorist, imprisoned, tortured for years and eventually, given the sentence you would wish on others who may or may not actually have committed any crime, whatsoever.
If you're so willing to commit torture and kill those whose only confession was obtained under such torture, you ARE as much a terrorist as your Traitor In Chief and his gang, and you should be treated as such. :thumbsdown: :|
Your gripe is with your perceived failure of the legal system to deal with Clinton. If you want to piss and moan about it, do so. If you can spur anyone in authority to act on your accusations and convict him, more power to you.
If you think any failure of the system to impose adequate sanctions against Clinton in any way rationalizes, let alone justifies, allowing or excusing the torture, murder and treason commited by your Traitor In Chief and his criminal gang, you dishonor the prinicples defined by our Constitution that have guided our nation for over 200 years and the value of every American life sacrificed in defending those principles.
YOU are an embarrassment to the United States of America and a disgrace to humanity.
See, I knew you were slipping earlier...the API between Earth and where you're at does support the Trifecta!!!
Slacker....
Chuck
Slacker....
Chuck
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