Russian sub in Gulf undetected for weeks

[The Boston Dangler]

yep, negativity is being used to leverage the incumbent president and future president for more funds. it could either be retaliation or padding future budgets. regardless, i'm confident in our ability and the low probability of goin' toe to toe with the ruskies.

 

[chusteczka]

I doubt we would publicize the fact that we could actually detect them, better to keep that information secret and surprise them when they think they are invisible. We know they aren't going to do anything other than swim around for a bit, so let them have their joy ride 'undetected'.

But it is American supremist propaganda to think they cannot slip past our defenses. The Russian submarines do slip past our defenses often enough for such concern to be real.

For my understanding behind this point of view, I do not need to depend up on information that is made publicly available.


Thinking more on Techs statement, with all our resources employed in that region, we should have known about the submarine. It may have slipped away undetected for 3 maybe 4 days at the most but certainly not weeks as the article mentioned. Therefore, I begin to think this article is purely FUD for political reasons to support the military budget.

 

[z1ggy]

Makes a lot of sense. They all play mind games with each other. One time they say they can't defend against something when they can. Another time they say they can defend against something when they can't. Disinformation is a cornerstone tactic.

So when they say they couldn't detect the sub, was it that they REALLY couldn't detect it, or they are just saying that because they actually can? Who knows.

We can definitely detect them, it's a matter of did we actually them, in this specific instance. My guess is no, because for every 1 time we don't hear them, there's plenty more times we do. I always wonder how this info gets leaked. The position of our submarines is highly classified and I can't imagine our ability/inability to detect other country's boats is any different.

Also I wanted to add the author of that article is a total dipshit. Any foreign country's boats near our borders with out our consent is not good. That sub has cruise missiles on board. It could definitely get close enough to the coat of LA or TX to blow up some big oil refineries and hurt our economy in a war time situation.

 

[benzylic]

Makes a lot of sense. They all play mind games with each other. One time they say they can't defend against something when they can. Another time they say they can defend against something when they can't. Disinformation is a cornerstone tactic.

So when they say they couldn't detect the sub, was it that they REALLY couldn't detect it, or they are just saying that because they actually can? Who knows.

I would go with this as well. The akula's have been around in some form or another almost 30 years, I guarantee we know how they work and what sounds they make. Let the general public and Russia think we are incompetent, and cant detect them. With regards to the spending cuts I think we allocate more money to the U.S. Navy alone than the Russians spend on their entire military. Pretty sure we could still kick their ass.

 

[darkxshade]

I have a confession to make myself... I was able to sneak into the oval office and left undetected. The white house has obvious security flaws.

 

[chusteczka]

I would go with this as well. The akula's have been around in some form or another almost 30 years, I guarantee we know how they work and what sounds they make. Let the general public and Russia think we are incompetent, and cant detect them. ...

Tigers have been around for thousands of years. We know how they hunt, their shape, and the sounds they make. Are you going to see it if one is standing in the tall grass 100 feet from you?

There is a big difference between knowing about them and being able to detect them.

 

[moonbogg]

Interesting but its a non issue. This relates to nuclear attack subs and russia's ability to track and destroy them. This is a non issue because deterence works and we have plenty of it.

 

[DrPizza]

Tigers have been around for thousands of years. We know how they hunt, their shape, and the sounds they make. Are you going to see it if one is standing in the tall grass 100 feet from you?

There is a big difference between knowing about them and being able to detect them.

If that tiger was important enough to detect (like a sub would be), you can bet your ass that we'd be using infrared detectors for that tiger, rather than visual eyes. The tiger would stand out like a sore thumb. In fact, you'd be able to see the stripes in infrared. Do you think that our submarine detection system consists of former Olympic swimmers hanging out in the middle of the Gulf, reporting "nope, I didn't see a submarine go past me."


----

On another note, is it possible that we really did know they were there and aren't admitting it, and they knew that we knew and they aren't admitting it, but perhaps some other country (China) might be interested in purchasing some of their submarine technology? For them, win - China will pay big bucks and help their economy. For us, win - China purchases "obsolete" equipment that we already have counter-measures for.

 

[momeNt]

What large defense contractor wrote this clearly fake article?

Guess we have to wait to find out who gets the contract for the attack sub attacker?

 

[Angry Irishman]

Shit guys. We better throw another few hundred billion at the military now. $500B/yr is clearly not enough. This aggression will not stand.

No, no, we should just ignore the fact that a nuclear boomer is patrolling right off our shores and go watch dancing with the stars. I'm sure everyone in the world is living in harmony and there's really nothing to worry about.

I don't think the average American has any idea or even cares (even worse) how compromised their military is now in terms of under-manning and old equipment.

 

[preslove]

“The Akula was built for one reason and one reason only: To kill U.S. Navy ballistic missile submarines and their crews,”

Yeah, and our attack boats are also built for one reason only: To kill Russian ballistic missile submarines and their crews. And the Captain Obvious award goes to...

Also, is there even a ballistic missile sub in the Gulf? The one in Florida is up north of Jacksonville, not in the gulf. That's a very long way away. This news story smells like there's an admiral or two who's going to have to retire because of budget cuts & they're feeding the press alarmist bs.

 

[chusteczka]

If that tiger was important enough to detect (like a sub would be), you can bet your ass that we'd be using infrared detectors for that tiger, rather than visual eyes. The tiger would stand out like a sore thumb. In fact, you'd be able to see the stripes in infrared. Do you think that our submarine detection system consists of former Olympic swimmers hanging out in the middle of the Gulf, reporting "nope, I didn't see a submarine go past me." ...

I know exactly what our submarine detection systems are capable of. While it is comforting and simplistic to believe that our American military and industrial complex is supreme, the truth remains that Akula class submarines are able to slip away undetected for periods of time.

 

[chusteczka]

Also, is there even a ballistic missile sub in the Gulf? The one in Florida is up north of Jacksonville, not in the gulf. That's a very long way away. This news story smells like there's an admiral or two who's going to have to retire because of budget cuts & they're feeding the press alarmist bs.

No, there is no need for an American submarine to be in the Gulf of Mexico, ballistic or attack. The Gulf is like a bathtub in undersea warfare consideration. The Gulf has depth and room to maneuver but not enough to evade for a significant period of time. A ballistic submarine placed in there for protective purposes would be at a disadvantage. The open ocean provides far better protection than geographic barriers.

Edit:
The Gulf is patrolled by the Coast Guard, ASW aircraft (Anti-Submarine Warfare), and civilian trawlers with towed sonar arrays miles in length. In addition to the permanently placed listening devices.

 

[K1052]

No, no, we should just ignore the fact that a nuclear boomer is patrolling right off our shores and go watch dancing with the stars. I'm sure everyone in the world is living in harmony and there's really nothing to worry about.

I don't think the average American has any idea or even cares (even worse) how compromised their military is now in terms of under-manning and old equipment.

The Akula is an attack sub not a boomer.

The US spends an an enormous amount on the military. Far more than anyone else in total and per capita terms.

 

[Angry Irishman]

The Akula is an attack sub not a boomer.

The US spends an an enormous amount on the military. Far more than anyone else in total and per capita terms.

OK....what's your point?

 

[K1052]

OK....what's your point?

That the military is not undermanned nor under equipped.

 

[yllus]

On another note, is it possible that we really did know they were there and aren't admitting it, and they knew that we knew and they aren't admitting it, but perhaps some other country (China) might be interested in purchasing some of their submarine technology? For them, win - China will pay big bucks and help their economy. For us, win - China purchases "obsolete" equipment that we already have counter-measures for.

If I recall correctly China has done exactly that; they've purchased a number of subs from Russia that were otherwise going to be junked, done very minor retrofits on them and then sent them back out under a Chinese flag.

Akula subs are at this point 20 years old; they're good but not leading edge (not sure what is, really). They can occasionally slip away today but in a wartime situation everything changes - Fortress North America will be in full effect. Besides, does it really matter if they slip away if all out war occurs? Nobody can stop subs from launching ICBMs and that's the real ace in the hole to get played here.

I think this is an early warning shot from the U.S. military to its political masters that any mention of cuts will generate this sort of story. America is spending itself into the ground in a number of questionable ways and each of those ways is going to throw up flak like this to avoid the axe. Let's see how savvy its citizens are at figuring that out.

 

[FM2n]

Don't worry, its just Sean Connery trying to defect. Give it a few more days and you'll see another Russian sub trying to find them..

 

[JeffreyLebowski]

We can definitely detect them, it's a matter of did we actually them, in this specific instance. My guess is no, because for every 1 time we don't hear them, there's plenty more times we do. I always wonder how this info gets leaked. The position of our submarines is highly classified and I can't imagine our ability/inability to detect other country's boats is any different.

Also I wanted to add the author of that article is a total dipshit. Any foreign country's boats near our borders with out our consent is not good. That sub has cruise missiles on board. It could definitely get close enough to the coat of LA or TX to blow up some big oil refineries and hurt our economy in a war time situation.

It gets leaked because the Administration wants it to be leaked.

Tigers have been around for thousands of years. We know how they hunt, their shape, and the sounds they make. Are you going to see it if one is standing in the tall grass 100 feet from you?

There is a big difference between knowing about them and being able to detect them.

Exactly, If we had the militaries budget, not only would we have equipment to detect the tiger, we'd also be detecting how many fleas it has.

Don't worry, its just Sean Connery trying to defect. Give it a few more days and you'll see another Russian sub trying to find them..

Or another deep water oil platform blown up

 

[BUTCH1]

Only one thing to do now, SEND IN THE STINGRAY......http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u_Mx1kA3irk&feature=related

 

[Skel]

I doubt we would publicize the fact that we could actually detect them, better to keep that information secret and surprise them when they think they are invisible. We know they aren't going to do anything other than swim around for a bit, so let them have their joy ride 'undetected'.

All I thought when I saw that was "Undetected by whom?" I'd like to think the people I count on to keep my shores safe aren't publicly detailing what they do or do not see.

 

[z1ggy]

What large defense contractor wrote this clearly fake article?

Guess we have to wait to find out who gets the contract for the attack sub attacker?

The contract for the Virginia class submarine is already in place broham. We already have built a bunch and bunch more are planned, too.

There are already contracts out for a new boomer class of boats, too, that will start to be built around 2020.

 

[FeuerFrei]

Undetected by .... the media? Unbelievable. :Þ

I believe an intrusion by a military vessel on domestic waters constitutes an act of aggression. The Russkys know better.

 

[dr150]

Our Navy has a secret weapon....and it ain't dolphins! :thumbsup:

 

[moonbogg]

Russia's military is old, stale and low in numbers of good equipment. We need attack dolphins.

EDIT: DR150, did you REALLY beat me to a dolphin comment?