Russian jet carrying KHL team crashes, 43 dead

[Locut0s]

Sweet, new episode of Air Crash Investigation (Mayday to you Yanks).

I love that show. Real life CSI done very well. Love how they slowly trace the mystery of what brought down flight XXX killing all aboard down to... a bomb?... nope, 2 faulty screws installed 10 maintenance cycles ago. There's even a fair amount of tension despite knowing exactly how things turned out, they cover the human element well too.

Umm, might want to rework that though if you don't want to be banned again.

 

[davmat787]

Thank you. I'd bet a substantial amount of money that the cause is maintenance. We'll have to wait for something official.

A maintenance issue that exposed a design flaw or faulty component, combined with a lack of training in how to handle that type of emergency, poor airman ship, etc. Often aviation disasters are the result of a series of problems.

 

[dennilfloss]

From http://deadspin.com/5838024/ :

almost the entire Lokomotiv Yaroslavl team took off in perfect weather this morning, had trouble gaining altitude, clipped a radar tower and crashed 1.5 miles from the airport. It's the exact same plane that had been banned two years ago by aviation authorities from flying to Europe because it did not meet any of the international standards for safety.

The Yakovlev Yak-42 was developed in the late 70s, the first Soviet aircraft to use modern turbofan engines. This specific jet, tail number RA-42433, first flew in 1993 and saw heavy service as a commercial airliner.

In 2009, the European Commission published a report on foreign carriers that did not meet standards. Included was RA-42433, previously operated by Tatarstan airlines.

On the basis of verified evidence of major safety deficiencies affecting flight operations detected on the part of the air carrier YAK Service certified by the competent authorities of the Russian Federation, the Commission launched a formal investigation of that air carrier on 15 July 2009...These aircraft were not equipped to perform international flights as per ICAO standards (not equipped with TAWS/E-GPWS) and their certificate of airworthiness had expired and had not been renewed.

The Russian Federation initially promised they would bring the aircraft up to date, but later decided against it. All planes owned by charter company YAK Service have been prohibited from flying to countries within the European community, which does not include Belarus, today's destination.

Preliminary legislation is currently making its way through labyrinthine Russian law that would bring the country's aviation standards up to the rest of the world's, in a "gradual reform." Currently Russia and the former Soviet States have the world's worst air safety record, with 13 times more incidents than the international average.

BTW, Galimov passed away.

 

[DaTT]

Sweet, new episode of Air Crash Investigation (Mayday to you Yanks).

Just so you know, it is a Canadian show. Most of the filming is done in my area. I love Mayday. I have my DVR set to record all episodes. So far there have been 2 new ones since August.

 

[DaTT]

From http://deadspin.com/5838024/ :



BTW, Galimov passed away.

RIP. Burns over 80% of his body at most likely 3rd degree....he may be better off.

 

[Rifter]

I love Mayday. I have my DVR set to record all episodes. So far there have been 2 new ones since August.

me to, love that show.

 

[Albatross]

Russian civil aviation is horridly under managed and regulated. Russian/Soviet aircraft ruggedness is extremely overrated. Many Russian jets have the provision to land on unprepared airstrips in extreme cold but that really isn't anything special.

Lawl,lecturing an Eastern European about shitty Russian tech..

 

[H54]

A maintenance issue that exposed a design flaw or faulty component, combined with a lack of training in how to handle that type of emergency, poor airman ship, etc. Often aviation disasters are the result of a series of problems.

That is true and I'm aware. A maintenance issue does not necessarily mean it is exposing a design flaw. Negligence, manufacturing issues, etc all fall under the umbrella of mx issue. In the realm of a lot of things aerospace, the Russians are no slouch. They have historically suffered from inferior quality control during manufacturing and lagged in the area of metallurgy and thus have been behind the cutting edge in engine tech.

 

[Blitzvogel]

Lawl,lecturing an Eastern European about shitty Russian tech..

Can't be too careful, considering Russian military aircraft have a way of smacking themselves into the ground due to pilot error. There are too many eggheads out there who actually think Russian aviation is flawless or miles ahead of everyone else.

 

[feralkid]

The Yak-42 is quite new, most build in the 1980s, the likely cause of the crash is a typical problem of a no-name Russian airline: overloading, shitty fuel, and no proper maintenance. Russia has hundreds of small airline companies with a handful of planes who don't give a damn about their reputation. This is why sometimes oligopolies are better.

Dude......

Built in the 1980's is not "quite new".

Particularly for aircraft.

 

[Wreckem]

Dude......

Built in the 1980's is not "quite new".

Particularly for aircraft.

He meant late 80s and early 90s. The specific plane that crashed entered service in 1993.

There are older planes flying around the US.

 

[gevorg]

He meant late 80s and early 90s. The specific plane that crashed entered service in 1993.

There are older planes flying around the US.

Exactly!

If you look at airline accident history across the world, the Soviet planes were one of the safest in their time. After the collapse of the USSR, a lot more accidents started to happen in Russia/CIS. In US/Europe on the other hand, there are less accidents in the last 10-20 years thanks to better technology/upgrades/support. Modern aircraft issues in Russia are mostly caused by human factors/negligence rather than original aircraft designers/engineers. A 20 year old plane can be very safe with proper support and maintenance.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_notable_accidents_and_incidents_on_commercial_aircraft

 

[classy]

Terrible off season for Hockey

Very rough off season. Barry Melrose hit it on the head the other night when he said the start of the season can't come fast enough.

 

[H54]

Dude......

Built in the 1980's is not "quite new".

Particularly for aircraft.

I think you'd better do some research. If people's cars were on the same maintenance schedules as aircraft, they would last forever. Plus, aircraft are prohibitively expensive which is why operators hang on to them as long as it makes sense.

Granted, these are list prices but check this out

http://www.boeing.com/commercial/prices/

 

[Blitzvogel]

I think you'd better do some research. If people's cars were on the same maintenance schedules as aircraft, they would last forever. Plus, aircraft are prohibitively expensive which is why operators hang on to them as long as it makes sense.

Granted, these are list prices but check this out

http://www.boeing.com/commercial/prices/

Wow, despite being a newly available plane, I'd expect the 787 prices to be closer to the 767 (as they are similar in capacity), but I guess with the better technology, more efficient engines, etc, it's worth the price.

As per maintenance goes, yes at least in the western world, airliners are "over-cared for" (and don't even get military habits involved), but when you're carrying people and image is everything, it's important to keep your customers confident in your service.

 

[H54]

Wow, despite being a newly available plane, I'd expect the 787 prices to be closer to the 767 (as they are similar in capacity), but I guess with the better technology, more efficient engines, etc, it's worth the price.

I'm sure that number will come down over time. Boeing had to do a massive amount of R&D to put the amount of new technology as they did in the 787. This aircraft really is a major paradigm shift in many, many ways.

 

[lupi]

http://sports.yahoo.com/nhl/blog/pu...k-8217-s-hockey-funeral-for-L?urn=nhl-wp12157

 

[Ns1]

One of the pilots appears to have inadvertently pressed on a brake pedal while pulling on the control yoke during takeoff, said Alexey Morozov, chairman of Russia's Interstate Aviation Committee’s technical commission.

Because of the braking, the Yak-42 plane didn’t have enough speed at takeoff, Morozov said, according to RIA-Novosti.

The aircraft, not having gained enough altitude fast enough, collided with the antenna of an airport beacon, fell to the ground and broke into several pieces and caught fire, the nation’s aviation ministry told CNN in September.

The plane was in good order, and “no failures in the operation of the airplane and the engines were found,” Morozov said, according to the state-run Itar-Tass news agency.

The IAC, which investigates aviation accidents in nations from the former Soviet Union, determined that a lack of pilot training was one of the factors that contributed to the wreck, RIA-Novosti reported.

http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2011/11/0...hat-killed-hockey-team-russian-officials-say/

 

[rasczak]

http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2011/11/0...hat-killed-hockey-team-russian-officials-say/

pretty convenient if you ask me. No one around for a rebuttal.

 

[rudder]

One of the pilots appears to have inadvertently pressed on a brake pedal while pulling on the control yoke during takeoff, said Alexey Morozov, chairman of Russia's Interstate Aviation Committee’s technical commission.

Because of the braking, the Yak-42 plane didn’t have enough speed at takeoff, Morozov said, according to RIA-Novosti.

What the hell man... not sure about russian planes, but on Boeing at least the brakes are at the top of the rudder pedals and you have to take your feet off the floor to press them... and if your speed is not at rotation speed by a given spot on the runway you abort. My guess is vodka was involved.

 

[H54]

pretty convenient if you ask me. No one around for a rebuttal.

Thats how accident investigations are done in the states as well. Instead of addressing the real issue, blame the pilots because they are dead. C'est la vie...

 

[JTsyo]

there is actually a movie based on this exact thing happening. was some college football team i believe.

sad story about the hockey team though.

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