RTG3rd March – Will Discuss Polaris, Fury X2, VR, DirectX 12 and More

[Maxima1]

Unlike with impoverished criminal defendants, there's no such thing as free legal aid for indigent corporations launching baseless lawsuits..

Corporations are people, my friend.

 

[Madpacket]

Caveat emptor.

Part of me hopes AMD dies so all the short-sighted Intel and Nvidia lovers around here finally get what they deserve. And then the market will quickly stagnate and I'll move on to a different and more interesting hobby.

 

[desprado]

Caveat emptor.

Part of me hopes AMD dies so all the short-sighted Intel and Nvidia lovers around here finally get what they deserve. And then the market will quickly stagnate and I'll move on to a different and more interesting hobby.

Nothing will happen. AMD has no contribution in CPU market and soon AMD will not contribution in GPU market as well if they do not deliver with Zen and Polaris.

 

[Pariah]

Caveat emptor.

Part of me hopes AMD dies so all the short-sighted Intel and Nvidia lovers around here finally get what they deserve. And then the market will quickly stagnate and I'll move on to a different and more interesting hobby.

Intel released the Core 2 Duo back in August of 2006. In a few months it will have been 10 years since AMD had a competitive high end part. 10 years. Intel is still chugging along even with zero competition from AMD. The theory that the market will stagnate with only one major player is ridiculous. If Intel and Nvidia don't continue to churn out new products at regular intervals, then there will be nothing to upgrade to, and they won't make any money. That will not make the stockholders happy. When was the last time Microsoft had any competition in the desktop OS market or office suite market? Yet the continue to put out updated versions every few years so that they can continue to make money. Companies have to continue to give customers a reason to spend money on their products. That eliminates the option of sitting around doing nothing.

 

[jackstar7]

So you're happy with the steps Intel has made in each gen?

 

[Pinstripe]

What makes everyone think Zen will in any way blow Intel's offerings out of the water? Because if Zen is "simply" as good as Skylake, nobody's gonna be interested in it.

 

[Arachnotronic]

What makes everyone think Zen will in any way blow Intel's offerings out of the water? Because if Zen is "simply" as good as Skylake, nobody's gonna be interested in it.

Not necessarily. If it's "as good" but cheaper, I think people would welcome it. AMD achieving a CPU "as good" as Skylake would be an incredible achievement and one that would probably earn them my money.

 

[Pinstripe]

People prefer to stick with the familiar and proven.

A 10 year abstinence of any real AMD competitor in the CPU market isn't something you can easily reverse. But at the very least APU's and future console chips using Zen should find a home.

 

[Leadbox]

What makes everyone think Zen will in any way blow Intel's offerings out of the water? Because if Zen is "simply" as good as Skylake, nobody's gonna be interested in it.

This is one of those situations were one should really speak only for oneself. Not everyone is out to get the fastest everything, that's why we're not all rocking 980TI cards. Skylake like performance at the right price will do me.

 

[monstercameron]

Intel released the Core 2 Duo back in August of 2006. In a few months it will have been 10 years since AMD had a competitive high end part. 10 years. Intel is still chugging along even with zero competition from AMD. The theory that the market will stagnate with only one major player is ridiculous. If Intel and Nvidia don't continue to churn out new products at regular intervals, then there will be nothing to upgrade to, and they won't make any money. That will not make the stockholders happy. When was the last time Microsoft had any competition in the desktop OS market or office suite market? Yet the continue to put out updated versions every few years so that they can continue to make money. Companies have to continue to give customers a reason to spend money on their products. That eliminates the option of sitting around doing nothing.

Planned obsolescence.

 

[Arachnotronic]

Intel released the Core 2 Duo back in August of 2006. In a few months it will have been 10 years since AMD had a competitive high end part. 10 years. Intel is still chugging along even with zero competition from AMD. The theory that the market will stagnate with only one major player is ridiculous. If Intel and Nvidia don't continue to churn out new products at regular intervals, then there will be nothing to upgrade to, and they won't make any money. That will not make the stockholders happy. When was the last time Microsoft had any competition in the desktop OS market or office suite market? Yet the continue to put out updated versions every few years so that they can continue to make money. Companies have to continue to give customers a reason to spend money on their products. That eliminates the option of sitting around doing nothing.

This dude right here, excellent understanding of business.

 

[thesmokingman]

Intel released the Core 2 Duo back in August of 2006. In a few months it will have been 10 years since AMD had a competitive high end part. 10 years. Intel is still chugging along even with zero competition from AMD. The theory that the market will stagnate with only one major player is ridiculous. If Intel and Nvidia don't continue to churn out new products at regular intervals, then there will be nothing to upgrade to, and they won't make any money. That will not make the stockholders happy. When was the last time Microsoft had any competition in the desktop OS market or office suite market? Yet the continue to put out updated versions every few years so that they can continue to make money. Companies have to continue to give customers a reason to spend money on their products. That eliminates the option of sitting around doing nothing.

You're ignoring the fact that the evolution will not be driven by competition and customer satisfaction but the sole providers profit and margins. That's a big problem for consumers. Just look at Windows 10. On the surface it looks great, but underneath consumers have had to sign their digital lives away. And there's no competitor in sight to give an opposing option. It's not so rosy eh? Also with Intel. All they do now is make little blips in improvement and charge full price each and every generation. That's not great either and again w/o in that case a strong AMD, it will continue on like that.

 

[Arachnotronic]

You're ignoring the fact that the evolution will not be driven by competition and customer satisfaction but the sole providers profit and margins. That's a big problem for consumers. Just look at Windows 10. On the surface it looks great, but underneath consumers have had to sign their digital lives away. And there's no competitor in sight to give an opposing option. It's not so rosy eh? Also with Intel. All they do now is make little blips in improvement and charge full price each and every generation. That's not great either and again w/o in that case a strong AMD, it will continue on like that.

Um, in that case, expect mobile phones to soon obviously outrun PCs in terms of performance/features and not look back.

If you think AMD is Intel's main "competition" then I don't think you've been paying attention to the massive changes that have gone on in the computing world.

 

[thesmokingman]

Um, in that case, expect mobile phones to soon obviously outrun PCs in terms of performance/features and not look back.

If you think AMD is Intel's main "competition" then I don't think you've been paying attention to the massive changes that have gone on in the computing world.

Is that what I wrote? Why don't you re-read what I wrote and come back? I'm pretty sure I wrote w/o a strong AMD, as AMD is not strong, nor or they much of a competitor to Intel which is why Intel has been free to whatever they want.

But oh, you just want to make it sound like I'm out of touch? :thumbsdown:

 

[xthetenth]

Planned obsolescence.

Is a possible solution but not one that has been taken, as all the happy 2500k owners know.

Also seriously I've got to laugh at the overblown as all hell FUD about W10, and would like to know the search engine and browser choice of the people making those claims.

 

[Bacon1]

Is a possible solution but not one that has been taken, as all the happy 2500k owners know.

Also seriously I've got to laugh at the overblown as all hell FUD about W10, and would like to know the search engine and browser choice of the people making those claims.

Yeah, for anyone who says Intel has been improving a lot over the years just have to look at 2500k vs recent. There is a tiny improvement overall.

We need competition to get lower prices and better improvements year after year.

 

[Pariah]

So you're happy with the steps Intel has made in each gen?

Compared to AMD? Yes.

My last CPU upgrade was the first time I upgraded "just because," not because I really needed to. I had a 2600k for about 3 years, and I upgraded to Haswell-E more for the updated platform than more CPU power. Today's home PC software hasn't needed a faster (Intel) CPU in years. More than faster CPU's, we need software that actually needs what we have today.

 

[Pariah]

Yeah, for anyone who says Intel has been improving a lot over the years just have to look at 2500k vs recent. There is a tiny improvement overall.

We need competition to get lower prices and better improvements year after year.

Comparing a 2500k to a 5960x and it does not look good for Sandy Bridge especially when you consider the 2500k has a 10% (300Mhz) clock advantage.

http://anandtech.com/bench/product/288?vs=1317

Again, it's not Intel's fault that typical software makes it difficult to perceive the speed difference when web browsing or writing a paper.

 

[Bacon1]

Comparing a 2500k to a 5960x and it does not look good for Sandy Bridge especially when you consider the 2500k has a 10% (300Mhz) clock advantage.

http://anandtech.com/bench/product/288?vs=1317

Again, it's not Intel's fault that typical software makes it difficult to perceive the speed difference when web browsing or writing a paper.

You just compared it a stock clocked 2500k vs a $1000 5960k?

At least compare it against a new I5:

http://anandtech.com/bench/product/288?vs=1544

And in games there is very little difference between them, especially when you OC the 2500k. There is a reason they are so popular, most people only upgrade because they want better USB 3.x support or other things unrelated to the chip performance itself.

 

[thesmokingman]

Comparing a 2500k to a 5960x and it does not look good for Sandy Bridge especially when you consider the 2500k has a 10% (300Mhz) clock advantage.

http://anandtech.com/bench/product/288?vs=1317

Again, it's not Intel's fault that typical software makes it difficult to perceive the speed difference when web browsing or writing a paper.

:thumbsdown:

That's kind of a rigged and not apples to apples comparo.

Here one generation skipped to the next.

http://anandtech.com/bench/product/443?vs=1317

 

[Pariah]

You just compared it a stock clocked 2500k vs a $1000 5960k?

At least compare it against a new I5:

http://anandtech.com/bench/product/288?vs=1544

And in games there is very little difference between them, especially when you OC the 2500k. There is a reason they are so popular, most people only upgrade because they want better USB 3.x support or other things unrelated to the chip performance itself.

They're both stock clocked. Overclocking both will not help the 2500k. If you would like to choose a lower end Haswell-E CPU (cheaper) to compare, it will actually get worse for the 2500k in some tests as the lower core chips have a higher stock clock. You made the blanket claim that there has been little improvement from Intel over the years. There has been plenty of improvement. You did not state a disclaimer that improvement you can't afford doesn't count.

 

[Pariah]

:thumbsdown:

That's kind of a rigged and not apples to apples comparo.

Here one generation skipped to the next.

http://anandtech.com/bench/product/443?vs=1317

It's not rigged, there were no conditions stated in the original post I was responding to. If you compare products that people might actually upgrade to, there is still plenty of improvement to be seen (2600k Sandy Bridge -> 6700k Skylake):

http://anandtech.com/bench/product/287?vs=1543

 

[thesmokingman]

It's not rigged, there were no conditions stated in the original post I was responding to. If you compare products that people might actually upgrade to, there is still plenty of improvement to be seen (2600k Sandy Bridge -> 6700k Skylake):

http://anandtech.com/bench/product/287?vs=1543

It wasn't apples to apples so it makes you look bad.

 

[xthetenth]

Intel from a few years ago is a serious competitor, and I see no reason why if AMD offers that level of performance and a modern platform for a cheaper price they won't be able to make inroads.

 

[poofyhairguy]

You made the blanket claim that there has been little improvement from Intel over the years. There has been plenty of improvement. You did not state a disclaimer that improvement you can't afford doesn't count.

I think most people expect improvements at the same price point when they say a company's technology offerings improved over the years.