Romney stayed longer at Bain

[fskimospy]

Maybe some but the majoity of companies like Bain will charged based on what they feel their services are worth. I think you missed the door for Economics 101.

Nope, sure didn't. I like how you backtrack from your statement and then still try to talk shit though.

 

[Matt1970]

It's all BS, and obviously so. Obama's people are going to have a field day with it.

Just like McCain people thought Bill Ayers was going to be the end of Obama and the draft dodging was going to be the end of Clinton. Bottom line people don't give a crap. Smart money would not bet on the outcome of the election at this point.

 

[Matt1970]

Nope, sure didn't. I like how you backtrack from your statement and then still try to talk shit though.

Nope, still stand behind what I said.

 

[Charles Kozierok]

Just like McCain people thought Bill Ayers was going to be the end of Obama and the draft dodging was going to be the end of Clinton. Bottom line people don't give a crap. Smart money would not bet on the outcome of the election at this point.

The smart money understands the difference between an attack line that is personal and tangential (Bill Ayers) and an attack line that goes to the heart of a candidate's claim to the presidency (Bain).

You either don't get that difference, or you just desperately don't want to accept it. Either way, it is there.

Is this a smoking gun that will end Romney's campaign? No. But it is another straw on the camel's back, and it is quite obvious that it has Romney on his heels.

Another important difference is that Clinton and Obama are both charismatic and generally liked, and Romney is an asshole. Things stick more when people don't like you.

They also stick more when they play into an existing narrative.. and an existing weakness.. such as Romney being an out-of-touch "capitalist" (yeah right) who plays by his own rules and only wants money and power. Good luck explaining to the American voter how you got a $100,000,000 retirement account, Mitt.

 

[Lemon law]

Romney is demanding an apology from Obama for making the Romney record at Bain into a campaign issue.

I would advise Mitt to not hold his breath, because he is unlikely to ever get that Obama apology. And every time Romney again demands an Obama apology the democrats release a new Bain capital attack add.

Poor ole Mittens, just six mouths ago, all Romney opponents in the GOP primaries were bitching that Mitt Romney was positively burying them in attack ads. But now when he gets a taste of his own medicine, Mittens claims unfair.

Meanwhile GOP strategists are telling Mitt, the only way to end the Bain finance noose from around his neck, is with complete disclosure of his tax returns. And Mitt still refuses. As the ole saying is likely to prevail, "if the shoe fits wear it."

 

[fskimospy]

Nope, still stand behind what I said.

I'm sorry to hear that you believe costs have no relationship with fees. While their impact varies from industry to industry I am unaware of any person that would claim they had no relationship whatsoever as you did.

Then again conservatives aren't exactly well known for their understanding of economics.

 

[chowderhead]

What I once again find funny is that even if you take 'ol Mitten's story as 100% fact that just means that he was getting six figure salaries from his company for doing literally nothing all while this same company was charging large management fees to companies that were forced to cut costs by laying off workers. That's really really shitty.

In some ways his explanation is even worse than what he's being accused of. Yes though, the idea that the founder, sole owner, and CEO of a major financial company would provide absolutely zero input into the company that he expected to return to requires a pretty huge level of naivete.

Then again at least this way he doesn't have to explain how Bain invested in a company that profited off the disposal of aborted fetuses.

this x1000. Willard is an awful choice by the Republicans. He literally IS the boss that fired you for your job.

 

[MooseNSquirrel]

I don't feel like adding all those up and I am not sure how much is acceptable to you but just the first few claims have it over $10 Billion.

Look I know details a pita but were talking about portions of that money, not all of it.

Lots of things arent even manufactured here so it would be impossible to spend the whole money on US soil.

 

[CallMeJoe]

Just like McCain people thought Bill Ayers was going to be the end of Obama and the draft dodging was going to be the end of Clinton. Bottom line people don't give a crap. Smart money would not bet on the outcome of the election at this point.

And the Bush campaign thought that the Swiftboat attacks and "I voted for the $87 billion before I voted against it" were going to be effective against Senator Kerry...

 

[Matt1970]

And the Bush campaign thought that the Swiftboat attacks and "I voted for the $87 billion before I voted against it" were going to be effective against Senator Kerry...

Right, which is what I have said all along. Most people don't give a crap.
Even if they did give a crap we are 4 months away from the election. People tend to forget stuff very quickly. You people thinking you have the smoking gun on Romney are kidding yourselves.

 

[Charles Kozierok]

Right, which is what I have said all along. Most people don't give a crap.

Woosh...

Those attacks WERE effective against Kerry.

 

[HomerJS]

Romney is demanding an apology from Obama for making the Romney record at Bain into a campaign issue.

I would advise Mitt to not hold his breath, because he is unlikely to ever get that Obama apology. And every time Romney again demands an Obama apology the democrats release a new Bain capital attack add.

Poor ole Mittens, just six mouths ago, all Romney opponents in the GOP primaries were bitching that Mitt Romney was positively burying them in attack ads. But now when he gets a taste of his own medicine, Mittens claims unfair.

Meanwhile GOP strategists are telling Mitt, the only way to end the Bain finance noose from around his neck, is with complete disclosure of his tax returns. And Mitt still refuses. As the ole saying is likely to prevail, "if the shoe fits wear it."

Mittens whining like a little beeotch!

 

[cybrsage]

The Obama Campaign is straight up lying in their ads...so asking them to apologize is actually the nice response to it.

 

[DrewSG3]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Ud3mMj0AZZk

probably one of the hardest hitting attack ads I've ever seen.. wow!

 

[blankslate]

Interesting article from Forbes about this issue.

35 Questions Mitt Romney Must Answer About Bain Capital Before The Issue Can Go Away

http://www.forbes.com/sites/tjwalke...ut-bain-capital-before-the-issue-can-go-away/

During times of crisis it is often a smart strategy to give virtually unlimited access to the media in order to push out your message aggressively and satisfy reporter curiosity so that the issue can be pushed of the front burner....

.....The biggest problem for Romney is that all of his interviews have only increased the questions that political observers, voters and the media have regarding he subject of Bain Capital.

This is the issue...
which a Texas Republican says is...

...."fair game" for people to ask for more information about GOP presidential candidate Mitt Romney's personal financial records. "His personal finances, the way he does things, his record, are fair game," Texas Republican Pete Sessions told CNN.

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/tag/cnn-senior-congressional-producer-deirdre-walsh/


Some of the questions are interesting and in my opinion fair because they seem to be focused on bringing out facts that undecided voters would definitely want to know.

I won't list all of them in the interests of brevity but the article is a good read.

1. Are you contending that an individual can simultaneously be the CEO, president, managing director of a company, and its sole stockholder and somehow be “disassociated” from the company or accurately classified as someone not having “any” formal involvement with a company?

2. You have stated that in “Feb. 1999 I left Bain capital and all management responsibility” and “I had no ongoing activity or involvement.” It depends on what the definition of “involvement” is, doesn’t it? Clearly you were involved with Bain to the extent that you owned it. Are you defining “involvement” in a uniquely specific way that only means “full-time, active, 60-hours-a-week, hands-on manager?”

3. How exactly are you defining “involvement?”

Interesting questions... these need to be answered because the claims by Romney don't jive with most undecided voters expectations of ownership of a company. This is evidenced by the fact that Governor Romney felt the pressure to do a media blitz on friday.

some more interesting questions.

5. You earned at least $100,000 as an executive from Bain in 2001 and 2002, separate from investment earnings according to filings with State of Massachusetts. Can you give an example of anyone else you personally know getting a six figure income, not dividend or investment return, but actual income, from a company they had nothing to do with?

6. What did you do for this $100,000 salary you earned from Bain in both 2000 and 2001?

7. If you did nothing to earn this salary, did the Bain managers violate their fiduciary duty by paying you a salary for no discernible reason?

8. Are there other companies that pay you six figures a year as earned income, not investment income, for which you have no involvement?

I'm pretty sure most people don't think you can get a $100k a year salary from a company for doing nothing even if you're the owner. Again this would seem to undecided voters as sketchy.


Question number 8. is interesting because I'm sure anyone would be interested in such a job if they could get it.

Again it calls into question the assertion that Governor Romney had no involvement with Bain Capital. If you're just the owner/main investor why would you get a salary in addition to any dividend or interest payments?


Another problem is that Governor Romney's campaign has yet to go on record about a very relevant detail that is related to these questions.

What were the purpose of trips he took back and forth between Utah and Massachusetts

http://articles.boston.com/2012-07-...epublican-presidential-candidate-steel-mill/3

Romney also testified that “there were a number of social trips and business trips that brought [him] back to Massachusetts, board meetings” while he was running the Olympics. He added that he remained on the boards of several companies, including the Lifelike Co., in which Bain Capital held a stake until 2001.

Romney’s lawyer at the hearing said that Romney’s work in the private sector continued unbroken while he ran the Olympics.

“He succeeded in that three-year period in restoring confidence in the Olympic Games, closing that disastrous deficit and staging one of the most successful Olympic Games ever to occur on US soil,” said Peter L. Ebb from Ropes & Gray.

“Now while all that was going on, very much in the public eye, what happened to his private and public ties to the Commonwealth of Massachusetts? And the answer is they continued unabated just as they had.”

The Romney campaign declined to comment on the record about whether the business trips and board meetings were related to Bain Capital obligations.

It just doesn't look right to be whining about an apology when you won't go on record about something you want the apology for.

Of course since Forbes is just a liberal rag maybe Governor Romney doesn't really have to answer the questions...

 

[cubby1223]

<snip>

Since nothing of what you said was worth anything, I'll just skip over your crap and get straight to the point:

When the choice is between devoting one's time answering questions from partisan hacks in order to win over a very, very, very small minority of "undecided" voters - versus using the time to be productive and accomplish other things, making oneself stronger in the eyes of more voters...

Politicians don't devote their time to answering questions because to partisan hacks, there is never an end to the number of questions than can be answered.

 

[cubby1223]

Woosh...

Those attacks WERE effective against Kerry.

Kerry lost primarily because he comes across as an insufferably boring person. I personally don't believe the swiftboat campaign detracted enough voters to have been a deciding factor.

Bush had the CBS News reports that ended up being false. Kerry had the the Swift boat stuff...

 

[fskimospy]

Since nothing of what you said was worth anything, I'll just skip over your crap and get straight to the point:

When the choice is between devoting one's time answering questions from partisan hacks in order to win over a very, very, very small minority of "undecided" voters - versus using the time to be productive and accomplish other things, making oneself stronger in the eyes of more voters...

Politicians don't devote their time to answering questions because to partisan hacks, there is never an end to the number of questions than can be answered.

It's not just partisans anymore due to his poor handling of it now it's everyone, including even some Republicans.

Now Romney is whining that Obama is being mean and unfair to him, which is rich considering the sorts of things Romney routinely says about Obama. Mitt is just looking pathetic now, and he's flailing.

 

[Charles Kozierok]

Kerry lost primarily because he comes across as an insufferably boring person. I personally don't believe the swiftboat campaign detracted enough voters to have been a deciding factor.

Well, you're certainly entitled to believe whatever you like. There's no way to prove how much of an impact one factor had on the election as a whole.

But I remember at the time a very big fuss being made about this attack. It led directly to a neologism still used today: "swiftboating". And there were many, many articles arguing that it did matter.

Point is: saying that people "don't care about this stuff" blankly is lame denialism used by unthinking partisans. People do care about this stuff, which is why Romney is squealing like a stuck pig.

Now Romney is whining that Obama is being mean and unfair to him, which is rich considering the sorts of things Romney routinely says about Obama.

Not only that -- this is a guy who gets caught brazenly lying about opponents, and when called out to apologize or withdraw the comments, shamelessly says he won't do so because he doesn't care, all that matters is getting "50.1%".

In addition to his many other character flaws, he's a whiny hypocrite. And yes, people are paying attention.

 

[chowderhead]

The Obama Campaign is straight up lying in their ads...so asking them to apologize is actually the nice response to it.

Didn't Romney write a book called "No Apology" and when is he going to return the 100k salary he took for being the CEO but "not having any role in any decision" or doing anything from 2000-2002 at Bain? He needs to release his tax records to clear these matters up.

 

[nageov3t]

if actually doing work was a requirement for collecting a paycheck, we'd be up to 90% unemployment

 

[fskimospy]

Now corporate documents from late in 2002 filed with the state of Massachusetts by Bain Capital list Romney as one of the managing directors. That's three and a half years after he 'left' where they are still notifying people that he's a manager in charge of major decisions. How can anyone still be swallowing this guy's bullshit?

Romney has lied so much and so often and gotten away with it that perhaps he thought he could just lie his way out of this too. Sooner or later everyone gets busted I guess.

 

[dmcowen674]

The Obama Campaign is straight up lying in their ads...so asking them to apologize is actually the nice response to it.

and the little piggy went running home crying we we we we

 

[dmcowen674]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Ud3mMj0AZZk

probably one of the hardest hitting attack ads I've ever seen.. wow!

Awesome, about time :thumbsup:

 

[Charles Kozierok]

Now corporate documents from late in 2002 filed with the state of Massachusetts by Bain Capital list Romney as one of the managing directors. That's three and a half years after he 'left' where they are still notifying people that he's a manager in charge of major decisions. How can anyone still be swallowing this guy's bullshit?

We're talking about conservatives here. It's been a long time since facts or reason had any impact on them, generally speaking.