RINOs fold like a wet noodles

[woolfe9998]

According to the Washington Post, Republicans are asking for a "fig leaf" - concessions on Obamacare. But why should the Democrats reward Republicans for doing what both sides really want? And under the new Republican plan, the debit limit would be raise only until the end of January, guaranteeing another round of blackmail in less than four months.

No, I'm afraid Obama really needs to swat this down. "No deal."

If the Republicans want to include some sort of language which requires good-faith negotiations (from BOTH sides, with NOTHING off the table - not Obamacare concessions and not tax increases), that would be fine. But asking for concessions from Obama while offering absolutely nothing in return is a non-starter.

I'm a bit hazy on the details, because they seem to vary depending on which article you read. For example, a four month extension on the debt ceiling is news to me. Last article I read said the GOP was offering 6 weeks.

And what concessions are they asking for in exchange? The repeal of the medical device tax?

I don't think a short term extension is something Obama should reject if it's just a clean bill with no concessions. If they want concessions, then I agree, he shouldn't offer any, not under threat of default.

I think we should just wait and see what comes of the current negotiations. It seems to be a pretty fluid situation.

 

[Matt1970]

In addition, some of the across-the-board "sequester" cuts would be reversed under the GOP plan. It has not been determined which specific cuts will be targeted at this time.

In exchange for meeting, at least momentarily, all of Obama's demands, the House GOP is seeking a "framework" for future negotiations on addressing longer-term budget issues. These negotiations would be led for the Republicans by Rep. Paul Ryan, who is likely to seek a "grand bargain" resolving the nation's structural budget problems.

That's like saying giving the credit card back to a shopping addict in exchange for later negotiations of how much to spend on it.

 

[IronWing]

That's like saying giving the credit card back to a shopping addict in exchange for later negotiations of how much to spend on it.

Not really. The President doesn't have a credit card. Congress does. The President (Treasury) just gets to sort receipts.

 

[drebo]

lawl. If you think Ryan is too far to the left then your idea of an ideal candidate is going to be on the absolute fringe of the right. Good luck with that.

Defunding (or even delaying) Obamacare was never going to happen with a Democratic Senate and Obama still in the White House. Anyone who has any rationality at all knows this. Wake the hell up.

Most republicans are only "Right-wing" on social issues.

Fiscally, they're all fucking left-of-center corporatists.

 

[OverVolt]

I expected the GOP to feel very very guilty and then everything is all passed at once.

 

[michal1980]

Most republicans are only "Right-wing" on social issues.

Fiscally, they're all fucking left-of-center corporatists.

Where they should drop most of the social issue crap. And be far more fiscal conservative.

 

[ElMonoDelMar]

The Republican circular firing squad is moving into position.

 

[dank69]

This is folding when you have leverage.

Lets see Obamacare gets no delay.

Obama gets his government reopened.

Obama gets sequester cuts rolled back.

Republicans get what?

If you are going to shut the government down, get something for it. Instead their national poll numbers sink like a rock. And they get less then they started with.

WTF was the point?


that's why these rino's need to be kicked out of office. They are total failures.

Good. Good. We wouldn't want this to be rock bottom for the GOP. Bust out that drill and see how low you guys can go!

Anyway, it seems even this 6 week extension is just as retarded as anything else originating from the GOP as that puts the next showdown right in the heart of holiday shopping season. Obama and Dems seem to be standing strong saying "no deal" and demanding 1 year resolution.

 

[shira]

I'm a bit hazy on the details, because they seem to vary depending on which article you read. For example, a four month extension on the debt ceiling is news to me. Last article I read said the GOP was offering 6 weeks.

And what concessions are they asking for in exchange? The repeal of the medical device tax?

Yes. And they also want to up the weekly hours that an employee can work and still be considered part time. And they want auditing of applicants to ensure that those getting subsidies are eligible.

I think the last two asks are reasonable, but I don't think they should be pre-conditions to ending the shutdown or doing a short-term increase to the debit limit. The Repubs are still asking for concessions without giving anything in return.

I don't think a short term extension is something Obama should reject if it's just a clean bill with no concessions. If they want concessions, then I agree, he shouldn't offer any, not under threat of default.

I think we should just wait and see what comes of the current negotiations. It seems to be a pretty fluid situation.

 

[spittledip]

no that's not what I'm saying.

I'm saying that if Boner and Lyan were true leaders they'd have an end game in mind. And if this is what they saw coming, and were true leaders, they wouldn't allow it to get to this point.

They did have an end game in mind most likely, and they probably achieved it somewhat. For some strange reason you thought their motivation, i.e. endgame, had something to do with what you wanted.

 

[drebo]

Where they should drop most of the social issue crap. And be far more fiscal conservative.

And that's why we have the libertarian party.

 

[Siddhartha]

This reminds me of when the GOP had their fantasies burst in the 2012 POTUS election. They had convinced themselves that contrary to polls that Mr Romney would win by a large margin.
In the current situation, the House Republicans thought that the country would support them in their bid to achieve their agenda by shutting down the government and the Democrats would do anything to get things going again. But the Democrats have not given in and polls have showed that the GOP\Tea Partiers were wrong. In fact, I suspect the GOP will pay heavily for their hubris in 2014 and 2016.

Did the House Republicans really celebrate with drinks when the Federal Government shut down? Boy, that is going to make some great commercials in the 2014 elections.

 

[shadow9d9]

Where they should drop most of the social issue crap. And be far more fiscal conservative.

The Republicans have never and will never actually be "fiscally conservative." That is simply a fantasy that they like to repeat, so that they could get suckers to vote for them.

 

[Siddhartha]

Good. Good. We wouldn't want this to be rock bottom for the GOP. Bust out that drill and see how low you guys can go!

Anyway, it seems even this 6 week extension is just as retarded as anything else originating from the GOP as that puts the next showdown right in the heart of holiday shopping season. Obama and Dems seem to be standing strong saying "no deal" and demanding 1 year resolution.

If they do a year, they will have the showdown just before the 2014 elections. Guess which party will take a hit if the House Republicans shut down the government again?

 

[sportage]

What a stupid post.
"Obama gets HIS government reopened" ???
P L E A S E ........

And, BTW, as if no one has noticed, it has been these anti-government tea party republicans that have been passing their mini bills to reopen the big bad government piece by piece. The pieces where closing, I guess, effected their neck of the woods. Doesn't take long for even the most die hard tea party-ist tea partier to realize that a closed government hits then in the butt just as hard as it does everyone else.

But, if one can't comprehend the vast functions of government in the first place, I guess we can't expect those persons to think of government as anything other than the invisible boogie man hiding under their bed.

 

[Moonbeam]

I remember when I tried to get my Mom to buy me ice cream by banging my head on the wall and telling her I wouldn't stop till she did. It took a while but I finally figured out I had picked a poor negotiating strategy. I wasn't very smart but I was a lot smarter than Republicans.

 

[Matt1970]

I remember when I tried to get my Mom to buy me ice cream by banging my head on the wall and telling her I wouldn't stop till she did. It took a while but I finally figured out I had picked a poor negotiating strategy. I wasn't very smart but I was a lot smarter than Republicans.

I don't think you are smarter than the wall you were banging your head against.

 

[Sonikku]

Doubt worry. Just a 6 week pretend victory for the Dems. When the debt ceiling discussion starts we get to do this all over again, this time with some ratcheting up.

 

[sportage]

I can't imagine why the latest weekend talks between the president and Boehner failed, broke down, hit a brick wall, etc etc.
Oh wait, yes I can.
No doubt Boehner brought that same old recording back into the room claiming he "was ready to talk".
His old song and dance routine "Kill Obamacare and we will sign a deal, do-daw do-daw".
Everyone knows they, Boehner and his thugs, have no interest in so called negations unless they have to their way and all their way. So what is the point here, Johnny-B?
The hostage taker still insists on a gun to the head. Nothing has changed.
At least now and finally the American people have taken notice.
When Dr Frankenstein failed to control his monster, the towns people rose up with torches a-blazing and stormed the castle.
Anyone got a match?

 

[DominionSeraph]

Lets see Obamacare gets no delay.

Obama gets his government reopened.

Obama gets sequester cuts rolled back.

Republicans get what?

If you are going to shut the government down, get something for it. Instead their national poll numbers sink like a rock. And they get less then they started with.

WTF was the point?

It's hard to predict what low-information voters will let you get away with.
Conservative talk's gimmick is to simply be contrary. It's easy to create a fantasy political battlefield in which your listeners will always be victorious when you don't need to put forth a comprehensive positive plan of your own for contrast:

When it comes to actually putting together a plan, Republicans can't assume that the lies their base will accept as passive entertainment will be the same conclusions they'll draw when actively thinking forward. Conservatards do not hold to any objectivity in their beliefs, it's just, "The truth is whatever I happen to feel it is right now." That can vary widely. Conservatards are stupid and put things together in many, many, many stupid ways.

 

[michal1980]

It's hard to predict what low-information voters will let you get away with.
Conservative talk's gimmick is to simply be contrary. It's easy to create a fantasy political battlefield in which your listeners will always be victorious when you don't need to put forth a comprehensive positive plan of your own for contrast:

When it comes to actually putting together a plan, Republicans can't assume that the lies their base will accept as passive entertainment will be the same conclusions they'll draw when actively thinking forward. Conservatards do not hold to any objectivity in their beliefs, it's just, "The truth is whatever I happen to feel it is right now." That can vary widely. Conservatards are stupid and put things together in many, many, many stupid ways.

can liberals construct a criticism of conservatives without bashing them? Resorting to calling them conservatards, and labeling them ignorant?

Are you that insecure in your belief's that you have to demonize and dehumanize those you disagree with?

 

[AViking]

This is folding when you have leverage.

Lets see Obamacare gets no delay.

Obama gets his government reopened.

Obama gets sequester cuts rolled back.

Republicans get what?

If you are going to shut the government down, get something for it. Instead their national poll numbers sink like a rock. And they get less then they started with.

WTF was the point?


that's why these rino's need to be kicked out of office. They are total failures.

What is a Republican today? They aren't fiscally responsible anymore so I can't vote for them for that. They have gone way too far to the right.

I agree with you though that there was no point to the shutdown. They shot themselves in the foot. AT THE VERY LEAST they should have been able to sway public opinion and show the American people who bad Obamacare is.

I think it's safe to say that they are on the losing side of the argument though.

 

[DominionSeraph]

can liberals construct a criticism of conservatives without bashing them?

Yup. But your base is fucking stupid.

Are you that insecure in your belief's that you have to demonize and dehumanize those you disagree with?

*beliefs

It's plural, moron, not possessive.

When complaining about people calling you ignorant, showcasing ignorance doesn't exactly disprove their contention.

 

[First]

no that's not what I'm saying.

I'm saying that if Boner and Lyan were true leaders they'd have an end game in mind. And if this is what they saw coming, and were true leaders, they wouldn't allow it to get to this point.

You're hopelessly clueless. The whole reason GOP House leadership is in this mess is that a small but significant enough minority of his own caucus (tea partiers) wanted this shutdown, because they somehow thought that magically they could get their way on defunding/hurting Obamacare. Leadership never actually wanted a shutdown, the GOP tea party nutters did. There was no plan to get out of the shutdown or avoid the shutdown because leadership realized they couldn't reason with these nutters. Like you, these nutters aren't particularly reasonable or intelligent beings, and most of them are novices at this shit.

This is well known, and not particularly controversial among anyone well informed.

 

[michal1980]

You're hopelessly clueless. The whole reason GOP House leadership is in this mess is that a small but significant enough minority of his own caucus (tea partiers) wanted this shutdown, because they somehow thought that magically they could get their way on defunding/hurting Obamacare. Leadership never actually wanted a shutdown, the GOP tea party nutters did. There was no plan to get out of the shutdown or avoid the shutdown because leadership realized they couldn't reason with these nutters. Like you, these nutters aren't particularly reasonable or intelligent beings, and most of them are novices at this shit.

This is well known, and not particularly controversial among anyone well informed.

If they were true leaders they would have stood up to the tea party. But they're not.