Absolutely false!AMD has reaffirmed Kaveri release in 2nd half of 2013. I do not know where you trolls get your disinformation from.
When, where, and to whom did AMD reaffirm this information?
Absolutely false!AMD has reaffirmed Kaveri release in 2nd half of 2013. I do not know where you trolls get your disinformation from.
well, from Llano to trinity, amd just made the IGP even more bandwidth starved...what really bumped the performance was the improvments in bandwidth sharing
from vliw 4 to GCN, the increase will be bigger...
at the same clocks/shader/bandwidth: http://www.inpai.com.cn/doc/hard/168475_30.htm
add another improvments in IMC, then it is a decent bump
(but probably will get owned to GT3)
LOL... If you wheren't so biased, you would realize that, THAT was my pointYour link only confirmed my expectations.
IMC improvements? Where?
It look awfully familiar...with these numbers:
http://www.anandtech.com/show/4061/amds-radeon-hd-6970-radeon-hd-6950/13
Not to mention CGN cores are clocked 33% higher. But they certainly dont perform 33% more. the TDP for the 2 cards are around the same, one is 40nm the other 28nm. CGN actually looks like a disaster. The hunt for GPGPU capabilities show its pain.
If anything, CGN cores are slower. But offset by the lower process node. So you can add more shaders/higherclock etc.
Your link only confirmed my expectations.
I think you missed in the graphs it shows that they down clocked the GCN architecture to the same speed as the VLIW4, so the improvement you see is clock for clock, GCN appears to have substantial gains over VLIW4.
Absolutely false!AMD has reaffirmed Kaveri release in 2nd half of 2013.
IMC improvements? Where?
It look awfully familiar...with these numbers:
http://www.anandtech.com/show/4061/amds-radeon-hd-6970-radeon-hd-6950/13
Not to mention CGN cores are clocked 33% higher. But they certainly dont perform 33% more. the TDP for the 2 cards are around the same, one is 40nm the other 28nm. CGN actually looks like a disaster. The hunt for GPGPU capabilities show its pain.
If anything, CGN cores are slower. But offset by the lower process node. So you can add more shaders/higherclock etc.
Your link only confirmed my expectations.
The point is that you live on the 40->28nm shrink. Take a HD6870, shrink it to 28nm and expand transistors as well from 1.7B to 2.8B plus buff the memory speed. Suddenly HD7870 doesnt look so good. And the speed increase only comes from the expanded transistor budget.
VLIW5 to VLIW4 had the benefit of the under utilized (bogus) shaders. That went from 320 to 384 from HD5870 to HD6970. Also why performance was abit of a hit or miss depending what you did, and why the VLIW4 cards suffered from throttle due to overheating.
Trinity to Richland is the same processnode. And a transistor count expansion on a 242mm2 chip wont be easy.
What they compared was the limited edition 6930. BTW, the 6870 was still VLIW5. The 69xx series has 2.64B transistors compared to 2.8B on the 78xx series, that's an increase of 6%, which is no where near what a full shrink can give you in the same die area.
2012-11-21 08:16:49 < Skyler_> BugMaster|work: it definitely doesn't do AVX2 and I didn't read that Steamroller supports AVX2 anywhere
2012-11-21 08:16:55 < Skyler_> AMD would have likely bragged about that if it did
2012-11-21 08:17:03 < Skyler_> I really doubt it because they didn't even shift to 256-bit execution units
2012-11-21 08:18:02 < MasterNobody> any way there is link to video drivers you can try but they from June so dunno if worse the try
2012-11-21 08:18:41 < BugMaster|work> *worth
2012-11-21 08:28:28 * Skyler_ reads
2012-11-21 08:30:02 < Skyler_> ah
2012-11-21 08:30:09 < Skyler_> note, I should mention that the shipping manifest is the thing that claimed Kaveri
2012-11-21 08:30:16 < Skyler_> I don't know if it said Kaveri anywhere on the actual chip/box
2012-11-21 08:30:48 < Skyler_> or wait. wow, I am dumb, it's a richland.
2012-11-21 08:31:13 < Skyler_> AHHHH I see what happened.
2012-11-21 08:31:22 < Skyler_> It said richland, I googled richland, I saw "richland is kaveri, okay"
2012-11-21 08:31:40 < Skyler_> but google seems to say that Richland *is* Kaveri?
2012-11-21 08:31:43 < Skyler_> aka Steamroller?
2012-11-21 08:31:53 < Skyler_> "AMD's Kaveri-based Richland APU [...]"
2012-11-21 08:32:48 < kshishkov> hasn't AMD shifted to some incomprehencible alphanumeric IDs for their products instead of random codenames?
2012-11-21 08:32:50 < Skyler_> This whole thing is really confusing, there seems to be a lot of contradictory information and I'm not even sure what AMD themselves claim.
2012-11-21 08:33:11 < Skyler_> AMD really does seem to be a mess ._.
2012-11-21 08:34:03 < kshishkov> don't worry, there are rumours it might cease to exist soon
2012-11-21 08:35:12 < Skyler_> For those reading these logs, I'm pretty confident they just sent me a refresh of Bulldozer. Benchmarks show that this 3.2ghz 4-core chip is almost exactly 1/4 + 5% as fast as a 3ghz 16-core bulldozer I've benched on, so I'm pretty confident there's zero speed improvement here
2012-11-21 08:35:17 < Skyler_> Steamrolle would be faster.
2012-11-21 08:35:26 < BugMaster|work> there was slide at http://www.donanimhaber.com/islemci...-ailesi-icin-2013te-guncelleme-gorunmuyor.htm that says that Richland is piledrive
2012-11-21 08:36:07 < Skyler_> It claims a 35W TDP though, which is extremely good -- I recall earlier that we were getting the same TDP off of ~2ghz parts, so it's probably the shrink.
Hold on there, you are comparing a cutdown product with disabled parts to a full one in terms of transistor count? Take a 6970 then, shrink it to 28nm. Add whatever speed you can up to 190W and see how it goes against a HD7870.
Without a shrink and its benefits, CGN doesnt look good at all.
You are still comparing the performance/tdp for 28nm vs 40nm. The 6850 would be clocked higher on 28nm. Again, without 28nm to the rescue, CGN doesnt look good.
I mentioned nothing of TDP. I'm comparing shader performance per clock, essentially. So, because GCN gets more performance out of every shader, even if the 6850 were shrunken and clocked higher to make up for the efficiency of GCN, it still has more transistors and a higher clock with the same VDD, so therefore power usage goes up to achieve the same performance and you don't get the compute benefits of GCN.
You can continue to deny it, but GCN is a very efficient architecture, more efficient than anything AMD has put out in recent years.
The HD6850 is essentially a 192 shader part. Marketing just got to it. Its also why VLIW4 was faster due to underutilized shaders. So you actually went from 320 to 384 with HD5870->HD6970. nVidia could have called the GTX580 for 1024SPs with the same convention.
hansmoleman said:Kabini Cinebench R10
Processor : AMD Eng Sample: 2M14F100J4460_17/14/08/06_9832
MHz :
Number of CPUs : 4
Operating System : WINDOWS 64 BIT 6.1.7601
Graphics Card : KB 4C 17W (N-1) (9832)
CINEBENCH R10
******************************
Rendering (Single CPU): 1568 CB-CPU
Rendering (Multiple CPU): 5653 CB-CPU
And Finally
2012-11-21 08:16:49 < Skyler_> BugMaster|work: it definitely doesn't do AVX2 and I didn't read that Steamroller supports AVX2 anywhere
2012-11-21 08:16:55 < Skyler_> AMD would have likely bragged about that if it did
2012-11-21 08:17:03 < Skyler_> I really doubt it because they didn't even shift to 256-bit execution units
2012-11-21 08:18:02 < MasterNobody> any way there is link to video drivers you can try but they from June so dunno if worse the try
2012-11-21 08:18:41 < BugMaster|work> *worth
2012-11-21 08:28:28 * Skyler_ reads
2012-11-21 08:30:02 < Skyler_> ah
2012-11-21 08:30:09 < Skyler_> note, I should mention that the shipping manifest is the thing that claimed Kaveri
2012-11-21 08:30:16 < Skyler_> I don't know if it said Kaveri anywhere on the actual chip/box
2012-11-21 08:30:48 < Skyler_> or wait. wow, I am dumb, it's a richland.
2012-11-21 08:31:13 < Skyler_> AHHHH I see what happened.
2012-11-21 08:31:22 < Skyler_> It said richland, I googled richland, I saw "richland is kaveri, okay"
2012-11-21 08:31:40 < Skyler_> but google seems to say that Richland *is* Kaveri?
2012-11-21 08:31:43 < Skyler_> aka Steamroller?
2012-11-21 08:31:53 < Skyler_> "AMD's Kaveri-based Richland APU [...]"
2012-11-21 08:32:48 < kshishkov> hasn't AMD shifted to some incomprehencible alphanumeric IDs for their products instead of random codenames?
2012-11-21 08:32:50 < Skyler_> This whole thing is really confusing, there seems to be a lot of contradictory information and I'm not even sure what AMD themselves claim.
2012-11-21 08:33:11 < Skyler_> AMD really does seem to be a mess ._.
2012-11-21 08:34:03 < kshishkov> don't worry, there are rumours it might cease to exist soon
2012-11-21 08:35:12 < Skyler_> For those reading these logs, I'm pretty confident they just sent me a refresh of Bulldozer. Benchmarks show that this 3.2ghz 4-core chip is almost exactly 1/4 + 5% as fast as a 3ghz 16-core bulldozer I've benched on, so I'm pretty confident there's zero speed improvement here
2012-11-21 08:35:17 < Skyler_> Steamrolle would be faster.
2012-11-21 08:35:26 < BugMaster|work> there was slide at http://www.donanimhaber.com/islemci/haberleri/DH-Ozel-AMDnin-FX-islemci-ailesi-icin-2013te-guncelleme-gorunmuyor.htm that says that Richland is piledrive
2012-11-21 08:36:07 < Skyler_> It claims a 35W TDP though, which is extremely good -- I recall earlier that we were getting the same TDP off of ~2ghz parts, so it's probably the shrink.
If Richland really can stay at 3.2 Ghz at 35W TDP loaded then that is quite a bit of and improvement over Trinity.
Hold on there, you are comparing a cutdown product with disabled parts to a full one in terms of transistor count? Take a 6970 then, shrink it to 28nm. Add whatever speed you can up to 190W and see how it goes against a HD7870.
Without a shrink and its benefits, CGN doesnt look good at all.
Any chance you'll be amending your thread title so as to more accurately reflect what this was all about?