Richest of the rich ponder how to level the field

[Fenixgoon]

here's a thought - why not make all insurance companies non profit? that way there is no point to denying claims, because all funds should be used (aside from running the company) to insure the policy holders.

obviously there's still a balance of claims vs. revenue, but i would expect it to be far better than having a for-profit, publicly-traded company that's trying to maximize ROI for its shareholders.

 

[MagickMan]

For the average American, no matter how smart they budget, they will not get into the top 1%.

Its the great irony of the USA - that the American dream that keeps you all going is unattainable my most.

Did I say 1%? Yes, some will, but others won't. However, they can improve their financial lot substantially, no matter who they are. Anything is better than wasting time complaining online, and even modest increases in investment will pay exponential dividends. It isn't hard, but it does take dedication.

 

[theeedude]

here's a thought - why not make all insurance companies non profit? that way there is no point to denying claims, because all funds should be used (aside from running the company) to insure the policy holders.

obviously there's still a balance of claims vs. revenue, but i would expect it to be far better than having a for-profit, publicly-traded company that's trying to maximize ROI for its shareholders.

That's how private insurance works in a some European countries, where profiteering off sickness is frowned upon. Private insurers still participate, because while they don't profit off health care, they can then sell home and auto insurance to their customers. That said, the main issue is US lack of price controls at the provider level. Even single payer style programs like Medicare, the Republicans wrote provisions in to ban Medicare from negotiating prescription drug prices. The same people now complain that Obamacare does nothing about costs.

 

[IronWing]

Ahh yes, let the government have the revenue for the people have more of a right to your earnings than your offspring do. They have proven time and time again they really are acting in our best interest and the money will be evenly distributed to those who need it.

Ah, yes, the myth that the accident of birth should determine financial winners and losers.

 

[Genx87]

Agreed,we need government programs run by government. Single payer.

This is where you fall off the rails. I just explained how a system will be run by our govt. A govt that is paid for by the rich. Your solution is to give these people the keys to the kingdom. And then wonder why wealth wasnt redistributed.

 

[Agent11]

For the average American, no matter how smart they budget, they will not get into the top 1%.

Its the great irony of the USA - that the American dream that keeps you all going is unattainable my most.

The top 1% is not the American dream. Those people are the old money. They will be around as long as their books are managed and their wealth is put to work. I don't begrudge them their wealth, I just wish they invested a bit more in the US rather than China. Didn't they warn us though? That we were going in a direction that was not going to work? Seems we are there.

 

[Matt1970]

Ah, yes, the myth that the accident of birth should determine financial winners and losers.

As opposed to someone ignoring every piece of advice ever given to them by dropping out of school, having multiple kids they can't pay, never even getting simple skills like carpentry or plumbing and then turn around and complain how life is unfair.

 

[IronWing]

As opposed to someone ignoring every piece of advice ever given to them by dropping out of school, having multiple kids they can't pay, never even getting simple skills like carpentry or plumbing and then turn around and complain how life is unfair.

I'm glad we able to get that out of the way.

 

[Incorruptible]

you cannot have free market in healthcare. It will not work. The fundamentals of competition do not exist. When you need healthcare it is not optional. You cannot shop. You cannot say "I'll pass". The providers are limited and continuing to become more limited. It is not compatible. Try thinking outside your ideology. Be practical.

Yes you can. The politicians don't want to go there because they like being able to work with corporate healthcare and all the lobbying money they get.

Try thinking outside your ideology you moron. Capitalism will do a better job than socialism in healthcare. Be practical.

 

[theeedude]

This is where you fall off the rails. I just explained how a system will be run by our govt. A govt that is paid for by the rich. Your solution is to give these people the keys to the kingdom. And then wonder why wealth wasnt redistributed.

And private insurers are run by who? The rich as well. Except I don't get to vote for them.

 

[Genx87]

And private insurers are run by who? The rich as well. Except I don't get to vote for them.

Right and they got laws passed that forces the poor and middle class to purchase their product via the force of govt. The cherry on top is not only do the insurance companies have a new stream of revenue to generate profits. This law written by these insurance companies and passed by our govt forces the young less wealthy to subsidize the older more wealthy.

 

[BUnit1701]

Right and they got laws passed that forces the poor and middle class to purchase their product via the force of govt. The cherry on top is not only do the insurance companies have a new stream of revenue to generate profits. This law written by these insurance companies and passed by our govt forces the young less wealthy to subsidize the older more wealthy.

Along with written in protections to protect their money if too few of those young less wealthy go along with the extortion scheme.

 

[theeedude]

Right and they got laws passed that forces the poor and middle class to purchase their product via the force of govt. The cherry on top is not only do the insurance companies have a new stream of revenue to generate profits. This law written by these insurance companies and passed by our govt forces the young less wealthy to subsidize the older more wealthy.

I get to vote for politicians, I don't get to vote for insurance company execs.
Young less wealthy are getting Medicaid and subsidies under Obamacare. Also, you do realize that the young eventually become old?

 

[Sonikku]

Free market doesn't work in health care, and there needs to be a socialist health care system.

I've been assured since birth that Socialism never works on any level and I think it's true. You'll see though when Germany collapses under the weight of it's ultra left wing socialism. Could be any month now. :\

 

[Genx87]

I get to vote for politicians, I don't get to vote for insurance company execs.
Young less wealthy are getting Medicaid and subsidies under Obamacare. Also, you do realize that the young eventually become old?

Who you voted for wrote a law that puts more money into the pockets of the rich.

 

[Moonbeam]

Who you voted for wrote a law that puts more money into the pockets of the rich.

Lesser of two evils.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

For the average American, no matter how smart they budget, they will not get into the top 1%.

Its the great irony of the USA - that the American dream that keeps you all going is unattainable my most.

Since when is "The American Dream" mean crushing everyone else by being in the top 1%?

 

[Attic]

Im sure it will involve low fed interest rates and govt programs, run by the rich. Which will magically not spread the wealth to the poor or middle class. But end up in the hands of the rich.

This and only this.


As long as the controllers (wealthy bureaucrats and the richer insiders who own them) rhetoric about how "evil" the rich are and how much their "helping" the poor and middle class is continued to be bought by a stupid electorate, the charade will continue. Problem is nobody has ever really underestimated how stupid our electorate really is. The R vs D distraction is the golden goose for an inept bureaucracy and an pillaging ultra wealthy class.

Just something to take for what it's worth, change isn't coming unless it's limited to the scribbled word found on a poster board or on some poser's T-Shirt during the next election cycle.

Anyone think the ones gaining from the abuses in the system (the ones who really run things, the owners of bureaucrats) are going to let any real change knock them down? The key is to let the electorate think they have control while ensuring they have so little as to be a non threat to the lucrative status quo. Obama's election and reelection should make clear that voters have less power than they would like, this is rationalized by the ones with the real power insisting that leaving an electorate without real power is for their own good.

 

[theeedude]

Who you voted for wrote a law that puts more money into the pockets of the rich.

Nice try, I am sure some feeble minded right wingers fall for this BS and vote against their own self interest, but it won't fly with me.
It provides insurance to millions of low income people through Medicaid expansion, and subsidies for others to buy it, paid for out of income taxes, which, as Republicans like to tell us at every corner, most Americans except the rich don't pay enough of. It also limits the profit margin of insurers.

 

[brycejones]

The government can't spread the wealth. You need jobs created to help with the problem of income inequality.

Impressive you got in before the OPs obligatory second post.

 

[Genx87]

Lesser of two evils.

Lesser of what evils? Senseamp thinks govt run by the rich is capable of crafting legislation unfavorable to the rich. To prove this he points to legislation written by the rich that forces people to pay the rich for a service.

 

[Genx87]

Nice try, I am sure some feeble minded right wingers fall for this BS and vote against their own self interest, but it won't fly with me.
It provides insurance to millions of low income people through Medicaid expansion, and subsidies for others to buy it, paid for out of income taxes, which, as Republicans like to tell us at every corner, most Americans except the rich don't pay enough of. It also limits the profit margin of insurers.

Hold on this was your argument buddy. You said and I quote "And private insurers are run by who? The rich as well. Except I don't get to vote for them"

Who benefits immesely from having millions more paying for private health insurance?

 

[Incorruptible]

Impressive you got in before the OPs obligatory second post.

I know. Why can't he just put everything in one post but he wants to bump his post count.

 

[theeedude]

Hold on this was your argument buddy. You said and I quote "And private insurers are run by who? The rich as well. Except I don't get to vote for them"

Who benefits immesely from having millions more paying for private health insurance?

That's the benefit side. The cost side, which you either ignore, or are ignorant of, is they can't discriminate based on pre-existing conditions, rescind coverage, or have overhead including profit in excess of 20%.

 

[Incorruptible]

That's the benefit side. The cost side, which you either ignore, or are ignorant of, is they can't discriminate based on pre-existing conditions, rescind coverage, or have overhead including profit in excess of 20%.

The government has no right to tell them how much profit they can have.