Religion aside; Logically, what happens after death?

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Ruptga

Lifer
Aug 3, 2006
10,246
207
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And a cure for severe cellular damage caused by the crystallization of water.




What sucks about error-proofed DNA is that there's no chance for beneficial mutations.

Though by that time, maybe we'll also have figured out how to modify DNA directly, without going all Gattaca, or ending up doing a top-notch reenactment of Star Trek's Eugenics Wars.

Screw all that, I'm going to upload myself to the cloud where I will survive as long as civilization does. Also I'd be able to take practically any form through remote control, transfer, or copying myself. I could embody a hoverjet, a supertanker, a military mech, or just hang out in the NIST's servers doing cool science shit.
 

SMOGZINN

Lifer
Jun 17, 2005
14,359
4,640
136
It takes more than a nudge. One would have to find a way to prevent or repair DNA transcription errors and DNA damage in every cell.

The prevailing theory right now is that DNA transcription errors are not the main cause of senescence, but genetic expression is. If we can find a way to prevent the senescence expression of genes, then top geneticists think it would take about 400 years for the DNA transcription errors to build up to a point where you start to have problems.

I think that if we could keep many of our most brilliant minds around for an extra 320 years or so, we could solve that transcription error problem.

i don't know about you guys but, im getting frozen, in case they find a cure for death

If we ever do cure death we are not going to wake up those that are already gone. Our population will already be in crisis, they are not going to add to it needlessly.
 

Jeff7

Lifer
Jan 4, 2001
41,596
20
81
Screw all that, I'm going to upload myself to the cloud where I will survive as long as civilization does. Also I'd be able to take practically any form through remote control, transfer, or copying myself. I could embody a hoverjet, a supertanker, a military mech, or just hang out in the NIST's servers doing cool science shit.
Or you'll accidentally get stuck in the wwv.nist.gov server and do nothing but constantly answer back at remote systems asking for the time. :sneaky:
 

Loop2kil

Platinum Member
Mar 28, 2004
2,605
21
81
Religion aside; Logically, what happens after death?
This is what I am coming up with and would love to here others opinions.
After death the brain will cease to function within seconds. No electrical impulses
will transmit. Thus, we will not be able to think and our consciousness will
no longer exist. It will literally be like we do no exist and never had existed.
We won't feel, think, or even know we are dead because that's impossible.
This may seem bad, but in reality, you will and never could possibly know.

Basically, it is the same as before when you were born. Do you remember a thing? Exactly.

I just want to know if there is another logical theory that could be possible besides this one?

My saying is very similar, "The nothingness you knew before you were born is the same nothingness that you will know when you die."
 

Ruptga

Lifer
Aug 3, 2006
10,246
207
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My saying is very similar, "The nothingness you knew before you were born is the same nothingness that you will know when you die."

That's hard for many people to conceptualize. When it comes up I suggest they consider a lego house. It's a house, and lego blocks. When it's disassembled and back in the bin it's just blocks, where did the house go? The house didn't "go" anywhere, it just doesn't exist anymore, and it's the exact same way when a person dies. Both consciousness and house-ness are considered emergent properties, for those interested in further reading.

Or you'll accidentally get stuck in the wwv.nist.gov server and do nothing but constantly answer back at remote systems asking for the time. :sneaky:
Mhm, accidentally.
 

BurnItDwn

Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
26,353
1,862
126
Not only do I disagree with you but nearly every single civilization or populous of people from the beginning of recorded history, and perhaps even beyond, all had an inherent notion of a after life. And that is not even taking in to the account of any religious or philosophical persuasions that have come about. That in and of itself is reason to 'suspect'. As far as belief, that I leave up to the individual. If you chose to believe or not, I am ok with that, but to outright discard any reason to suspect is just foolish in my humble opinion.

Either way, you need to live (and die) with yourself so what you chose to believe is just fine with me. I can tell you this though, if I were arrogant enough to think that every civilizations of people to ever come before me were just stupid or crazy, and have the audacity to discard any and all spiritual reasoning without benefit, then I too would perhaps take your stance.

Of course you disagree with me. I merely was explaining why you were wrong using logic and reasoning. You have essentially stated that you do not believe in logic and reasoning, and instead rely on some supernatural mysticism because some other people also in past history also relied on supernatural mysticism.

In any case, no evidence of afterlife.
I'm not saying afterlife is "impossible", as I can not prove that. I't just seems quite infeasible and with no evidence or basis, astronomically improbable.

The only way to believe in an afterlife is "religiously" since there is absolutely no secular basis or reason to believe.

The same is true with god(s). There may or may not be gods, but, until you are able to measure a god, or measure an impact of a god, and have some way to interpret a god, logically, the correct assertion to make given the vast information available is that gods do not likely exist or do not get involved in our universe.


Anyhow, Looking at it logically. You die and your dead. The end.

Any other way of looking at it is essentially faith based and no longer logical.


You can believe what you want to believe, but, when your beliefs are not logical, it is dishonest to claim that they are. When there is evidence that contradicts your beliefs, you are still free to believe whatever you want to believe, but, that does not make your opinion or belief valid.

People used to think the Earth was flat, or that the earth was the center of the solar system, or that the stars were just little lights and not other "suns." People used to think that the world was only a few thousand years old because they could not measure it's age. People used to think that species were "created" even though they obviously have evolved. People used to think that black cats were bad luck or that certain numbers or symbols were "lucky."

People have believed in horseshit for thousands of years.

There are many many obsolete beliefs spanning the centuries past. It is not arrogance to learn and accept new information/science. It is arrogance to discount facts and reality in favor of fantasy.
 

SMOGZINN

Lifer
Jun 17, 2005
14,359
4,640
136
Not only do I disagree with you but nearly every single civilization or populous of people from the beginning of recorded history, and perhaps even beyond, all had an inherent notion of a after life. And that is not even taking in to the account of any religious or philosophical persuasions that have come about. That in and of itself is reason to 'suspect'. As far as belief, that I leave up to the individual. If you chose to believe or not, I am ok with that, but to outright discard any reason to suspect is just foolish in my humble opinion.

"Nearly every single civilization or populous of people from the beginning of recorded history" has also believed in magical men, but I find that no reason to believe in wizards.
 

moonbogg

Lifer
Jan 8, 2011
10,731
3,440
136
Religion aside; Logically, what happens after death?
This is what I am coming up with and would love to here others opinions.
After death the brain will cease to function within seconds. No electrical impulses
will transmit. Thus, we will not be able to think and our consciousness will
no longer exist. It will literally be like we do no exist and never had existed.
We won't feel, think, or even know we are dead because that's impossible.
This may seem bad, but in reality, you will and never could possibly know.

Basically, it is the same as before when you were born. Do you remember a thing? Exactly.

I just want to know if there is another logical theory that could be possible besides this one?

I agree with your ideas. There is a strangeness to it though. Hard to imagine not existing since here we are right now, but that's what happens it seems.
 

Pr0d1gy

Diamond Member
Jan 30, 2005
7,774
0
76
I already answered the OP on the last page but I forgot to mention that after you die you shit yourself. So in the correct order:

1) Shit yourself.

2) Disappear into the abyss or move into the next state of consciousness.

You can thank me in the next thread we speak in.

/end thread
 

moonbogg

Lifer
Jan 8, 2011
10,731
3,440
136
That's hard for many people to conceptualize. When it comes up I suggest they consider a lego house. It's a house, and lego blocks. When it's disassembled and back in the bin it's just blocks, where did the house go? The house didn't "go" anywhere, it just doesn't exist anymore, and it's the exact same way when a person dies. Both consciousness and house-ness are considered emergent properties, for those interested in further reading.

What if you swapped half the blocks out with different blocks but kept the same overall shape? Would it be the same house? What if you did the same to a person, but instead of swapping blocks, you swapped memories? At what point do they become someone else? When would you declare the original person lost or dead?
 
Oct 9, 1999
19,632
38
91
Can't help it. I find this state of affairs to be completely unacceptable. I will never be ok with it. I don't think about it every minute of every day, but when I do reflect on it I think it is with an amount of horror that is entirely appropriate.

I'm right there with you. I am TERRIFIED of life ending. I love it too much. Maybe it's because I've been extremely fortunate and have had a great life so far. Maybe it's because I know one day every one I know and love will be dead, forever.

I grew up in a Christian enviroment for 20 years before turning agnostic but I am not a fan of being agnostic at all. The "end" is a horrible, scary thing for me. It doesn't interfere with my life but it does suck knowing it's a real fact.

I would be open to anything post-life re: reincarnation, etc.

Fucking sucks:|
 

Ruptga

Lifer
Aug 3, 2006
10,246
207
106
What if you swapped half the blocks out with different blocks but kept the same overall shape? Would it be the same house? What if you did the same to a person, but instead of swapping blocks, you swapped memories? At what point do they become someone else? When would you declare the original person lost or dead?

If the house changes in any detectable way (color of the bricks, shape, ordering of the bricks, whatever) technically it is not the exact same house. It may be a very similar house, so much so that it's practically the same house, but it's not the same unless there is no way to tell them apart even at the molecular level (and possibly beyond).

As far as I'm concerned, a person is their consciousness, and their consciousness is their bundled memories, habits, continuing thought processes, etc. Screwing with any of that results in a different person, so technically my individual body does not support the same person as it did when it went to sleep last night. Of course last-night-me and today-me are identical for all practical purposes, so most people don't give a damn about the distinction.

If that sounds asinine or even ridiculous consider the following: a person is happy organized and smart until they lose most of a brain lobe in a horrific accident. After the accident they're grumpy, lousy, and can't reason their way out of a paper sack. Are they really the same person? If you've ever known a serious drunk that managed to stay sober for a few years, is the current-sober-them and the past-drunk-them really the same person? A lot of it hinges on semantics, what we really mean by a "person," but if you only consider their observable qualities they're not the same person at all.

Oh and I consider a person dead when they experience cerebral death but frankly a persistent vegetative state is close enough. In both cases the person they once were is completely and permanently gone, and whatever is left isn't enough to count as a person. Technically my hypothetical brain damaged person's original-person is dead but that body now houses a different living personality, so to deny them treatment or consider them dead would not be acceptable.
 
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