Re-Opened: The P&N Improvement Association -- Please Read & Contribute

[dank69]

Moonbeam may not swear or scream a lot, but IMO is one of the biggest problem posters on this board.

Flaming generally starts with flamebait, and Moonbeam's constant amateur psychoanalysis is a major impetus for people getting angry and threads going off the rails. There's no way this individual can back up his "diagnoses", and no real way anyone can respond to them other than by getting pissed off.

His constant attempts to portray half the country as being mentally ill are likewise counterproductive and inflammatory.



Personally, I'd rather be sweared at than listen to that.

...

That's just because he offends your massive ego.

 

[jackstar7]

Also, there is an Ignore List functionality on the board.

You decide what you read.

 

[Charles Kozierok]

That's just because he offends your massive ego.

I hope that was intended as ironic.

 

[Londo_Jowo]

Seriously. Get a handle on it, you two.

Yes, Mr self appointed mod.

 

[jackstar7]

Yes, Mr self appointed mod.

Actually, just someone who wants to see this thread produce something.

Sorry you cannot tell the difference.

 

[Londo_Jowo]

Actually, just someone who wants to see this thread produce something.

Sorry you cannot tell the difference.

I had seen his last reply and chose not to reply to it as I had said all I wanted to say.

 

[alzan]

Moonbeam may not swear or scream a lot, but IMO is one of the biggest problem posters on this board.

Flaming generally starts with flamebait, and Moonbeam's constant amateur psychoanalysis is a major impetus for people getting angry and threads going off the rails. There's no way this individual can back up his "diagnoses", and no real way anyone can respond to them other than by getting pissed off.

His constant attempts to portray half the country as being mentally ill are likewise counterproductive and inflammatory.



Personally, I'd rather be sweared at than listen to that.

Any effort to deal with the problems in this place must be holistic and address the causes, not just the symptoms.

I don't think Moonbeam intends to derail threads or insult posters; I do think an infinitessimally(sp?) small percentage of his posts have in the past derailed threads and will do so in the future.

That being said, there's a small group of posters I look for when reading/participating in threads, Moonbeam and you are two of them but not for the same reason.

Back On Topic, I would like to see the blatant insults reported and the poster dealt with appropriately; with the acknowledgment and understanding that I've broken that rule myself and could be vacationed. But like dank69 and others I feel that a well-worded and appropriately applied "zinger" as part of a thoughtful reply is an exquisite conversational pearl and should be left alone so that all may partake of it's beauty.

 

[JEDIYoda]

Also, there is an Ignore List functionality on the board.

You decide what you read.

yes you are correct...so let me guess....
YOU Favor people being able to post whatever theyn want or to respond whatever way they desire....because after all there is an ignore feature......hmmmmm....sounds reasonable.....rofl.....hahahahaaa.....

BTW....DO you have anything constructive to add to this thread??

 

[JEDIYoda]

lets talk about blatant insults......I find it not cool to fly off the handle with very offensive words or phrases such as blank You..or blank your mother and father...etc.....

I am not hurt by names such as noob...stoopid...moron...etc........but IMO if all your going to do is post that I am an idiot for what I thnk and not explain why you think I am an idiot..well you should get an infraction for not adding anything of substance to the thread....

In other words it simply is not enough to post that I am an idiot or that you disagree with my opinion.......you need to explain why....add commentary related to the threads subject matter

Just like when people start threads in P&N commentary by the poster is required....

 

[werepossum]

I don't think Moonbeam intends to derail threads or insult posters; I do think an infinitessimally(sp?) small percentage of his posts have in the past derailed threads and will do so in the future.

That being said, there's a small group of posters I look for when reading/participating in threads, Moonbeam and you are two of them but not for the same reason.

Back On Topic, I would like to see the blatant insults reported and the poster dealt with appropriately; with the acknowledgment and understanding that I've broken that rule myself and could be vacationed. But like dank69 and others I feel that a well-worded and appropriately applied "zinger" as part of a thoughtful reply is an exquisite conversational pearl and should be left alone so that all may partake of it's beauty.

This, exactly. (And I don't mind receiving them.)

Moonie does seem to have degenerated into a one trick pony, but hopefully with the election over he'll recover. His posts are often deeply insightful and near poetic; placing him on Ignore would subtly dull one's world.

 

[jackstar7]

yes you are correct...so let me guess....
YOU Favor people being able to post whatever theyn want or to respond whatever way they desire....because after all there is an ignore feature......hmmmmm....sounds reasonable.....rofl.....hahahahaaa.....

BTW....DO you have anything constructive to add to this thread??

Post #40. That was my first attempt to contribute, if you missed it. Maybe you deemed it not constructive though. Which is it? Did you miss it or did you decide it wasn't constructive?

Also, no, I don't think people should be able to say whatever they want here, but if you find someone isn't being reprimanded/banned and they repeatedly push your buttons, at some point you need to take control and Ignore the person.

 

[JEDIYoda]

Post #40. That was my first attempt to contribute, if you missed it. Maybe you deemed it not constructive though. Which is it? Did you miss it or did you decide it wasn't constructive?OK...MY BAD...

Also, no, I don't think people should be able to say whatever they want here, but if you find someone isn't being reprimanded/banned and they repeatedly push your buttons, at some point you need to take control and Ignore the person.

....if somebody is pushinng your button and not being repirmanded or banned......that could mean that they are pushing your buttons within the appropriate posting guidelines.....

Just because somebody hurts somebody elses feelings does not mean that person is breaking any rules.....

 

[jackstar7]

....if somebody is pushinng your button and not being repirmanded or banned......that could mean that they are pushing your buttons within the appropriate posting guidelines.....

Just because somebody hurts somebody elses feelings does not mean that person is breaking any rules.....

Which is exactly where it becomes incumbant on the individual getting pissed all the time to take some responsibility and put the person getting their goat on ignore; assuming they cannot simply figure out what it is that's bothering them so much and address that on a personal level.

 

[Londo_Jowo]

A user's family should always be off limits.

Commentary being added to the start of a thread and said commentary should be in the first post of the thread as well.

 

[jackstar7]

A user's family should always be off limits.

Commentary being added to the start of a thread and said commentary should be in the first post of the thread as well.

Agreed on both points.

 

[Incorruptible]

A user's family should always be off limits.

Commentary being added to the start of a thread and said commentary should be in the first post of the thread as well.

You mean like this?

STFU troll, you wouldn't know what real outrage or "radical Islam" were if both of them were tag teaming your mother in front of you.
I was talking like an adult to an adult, I don't need input from a whiny, bitch-ass troll like you.

 

[Charles Kozierok]

I don't think Moonbeam intends to derail threads or insult posters...

I do. Anyone who claims to have the intelligence to psychoanalyze others should also be smart enough to know that calling people stupid or crazy is insulting, even if you dress it up with flowery language.

Please read post #95 and tell me honestly that he was not trying to insult people.

His posts are often deeply insightful and near poetic; placing him on Ignore would subtly dull one's world.

Hasn't been my experience. In fact, he's one of the few people I do keep on ignore around here, because even though I agree with him on many actual viewpoints, after a while, every post is the same, and few of them contribute to the topic at hand.

Jackstar7, you're greatly overstating the value of the ignore tool in this software. All it takes is one or two people to engage the trolls, and a thread is history. I have on many occasions even asked people to stop responding to them, and they refuse, because they consider it "fun" to flame back and forth with someone who isn't actually serious about the topic. While they are having their "fun", the thread is ruined for everyone else.

If it really comes down to people caring more about flaming than sensible discussion, then please split the group or something.

 

[dank69]

A user's family should always be off limits.

...

You only believe that because your mother is a whore. *read post 33 if you are unsure if this is a joke

 

[CrackRabbit]

You mean like this?

Hey that was a pretty good one!

Let's get back to the fact that you (and a couple of other posters) have nothing of value to add to conversations here except to derail them with stupidity.

Here's a perfect example from today:
http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2295532

Crap like that is exactly what needs to be dealt with here. You eliminate the obvious trolls and things will simmer down quite a bit.

Edit:
Here's another active one. Even if you ignore the flamebait title, the two trolls in the thread (one of them being Incorruptible) are fairly obvious.
http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2295216

 

[JEDIYoda]

Hey that was a pretty good one!

Let's get back to the fact that you (and a couple of other posters) have nothing of value to add to conversations here except to derail them with stupidity.

Here's a perfect example from today:
http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2295532

Crap like that is exactly what needs to be dealt with here. You eliminate the obvious trolls and things will simmer down quite a bit.

Since when do you decide what posts are crap and what posts are not??

 

[CrackRabbit]

Since when do you decide what posts are crap and what posts are not??

I don't, but it should be fairly obvious who is attempting to derail the thread.

 

[Charles Kozierok]

Here's a perfect example from today:
http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2295532

Crap like that is exactly what needs to be dealt with here. You eliminate the obvious trolls and things will simmer down quite a bit.

Yep, I posted that one in this thread this morning. What could have been a reasonable discussion destroyed by one leftist and one rightist both derailing it with nonsense.

 

[jackstar7]

Jackstar7, you're greatly overstating the value of the ignore tool in this software. All it takes is one or two people to engage the trolls, and a thread is history. I have on many occasions even asked people to stop responding to them, and they refuse, because they consider it "fun" to flame back and forth with someone who isn't actually serious about the topic. While they are having their "fun", the thread is ruined for everyone else.

If it really comes down to people caring more about flaming than sensible discussion, then please split the group or something.

I wasn't trying to overstate, just that I think there are a number of people who would be served best by some introspection, and since that seems unlikely, the Ignore functionality.

Beyond that, you are getting back to my original suggestion that people do not respond to trolls or perceived trolls, but just report them. I think people just calling out troll posts (and bumping otherwise pointless threads) do a disservice to the discourse. People cluttering an otherwise worthwhile thread with call-outs are not helping either. Best that the useless posters/trolls just be ignored or reported as needed rather than indulged.

I'd be comfortable with that behavior being policed.

 

[Londo_Jowo]

I wasn't trying to overstate, just that I think there are a number of people who would be served best by some introspection, and since that seems unlikely, the Ignore functionality.

Beyond that, you are getting back to my original suggestion that people do not respond to trolls or perceived trolls, but just report them. I think people just calling out troll posts (and bumping otherwise pointless threads) do a disservice to the discourse. People cluttering an otherwise worthwhile thread with call-outs are not helping either. Best that the useless posters/trolls just be ignored or reported as needed rather than indulged.

I'd be comfortable with that behavior being policed.

Agreed, the mods could always delete the reported/offending posts and restore the thread to the given subject.

 

[Moonbeam]

CharlesKozierok: Moonbeam may not swear or scream a lot, but IMO is one of the biggest problem posters on this board.

M: I think I do swear and scream a lot.

CK: Flaming generally starts with flamebait, and Moonbeam's constant amateur psychoanalysis is a major impetus for people getting angry and threads going off the rails.

M: An alternate explanation is that truth is flamebait and every time you hear it you get angry and go off the rails. It wouldn't be truth if it had any other effect, but you have to know something to know that. That something can't be given away. It must be acquired by work. You do not know what kind of work is required and have never done any and are thus incapable of judging who has or its value.

CK: There's no way this individual can back up his "diagnoses", and no real way anyone can respond to them other than by getting pissed off.

M: You limit yourself by your assumptions as to what is or isn't possible. You have the option to trust and self examine or posit alternate theories to explain away what I say. You get pissed off, but I provide reasons as to why you do. I can explain why you get pissed off. And the reasons are simple. You don't know what you feel. But you also don't know that you don't know because you can't know what you don't know. You can't think what you feel. You have to feel it. You can't imagine what this amateur psychologist has been through to know something about this. You are ignorant beyond measure compared to me and only one of us has the experience to see it. I wouldn't blow you off like this if you weren't so presumptuous. The truth is concealed by its immediately unlikeliness.

CK: His constant attempts to portray half the country as being mentally ill are likewise counterproductive and inflammatory.

M: What do you know of counterproductive? You are here with your logic and reason, traits I deeply admire. I love your posts and the skill with with you argue. But is is totally useless. You are trying to teach pigs to fly and in this thread express your frustration. Your answers are to have people banned, people you can't reach and frustrate you in your attempts. I tell you that you know nothing and are you affected? Hehe, I will say it again. People are asleep living in a dream. We hate ourselves, don't know it, and don't want to know we don't want to know. I have known from the first day I posted here that people can't be reached. I offer only a mirror. It's was a mirror, if you remember, that allowed the Hero to see the seven heads of the serpent and cut them off with his sword. You to your way and me to mine please.

You are free to reason with people who can't think. I want them to consider their condition. I believe there is evidence that folk who react with disgust are amenable to its application, they change when they become the object of ridicule, comfort the afflicted and afflict the comfortable, as they say.

CK: Personally, I'd rather be sweared at than listen to that.

M: I know much better than you do that you feel that way.

CK: Any effort to deal with the problems in this place must be holistic and address the causes, not just the symptoms.

M: Quite so, but I am more holistic and much more aware of the causes than you are so I operate in a dimension you don't comprehend but I do know that there is no way I can prove that or prevent my knowing so from pissing you off.

I think you want to argue the value of this or that political idea. I want to illustrate why people can't see real value for themselves. You want to sit at a table where the chairs are so high nobody can reach them. You can't serve up good thinking at a table where there are no guests. First things first. Find a way to reach people who are mentally disabled. You can't reason with folk who are mentally two. You can't show them they are two either, but you can make them feel like two year olds feel. I seem to do it to you with apparent ease. (What foods these morsels be.) Anyway, my point is that it is a fool who thinks that doing something over and over that doesn't work will work the next time. You have a one note keyboard, in my opinion, a prisoner of your assumptions.

The fundamental point of contention with what you argue, therefore, from my point of view is that psychological understanding of other people is dependent of psychological understanding of one's self and there is no way for one person on a higher level of understanding to prove to somebody on a lower level their relative standing. Knowledge is known only to those who know it. The awake in a room of sleeping people, know who is awake and who is not, etc. No rational argument can touch this. Only some potentially intuitive obviousness this must be so can be had. The burden then, it seems to me, that if you want to say I am a psychological amateur you should have to prove it rather than assert it as fact. I can prove nothing to you. Luckily, I don't need to.