R520 Faster Than G70 and 6800U SLI

[RussianSensation]

Originally posted by: AndyD2k

Originally posted by: RussianSensation
...What I wanna know is why Island2 demo - v1.1 for Radeon 8500, using DX8.1, still looks better than any game out there right now 4 years after the demo was released. I just ran it in real time, and the water looks better than far cry in DX9, textures are sharper than in HL2 or Doom 3, and the creature that gets out of the water is shiny as if it has HDR on it (like what the demos were showing of HL2 enemies prior to its release on the rooftop). This runs perfectly smooth on my card. We have cards much much faster, but games dont even touch the quality of the demo.......why? Also how can some games be so poorly programmed -- ie. Halo for PC looks like crap and runs choppy even on new hardware. LIke how hard is it to program a game? Painkiller looks better than Halo and I can run it at 100frames at same resolution that gives me 25 frames in Halo.

because there is a lot more going on in those games than just a pretty scene? that demo was made for one thing...to show off graphics capability.

Like what exactlY? The demo runs at very high frames on my computer. So I would imagine X850xt pe and 6800Ultra would give 200 frames. Even if you add complexity of doom 3 or HL2 as you said, they'll easily pull 60 frames and still look better. Besides, you actually think the boat level (with water and ground and wall textures in HL2) is more complex than the demo? Well it runs like crap on my 4 year old videocard at like 40 frames 800x600.

 

[g3pro]

I've done tests on the G70 and R520 in 3dmark2005 and 3dmark2003, and the nVidia card beats out the ATi card by some big margins. I don't know where the inquirer gets its information, but they have some bogus data.

As far as "the inquirer was right before", I'll just say "a broken clock is still correct twice a day."

 

[imported_X]

I have a hard time believing the G70 beats the R520 by "big margins". I would be equally skeptical if the reverse were being claimed. No offense, but although the Inquirer gets some things wrong, I'll take their word over yours until hard numbers come out.

 

[VIAN]

Island 3 demo doesn't look that good. The character poly sucks, and the water isn't that great. Textures are sharp, but They've been done somewhere close to that at least. The entire demo has a 2001 look to it.

 

[gobucks]

i really hope this score is for real, but there is no way that nvidia is gonna let ATI embarass it again like with the whole NV30 mess. Both companies have great architectures (although up until R520 i've kinda been annoyed with ATI's aging feature set, which has been thankfully rectified with the new core). Both are 24-pipeline designs, and will be using similar memory (1.4-1.6GHz GDDR3 at first, probably 2.0+GHz GDDR4 later on), and while ATI's R420 manages a clockspeed advantage, nvidia's NV40 cores are generally more efficient on a per-MHz basis. Unless ATI has found a way to seriously enhance efficiency or crank up the clockspeed, I don't think they are gonna be able to blow out the G70. Also, nvidia has purposely left off its highest end model, the 7800 Ultra, from the lineup. Why? Because they will sell a crapload of 7800/GT/GTX cards in the multiple month gap before R520 is released, and when ATI's hand is revealed come august/september, they can launch an 7800 Ultra with clockspeeds that are just fast enough to come in very close, and possibly beat (i don't know which will win though) the X900.

But for me, it's irrelevant. I really like R520's feature set, with PS3.0, unified shaders, and H.264 acceleration, but then again we don't know what G70 will have. And what's most important is how the $200-300 segment shakes out. Whoever has the better offering, bringing me the most complete feature set, in this price range, is gonna be getting the lion's share of the sales from people like me.

 

[fierydemise]

Originally posted by: gobucks
i really hope this score is for real, but there is no way that nvidia is gonna let ATI embarass it again like with the whole NV30 mess. Both companies have great architectures (although up until R520 i've kinda been annoyed with ATI's aging feature set, which has been thankfully rectified with the new core). Both are 24-pipeline designs, and will be using similar memory (1.4-1.6GHz GDDR3 at first, probably 2.0+GHz GDDR4 later on), and while ATI's R420 manages a clockspeed advantage, nvidia's NV40 cores are generally more efficient on a per-MHz basis. Unless ATI has found a way to seriously enhance efficiency or crank up the clockspeed, I don't think they are gonna be able to blow out the G70. Also, nvidia has purposely left off its highest end model, the 7800 Ultra, from the lineup. Why? Because they will sell a crapload of 7800/GT/GTX cards in the multiple month gap before R520 is released, and when ATI's hand is revealed come august/september, they can launch an 7800 Ultra with clockspeeds that are just fast enough to come in very close, and possibly beat (i don't know which will win though) the X900.

But for me, it's irrelevant. I really like R520's feature set, with PS3.0, unified shaders, and H.264 acceleration, but then again we don't know what G70 will have. And what's most important is how the $200-300 segment shakes out. Whoever has the better offering, bringing me the most complete feature set, in this price range, is gonna be getting the lion's share of the sales from people like me.

R520 is speculated to have 32 pipes (compared to the 24 of G70) and will not use unified shaders (that won't come until R600)

 

[sxr7171]

Originally posted by: X

Originally posted by: sxr7171
If two 6800 Ultras in SLI is the benchmark why not spend the $850 now for two 6800 Ultras than wait until October (when you can actually get your hands on it) to pay $800 (since there will be supply shortages) for an R520?

1) I don't think the R520 will be that expensive, but regardless if you want top performance and longevity, 2 R520s will kill 2 6800 Ultras

2) It has been reported that the G70 is already in the hands of major manufacturers and should not suffer from shortages, so it would be a lot smarter to get that than 2 6800 Ultras. The same might prove to be true for the R520

3) When the G70 and R520 come out in the next few weeks, the price on 6800 Ultras will drop. Is it really worth it to spend $850 now given that fact?

I was actually being sarcastic about the cost and delays of cards these days. You can keep saying that they are ready to be made in large numbers, but I'll believe that when I actually see it. Sure 2 R520s will kill 2 6800 Ultras you don't have to have a Ph.D in nuclear astrophysics to figure that out, but you won't have to wait until October and drop $1500 for one of those options.

 

[imported_X]

You're welcome to run out today and buy two 6800 Ultras, but personally I think it is wiser to wait. I don't think it is going to be October like you say, but time will tell

 

[g3pro]

Originally posted by: X
I have a hard time believing the G70 beats the R520 by "big margins". I would be equally skeptical if the reverse were being claimed. No offense, but although the Inquirer gets some things wrong, I'll take their word over yours until hard numbers come out.

Don't be too surprised when it's true.

 

[Avalon]

Originally posted by: g3pro
I've done tests on the G70 and R520 in 3dmark2005 and 3dmark2003, and the nVidia card beats out the ATi card by some big margins. I don't know where the inquirer gets its information, but they have some bogus data.

As far as "the inquirer was right before", I'll just say "a broken clock is still correct twice a day."

Signaturized for validation in the future.

 

[Acanthus]

Originally posted by: RussianSensation

Originally posted by: AndyD2k

Originally posted by: RussianSensation
...What I wanna know is why Island2 demo - v1.1 for Radeon 8500, using DX8.1, still looks better than any game out there right now 4 years after the demo was released. I just ran it in real time, and the water looks better than far cry in DX9, textures are sharper than in HL2 or Doom 3, and the creature that gets out of the water is shiny as if it has HDR on it (like what the demos were showing of HL2 enemies prior to its release on the rooftop). This runs perfectly smooth on my card. We have cards much much faster, but games dont even touch the quality of the demo.......why? Also how can some games be so poorly programmed -- ie. Halo for PC looks like crap and runs choppy even on new hardware. LIke how hard is it to program a game? Painkiller looks better than Halo and I can run it at 100frames at same resolution that gives me 25 frames in Halo.

because there is a lot more going on in those games than just a pretty scene? that demo was made for one thing...to show off graphics capability.

Like what exactlY? The demo runs at very high frames on my computer. So I would imagine X850xt pe and 6800Ultra would give 200 frames. Even if you add complexity of doom 3 or HL2 as you said, they'll easily pull 60 frames and still look better. Besides, you actually think the boat level (with water and ground and wall textures in HL2) is more complex than the demo? Well it runs like crap on my 4 year old videocard at like 40 frames 800x600.

Like physics, AI, realtime shaders, occlusion culling that isnt fixed point, and swapping textures into and out of memory.

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: X
I have a hard time believing the G70 beats the R520 by "big margins". I would not be equally skeptical if the reverse were being claimed. No offense, but although the Inquirer gets some things wrong, I'll take the word of the one who says ATI wins over yours until hard numbers come out.

Fixed for ya.

 

[imported_X]

Actually, I meant what I said. You can remove the misquote. If people were claiming that the R520 is going to beat the G70 by "big margins", I would be similarly skeptical. I think the top offerings of both will be comparable in performance like the X850XT and 6800U are today.

 

[Avalon]

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: X
I have a hard time believing the G70 beats the R520 by "big margins". I would not be equally skeptical if the reverse were being claimed. No offense, but although the Inquirer gets some things wrong, I'll take the word of the one who says ATI wins over yours until hard numbers come out.

Fixed for ya.

And the same could be said for the Nvidia camp for at least 5 people in this thread. What's your point?

 

[Insomniak]

Originally posted by: Avalon

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: X
I have a hard time believing the G70 beats the R520 by "big margins". I would not be equally skeptical if the reverse were being claimed. No offense, but although the Inquirer gets some things wrong, I'll take the word of the one who says ATI wins over yours until hard numbers come out.

Fixed for ya.

And the same could be said for the Nvidia camp for at least 5 people in this thread. What's your point?

LOL and keys is one of 'em, that's the best part.

 

[SVT Cobra]

speculation...no need to get your panites in a bunch yet

 

[Gamingphreek]

Originally posted by: g3pro
I've done tests on the G70 and R520 in 3dmark2005 and 3dmark2003, and the nVidia card beats out the ATi card by some big margins. I don't know where the inquirer gets its information, but they have some bogus data.

As far as "the inquirer was right before", I'll just say "a broken clock is still correct twice a day."

You have done tests with these cards huh? What are you a developer?

Additionally, not trying to start problems but isn't telling whether or not a card wins in benches or something violating NDA agreement. I honestly am not sure.

-Kevin

 

[Killrose]

Originally posted by: Gamingphreek

Originally posted by: g3pro
I've done tests on the G70 and R520 in 3dmark2005 and 3dmark2003, and the nVidia card beats out the ATi card by some big margins. I don't know where the inquirer gets its information, but they have some bogus data.

As far as "the inquirer was right before", I'll just say "a broken clock is still correct twice a day."

You have done tests with these cards huh? What are you a developer?

Additionally, not trying to start problems but isn't telling whether or not a card wins in benches or something violating NDA agreement. I honestly am not sure.

-Kevin

I would guess that would be a bigtime violation of NDA.

 

[imported_X]

Which is one of the reasons I place his credibility even lower than the Inquirer

 

[Ronin]

No, he hasn't done the tests, because the R520 isn't in the hands of anyone aside from ATi.

If you're going to post crap, make sure there's no one else here that knows better. AND the G70 is in very select hands right now, and I would highly doubt that anyone so ready to break their NDA would be on that list, or be under NDA to begin with.

Those with NDAs with these companies know enough to respect them, because they enjoy receiving and testing the products first, and providing feedback. You, sir, are not one of those people, and if you are, I'll see that you are reported to both companies. There's nothing I detest more than someone who can't respect a legal agreement, and doesn't realize the consequences of doing so.

 

[trinibwoy]

Originally posted by: Ronin
There's nothing I detest more than someone who can't respect a legal agreement, and doesn't realize the consequences of doing so.

I can think of a lot of things I detest more but to each their own

 

[Ronin]

Well, to be honest, same here, but it was an effort on my part to express my extreme distaste for such actions.

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: Avalon

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: X
I have a hard time believing the G70 beats the R520 by "big margins". I would not be equally skeptical if the reverse were being claimed. No offense, but although the Inquirer gets some things wrong, I'll take the word of the one who says ATI wins over yours until hard numbers come out.

Fixed for ya.

And the same could be said for the Nvidia camp for at least 5 people in this thread. What's your point?

Is it even possible to have a point in a pointless thread? Not really gonna try to go all sensible in a thread that really doesn't do anything for us.

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: Insomniak

Originally posted by: Avalon

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: X
I have a hard time believing the G70 beats the R520 by "big margins". I would not be equally skeptical if the reverse were being claimed. No offense, but although the Inquirer gets some things wrong, I'll take the word of the one who says ATI wins over yours until hard numbers come out.

Fixed for ya.

And the same could be said for the Nvidia camp for at least 5 people in this thread. What's your point?

LOL and keys is one of 'em, that's the best part.

Hey, just trying to keep the playing field level.

 

[Insomniak]

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: Insomniak

Originally posted by: Avalon

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: X
I have a hard time believing the G70 beats the R520 by "big margins". I would not be equally skeptical if the reverse were being claimed. No offense, but although the Inquirer gets some things wrong, I'll take the word of the one who says ATI wins over yours until hard numbers come out.

Fixed for ya.

And the same could be said for the Nvidia camp for at least 5 people in this thread. What's your point?

LOL and keys is one of 'em, that's the best part.

Hey, just trying to keep the playing field level.

I don't blame you my man. I think my preference for Nvidia is pretty well known around here.