R500 to be ready at end of Q1 2005

[Genx87]

I think the money is in the games, but I could be wrong. Like my last cheap printer, only cost $30 a month or so for ink.

I would buy into that except Microsoft lost a shatload of money on the original XBox because of hardware costs. If the costs didnt mean much then they would not have tried to weasel their way out of their contract with Nvidia.

While Microsoft has deep pockets. I dont see them going out and losing 200 bucks on each box on purpose in the hopes they manage to make up for from the user purchasing enough software. Especially since the xBox just doesnt have the market sway Sony does and thus doesnt have many great exclusive titles. Halo is the only one I can think of and it wasnt impressive imo.

 

[Lonyo]

Originally posted by: BFG10K

This will occur only in multitexture games but nowadays all games use more then one texture per pass.

Not really. In fact static multitexturing is going the way of the Dodo and is being replaced by shaders. Adding a second TMU to that card isn't terribly exciting at all and in fact could be quite useless.

Actually, a second TMU almost certainly WON'T be useless, for the XBox 2.
Sure, the devs will use more and more shaders, but they will also make sure to use the extra TMU, as they have a set spec to design for.
I think that XBox developers will (and should) design for a 2 TMU design, if indeed the R520 is a 2 TMU design.
To do otherwise (except for cross platform games, possible), would be silly.

In terms of PC games, where the standards are different, the extra TMU will provide less benefit.

 

[Insomniak]

Originally posted by: Genx87

I think the money is in the games, but I could be wrong. Like my last cheap printer, only cost $30 a month or so for ink.

I would buy into that except Microsoft lost a shatload of money on the original XBox because of hardware costs. If the costs didnt mean much then they would not have tried to weasel their way out of their contract with Nvidia.

While Microsoft has deep pockets. I dont see them going out and losing 200 bucks on each box on purpose in the hopes they manage to make up for from the user purchasing enough software. Especially since the xBox just doesnt have the market sway Sony does and thus doesnt have many great exclusive titles. Halo is the only one I can think of and it wasnt impressive imo.

KotOR.


Best RPG I've played.

 

[Delorian]

Originally posted by: Rage187
I think they just make up sh1t so they can get hits on their website, go figure.

I agree :roll:

Even if the R500 is released in Q1 '05, it won't be widely available until Q4 '05 or later, I mean come on look how long it has taken to get production up on these new 6800 and x800 cards.

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: Delorian

Originally posted by: Rage187
I think they just make up sh1t so they can get hits on their website, go figure.

I agree :roll:

Even if the R500 is released in Q1 '05, it won't be widely available until Q4 '05 or later, I mean come on look how long it has taken to get production up on these new 6800 and x800 cards.

Realistically, IF the r500/r520 are released in Q1-'05, we can expect availability of desktop videocards by Summer('s end) and the X-Box II in stores for the X-mas season.

and MS DOES expect to make up any loss on their console on games, accessories, and online play. But i also think it will be more expensive than the original X-Box . . .

 

[ponyo]

Xbox is nice tax writeoff for Microsoft. Xbox2 will be likely as well.

 

[Drayvn]

ATi are taking royalties off their chip design.

nV used to sell their chips in bulk so it was always a set price, while MS now gets them but gives ATi royalties on every xbox sold.

R500 is a totally new core and the R520 is also different from the R500, as they will be doing 2 completely different tasks, and the R520 has to be a lot more flexible also.

ATi only had problems distributing the X800 because they focused on their Tier 1 OEM partners, they released a few weeks ago or maybe longer that with future generation cards they will be balancing this OEM - Retail distribution technique so they dont leave us totally in the dark.

 

[SickBeast]

If MS is smart, they will make it possible to install PC games on the Xbox2. Apoppin posted something about compatibility, but I'm pretty sure they're just referring to online gaming.

 

[zephyrprime]

Originally posted by: BFG10K
Not really. In fact static multitexturing is going the way of the Dodo and is being replaced by shaders.

how so?

 

[BFG10K]

how so?

Sure, the devs will use more and more shaders, but they will also make sure to use the extra TMU, as they have a set spec to design for.

Shaders are replacing texture units because traditional multitexturing is both primitive and restrictive. If ATi slaps on a second TMU but doesn't add any shader units they are in fact making a step backwards on the R520.

 

[BenSkywalker]

Shaders are replacing texture units because traditional multitexturing is both primitive and restrictive. If ATi slaps on a second TMU but doesn't add any shader units they are in fact making a step backwards on the R520.

Just wanted to throw out there that they still use the TMUs for filtering.

 

[nRollo]

The real question is will you be able to buy a X800XT PE for MSRP by the time this chip "launches"?

In any case, I don't believe anything I read on the Inquirer, but would be happy to see any new high end part hit the market.

 

[Pete]

Originally posted by: Insomniak
KotOR.


Best RPG I've played.

:thumbsup:

 

[imported_obsidian]

That is 6 months away...

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: obsidian
That is 6 months away...

The obvious . . .
. . . which most people don't realize . . .
. . . that is WHY i posted it
:roll:

Some people are thinking of upgrading - now . . . . this gives them a new factor to their "equation" . . . .



As to the XT-PE, it is pretty clear ati is going to have trouble with yield/availability . . . . maybe forever (much like nVidia's dustbuster; although it certainly is a powerful beast when/if you can get one) . . . .

. . . . this early Summer, when i first heard about the r520/nv50, i figured my 9800xt certainly will last another 12 months . . . . most 9800pros will too . . . by NEXT Summer, the 6800u/xtpe will certainly be half the price they are now . . . . and about that same time we should see GAMES that actually "stress" midrange (x800/6600) and older high-end videocards (9800p/xt) . . . . and sli will also be widely available.

Of course if you NEED it now . . . go 4 it!

 

[nRollo]

The obvious . . .
. . . which most people don't realize . . .
. . . that is WHY i posted it


Some people are thinking of upgrading - now . . . . this gives them a new factor to their "equation" . . . .

Not really.

The Inquirer is about as reliable as grafitti on the bathroom wall of a mental hospital. There might be some truth there, but odds are against it.

Inquirer tells us when we can buy XT PEs

The Platinum Edition version of the X800 will be powered by a 16-pipe pixel processing engine, clocked at 520MHz. This product has been paired with a 1.12GHz data rate GDDR3 memory, and a 256-bit memory interface. The product will ship this month at around $499.

Funny, I don't remember seeing any $499 XT PEs in May...(or if anyone did get one at that price, they were probably like 1/100,000 who ordered)

You'll forgive me if The Inquirer saying the next high end ATI chip will be available to developers by the end of quarter one 2005 doesn't make me say,"Yippie-skips! Retail R500s next March!"

I'll believe it when I can order for MSRP or less from Best Buy or Newegg, and this rumor wouldn't help me plan.

You sound like people who read this can actually take it as factual. "My 9800XT can last another six months! Then the R500 will be out and I'll buy that!"

Sounds nice- don't have to come up with any money now, get the smoking next gen in a few short months...

The reality is probably more like: A. Limp along in DX9 and Doom3/based with 9800XT at low framerates and detail settings, wishing for R500 B. R500 comes out next fall for big bucks, after you've spent 6 months cursing the Inquirer.

Ask 99.999999% of the people who ordered XT PEs back in May if you don't believe me.

BTW- by "limping along" I mean compared to current high end. Obviously 9800s are good mid range cards these days.

 

[BFG10K]

Just wanted to throw out there that they still use the TMUs for filtering.

AFAIK that's done on the shader now as part of legacy requirements isn't it? Static TMUs in the traditional sense are being phased out.

 

[IeraseU]

Given the many rumours of Xbox 2 at E3 2005 (sony and nintendo have already commited to showing next gen products at e3), I'd say the r500/r520 reports (now being reported at many gaming centric websites) probably have a fair bit of substance behind them.

I can see where someone might want to skip this particular generation if they did not absolutely have to upgrade.....even so, a 'tide you over product' might make sense.

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: IeraseU
Given the many rumours of Xbox 2 at E3 2005 (sony and nintendo have already commited to showing next gen products at e3), I'd say the r500/r520 reports (now being reported at many gaming centric websites) probably have a fair bit of substance behind them.

I can see where someone might want to skip this particular generation if they did not absolutely have to upgrade.....even so, a 'tide you over product' might make sense.

that IS my point . . .

last year's top cards are todays mid-cards ... . eg . . . my 9800xt hangs with the x700/6600 class of cards . . . . blazingly fast with last years games (as evidenced by 3DMark01 scores near 15-20K), decent for todays newest games (Doom III, Far Cry, Thief III and evidenced bt 3DMark03 scores of 5-6K) but slow for TOMORROW's games (as shown in 3DMark05):

3DMark Score: 2581
GT1 - Return to Proxycon 10.6 fps
GT2 - Firefly Forest 7.4 fps
GT3 - Canyon Flight 14.0 fps

CPU Score: 3581
CPU Test 1 1.9 fps
CPU Test 2 3.2 fps

(all at stock 9800xt speeds - no o/c)
Now do i even care about NEXT year's (and the year after) games? Clearly today's middle-high end cards won't "cut" it either

:roll:

It'll take r520/nv50 to make 3DMark05 (and the games of late 2005) smooth as 'butter' . . . . i'm skipping this gen of cards - at least till they are "bargains" (and considering future SLI options).

More options are always good.

edit: looks like SLI is not "vapourware

Nforce 4 will be born on the 19th October

Nvidia will introduce the SLI chipset when it decides it's the right time to do it, but it won't take long. The 65 driver series will support SLI setups and should be ready soon. You can already get OEM and beta versions of this driver, even with WHQL certification.

K8T890 might get nasty competition in this chipset arena, and ATI RX480 will follow shortly - at least in the same quarter.

r480 next quarter??!!!
edit: No . . . . i am mixing up r480 and rX 480.


(!)

:roll:

 

[Insomniak]

I'd crack up if ATi made a dual PEG slot chipset.

 

[Drayvn]

RX480 is the the chipset for the AMD motherboards by the way.

But yes, the R480 has just been taped out, so probably next quarter

Also if any of u didnt know, ATi are making Nintendos GPU also.

 

[Delorian]

Originally posted by: apoppin

Originally posted by: Delorian

Originally posted by: Rage187
I think they just make up sh1t so they can get hits on their website, go figure.

I agree :roll:

Even if the R500 is released in Q1 '05, it won't be widely available until Q4 '05 or later, I mean come on look how long it has taken to get production up on these new 6800 and x800 cards.

Realistically, IF the r500/r520 are released in Q1-'05, we can expect availability of desktop videocards by Summer('s end) and the X-Box II in stores for the X-mas season.

and MS DOES expect to make up any loss on their console on games, accessories, and online play. But i also think it will be more expensive than the original X-Box . . .

The nv40/x800 cards were announced in april, released in june which was 6/4 months ago. Cards are still a little harder to find than they should be (higher end of course). I've heard this is due to the recent "shortage" of memory chips for the new cards. If these new cards are announced in april 05 and released in june 05 with the assurance of 512mb cards, I wouldn't expect mass availability until about a year from now or later. I shudder to think of the prices of those cards.

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: Drayvn
RX480 is the the chipset for the AMD motherboards by the way.

But yes, the R480 has just been taped out, so probably next quarter

Also if any of u didnt know, ATi are making Nintendos GPU also.

You're right . . . i mixed up rX-480 (chipset) with r-480 (next fall refresh).

Quite easy to do with these stupid naming conventions.
:roll:

BTW (old news),
ATI to release R480 PCI Express in Q4
*CONFIRMED*



*(by the Inq)
:roll:

time for my nap.

EDIT: that was short.

BTW, someone was asking . . . CompUSA has the XTPE in STOCK ($500). . . . guess it's AVAILABLE, now.
:shocked:

:roll:

 

[klah]

Originally posted by: apoppin
BTW, someone was asking . . . CompUSA has the XTPE in STOCK ($500). . . . guess it's AVAILABLE, now.
:shocked:

:roll:

I doubt it. Both the ATI and Visiontek are listed as OOS and the 6 zip codes I entered showed all stores OOS as well.

 

[Drayvn]

Originally posted by: apoppin

Originally posted by: Drayvn
RX480 is the the chipset for the AMD motherboards by the way.

But yes, the R480 has just been taped out, so probably next quarter

Also if any of u didnt know, ATi are making Nintendos GPU also.

You're right . . . i mixed up rX-480 (chipset) with r-480 (next fall refresh).

Quite easy to do with these stupid naming conventions.
:roll:

BTW (old news),
ATI to release R480 PCI Express in Q4
*CONFIRMED*



*(by the Inq)
:roll:

time for my nap.

EDIT: that was short.

BTW, someone was asking . . . CompUSA has the XTPE in STOCK ($500). . . . guess it's AVAILABLE, now.
:shocked:

:roll:

Cheers bud, didnt know the PCI-E version was out already...