Question: how can I upgrade current budget system ?

[tommyncal]

I built my current system in July of 2009 and it now lags quite a bit. I figure its time for an upgrade or completely new system. Thought I'd ask for some help. Hopefully, all I would like to upgrade would be the MB, CPU & RAM. I would like to use the integrated graphics, but if needed, could buy a graphics card.
Usage: pretty simple, web surfing, light video streaming and light use of 'Lightroom' photo editing (just family photos).
Budget:not counting monitor, MB~$100, CPU~$125-$150, RAM~$40-$50. So, about $275 to $300. If needed, an inexpensive graphics card~$75.
I'm in the USA and usually buy through Newegg. Not sure if my existing parts will work with the newer parts (MB,CPU,RAM). I don't overclock and have a copy of Windows XP.
I'm looking to buy a new monitor, since my old one died and am using an old 17" CRT. Probably going to buy one of these 24" Asus monitors: PA248Q or VS248H-P
Current System:
MB: Gigabyte-MA78GM-US2H (onboard graphics AMD 780G w/ ATI Radeon HD3200)
CPU: AMD Athlon 64 X2 5600+
RAM: Kingston 2GB (2 x 1GB) DDR2 PC6400 800MHz
HDD: Western Digital 320GB IDE (WD3200AAJB-00WGA0)
Optical: Samsung
PSU: Antec Smart Power 450 watt
Case: Antec Sonata
My thoughts on new parts:
CPU: i3-3220 or i3-3225 (read somewhere the 3225 might have better onboard graphics???)
MB: no idea
RAM: 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Samsung or Corsair
Graphics: not sure if I need one
PSU; not sure if I need one
Thanks for any help and suggestions.

 

[RaistlinZ]

I think you'll need a new hard drive too, yes? I don't think anything really supports IDE anymore.

You'll want to factor in a small SSD for your OS and a regular SATA hard drive for storage. You can use onboard video unti you save up again for a video card.

 

[lehtv]

Your usage doesn't list anything GPU intensive, you will get by easily with just integrated graphics. Video streaming is CPU intensive.

An SSD is not necessary, any SATA HDD will be a good improvement over an IDE HDD anyway.

Asrock H77M $70 @newegg
i3-3225 $128 (hd 4000 graphics) @ncix
2x4GB G.Skill NS $42 @newegg
Seagate ST1500DM003 $70 @ncix

= $310

If you have to buy from newegg (don't see why), 3225 is $145, 3220 is $130, and ST1000DM005 is $65 AP. Alteratively WD Black 500GB with 5yr warranty for $70 AP, or 1TB for $105

 

[riversend]

Agree that you do not need the SSD or GPU. lehtv's build will be a nice improvement over what you have.

 

[VirtualLarry]

have you thought of buying just an AM3 quad-core like a 630 or 640, and then an ssd?

Intel's IGP isn't that much better than your existing one.

Oh yes, get Windows 7, the drivers for the 780G under XP don't accelerate much.

Edit: Get one of these:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16819103871

Edit: Even if you did go with the Intel solution, I wouldn't expect the drivers for XP (if they are even available) to do that much for you.

 

[Torn Mind]

With a BIOS update, your mobo does support Phenom IIs. However, a new 8GB of DDR2 RAM costs an arm and a leg these days.

 

[DominionSeraph]

Your computer should be fine. I've been photo editing and legacy gaming on an X2 5200+/2GB machine since 2006, so I'm rather aware of what such a system is capable of, and your usage shouldn't be taxing it.

Try reinstalling Windows. Preferably a fresh format and installed to its own partition. (Making a ~20GB partition solely for Windows and your most-used apps keeps performance up because it keeps your most-used files physically close together on the fastest part of your hard drive. Even if the files get fragmented, they're still right there.)

Of course, you're lucky in that your motherboard supports 125W processors. You have a rather nice upgrade route right into a Phenom II X4:
http://us.ncix.com/products/?sku=46281&vpn=HDZ965FBGMBOX&manufacture=AMD&promoid=1201

$90 X4 965 beats the hell outta $200 on an i3 + mobo.

With a BIOS update, your mobo does support Phenom IIs. However, a new 8GB of DDR2 RAM costs an arm and a leg these days.

He doesn't need 8GB.

4GB for $30:
http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2293636&highlight=ddr2

That gives him 6GB.

 

[tommyncal]

Your computer should be fine. I've been photo editing and legacy gaming on an X2 5200+/2GB machine since 2006, so I'm rather aware of what such a system is capable of, and your usage shouldn't be taxing it.

Try reinstalling Windows. Preferably a fresh format and installed to its own partition. (Making a ~20GB partition solely for Windows and your most-used apps keeps performance up because it keeps your most-used files physically close together on the fastest part of your hard drive. Even if the files get fragmented, they're still right there.)

Of course, you're lucky in that your motherboard supports 125W processors. You have a rather nice upgrade route right into a Phenom II X4:
http://us.ncix.com/products/?sku=46281&vpn=HDZ965FBGMBOX&manufacture=AMD&promoid=1201

$90 X4 965 beats the hell outta $200 on an i3 + mobo.



He doesn't need 8GB.

4GB for $30:
http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2293636&highlight=ddr2

That gives him 6GB.

So, are you saying I could just replace the CPU without a BIOS upgrade? Then just reformat with a separate partition for the OS and not sure what other programs.

I also have a Seagate SATA 500GB HDD that I have been using for external backup. I could switch my HDD's??

 

[tommyncal]

Your usage doesn't list anything GPU intensive, you will get by easily with just integrated graphics. Video streaming is CPU intensive.

An SSD is not necessary, any SATA HDD will be a good improvement over an IDE HDD anyway.

Asrock H77M $70 @newegg
i3-3225 $128 (hd 4000 graphics) @ncix
2x4GB G.Skill NS $42 @newegg
Seagate ST1500DM003 $70 @ncix

= $310

If you have to buy from newegg (don't see why), 3225 is $145, 3220 is $130, and ST1000DM005 is $65 AP. Alteratively WD Black 500GB with 5yr warranty for $70 AP, or 1TB for $105

So, I could switch in my external Seagate 500GB SATA HDD? Then just get the MB,i3 & Ram for aproximately $250? For my usage do you think it would be a lot of improvement over my existing system (also switching in my SATA HDD) by just replacing my CPU to the Phenom II CPU for about $90?

 

[Smoove910]

Personally I would do this:

Realize that 2x1gb ram on Windows 7 is skimping pretty low. Because 4 or 8 gb of DDR2 is quite expensive, I would automatically think about DDR3 which can get you 8gb for around $50.

Now since your current mobo doesn't support DDR3, I would start looking for something that does, and also supports AM2+, or AM3+ if you want the latest and greatest AMD offerings. If you want a simple X4 Athlon II or Phenom II, an AM2+ board will be sufficient. This will cost around $50-$100

For processor I would go with this: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16819103871

Lastly, since your HD is IDE, you would need to upgrade to SATA... I'd go with Western Digital offerings. IF you are wanting to feel saucy, get an SSD as suggested and your system will scream.

You could always go the Intel route, but I'm not well-versed enough to know how an i3 compares to the proc I linked you to. I just like AMD stuff, so I went that route for you.

Good Luck!

 

[mfenn]

So, I could switch in my external Seagate 500GB SATA HDD? Then just get the MB,i3 & Ram for aproximately $250? For my usage do you think it would be a lot of improvement over my existing system (also switching in my SATA HDD) by just replacing my CPU to the Phenom II CPU for about $90?

Depends on what exact drive it is. A lot of drives sold as externals are 5400RPM, which would be slower (or at least not faster) than your current drive.

How much storage do you need? If it's not much, I'm thinking something like:

Pentium G645 $70
ASRock B75M-DGS $55
G.Skill DDR3 1600 8GB $42 - not all of it will be available until you upgrade to a 64-bit OS
Corsair Neutron 120GB $120
Total: $287

What you're doing is not really CPU bound, so while this will give you a reasonable CPU upgrade, that's not really the point. What it does instead is give you a lot more RAM and a very fast storage system.

 

[DominionSeraph]

So, are you saying I could just replace the CPU without a BIOS upgrade? Then just reformat with a separate partition for the OS and not sure what other programs.

I'd first do the reformat with your current setup and see how that works. An X2 is really fine for your use -- it sounds more like Windows has just gotten slower with age or possibly your hard drive's performance has fallen and so that might need to be replaced. Run an HDTune benchmark and post it here so we can see what we're dealing with.

I see no reason for you to be upgrading to a new system for web browsing. It's not like you're on a single-core Pentium 4, here -- your X2 has the muscle to do 1080p Youtube without any GPU offload. I was really just recommending the Phenom because the retail channel is going to empty of new ones, but they were a very popular chip so you can always pick up one used when it's actually time to upgrade.

(If you have the upgrade itch, this guy has a 955 for $60: http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2295186&highlight=phenom)

I also have a Seagate SATA 500GB HDD that I have been using for external backup. I could switch my HDD's??

Benchmark both and see which is faster.

 

[Mloot]

n/m

 

[tracerbullet]

IMO: Add an SSD for Windows (using the existing 320GB for data storage), add another 2-4GB of RAM, then wipe and reinstall Windows and it'll feel like a brand new machine. I just did this to my parents computer over the holidays, mom surfs and dad Photoshops, and they couldn't believe the difference.

Monitor, even mouse / keyboard are nice too if you have leftover budget, as for the "feels like a new computer" thing.

 

[tommyncal]

Thanks to all for the help and suggestions. I think my first course of action will be to reformat and put the OS in it's own 20GB partition and switch in my Seagate 500GB SATA 7200/RPM HDD. I'll see if this helps the sluggishness or not. For some reason I can't add attachments so this was my WD 320GB IDE HDD benchmark test results. I have no idea what they mean.

Min Transfer Rate: 13.9MB/sec
Max Transfer Rate: 30.3 MB/sec
Avg Transfer Rate: 29.2 MB/sec
Access Time: 12.5 ms
Burst Rate: 28.4 MB/sec
CPU Usage: 2.8%

 

[DominionSeraph]

Min Transfer Rate: 13.9MB/sec
Max Transfer Rate: 30.3 MB/sec
Avg Transfer Rate: 29.2 MB/sec
Access Time: 12.5 ms
Burst Rate: 28.4 MB/sec
CPU Usage: 2.8%

Ok, that's weird. Your average transfer rate is almost the same as your max and your burst. I think you might be running in ATA-33 mode which limits the interface to 33MB/s.
Switching to the SATA drive would bypass that problem.

 

[VirtualLarry]

Yeah, those disk benchmarks look off. An old 40GB IDE drive I used to have, benchmarked faster.

If DS's theory is right, try deleting the IDE controllers in Windows, and letting them re-install.

I have some 30GB OCZ Agility SSDs, if you're interested in a cheap starter SSD.

 

[Torn Mind]

Thanks to all for the help and suggestions. I think my first course of action will be to reformat and put the OS in it's own 20GB partition and switch in my Seagate 500GB SATA 7200/RPM HDD. I'll see if this helps the sluggishness or not. For some reason I can't add attachments so this was my WD 320GB IDE HDD benchmark test results. I have no idea what they mean.

Min Transfer Rate: 13.9MB/sec
Max Transfer Rate: 30.3 MB/sec
Avg Transfer Rate: 29.2 MB/sec
Access Time: 12.5 ms
Burst Rate: 28.4 MB/sec
CPU Usage: 2.8%

Did you try defragmenting first?

 

[VirtualLarry]

Did you try defragmenting first?

If that's an HDTune read benchmark, which I suspect it is, then it accesses the HDD as a block device, and bypasses the filesystem. Thus defragmenting would have no effect on that benchmark.

 

[Insert_Nickname]

Thanks to all for the help and suggestions. I think my first course of action will be to reformat and put the OS in it's own 20GB partition and switch in my Seagate 500GB SATA 7200/RPM HDD. I'll see if this helps the sluggishness or not. For some reason I can't add attachments so this was my WD 320GB IDE HDD benchmark test results. I have no idea what they mean.

Min Transfer Rate: 13.9MB/sec
Max Transfer Rate: 30.3 MB/sec
Avg Transfer Rate: 29.2 MB/sec
Access Time: 12.5 ms
Burst Rate: 28.4 MB/sec
CPU Usage: 2.8%

Ok, that's weird. Your average transfer rate is almost the same as your max and your burst. I think you might be running in ATA-33 mode which limits the interface to 33MB/s.
Switching to the SATA drive would bypass that problem.

Ouch. Looks more like USB transfer rates then IDE... :\

You might want to make sure that it's running UDMA-6 and not PIO or something.

 

[Torn Mind]

If that's an HDTune read benchmark, which I suspect it is, then it accesses the HDD as a block device, and bypasses the filesystem. Thus defragmenting would have no effect on that benchmark.

I know that.

Maybe Windows has set it to PIO mode?

http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/147161-45-forcing-mode-primary-hard-drive

Open Device Manager.

Double-click IDE ATA/ATAPI Controllers to display the
list of controllers and channels.

Right-click the icon for the channel to which the device
is connected, select Properties, and then click
the Advanced Settings tab.

In the Current Transfer Mode drop-down box, select "DMA
if Available" if the current setting is "PIO Only".

If the drop-down box already shows "DMA if Available" but
the current transfer mode is "PIO Only", then the
user must toggle the settings.

That is:
Change the selection from "DMA if available" to "PIO
only", and click OK. Then repeat the steps above to
change the selection to "DMA if Available".

 

[tommyncal]

First, why won't this forum let me post attachments? Then I could just attach the HD benchmark chart.

 

[Pedroc1999]

I rememember looking at DDR2 not too long ago and 8gb costing over £80, you can get 32gb or maybe even 64gb of 1600 DDR3 for that money!

 

[AnonymouseUser]

First, why won't this forum let me post attachments? Then I could just attach the HD benchmark chart.

It's an option that isn't enabled by admins. They have their reasons. There is a site for Anandtech members (requires registration) to use to post images here, if they want to, or you could just use imgur.

Also, Phenom II X4 or X6 plus RAM would be my upgrade recommendation.

 

[Pedroc1999]

^^^ The above and a DDR3 based Mobo