Question for Darwinists

[huberm]

Originally posted by: KingGheedora

Originally posted by: everman

Originally posted by: KingGheedora

Originally posted by: huberm
This is just something I have been thinking about lately and in no way am trying to offend anyone. I am not trying to be judgemental nor am I trying to force any beliefs onto anyone else. I am simply curious as to what others think.

So here goes:

Regardless of if the big bang theory, evolution, etc is correct, didn't the matter have to come from somewhere? You cannot have an effect without a cause, can you?

What makes you think matter had to come from somewhere?

Entropy.

What does entropy have to do with matter existing? Isn't entropy about energy? And dude, your post about the hyperdimensional "white mice" had me laughing my ass off. Is that a reference to a movie or something, or did you just come up with that?

There is good evidence that the universe had a beginning, which can be shown from the laws of thermodynamics:

1st law: the TOTAL amount of mass-energy in the universe is CONSTANT.
2nd law: the amount of energy AVAILABLE FOR WORK is running out, or entropy is
increasing to a maximum.

If the total amount of energy is limited and the amount of usable energy is decreasing, the universe cannot have existed forever (otherwise it would have already exhausted its usable energy).

So, my logical conclusion is the universe began a finite time ago with bunches of energy and is now depleting.

Likewise, I feel the universe can't be self caused. Nothing can create itself because that would mean it existed before it came into existence, which is absurd.

 

[everman]

Originally posted by: KingGheedora

Originally posted by: everman

Originally posted by: KingGheedora

Originally posted by: huberm
This is just something I have been thinking about lately and in no way am trying to offend anyone. I am not trying to be judgemental nor am I trying to force any beliefs onto anyone else. I am simply curious as to what others think.

So here goes:

Regardless of if the big bang theory, evolution, etc is correct, didn't the matter have to come from somewhere? You cannot have an effect without a cause, can you?

What makes you think matter had to come from somewhere?

Entropy.

What does entropy have to do with matter existing? Isn't entropy about energy? And dude, your post about the hyperdimensional "white mice" had me laughing my ass off. Is that a reference to a movie or something, or did you just come up with that?

stolen from the hitchhiker's guide to the galaxy You clearly need to read it

What I meant about entropy is that eventually everything slows down and the universe would need to be wound up again so to speak. So either we are on the first round(unlikely), or we were wound up again somehow (big shrink?), or something else added more energy back into the system. So in order for the universe to exist forever there needs to be some way to reverse entropy. I guess this doesn't really answer where did matter come from, just how long can we keep on these shenanigans before we run out of energy?

And on that note you can read "the last question" from Asimov. You can find the short story freely on the internets.

 

[TechBoyJK]

Originally posted by: Strk

Originally posted by: RapidSnail

Originally posted by: dug777
Meh, you miss the point of what darwin actually set out to explain, and which we now know far more about, evolution.

Where does it say anything about the big bang?

Damn religious jackasses

Personally, i can't see why a belief in a 'god' and a rational understanding of the science of evolution can't quite happily co-exist?

I believe they contradict each other. At least it does Christianity. I don't know about Catholicism, Mormonism, Jehovah's Witnesses, etc.

You only listed denominations of Christianity.

Religion and science can happily coexist, it's just that you have some people who take the bible literally, which has a few issues with things like evolution (the world being more than 6,000 years old, everything not being the same as it was when created etc). However, many religious people take the bible more metaphorically (i.e. Genesis shows G_d's connection, love and devotion, but Eden, Adam & Eve and so on didn't actually exist).

ive come to the conclusion that whether or not something is true in the Bible doesn't make the story the useful or not. I've opened up the bible to random spots and read just a few paragraphs and told myself, damn, had I thought about that 2 years ago, i wouldnt have made such a retarted mistake..

and the 10 commandments... regardless of where they came from, obeying them keeps you safe, in general.. dont covet thy neighbor's wife? go ahead and bang her, but her jealous hubby might shove a shotgun down your throat... Dont steal? get caught and the person you were trying to steal from might cut your hands off. Dont murder? murder him, but his family will murder you harder.

 

[alien42]

a single point

 

[WHAMPOM]

Matter tumbles through the eleven dimensions appearing and disappearing from our limited perception. The imperceptible dimensions being where the dark matter hides.

 

[dug777]

Well, since the OP kindly ignored my post, i'll assume he's just a rude religious nutter who doesn't actually understand what the concept of 'darwinism/evolution' actually means, has no desire of actually learning anything, and therefore, like most rude religious trolls, isn't worth wasting my time arguing with :roll:

 

[imported_Macros]

Originally posted by: Kenazo

Originally posted by: sourceninja
Matter is eternal, it has always existed.

Wouldn't energy be the eternal part?

E=mc^2

 

[cubby1223]

Sheesh, it's so simple people. God first said, "Let there be me." And it was. Then, God said, "Let there be matter." And too, it was. With a final decree, God then said, "Let there be creation debates at ATOT on Saturday evenings." And thus concluding our history lesson bringing us from the beginning all the way to present day.

 

[dug777]

Originally posted by: cubby1223
Sheesh, it's so simple people. God first said, "Let there be me." And it was. Then, God said, "Let there be matter." And too, it was. With a final decree, God then said, "Let there be creation debates at ATOT on Saturday evenings." And thus concluding our history lesson bringing us from the beginning all the way to present day.

He also said 'let dug777 be in the future & sh1t', so it's early sunday arvo here

 

[judasmachine]

Originally posted by: oldsmoboat
Where did god come from?

Originally posted by: her209
Its unanswerable at the moment. And note the same question can be posed for God.

QFT

 

[sourceninja]

Originally posted by: huberm

Originally posted by: sourceninja
Matter is eternal, it has always existed.

is there any theory or scientific proof that supports this? (sorry I am very curious)

Is there a theory that doesn't?