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Pro Union? Anti Union?

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As a former union member, I will say that I am anti union but I will join one.

Why?

Overpaid, underworked. Promotes an environment of being equally lazy and feelings of entitlement.
 
As much as I dislike unions (they often allow lazy people to get more than they deserve), I'd love to see someone actually make an IT workers union work. The bargaining power of an IT union would be amazing!

Imagine getting all of the programmers and system administrators in a company to go on strike at once, making sure to turn off all of the servers on the way out. It sure as hell wouldn't be a long strike, as the entire corporation's business would likely freeze to a halt when their e-mail and ordering systems go down. Getting a "server not found" error when going to the companyname.com website wouldn't do much for business, either 🙂 This wouldn't be like an auto workers strike or a writers strike where the company would go on a few weeks without them... we're talking a total business shutdown like a transit strike in many cases.
 
Originally posted by: ultimatebob
As much as I dislike unions (they often allow lazy people to get more than they deserve), I'd love to see someone actually make an IT workers union work. The bargaining power of an IT union would be amazing!

Imagine getting all of the programmers and system administrators in a company to go on strike at once, making sure to turn off all of the servers on the way out. It sure as hell wouldn't be a long strike, as the entire corporation's business would likely freeze to a halt when their e-mail and ordering systems go down. Getting a "server not found" error when going to the companyname.com website wouldn't do much for business, either 🙂 This wouldn't be like an auto workers strike or a writers strike where the company would go on a few weeks without them... we're talking a total business shutdown like a transit strike in many cases.
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this idiot is what gives unions a bad name
and my union has a no strike clause
IBEW FTW
 
Even if I didn't join the union where I work, they force you to pay the union fee anyway. So they have everyone by the balls here. I hate how they negotiate pay for everyone as well. I'd much rather have raises based on ability than union enforced raises spread out over everyone.
 
Originally posted by: ppdes
Even if I didn't join the union where I work, they force you to pay the union fee anyway. So they have everyone by the balls here. I hate how they negotiate pay for everyone as well. I'd much rather have raises based on ability than union enforced raises spread out over everyone.
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But I DESERVE $14 an hour for doing the bare minimum required work! And goddamnit, I am going to do the bare minimum for 25 years until my pension is fully vested.

Don't like my attitude? Too bad, I got seniority 😀
 
Originally posted by: bctbct
I love how everyone thinks lazy people only exist in Union enviornments.
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lazy people exist everywhere. Getting rewarded for your laziness however is like a union rule.
 
Originally posted by: Ns1
Originally posted by: bctbct
I love how everyone thinks lazy people only exist in Union enviornments.
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lazy people exist everywhere. Getting rewarded for your laziness however is like a union rule.
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Many work places have a pay scale based on longevity.
 
Originally posted by: bctbct
Originally posted by: Ns1
Originally posted by: bctbct
I love how everyone thinks lazy people only exist in Union enviornments.
Click to expand...

lazy people exist everywhere. Getting rewarded for your laziness however is like a union rule.
Click to expand...


Many work places have a pay scale based on longevity.
Click to expand...

reward =/= pay
 
Originally posted by: TheSiege
Originally posted by: Jumpem
Anti-union and I would decline a job that required me to join one.
Click to expand...

no job can require you to join one
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wrong. The job I worked at required it before a certain date. But I had quit it before they could fire me--and I never paid my union fees. Suckahs!!
 
Originally posted by: TehMac
Originally posted by: TheSiege
Originally posted by: Jumpem
Anti-union and I would decline a job that required me to join one.
Click to expand...

no job can require you to join one
Click to expand...

wrong. The job I worked at required it before a certain date. But I had quit it before they could fire me--and I never paid my union fees. Suckahs!!
Click to expand...

ok no employer in a right to work state
 
Originally posted by: TheSiege
Originally posted by: TehMac
Originally posted by: TheSiege
Originally posted by: Jumpem
Anti-union and I would decline a job that required me to join one.
Click to expand...

no job can require you to join one
Click to expand...

wrong. The job I worked at required it before a certain date. But I had quit it before they could fire me--and I never paid my union fees. Suckahs!!
Click to expand...

ok no employer in a right to work state
Click to expand...

Correcto.
 
Originally posted by: FallenHero
Originally posted by: Excelsior
Originally posted by: Glavinsolo
Originally posted by: Journer
unions are the worst thing to happen to any company. period. they are never, ever good. they do more harm than they do good. look at the union of the states...if we were still a confederacy (like it should have been) things would be fine.
Click to expand...

PSST....
...
The north won
Click to expand...

PSST...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Articles_of_Confederation
Click to expand...

Failed...miserably. It took multiple wars for people to even think of The United States as more than what state they were from.
Click to expand...

it should have stayed that way. america has soo many stupid problems because of the separation of it's people. the ideals of people in say, california, simply do not agree with those in say, Alabama. these people should not be forced to abide by rules that are set from people thousands of miles away. it's bullshit. fine, if californians want to control smoking, emissions, and all the other crazy shit they do, i could care less. but when you try to force said laws on everyone else because you think you are the smartest, thats where the problems lie. thusly, the federal gov. is the cause of almost all of our problems. a confederacy could have brought everything we have now without so much oppression on state authority.

back on subject. again, unions NEVER work and they are bullshit. they should be illegal. if i own a business, nobody should be able to tell me how to run it as long as i am not doing anything illegal. if you dont like it then quit. look what unions have done to the industrial companies like ford. the problem is the corruption. the union leaders get greedy and do everything for themselves instead of the workers. and all this seniority stuff is BULLSHIT. if i have more talent and do a better job than the old fart next to me i should be making more money and the company should replace him with a more talented person. that is life...
 
Originally posted by: Journer
Originally posted by: FallenHero
Originally posted by: Excelsior
Originally posted by: Glavinsolo
Originally posted by: Journer
unions are the worst thing to happen to any company. period. they are never, ever good. they do more harm than they do good. look at the union of the states...if we were still a confederacy (like it should have been) things would be fine.
Click to expand...

PSST....
...
The north won
Click to expand...

PSST...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Articles_of_Confederation
Click to expand...

Failed...miserably. It took multiple wars for people to even think of The United States as more than what state they were from.
Click to expand...

it should have stayed that way. america has soo many stupid problems because of the separation of it's people. the ideals of people in say, california, simply do not agree with those in say, Alabama. these people should not be forced to abide by rules that are set from people thousands of miles away. it's bullshit. fine, if californians want to control smoking, emissions, and all the other crazy shit they do, i could care less. but when you try to force said laws on everyone else because you think you are the smartest, thats where the problems lie. thusly, the federal gov. is the cause of almost all of our problems. a confederacy could have brought everything we have now without so much oppression on state authority.

back on subject. again, unions NEVER work and they are bullshit. they should be illegal. if i own a business, nobody should be able to tell me how to run it as long as i am not doing anything illegal. if you dont like it then quit. look what unions have done to the industrial companies like ford. the problem is the corruption. the union leaders get greedy and do everything for themselves instead of the workers. and all this seniority stuff is BULLSHIT. if i have more talent and do a better job than the old fart next to me i should be making more money and the company should replace him with a more talented person. that is life...
Click to expand...

Yea, because WW 2 would have turned out great if America was a weak federation of states, and no one gave a shit when Hawaii was attacked, let alone was able to mobilize massive industrial production.
 
Originally posted by: Journer
Originally posted by: FallenHero
Originally posted by: Excelsior
Originally posted by: Glavinsolo
Originally posted by: Journer
unions are the worst thing to happen to any company. period. they are never, ever good. they do more harm than they do good. look at the union of the states...if we were still a confederacy (like it should have been) things would be fine.
Click to expand...

PSST....
...
The north won
Click to expand...

PSST...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Articles_of_Confederation
Click to expand...

Failed...miserably. It took multiple wars for people to even think of The United States as more than what state they were from.
Click to expand...

it should have stayed that way. america has soo many stupid problems because of the separation of it's people. the ideals of people in say, california, simply do not agree with those in say, Alabama. these people should not be forced to abide by rules that are set from people thousands of miles away. it's bullshit. fine, if californians want to control smoking, emissions, and all the other crazy shit they do, i could care less. but when you try to force said laws on everyone else because you think you are the smartest, thats where the problems lie. thusly, the federal gov. is the cause of almost all of our problems. a confederacy could have brought everything we have now without so much oppression on state authority.

back on subject. again, unions NEVER work and they are bullshit. they should be illegal. if i own a business, nobody should be able to tell me how to run it as long as i am not doing anything illegal. if you dont like it then quit. look what unions have done to the industrial companies like ford. the problem is the corruption. the union leaders get greedy and do everything for themselves instead of the workers. and all this seniority stuff is BULLSHIT. if i have more talent and do a better job than the old fart next to me i should be making more money and the company should replace him with a more talented person. that is life...
Click to expand...

As I said, they have largely BECOME corrupted...however initially they were the salvation of the citizen. Because of that your statement that they 'never' work is incorrect. They were absolutely essential to the formation of our nation.

You should also realize that it varies by geography...America is very sparsely unionized now, while many other nations are heavily unionized and it works for them. The difference is in our legal system, our corporate environment, and our unions themselves. But again, to say that they 'never' work is an absolute falsehood demonstrating total lack of knowledge on the subject.
 
Originally posted by: Turin39789
Yea, because WW 2 would have turned out great if America was a weak federation of states,
Click to expand...

That was changed by Lincoln and the Civil War. And even before that I wouldn't call the USA weak. We fought the world's most powerful empire twice, and also kicked butt to the shores of Tripoli.

and no one gave a shit when Hawaii was attacked, let alone was able to mobilize massive industrial production.
Click to expand...

Remember the Maine! Spain in Cuba got the USA riled up. We didn't need Unions to be upset and take action about the Japanese killing our soldiers and sinking our ships.

What you said is a non sequitur anyways.
 
I'm pro-union and I support closed shop agreements. You want to work here, you join and pay dues. You object to that? Find a different job.
 
I would join if it was expected I join.

I wouldn't work for Ford and not join the UAW.


As far as whether or not I like unions, well that depends on the industry and union.


Certain industries still need unions so employees get a fair deal. In other industries like auto the unions are bankrupting the hand that fees them (ie ford).
 
Originally posted by: BoomerD
I'm pro-union and I support closed shop agreements. You want to work here, you join and pay dues. You object to that? Find a different job.
Click to expand...

Any reasoning behind that sentiment? I think that fairly absurd, myself.
 
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