Pregnant nurse fired for not taking flu vaccine

[abj13]

I am trying not to offend anyone.

As I have posted in various threads, the weak minded resort to insults.

http://www.examiner.com/article/massive-increase-miscarriages-from-flu-vaccine-ncow-claims

You just quoted your moronic study posted several messages back, which has been already discredited as an anti-vaccine crap paper that doesn't even include some basic science concepts, or even understand that around 15% of ALL recognized pregnancies result in spontaneous abortion.

Next time read your study, and read your own damn links.

The influenza vaccine is recommended in ALL pregnancies. Why are the CDC, ACIP, ACOG, etc all liars about the safety of the vaccine in pregnancy?

 

[TraumaRN]

I am trying not to offend anyone.

As I have posted in various threads, the weak minded resort to insults.




http://www.examiner.com/article/massive-increase-miscarriages-from-flu-vaccine-ncow-claims

Oh look at you backtrack...

Moreover look at you ignoring the vast body of my response just like you continue to do with everyone else.

Secondly,

BUHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAH *deep breath* BUHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHA

Tell me why you think it is a valid claim considering it is not peer reviewed and so grossly abnormal as a result as to defy logic? This is garbage, it's not research. Ever heard of GIGO(garbage in, garbage out). That is describes exactly what you posted. That link is hot putrid garbage that is not close to meeting the rigors of science or peer review.

Moreover, the examiner doesn't exactly strike me as a bastion of scientific literature.

Care to try again on finding a peer reviewed scientific article/study that supports your claim?

 

[Texashiker]

Tell me why you think it is a valid claim considering it is not peer reviewed and so grossly abnormal as a result as to defy logic? This is garbage, it's not research. Ever heard of GIGO(garbage in, garbage out). That is describes exactly what you posted. That link is hot putrid garbage that is not close to meeting the rigors of science or peer review.

Do you have a peer reviewed study to support your claim that the flu vaccine is safe for women with a history of miscarriages?

yes or no?

You just quoted your moronic study posted several messages back, which has been already discredited as an anti-vaccine crap paper that doesn't even include some basic science concepts, or even understand that around 15% of ALL recognized pregnancies result in spontaneous abortion.

You already said you do not have a study, why are you still posting?

 

[TraumaRN]

Do you have a peer reviewed study to support your claim that the flu vaccine is safe for women with a history of miscarriages?

yes or no?




You already said you do not have a study, why are you still posting?

For the 100th time we have posted research. The answer is resoundingly YES you should vaccinate said pregnant woman and that it is safe. You refuse to accept it. You are flat out WRONG. You are literally using the same tactics as an anti-vaxxer.

Moreover, the burden of proof remains on you. You are the one making the claim so back it up with some scientific peer reviewed research.

Moreover at this point I'm curious, what kind of work do you even do? Are you even involved in science at all?

 

[abj13]

Do you have a peer reviewed study to support your claim that the flu vaccine is safe for women with a history of miscarriages?

yes or no?

You already said you do not have a study, why are you still posting?

No, I've posted several studies. You somehow think one is a powerpoint, since you've never heard of the official journal of the ACOG. Another study you ignored since you haven't heard of the journal of Vaccine. The third you don't even understand what a cohort study is even in reference to. And you still ignore: Moro PL, Broder K, Zheteyeva Y, Walton K, Rohan P, Sutherland A, Guh A, Haber P, Destefano F, Vellozzi C.Adverse events in pregnant women following administration of trivalent inactivated influenza vaccine and live attenuated influenza vaccine in the Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System, 1990-2009. Am J Obstet Gynecol. 2011 Feb;204(2):146.

Better question, why are you posting? You don't read studies. You don't address why the ACOG, CDC, AAP, WHO, ECDC all recommend the vaccine despite your denials, and why the VAERS system hasn't triggered an alert about the safety?

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Do you have a peer reviewed study to support your claim that the flu vaccine is safe for women with a history of miscarriages?

Do you have peer reviewed studies that the name Throatwarblermangrove does not make you immune to explosive data? If you don't then changing your name may save your life.

 

[DrPizza]

You yourself said 5.56%,,, or somewhere around there.

That is so small of a sample it is not even worth mentioning,

Ahhhhh, you suck at math too!

So, let's say that there was a study of people with celiac disease, and 100% of the participants in a study had that disease, you would consider that sufficient. But, if in another study, if they looked at a much larger population where those with celiac disease made up about 1% of that group, you'd find their data to be "so small of a sample."

But, in the first case, 100% of the participants could mean 3 out of 3. And in the second study, it could be the entire population of the US, meaning that EVERY person in the US with celiac disease was studied - you would find that "so small of a sample."

You suck at math.
And science.

 

[DrPizza]

My debate is not about the vaccine so much as civil rights.
<snip>
You are jumping to conclusions that this is an anti-vaccine thread, and you are wrong.

I never said I was anti-vaccine.

Insomuch as this thread is about the flu vaccine, you most certainly are anti-flu-vaccine.

Unless there are underlying conditions, there is no reason for a healthy adult to get a flu vaccine.

Which, by the way, is a false statement, because historically we know that many types of flu kill infants and the old; but some types of flu have largely not killed those groups, but instead, killed healthy adults.

 

[mikeymikec]

So anyone is free to make any statement they want, and other people have the responsibility to prove the statement wrong?

No, but apparently you think you are free to make any statement you want without any evidence, and other people have the responsibility to prove the statement wrong.

Your current goal-shifted argument has already been blown out of the water through logic but you're still beating the same drum. I'd quote the posts, but you would just ignore it, just like you've ignored several posts I've made that are directly relevant.

As someone else has said - it's time for you to bring some evidence to the table. Everyone else thinks you're wrong, you haven't been able to dispute their logic, and you're wondering why people are acting this way. Yours is the argument that is lacking substance here.

IMO, the only evidence that would aid your argument at this point would be a general study that shows up some anomalies in relevant high-risk pregnancy categories which would conclude that more studies need to be done in those areas, or preferably a study in response to that one which addresses those concerns. Unfortunately for your argument, as I've said before, your query is so vague because saying "people with a higher risk of miscarriage" is like saying "people at higher risk of having headaches", there's a load of entirely unrelated reasons why people might be in that category.

If the person described in the OP had experienced miscarriages due to a particular (positively identified by a medical professional) unusual factor, then perhaps finding studies have been performed with regard to that particular unusual factor and the flu vaccine would be appropriate.

One other thing, did you actually read up on the "National Coalition of Organised Women" (and by "read up" I mean "at least spend a couple of minutes googling them") before posting that crap?
Some interesting reading for you:
http://www.skepdic.com/skeptimedia/skeptimedia117.html

 

[Moonbeam]

Nobody can reach Texashiker because he believes that it is not fair to make women do something that could put their fetus at risk. You will never be able to reach him because he is right, and can feel it in his bones. All of you who are trying to convince him he is wrong also all believe that women's fetuses should be protected from things that could put them at risk. We are all on the same side. Texashiker is a good person. He aims for what is right. He is just defective in his analysis of what risk is. His paranoia that a high risk pregnant woman COULD BE at threat from untested vaccines can't be allayed by scientific data that is beyond his level of training to assess. Where a trained scientist can make out risk in a rational way he sees darkness and into that darkness he projects the monsters who would harm pregnant women our of hubris and arrogant ignorant certainty, the very things which are blinding him. He does not want to see that the battle he wages against callus indifference to women is what he can be like himself. He does not trust the data and doesn't think anybody can. He is as limited in understanding the capacity of others to objectively evaluate the data based of a real concern for pregnant women because he can't do that himself. When you can't do something and you have been told that value equals proficiency, you can wind up pretending you are as capable as others. But the reason we trust in experts and authorities is because we can't all be in all areas at all times. This is why sane and modest people, folk not infected with arrogance, will listen to other people without making stupid conditions. And once you realize that you do this, insert absurd conditions, you need to learn to make an effort not to insert your blindness into every conceivable matter no matter what the subject is. The medical folk that make medical decisions that affect people's lives and health also have the same moral standards as you do and in addition have trained their whole lives to make them as best they can. Show some modesty out of respect. There will be lots and lots of young doctors and researchers out there gunning to find flaws in current scientific thinking, in order to improve medicine and make names for themselves. It's not a wise fisherman who wades too far out into the river.

 

[glenn1]

Certainly not.

If you say you are an RN, then I respect that.

Not at all.

We use studies to help prove or disprove a point. Professionals are supposed to base their judgements and decisions on those studies.

There are no studies on the flu vaccine on high risk pregnancies with a history of miscarriages. However, we can make an educated decision with the evidence we have on hand.

But without a peer reviewed study all we are really doing is speculating.

Don't women deserve more than speculation?

TexasHiker medicine:

 

[glenn1]

Do you have a peer reviewed study to support your claim that the flu vaccine is safe for women with a history of miscarriages?

yes or no?

You already said you do not have a study, why are you still posting?

 

[Texashiker]

you most certainly are anti-flu-vaccine.

That is simply not true.

My personal decision about my health are just that, my decisions.

Were you sitting in my living room when I told my step-son he should get the flu shot? He works face-to-face with the public and has 3 small children.

Were you listening on my phone last year when my wife told me she got her flu shot, and I said good job? My wife works face-to-face with the public and has underlying health conditions.

My wife is going this evening to walgreens to get her flu shot. If walgreens offers flumist I will get that, but I am not taking no dam shot.

You suck at math.
And science.

insults, the last resort of the weak minded.

 

[Wreckem]

What exactly is flonase going to do if you contract H1N1?

 

[Texashiker]

What exactly is flonase going to do if you contract H1N1?

My apologizes, I meant FluMist.

 

[Moonbeam]

My apologizes, I meant FluMist.

I can find no studies that prove that doesn't cause impotence in men. Think about it. Only pussy men are afraid of shots, so the nose stuff has got to be the cause. Google 'limp gun syndrome'. Sounds like you might have it. Were those the parts you were playing with?

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Maybe trypanophobia?

 

[Nintendesert]

What really sucks is when you realize TexasTard has just as many votes as anyone else.

 

[Fanatical Meat]

Even Jenny McCarthy has backed down on her anti vaccine rhetoric, she now doesn't like the idea of multiple vaccines giving at the same time or in a short period of time.

 

[Moonbeam]

Maybe trypanophobia?

But that's an irrational fear.

 

[Texashiker]

I can find no studies that prove that doesn't cause impotence in men. Think about it. Only pussy men are afraid of shots, so the nose stuff has got to be the cause. Google 'limp gun syndrome'. Sounds like you might have it. Were those the parts you were playing with?

My wife and I went to the local walgreens last night to get our flu vaccines.

She got her flu shot and I was going to get the flumist. Walgreens was out of the mist, so no vaccine for me.

The parts I was playing with was a bolt carrier group and swapping out some stocks and a light.

 

[Darwin333]

There was a comment about what good is a nurse if she can not see people.

Lets say her doctor put her on bed rest, should she be fired because she can not do her job?

What is the same thing that would happen to virtually every other working person in the country for $1,000?

We are not talking about a permanent situation here.

Stupidity, at least imo, and is almost never curable.

It is attitudes like the ones posted in this thread that make the United States a second world nation when it comes to womens rights. Pregnant? Need some kind of commendation? Too bad, you are fired.

LMAO!! Actually its the populaces willful ignorance, such as displayed by you in this thread, imho. But thats just me.

Three things for you.

Do you know why the flu vaccine isn't certified for pregnant women or why it might be absurdly difficult to do?

Do you have any sort of understanding on how the flu vaccine works?

Why do you suppose that virtually every (if not every) serious medical group especially recommend that pregnant women get the flu vaccine?

 

[Darwin333]

My wife is going this evening to walgreens to get her flu shot. If walgreens offers flumist I will get that, but I am not taking no dam shot.

Its just an itsy bitsy shot though and if you are good I bet they will even give you a lollipop. I feel ya though, I am no fan of shots either, my trick is I just don't look at them doing it and before I know it everything is done.

It does aggravate me that they insist on putting a damn bandaid/bandage on it. Its a friggen pin prick that you couldn't squeeze a drop of blood out of if you tried. Shrug, hell of a lot better than the damn flu though.

 

[Moonbeam]

My wife and I went to the local walgreens last night to get our flu vaccines.

She got her flu shot and I was going to get the flumist. Walgreens was out of the mist, so no vaccine for me.

The parts I was playing with was a bolt carrier group and swapping out some stocks and a light.

I presume you have weapons in part for self protection. You can understand that but not the reason to get the shot. They are basically the same thing but one makes sense to you and the other not, all because of phantom's in your head. You can do as you please but I know that I care more about you than you do. Would never ever force it on you, but it's true all the same. If you get sick from the flu and die, your wife will doubtless suffer the real price of your intransigence. You are not an island, my friend.

 

[Texashiker]

Its just an itsy bitsy shot though

Screw that.

I presume you have weapons in part for self protection.

Yes, and to protect my livestock and property.

My wife live in a rural area surrendered by thousands of acres of timber company land. We have a couple of neighbors, but only a handful.

The ARs are to shoot coyotes, bobcats, wild pigs, raccoons, liberals, democrats, feral dogs,,, anything that tries to steal the stuff I worked hard for.