Post-Exercise shakes?

[MrMatt]

anyone here use post-workout shakes? If so, what's it consist of?

I'm just curious as to what people use, I know T-Nation is big on surge. I used to do protein immediately. I noticed no difference (I already get about 300g protein per day though, could be why)

 

[M0oG0oGaiPan]

http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/mu...son-of-chocolate-milk-and-surge-recovery.html

 

[SociallyChallenged]

anyone here use post-workout shakes? If so, what's it consist of?

I'm just curious as to what people use, I know T-Nation is big on surge. I used to do protein immediately. I noticed no difference (I already get about 300g protein per day though, could be why)

If you take in sufficient protein throughout the day, you actually don't need anything post-workout. I just read a research article on how they tested this in the elderly. There was no statistical significance when the individual supplemented protein before and after working out, if and only if he ate enough protein. 300g of protein is too much tbh, and I'm pretty lenient when it comes to protein intake. Unless you are over 300 pounds, you don't need anywhere close to that amount.

 

[MrMatt]

If you take in sufficient protein throughout the day, you actually don't need anything post-workout. I just read a research article on how they tested this in the elderly. There was no statistical significance when the individual supplemented protein before and after working out, if and only if he ate enough protein. 300g of protein is too much tbh, and I'm pretty lenient when it comes to protein intake. Unless you are over 300 pounds, you don't need anywhere close to that amount.

I'm not surprised by that article, supplements are just that: supplements. If you don't get enough of something they make up for it.

As for the protein: It's that or start taking it in as carbs or fat. I aim for low-mid 3000s for calories. Plus I absolutely brutalize my body, I deadlift twice per week, I run steady state, as well as complexes, and sprinting. I'm not sure if I'd suffer if I cut back on the protein..but honestly I'd rather not find out. Besides, I'm cutting, the best way to avoid losing strength (from a diet perspective) is make sure you get enough protein. If you have other ideas, I'd love to hear them. I've always been a bit shady when it comes to cutting.

 

[elitejp]

If you take in sufficient protein throughout the day, you actually don't need anything post-workout. I just read a research article on how they tested this in the elderly. There was no statistical significance when the individual supplemented protein before and after working out, if and only if he ate enough protein. 300g of protein is too much tbh, and I'm pretty lenient when it comes to protein intake. Unless you are over 300 pounds, you don't need anywhere close to that amount.

That research article has no application to bodybuilders. It was tested on the eldery, not healthy young males who's body actually still produces testosterone. But i do agree with if you are getting enough protein throughout the day it wont be that big of a difference. What you will see a difference in is learning how to control your insulin, and eating properly to be more more insulin sensitive. Thats why T-nation and bernardi recommend surge. Its whey protein mixed with glucose and some bcaa's. The idea is to spike the insulin and push all those amino acids into the muscles. I used to do it by making my own and started to gain a bit of fat along with an upset stomach. I now much prefer to eat oats and noodles with a whey shake after the workout. With the high sugar i lose my appetite, but with normal carbs im hungry again in an hr. I also sip on a very diluted whey shake during the gym w/o, especially if its gonna be a long one.

For cutting i do think its important to keep the protein high but also just as important to keep the vegetables high. If you must eat simple carbs do it early in the day but be sure to cut them out at night and switch to veggys instead. Just be careful not to lose too much weight too quickly.

 

[SociallyChallenged]

That research article has no application to bodybuilders. It was tested on the eldery, not healthy young males who's body actually still produces testosterone. But i do agree with if you are getting enough protein throughout the day it wont be that big of a difference. What you will see a difference in is learning how to control your insulin, and eating properly to be more more insulin sensitive. Thats why T-nation and bernardi recommend surge. Its whey protein mixed with glucose and some bcaa's. The idea is to spike the insulin and push all those amino acids into the muscles. I used to do it by making my own and started to gain a bit of fat along with an upset stomach. I now much prefer to eat oats and noodles with a whey shake after the workout. With the high sugar i lose my appetite, but with normal carbs im hungry again in an hr. I also sip on a very diluted whey shake during the gym w/o, especially if its gonna be a long one.

For cutting i do think its important to keep the protein high but also just as important to keep the vegetables high. If you must eat simple carbs do it early in the day but be sure to cut them out at night and switch to veggys instead. Just be careful not to lose too much weight too quickly.

That research study actually does have an application to everybody. Go look up similar research studies on all ages, sexes, and activity levels. If you eat enough protein, your body retains a large enough amino acid pool from both dietary and bodily sources to repair muscle accordingly. Also, it makes me chuckle at how bodybuilders stress insulin. Yes, it's anabolic. However, after exercise the insulin response is extremely blunted due to massive increases in non-insulin induced glucose transporters in cell membranes. Load is the most important thing when it comes to hypertrophy. Also, eating enough is just as important because insulin is stimulated (not only after you workout, but throughout the day) to store the surplus calories. Post-workout stuff is way less important than the bodybuilders like to say it is.

 

[MrMatt]

That research study actually does have an application to everybody. Go look up similar research studies on all ages, sexes, and activity levels. If you eat enough protein, your body retains a large enough amino acid pool from both dietary and bodily sources to repair muscle accordingly. Also, it makes me chuckle at how bodybuilders stress insulin. Yes, it's anabolic. However, after exercise the insulin response is extremely blunted due to massive increases in non-insulin induced glucose transporters in cell membranes. Load is the most important thing when it comes to hypertrophy. Also, eating enough is just as important because insulin is stimulated (not only after you workout, but throughout the day) to store the surplus calories. Post-workout stuff is way less important than the bodybuilders like to say it is.

One of the biggest guys on T-Nation, Professor X, agrees with this actually. He says that sometimes he gets a good protein & carb meal/shake right after working out, other times it's a few hours, and it doesn't seem to make a difference really.

 

[elitejp]

What you also need to consider is if Professor X is on steroids and what his natural genetics are like. I knew a black dude that was twice my size and shredded, yet he never once stepped foot in a gym My body does not work that way.

And I did agree with everyone that " if you are getting enough protein throughout the day it wont be that big of a difference." And my thoughts on insulin werent just on it being anobolic but also on how to use it properly so that it can give you a better anobolic response. Which is also a great way to avoid diabetes. You need to stop reading into my posts and drawing conclusions that i didnt even imply. Nowhere did i stress that an immediate post w/o protein shake will make or break your entire physique or that you can lift like a 12 year old girl and get results. But if you want my opinion it is worthwhile to eat healthy throughout the day, lift hard, and eat asap after your workout. If the difference is a shake directly after a workout or waiting till you get home and cooking a meal and then eating...my vote is defineately for having a shake. Your kidneys clear nitogen from your blood at within 3 hrs of comsumption, by the time your workout is finshed your body is ready for some protein. But seriously, i dont think the elderly workout with the kind of load that i workout with and I would very much doubt they need the kind of nutrition that I need. But if you want to take your lifting and eating habits from the elderly than feel free. Ive lifted for years and years and when i implement these types of principles i see results.

 

[Koing]

I don't take one. I try and eat something reasonably quick after training. I do take a shake 90-120mins before training (work issues and commute) and take a training drink with added bcaa and creatine to tide me over for training.

T-Nation is a huge marketing website for their own products...just get the main things in, the rest is fluff and if it isn't is paying a load of money for an very very argueable 1-3% gain worth it? If your that pedantic go to bed 90mins earlier each day and you'll see better gains from an additional 7-9hrs sleep a week!

Koing

 

[brikis98]

My PWO meal used to be Syntrax Nectar whey protein isolate with milk and some fruit on the side. Nowadays, I don't drink shakes anymore and just eat lots of normal/whole food through out the day. Personally, I haven't seen any difference, except that the shake was more convenient but the real food is more filling. Of course, my results are purely anecdotal, but I strongly suspect that having your entire diet in check is vastly more important than the exact timing of it.

 

[KoolDrew]

My take on it is that as long as you get sufficient calories and protein by the end of the day, the other stuff isn't going to matter as much. However, I do try to eat most of my calories post workout.

 

[darkxshade]

The only time I really drink PWO shakes is when I'm on creatine which I plan on hopping back on next week. Pretty much scoop of whey + 5g creatine + the meal I normally eat after the workout. The whey is only in there because it feels weird just drinking a tbsp of creatine.

 

[Eric62]

What I do:
I bring 50 grams of whey (vanilla) mixed with 2 cups water (on ice) and sip on that during training, along with ample amounts of plain water.
I have another 50 grams of (vanilla) whey mixed with 2 cups cran-grape juice and a tablespoon of metamucil (when you get into your 40's you'll understand) (on ice) stored in my car, and I drink that on my drive home.
About 90 minutes after that, I'll have a regular meal with 25 grams of whey (chocolate) mixed in with skim milk.
Every meal I add 25 grams of whey protein (chocolate) to my skim milk.