Polls Close In Iraq

[HardWarrior]

Originally posted by: BBond
This constitution and this vote did nothing more than give Bush something to crow about in the U.S. press.

Exactly right. It doesn't matter whether the vote is a positive or a negative in the long term. It's just more happy-talk that can be used to manage another news cycle.

 

[HardWarrior]

Originally posted by: BBond

Originally posted by: Pabster
I hate to break it to ya Bond but our Constitution isn't even set in stone. It can be (and has been) amended a number of times. There's endless debate about it - hence why the current state of the Supreme Court is so important - it is absurd to expect the Iraqi Constitution to be a document written in stone.

But it was a completed document when it was voted on and it was amended through votes, not through the pressure of an occupation force.

You're on a roll tonight, B! :thumbsup:

 

[ntdz]

Originally posted by: HardWarrior

Originally posted by: ntdz

Originally posted by: HardWarrior

Originally posted by: magomago

Originally posted by: HardWarrior

Originally posted by: JTWill

Originally posted by: TheSlamma
I just hope they don't use Diebold machines.


Anyway thats good news, I hope we can leave their country for good in the near future.

What alot of people dont realize is they will be asking us to leave , in a year they will ask us to do a major stand dowm if they are not ready for us to completely leave.

One very late draft had just that sort of wording included, the lawful/binding ability to ask us to leave and otherwise make it difficult to stay. It was mysteriously removed from the version that was voted on.

I would agree with that. A constitution is meant to be timeless in the sense that it should apply whenever. To mention stuff like American troops in the consitution is pointless, even if they are to leave. To mention stuff like the Ba'ath party and Saddam is stupid and ridiculous. Leave the politics out of the Constitution

No, you jumped to the wrong conclusion. The passages I saw didn't mention the US by name. They were both and specific and general at the same time, using terms like "foreign troops." As it is, the Iraqi's are trying hard to express their discomfort with American occupation. Some use bombs, others have been trying other routes. Either way, we should pay attention.

No ****** we should pay attention. Will you at least agree that what the insurgents are doing is going to keep our troops there longer than if there wasn't an insurgency? They are being counter-productive.

Yet we aren't paying attention. How many American's know, or care that what passes for an Iraqi government is quietly trying to let us know that they don't want us there? If you listen to the Whitehouse spin-machine, which most of the mainstream media gets its marching orders from, it would be easy to assume that the overwhelming majority of Iraqi's are just tickled pink to have us there.

I don't agree with the premise of your question because I see US activities in a different light. With several permanent permanent bases being constructed, the troops stationed in Saudi Arabia having been asked to leave and no indication whatsoever form the Whitehouse that we intend to leave (beyond empty-headed slogans "We'll stand down when the Iraqi's stand up!!!", etc.), I think the Iraqi rebels have very little hope of us leaving under any circumstances. Unless, of course, they make it too hard for us to stay.

Can Iraqi's fighting our occupation of their country be viewed as "counter-productive?" I'm sure many American's see it as such, so yeah. However, I support the right of indigenous people to fight, tooth and nail, any unjust and brutal foreign occupation. I'd be a hypocrite if I changed my opinion now because it's my nation doing the occupying. After all, we DID have the option of leaving them the hell alone.

I don't see our occupation as unjust or brutal. We are trying to improve their country, trying to improve infrastucture, their economy and their quality of life. Besides, it's no longer an occupation, we have permission, from an ELECTED govt, to be there.

 

[BBond]

Originally posted by: ntdz

I don't see our occupation as unjust or brutal. We are trying to improve their country, trying to improve infrastucture, their economy and their quality of life. Besides, it's no longer an occupation, we have permission, from an ELECTED govt, to be there.

We have permission from a puppet government to continue attacking those Iraqis who refuse to bow to illegal, immoral, unprovoked aggression.

 

[Steeplerot]

Originally posted by: ntdz

I don't see our occupation as unjust or brutal. We are trying to improve their country, trying to improve infrastucture, their economy and their quality of life. Besides, it's no longer an occupation, we have permission, from an ELECTED govt, to be there.

Did you copy and paste that from vietnam era news?

sounds like the same line..

Wow! this is worthy of another we are turning the corner speech, like the last one earlier this year 500 us soldiers deaths ago... :roll:

 

[Pabster]

Originally posted by: BBond
We have permission from a puppet government to continue attacking those Iraqis who refuse to bow to illegal, immoral, unprovoked aggression.

Yeah, after all, we held a gun to each of the millions of voters heads and forced them to go out and vote in the election...

 

[BBond]

Originally posted by: Steeplerot

Originally posted by: ntdz

I don't see our occupation as unjust or brutal. We are trying to improve their country, trying to improve infrastucture, their economy and their quality of life. Besides, it's no longer an occupation, we have permission, from an ELECTED govt, to be there.

Did you copy and paste that from vietnam era news?

sounds like the same line..

Wow! this is worthy of another we are turning the corner speech, like the last one earlier this year 500 us soldiers deaths ago... :roll:

And the death toll, civilian and military, just keeps climbing.

I'm sure that one more election, one more happy talk scripted "conversation" between the "president" and his troops will solve everything.

Iraqi charter expected to pass Iraqi charter expected to pass

The U.S. military, however, announced that five U.S. soldiers were killed by a roadside bomb in the western insurgent stronghold of Ramadi on Saturday, when Iraqi insurgent groups had largely halted attacks so Sunnis could cast ballots. A Marine was killed in another town.

Hospital officials in Ramadi alleged that 25 people were killed when U.S. warplanes retaliated for another roadside bombing Sunday.

 

[BBond]

Originally posted by: Pabster

Originally posted by: BBond
We have permission from a puppet government to continue attacking those Iraqis who refuse to bow to illegal, immoral, unprovoked aggression.

Yeah, after all, we held a gun to each of the millions of voters heads and forced them to go out and vote in the election...

We are holding a gun to the head of an entire nation.

 

[ntdz]

Originally posted by: BBond

Originally posted by: Pabster

Originally posted by: BBond
We have permission from a puppet government to continue attacking those Iraqis who refuse to bow to illegal, immoral, unprovoked aggression.

Yeah, after all, we held a gun to each of the millions of voters heads and forced them to go out and vote in the election...

We are holding a gun to the head of an entire nation.

My god, liberals in here think that the US is the bad guy in Iraq and the terrorists are the good guys. You guys need to get a grip, we are fighting terrorists groups, including AL-QAEDA.

 

[HardWarrior]

Originally posted by: ntdz
I don't see our occupation as unjust or brutal. We are trying to improve their country, trying to improve infrastucture, their economy and their quality of life. Besides, it's no longer an occupation, we have permission, from an ELECTED govt, to be there.

I'm sure your believe all of this.

 

[Pabster]

Originally posted by: ntdz
My god, liberals in here think that the US is the bad guy in Iraq and the terrorists are the good guys. You guys need to get a grip, we are fighting terrorists groups, including AL-QAEDA.

Yep. And that's why they'll keep losing elections.

 

[HardWarrior]

Originally posted by: ntdzMy god, liberals in here think that the US is the bad guy in Iraq and the terrorists are the good guys. You guys need to get a grip, we are fighting terrorists groups, including AL-QAEDA.

"Liberals" aren't the only people against this so-called war. The US is the bad guy in this situation. Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11. The idea that we can just pick a country to fight Terrorists!!!(tm) in, regardless of circumstances, is morally bankrupt. At the very least, you pro-war people need to know a LOT more about what you're supporting. As it is, most of you are cheering frantically for something you don't seem to know very much about.

 

[JacobJ]

The fundamental problem with the vote is it's not about voting for a constitution, it's about voting for or against the insurgency. The whole frame for the arguments here are mostly about the level of violence, and how the constutition might affect that...but shouldn't it be about whats in the document being voted on? It seems to me, if you want a constitution you have to support this one, cause there ain't gonna be a second chance. So, the vote was not really about the constitution -- it' was about saying 'no' to the insurgency.

 

[BBond]

Originally posted by: ntdz

Originally posted by: BBond

Originally posted by: Pabster

Originally posted by: BBond
We have permission from a puppet government to continue attacking those Iraqis who refuse to bow to illegal, immoral, unprovoked aggression.

Yeah, after all, we held a gun to each of the millions of voters heads and forced them to go out and vote in the election...

We are holding a gun to the head of an entire nation.

My god, liberals in here think that the US is the bad guy in Iraq and the terrorists are the good guys. You guys need to get a grip, we are fighting terrorists groups, including AL-QAEDA.

In NYC, Washington, and a field in PA, al Qaeda was the bad guy.

Since there is profligate proof that Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11, terrorist organizations like al Qaeda, had any banned weapons (WMD,) or in any way planned to or was even capable of attacking the USA, it would appear that it is you who needs to "get a grip".

Bush brought his war on terror to Iraq the same way al Qaeda brought theirs to America. We like to see our victims as innocents but we Americans can't seem to visualize the thousands upon thousands of dead and wounded Iraqis -- all of whom are victims of a vicious attack based totally on Bush's lies -- as innocents.

What did the people of Iraq do to deserve this carnage? How can America still refuse to admit to herself what Bush has done in her name?

 

[ntdz]

Originally posted by: BBond

Originally posted by: ntdz

Originally posted by: BBond

Originally posted by: Pabster

Originally posted by: BBond
We have permission from a puppet government to continue attacking those Iraqis who refuse to bow to illegal, immoral, unprovoked aggression.

Yeah, after all, we held a gun to each of the millions of voters heads and forced them to go out and vote in the election...

We are holding a gun to the head of an entire nation.

My god, liberals in here think that the US is the bad guy in Iraq and the terrorists are the good guys. You guys need to get a grip, we are fighting terrorists groups, including AL-QAEDA.

In NYC, Washington, and a field in PA, al Qaeda was the bad guy.

Since there is profligate proof that Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11, terrorist organizations like al Qaeda, had any banned weapons (WMD,) or in any way planned to or was even capable of attacking the USA, it would appear that it is you who needs to "get a grip".

Bush brought his war on terror to Iraq the same way al Qaeda brought theirs to America. We like to see our victims as innocents but we Americans can't seem to visualize the thousands upon thousands of dead and wounded Iraqis -- all of whom are victims of a vicious attack based totally on Bush's lies -- as innocents.

What did the people of Iraq do to deserve this carnage? How can America still refuse to admit to herself what Bush has done in her name?

If the terrorists weren't attacking us and civilians every day, we could have started pulling out of Iraq and wouldn't have to be bombing terrorist sites and accidently killing civilians.

 

[OneOfTheseDays]

why do you think the terrorists are attacking us in Iraq everyday? please don't tell me it is because they hate our freedom....

yet again the idiotic Republicans fail to understand history and learn that Iraq itself is entirely unstable if left alone. The Sunni's, Shiites, and Kurds DO NOT get along, nor will they with this magical constitution. Why do you think it took a ruthless dictator like Sadaam to keep them all in line? The moral of the story is, we have absolutely no idea what will happen when we pull out of there. Iraq may descend into all out civil war, and if that's the case our entire mission in Iraq will have been a waste. I will concede that there is a slight chance that things will turn out ok, but the more I see of this Iraq situation the less hopeful I am.

 

[Pabster]

Originally posted by: Sudheer Anne
why do you think the terrorists are attacking us in Iraq everyday? please don't tell me it is because they hate our freedom....

They hate everything America stands for. Freedom is but a sliver in the big picture.

yet again the idiotic Republicans fail to understand history and learn that Iraq itself is entirely unstable if left alone. The Sunni's, Shiites, and Kurds DO NOT get along, nor will they with this magical constitution. Why do you think it took a ruthless dictator like Sadaam to keep them all in line? The moral of the story is, we have absolutely no idea what will happen when we pull out of there. Iraq may descend into all out civil war, and if that's the case our entire mission in Iraq will have been a waste. I will concede that there is a slight chance that things will turn out ok, but the more I see of this Iraq situation the less hopeful I am.

Repeat after me: GLOOM AND DOOM, GLOOM AND DOOM, GLOOM AND DOOM!!!

 

[Steeplerot]

Originally posted by: Pabster

Repeat after me: GLOOM AND DOOM, GLOOM AND DOOM, GLOOM AND DOOM!!!

I think you left your caps lock on again...

 

[Pabster]

Originally posted by: Steeplerot
I wouldn't bother

Is that a self-portrait?

 

[Steeplerot]

Nope, your the one sporting the red white and blue freeper creeper.

 

[OneOfTheseDays]

Originally posted by: Pabster

Originally posted by: Sudheer Anne
why do you think the terrorists are attacking us in Iraq everyday? please don't tell me it is because they hate our freedom....

They hate everything America stands for. Freedom is but a sliver in the big picture.

yet again the idiotic Republicans fail to understand history and learn that Iraq itself is entirely unstable if left alone. The Sunni's, Shiites, and Kurds DO NOT get along, nor will they with this magical constitution. Why do you think it took a ruthless dictator like Sadaam to keep them all in line? The moral of the story is, we have absolutely no idea what will happen when we pull out of there. Iraq may descend into all out civil war, and if that's the case our entire mission in Iraq will have been a waste. I will concede that there is a slight chance that things will turn out ok, but the more I see of this Iraq situation the less hopeful I am.

Repeat after me: GLOOM AND DOOM, GLOOM AND DOOM, GLOOM AND DOOM!!!

those who do not learn from the past are bound to repeat it. what this administration needs is a healthy dose of reality, it seems they have brainwashed far too many people into believing everything is rosy in Iraq. "we're turning the corner", my god we've turned the corner so many times we've gone in a circle by now.

 

[umbrella39]

LOL. The good old freepers who pretend to care about the Iraqis are still out in full force in this thread! Keep up the good work. Less and less of the American public is buying it every day and it is due to the echo chamger you subscribe to. :thumbsup:

 

[sandorski]

Charges of voting anomalies are surfacing. Stay tuned.

 

[tommywishbone]

Voting anomalies? What? In an enslaved country, where donkeys explode and fire falls from the sky... impossible!

 

[BBond]

Originally posted by: ntdz


If the terrorists weren't attacking us and civilians every day, we could have started pulling out of Iraq and wouldn't have to be bombing terrorist sites and accidently killing civilians.

If Bush hadn't lied to justify invading Iraq there would be no terrorists there to begin with and therefore no terrorist sites to use as an excuse to bomb civilian targets.