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Poll only - Who's lying?

UglyCasanova said:
I don’t think either are lying, they probably do believe what they are saying.
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Sorry, fence sitter, they both can't be telling the truth.

I'll believe the person who answered questions directly and who didn't try to filibuster their way out of answering questions from the senators.

I'll believe the person that that agrees to and called for an investigation into the matter versus the person who, when given the opportunity, to ask for an investigation, went silent.

I'll believe the person that was careful not charge minor actions to the accused when they weren't 100% positive.

I'll believe the person that was careful not to make accusations about others who were present versus the person who claims there is a vast conspiracy theory against them that happens to fall along party lines.

I'll believe the person that admits to what details are fuzzy and what details are sharp versus the person that can't answer a straight question like what they considered too many beers.

I'll believe the person who wasn't combative when senators asked difficult questions versus the guy that was looking to spar with senators, so much so, he later had to apologize for his behavior.


Of course, I'd prefer to have even more facts and evidence presented, including FBI provided witness testimony, before rating any final conclusions. But we know that's not going to happen and one can only imagine why.
 
UglyCasanova said:
No, but they may both be telling the truth as they see it. Maybe neither one is telling the truth truth and reality differs from how either one remember it.
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Sorry, no. Ford has accused kavanaugh of assaulting her in no uncertain terms. There is no mis-remembering, its either a lie or the truth. There are no other options.
 
Well, Kavanaugh lied about something as asinine as "Devil's Triangle" and "boofing" today. He probably lied about his drinking habits (that whole schtick about "how many beers is too many? Whatever the BAC chart says!" tells me he was never one to keep count.)

If he lies about those things, I think he's lying about other bigger things too. But I still believe him when he denies some of the other allegations...I don't think all the other 4 named & anonymous accusations are as legit as Ford.
 
He lied about the yearbook about drinking and about it being legal.. many other small tidbits there... Where is Judge? If Kavanaugh is confirmed he is going to carry the dems into senate house and wh.. goodbye 60pct for impeachment goodbye kavanaugh... repubs is screwing themselves
 
Speaking of fence-sitters, I found it interesting how Kavanaugh tried a bit of that himself when he tried to go for the impartial "I'm sure something happened to her, just not by me", then went full-Trump with "LEFTIST CONSPIRACY!".

That's one hell of a complicated narrative... We've got a Schrödinger's Witness AND a leftist conspiracy!
 
We got to see the intense hatred created in childhood when conservatives are made victims of shame to instill conformist thinking. When their righteous indignation about their moral superiority is breached, they whimper and throw tantrums like children. All that bottled up hatred and madness comes pouring out as rage against the left in the usual Stockholm hatred of the real victims. There’s no monster quite like the monster with victim mentality. And this psycho is going to be on the court?
 
I watched most of Ford's testimony and found her absolutely believable. I watched all of Kavanaugh's and I don't believe that someone whose primary concern is defending and restoring his and his family's honor and integrity would shy away from as full of an investigation as possible, and certainly wouldn't hide behind "I'll do whatever the committee wants me to do". He seems absolutely obsessed with becoming a supreme court member, and I feel very strongly that should disqualify him. But I have little doubt about what the end result will be.
 
hardhat said:
I watched most of Ford's testimony and found her absolutely believable. I watched all of Kavanaugh's and I don't believe that someone whose primary concern is defending and restoring his and his family's honor and integrity would shy away from as full of an investigation as possible, and certainly wouldn't hide behind "I'll do whatever the committee wants me to do". He seems absolutely obsessed with becoming a supreme court member, and I feel very strongly that should disqualify him. But I have little doubt about what the end result will be.
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I tend to agree, anyone who pushes as hard as he is to be one of the supremes does not deserve to be one of them.
 
dawp said:
I tend to agree, anyone who pushes as hard as he is to be one of the supremes does not deserve to be one of them.
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Come now, there's a principle at stake here! He could become the first white, male, conservative SC judge the US has ever had! Of course he should fight for it!
 
IMO only ONE of the 2 have taken a polygraph examination, when asked about it Kavanaugh replied "they are not admissible in federal court". Huh?, we all know that Brett, but just the same with a highly qualified operator the test's are around 90-95% accuracy. If you are so passionate that "I did not do this" you would jump at this chance to help clear your name. The fact that he does not want an FBI investigation (obviously to protect Mark Judd) is screaming "I'm hiding something".
 
A classmate of his from Yale who knew him quite well was on CNN last night. She stated they all played sports and studied hard. But on Saturday nights they would party like crazy. In the hearing you could tell he was lying about the drinking. He probably believes he never assaulted Dr. Ford because he was so wasted when it happened.
 
sandorski said:
More of his former schoolmates are speaking up about how much he lied about himself.
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That whole weak stomach thing was pure crap. If only drinking a few beers made him puke why would he still drink it? He was a super privileged white boy. They should have made him drink beer during that hearing...
 
UNCjigga said:
Well, Kavanaugh lied about something as asinine as "Devil's Triangle" and "boofing" today. He probably lied about his drinking habits (that whole schtick about "how many beers is too many? Whatever the BAC chart says!" tells me he was never one to keep count.)

If he lies about those things, I think he's lying about other bigger things too. But I still believe him when he denies some of the other allegations...I don't think all the other 4 named & anonymous accusations are as legit as Ford.
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I'm just being fair when I say democrats really did ask some fucking dumb - or rather asshole-ish questions.

"Do you drink on weekdays?" isn't a yes or no question - I went into this in the thread.

"How many beers is too many?" is an INCREDIBLY stupid question. I have beers in my house that will have you in drunk state before you even finish the bottle. That one bottle will probably have you over the BAC for driving (.08). Finish two and you're likely to have a hangover minimal.

On the other hand, if you drink busch light you can probably safely have 4 before you are even at .08 and starting to feel it.

I also have plenty that are somewhere in the middle of that spectrum.
 
s0me0nesmind1 said:
I'm just being fair when I say democrats really did ask some fucking dumb - or rather asshole-ish questions.

"Do you drink on weekdays?" isn't a yes or no question - I went into this in the thread.

"How many beers is too many?" is an INCREDIBLY stupid question. I have beers in my house that will have you in drunk state before you even finish the bottle. That one bottle will probably have you over the BAC for driving (.08). Finish two and you're likely to have a hangover minimal.

On the other hand, if you drink busch light you can probably safely have 4 before you are even at .08 and starting to feel it.

I also have plenty that are somewhere in the middle of that spectrum.
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Asshol-ish questions??? Fuck his feels.
 
ivwshane said:
Sorry, no. Ford has accused kavanaugh of assaulting her in no uncertain terms. There is no mis-remembering, its either a lie or the truth. There are no other options.
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And he didn't say he didn't recall it, and he dodged the question on whether he ever drank at that time to the point of not remembering. She at least stated where her uncertainties of memory lie, and she was 100% certain it was him, and he asserted that there was no truth to the allegations, and he had no doubt of that assertion.
 
ivwshane said:
Sorry, no. Ford has accused kavanaugh of assaulting her in no uncertain terms. There is no mis-remembering, its either a lie or the truth. There are no other options.
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I believe Kavanaugh is an entitled dude bro frat boy that is a product of the late 70s and 80s drinking/party culture inspired by movies like Animal House, Porky’s and the John Hughes movies, where sexual assault was overlooked by and in many cases enabled and rationalized by the adults.

I believe Dr. Ford was a willing participant in that culture as well. I also believe she was a victim of it.

I believe the peer pressure of the time period made kids do stupid things. I say this because this was the culture of my youth, and I was ostracized for not participating. I also heard the stories of what went on at those parties.

I believe the Senate failed in its duties. The GOP for not initiating an FBI investigation. The Democrats for weaponizing victims to stop a SCOTUS nominee.

I found Dr. Ford believable

I don’t believe Kavanaugh’s virginal choir boy defense. His arrogance and combativeness yesterday disqualify him, independent of these charges.

I cannot say who is lying because there was no investigation.

I think it is possible that both are telling a version of the truth.
 
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About the incident itself, maybe neither. I find it very possible that a heavy drinker could black out and not remember many of their actions. Based on the information available he seems like such a person.

About basically everything else Kavanaugh's credibility is really thin and explanations insufficient or badly strain plausibility. His manner and partisanship in the hearing though should have been sufficient to render him unfit for the bench he's proposed to be elevated to.
 
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