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Poll: Is Healthcare a Right or a Privelage?

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you read correctly

healthcare premiums are increasing every year and its starting to eat up the profits of corporate america.

Note: -- this was just a "vision" of what might come if premiums get any higher.
 
Thats fine so long as Medicare is adequate health care, or if the person can afford to make payments...

-Max
 
Ahhh ok I think I understand now... so based on that situation... isnt that further evidence that some form of socialized healthcare is not just a good idea but a necessity?

-Max
 
In a civilized society, everybody should have access to at least basic healthcare. By that I mean immunizations, emergency care, yearly checkups, basic dental and so on. Of course paying for it is an issue but that doesn't change what I believe should be a basic right.
 


<< Thats fine so long as Medicare is adequate health care, or if the person can afford to make payments...

-Max >>




Anyone can afford to make payments. According to federal law, one dollar
a month counts as a payment and they cannot hound you for more money if
you truelly can't afford it.


DD
 
90% of all healthcare costs come in the last 10 days of life. Le the old f*ckers die and we will save some big bucks!!!!!




Yes, I am aware that this is about the most insensitive thing I have ever said, but consider the implications in relation to the poll. Do you have a right to have your life pointlessly extended by a painful week?

just throwing it out there....
 
Mwilding, that's another whole issue.

And should we allow those who want to die because of incurable conditions to do so? I think it's their decision, and not the govt's role to say &quot;You MUST keep living in pain!!&quot;
 
I think everyone deserves at least a basic form of health care. Taking care of the health of all citizens is good public policy, IMHO, because healthier citizens are more productive citizens. It's also vital for children. There are custodians at my campus (majority of whom are African American) who could make better money at other jobs, but stay (often working early morning/night shifts) because of the state health care benefits. If there was basic health coverage, they could have more choices at which jobs to work and support their children.
 
Another twist I will throw into the mix is this:

Consider the difference between your rights as a human and the duty of a society to its constituents.

My contention is that you have ZERO right to healthcare. However, a civilized society has a duty to see to it that its peeps are taken care of.
 
Well this goes back to my debate about socialism with AmusedOne...
My belief is that societies DUTY and PURPOSE are to provide a better form of life for it's people... and therefore Socialist programs such as Healthcare... provide for accomplishing this duty... so we could say that as members of society, we have a right to recieve the benefits that Society is duty-bound to provide. Thereby we have a right to recieve healthcare.

-Max
 
privilege

You have no &quot;right&quot; to the fruits of another's labor. If you can afford to pay someone to care for you, fine. However, to force healthcare workers, or tax payers, or drug companies, or all of the above to pay for your healthcare amounts to no less than forced labor, i.e., slavery. You are usurping their rights, for your own well being.

 


<< Well this goes back to my debate about socialism with AmusedOne...
My belief is that societies DUTY and PURPOSE are to provide a better form of life for it's people... and therefore Socialist programs such as Healthcare... provide for accomplishing this duty... so we could say that as members of society, we have a right to recieve the benefits that Society is duty-bound to provide. Thereby we have a right to recieve healthcare.

-Max >>



No. You'll note the Constitution says &quot;PROMOTE the general welfare&quot; not provide.

When you &quot;provide&quot; the general welfare, you enslave one part of the population to support another.

As I said above, you have NO &quot;right&quot; to the fruits of another person's labor.
 


<< Well this goes back to my debate about socialism with AmusedOne...
My belief is that societies DUTY and PURPOSE are to provide a better form of life for it's people... and therefore Socialist programs such as Healthcare... provide for accomplishing this duty... so we could say that as members of society, we have a right to recieve the benefits that Society is duty-bound to provide. Thereby we have a right to recieve healthcare.

-Max >>



So exactly where do those &quot;duties&quot; end? I'm not making six figures
a year, and if you were to provide that for me I just know it would
provide a better form of life for myself.

DD

 


<< Well this goes back to my debate about socialism with AmusedOne...
My belief is that societies DUTY and PURPOSE are to provide a better form of life for it's people... and therefore Socialist programs such as Healthcare... provide for accomplishing this duty... so we could say that as members of society, we have a right to recieve the benefits that Society is duty-bound to provide. Thereby we have a right to recieve healthcare.

-Max >>




And, why exactly is society duty bound to take care of you just because
you happened to be born?


DD
 
I think it's a fine line. It should be availabe, but not priced out of the range of affordability as it is now becoming. People shouldn't have to look to their employers to provide them with coverage. They should be able to seek an affordable policy on their own which doesn't take more than 30% of their income. The same guidelines used for affordable housing guidelines by the government (FHA).

They should also be able to choose some type of plan. Say they don't have much money, how about a preventative maintenance plan at the very basic for a small amount of money. For a woman, it could include a yearly checkup and gynecological exam with a basic dental exam and teeth cleaning. This could be made very affordable and give people more security than nothing at all.

If you ask most doctors, they would love to be able to provide basic healthcare. Just look at the free clinic/hospital projects which have been started not only in this country, but also around the world in the past.

Where the problems arise is for-profit insurance companies, hospital administration costs, malpractice lawsuits, and drug advertising.

All of these greatly increase the costs (overhead) which we pay, as a society, for healthy citizens.

The system is fatally flawed, but I think with proper legislation to control some of these overhead costs, it could be greatly improved. With even some very basic limitations, such as controlling TV advertisement for drugs, limiting malpractice lawsuit damage amounts, reducing drug patent time limits, and a national insurance program to ensure preventative care, things could be improved. Also, doctors shouldn't have to pay out the wazoo for building costs and taxes. I think any doctor who subscribed to a national insurance plan should receive some sort of incentive through tax breaks, etc.

Right now, medical students are at an all time low. With the current system, who wants to be a doctor? They are being squeezed by insurance companies and federal medicare/medicaid. There needs to be some choice. It's a big responsibility to be a health care provider. People shouldn't take it with a grain of salt, yet common sense on the health industries part needs to be utilized as well.
 
I'm gonna have to toss in the &quot;compassionate conservatism&quot; here, as this is a textbook example of what it means.

Everyone that is somehow physically or mentally incapable of working to pay for their own basic health care should receive government-paid health services. Anyone who is capable, but somehow unwilling (too lazy for example) to do what is needed does not have a right to anything.

This doesn't just apply to healthcare, it should apply to just about everything. If you are capable of working but are either too lazy or unwilling to work, you should not have a 'right' to anything from the working members of society. As compassionate humans, we should support those that are not able to fend for themselves.
 
If healthcare is a right, so too is eating. If a government pays for something simply because it is a right, I'll send them a bill for my Double Whopper combo🙂 I'm at work and due to technical problems cannot write a big post, but I will say this - I believe in socialized/universal healthcare. I will give you my reasoning later on.
 
Public health is so incredibly important. When people are healthy, they work more productively. When they are healthy, they don't spread diseases to others. Preventative medicine helps a great deal to decrease the need for emergency medicine. If every person in this country were able to receive the preventative medicine, and treatment for ailments before they worsen, the costs of healthcare would go down, because far fewer people would require super-expensive procedures to cure problems that could have been nipped in the bud. AmusedOne, this isn't like the welfare issue we were discussing earlier. NOBODY is talking about handouts, or &quot;enslaving part of the population.&quot; Children in my state already can receive absolutely free healthcare if their parents don't have insurance. Why? Because it's cheaper to catch illnesses and problems early, than to try and take care of them after many years. Why doesn't that same logic apply to the rest of the population? Many countries in Europe have had socialized medicine for a long time, and many of them have a quality of healthcare that is on par with the US. Also, many of the expensive, modernized treatments here in the US occur in University hospitals, in fact some of the best medicine is practiced there. This contributes to the education of doctors and the progress of modern medicine. Claiming that the only reason we have quality medicine in this country is because it is expensive completely discounts the progress made in the Universities. I also find it completely unlikely that people would stop wanting to be doctors simply because of socialized healthcare. Specialized fields always get more money, whether in the private or public sector. Anyone who only becomes a doctor because it will make them a multimillionaire is the wrong kind of doctor to begin with. There will still be plenty of elective medicine left for them.
 
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