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police-involved shooting in Kenosha, WI...unrest ensues

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s0me0nesmind1 said:
OANN I've only ever heard of recently - specifically from other news reporting on them being at white house press briefings... I still have no idea how to even access their media. I presume it all streams from their websites?

I also have no idea what you're referring to when you say RT.

So... yeah, cant say those are mainstream.
Click to expand...

so, what you're saying is that you are are actually rather poorly informed.
 
Maxima1 said:
lolwut. That's who you were talking about, and that's why they went after him, duh. That guy got shot for good reason. Threat level was basically zero unless someone pulled what that guy did.
Click to expand...

While charging at a guy, when there is no threat to yourself or others, who is armed with an AR15 is itself worthy of a Darwin Award, in this case it's probably the guy behind him who fired his pistol in the air that turned the encounter into a lethal one.
 
Maxima1 said:
lolwut. That's who you were talking about, and that's why they went after him, duh. That guy got shot for good reason. Threat level was basically zero unless someone pulled what that guy did. Default shouldn't be to assume MaSs SHoOtInG either.

"This kid was no trivial threat, he had just murdered someone and was fleeing the scene of a crime. "

www.nbcnews.com

U.S. mass killings hit new high in 2019, most were shootings

In all, there were 41 mass killings. Of those, 33 were mass shootings. More than 210 people were killed.
www.nbcnews.com www.nbcnews.com

The majority of the killings involved people who knew each other — family disputes, drug or gang violence or people with beefs that directed their anger at co-workers or relatives.

“These are still rare events. Clearly the risk is low but the fear is high,” Fox said. “What fuels contagion is fear.”
Click to expand...
There's a big difference in Mass killings and Mass shootings as how/who/why. You're cherry picking mass killings with that link.
 
mytimes has a timeline of the videos and events of the incident now

www.nytimes.com

Tracking the Suspect in the Fatal Kenosha Shootings (Published 2020)

Footage appears to show a teenager shooting three people during protests in Wisconsin. We tracked his movements that night.
www.nytimes.com www.nytimes.com

So basically he is with others hired to protect a dealership during the riots. At one point he leaves the dealership to offer medical aid and water to protestors hit by pepper spray. A few minutes after that, the crowd of "protestors" finds him. Someone shoots a handgun into the air first, as they start charging after him in front of the dealership. He tries to run away at first before having to fire back. The whole case is looking like pure self defense from what is now being trickled out. A crowd charging at you first and firing a handgun first pretty much makes this simple self defense. If what the nytimes put together is true then the only issue is going to be his age here. If the age thing sticks and is a felony it may lead to felony murder if Wisconsin has that as a charge. Then again, I would fight that all the way to SCOTUS if that is what ends up happening. If the evidence of what I see is true so far then murder 1 is going anywhere in a court room. There may still be other evidence I haven't seen though which still changes things up, but starting to doubt that will happen.
 
HumblePie said:
mytimes has a timeline of the videos and events of the incident now

www.nytimes.com

Tracking the Suspect in the Fatal Kenosha Shootings (Published 2020)

Footage appears to show a teenager shooting three people during protests in Wisconsin. We tracked his movements that night.
www.nytimes.com www.nytimes.com

So basically he is with others hired to protect a dealership during the riots. At one point he leaves the dealership to offer medical aid and water to protestors hit by pepper spray. A few minutes after that, the crowd of "protestors" finds him. Someone shoots a handgun into the air first, as they start charging after him in front of the dealership. He tries to run away at first before having to fire back. The whole case is looking like pure self defense from what is now being trickled out. A crowd charging at you first and firing a handgun first pretty much makes this simple self defense. If what the nytimes put together is true then the only issue is going to be his age here.
Click to expand...
Who had the authority to hire a 17 year old as private security/mercenary?
 
[DHT]Osiris said:
Who had the authority to hire a 17 year old as private security/mercenary?
Click to expand...

Authority? WTF? You don't need to do that. They hired his militia group for aid during the protests to protect their property. His group is based in Illinois. The owner of the dealership I thought I read somewhere was friends with the people in the group. Also, Illinois only has a minimum age of 14 for ownership of any firearm. So at 17 he can legally own a long gun in Illinois. He can't carry it around though in that state except in certain circumstances, but Wisconsin is much more friendly for open carry. Except that whole age 18+ thing. Still, that is for in public areas, and not private land. So even in Wisconsin he could legally carry openly on private land with permission of the owner. Of course he left with the firearm to provide aid and as I said then by law there he isn't on private property anymore. As I said, it could get murky in regards to this quirk of the case.
 
HumblePie said:
mytimes has a timeline of the videos and events of the incident now

www.nytimes.com

Tracking the Suspect in the Fatal Kenosha Shootings (Published 2020)

Footage appears to show a teenager shooting three people during protests in Wisconsin. We tracked his movements that night.
www.nytimes.com www.nytimes.com

So basically he is with others hired to protect a dealership during the riots. At one point he leaves the dealership to offer medical aid and water to protestors hit by pepper spray. A few minutes after that, the crowd of "protestors" finds him. Someone shoots a handgun into the air first, as they start charging after him in front of the dealership. He tries to run away at first before having to fire back. The whole case is looking like pure self defense from what is now being trickled out. A crowd charging at you first and firing a handgun first pretty much makes this simple self defense. If what the nytimes put together is true then the only issue is going to be his age here. If the age thing sticks and is a felony it may lead to felony murder if Wisconsin has that as a charge. Then again, I would fight that all the way to SCOTUS if that is what ends up happening. If the evidence of what I see is true so far then murder 1 is going anywhere in a court room. There may still be other evidence I haven't seen though which still changes things up, but starting to doubt that will happen.
Click to expand...
Please post the quote from the article that states he or anyone else there was hired...he doesn't even live there... how about a verification from the owner...nope?
 
HumblePie said:
Authority? WTF? You don't need to do that. They hired his militia group for aid during the protests to protect their property. His group is based in Illinois. The owner of the dealership I thought I read somewhere was friends with the people in the group.
Click to expand...
So they were friends with a bunch of dudes with guns. You can't just pay a bunch of dudes with guns to shoot at people that come near your store, or even damage it. That's not legal.
 
[DHT]Osiris said:
So they were friends with a bunch of dudes with guns. You can't just pay a bunch of dudes with guns to shoot at people that come near your store, or even damage it. That's not legal.
Click to expand...

You are literally stupid for this post. You can hire people to be on your property period. They can also be armed. They didn't fire first at all. They are literally there to do what the Koreans do with their businesses. Stand around and carry guns so that idiots don't attempt to do what happened in this incident. Unfortunately, the kid wanted to be a helper as well with his medkit. His good intentions to help others got him trapped into a scenario that forced him to take a life or more than likely die. Fuck you for thinking anything else.
 
HurleyBird said:
While charging at a guy, when there is no threat to yourself or others, who is armed with an AR15 is itself worthy of a Darwin Award, in this case it's probably the guy behind him who fired his pistol in the air that turned the encounter into a lethal one.
Click to expand...
For it to be charging, doesn't one of the people have to be stationary.
 
HumblePie said:
You are literally stupid for this post. You can hire people to be on your property period. They can also be armed. They didn't fire first at all. They are literally there to do what the Koreans do with their businesses. Stand around and carry guns so that idiots don't attempt to do what happened in this incident. Unfortunately, the kid wanted to be a helper as well with his medkit. His good intentions to help others got him trapped into a scenario that forced him to take a life or more than likely die. Fuck you for thinking anything else.
Click to expand...

Wisconsin Private Security Requirements | Become a Security Guard in WI - SecurityGuard-license.org

Private Security Persons Requirements in Wisconsin Wisconsin regulates armed and unarmed security guards. They are termed "private security persons'. An individual must be credentialed unless he or she is exempt under state law. An individual hired to provide security services directly to a...
securityguard-license.org securityguard-license.org
Wisconsin regulates armed and unarmed security guards. They are termed "private security persons'. An individual must be credentialed unless he or she is exempt under state law. An individual hired to provide security services directly to a business may be exempt. An individual who works for a security agency will be credentialed.

Security guards who will be armed will need firearms permits. Those who are in business for themselves must also apply for agency licenses. All credentials are issued by the Department of Safety and Professional Services.
Click to expand...
GTFO with your weak shit justification. This wasn't private security and it wasn't legal.
 
[DHT]Osiris said:

Wisconsin Private Security Requirements | Become a Security Guard in WI - SecurityGuard-license.org

Private Security Persons Requirements in Wisconsin Wisconsin regulates armed and unarmed security guards. They are termed "private security persons'. An individual must be credentialed unless he or she is exempt under state law. An individual hired to provide security services directly to a...
securityguard-license.org securityguard-license.org

GTFO with your weak shit justification. This wasn't private security and it wasn't legal.
Click to expand...

GTFO with your idiot shit. There is a difference between a guard COMPANY that requires regulation and permits for armed guards with a bit more leeway in the laws regarding use of force, and hiring people to stand on your property while they happen to be armed. You are an idiot that can't see the difference. Guards are a reoccurring thing and this is a one off thing. Seriously learn the fucking difference. This is why people in Wisconsin, like anywhere, can be their own armed guards for their own property without having to be registered as private security. Fuck your logic is stupid as shit.
 
HumblePie said:
GTFO with your idiot shit. There is a difference between a guard COMPANY that requires regulation and permits for armed guards with a bit more leeway in the laws regarding use of force, and hiring people to stand on your property while they happen to be armed. You are an idiot that can't see the difference. Guards are a reoccurring thing and this is a one off thing. Seriously learn the fucking difference.
Click to expand...
You cannot hire random people to guard your property, there's a term for that person, a security guard, and yes it's fucking regulated. There's no legal standing for 'I paid a kid to stand there with a gun to shoot people for me'. If that was the case, no business would hire expensive security guards, there'd just be random dudes with guns everywhere.
 
[DHT]Osiris said:
So they were friends with a bunch of dudes with guns. You can't just pay a bunch of dudes with guns to shoot at people that come near your store, or even damage it. That's not legal.
Click to expand...
No, but you can hire people to serve as deterrents to violence. That is why a lot of police moonlight or take on second careers after retirement as bouncers and private security.

Having said that, a 17 year old militia member lacks the maturity and training to handle an escalation, nor do they qualify as private security. The militia shouldn’t have been there. That also goes for the rioters and looters that prompted the local business to employ them.
 
Starbuck1975 said:
No, but you can hire people to serve as deterrents to violence. That is why a lot of police moonlight or take on second careers after retirement as bouncers and private security.

Having said that, a 17 year old militia member lacks the maturity and training to handle an escalation, nor do they qualify as private security. The militia shouldn’t have been there. That also goes for the rioters and looters that prompted the local business to employ them.
Click to expand...
Exactly, you can hire private security, even as a one off, but it still has to be legit security. You can't just get Jimmy the 17 year old with a rifle because you're unwilling to put yourself in harm's way.
 
soundforbjt said:
For it to be charging, doesn't one of the people have to be stationary.
Click to expand...

Haven't ever heard that. Assuming that's correct though, then setting definitions aside for a moment the fact that Rittenhouse was trying to get away from the man lunging at him hardly hurts his case vs. remaining stationary. If anything, it strengthens it.
 
Prosecutors have added more charges:

www.cnn.com

Kenosha shooting suspect faces more homicide charges | CNN

The suspect in the Kenosha, Wisconsin, fatal shooting is facing multiple homicide charges, court records show.
www.cnn.com www.cnn.com

Prosecutors filed more charges against Rittenhouse on Thursday, adding one count of reckless homicide, a count for attempted intentional homicide and two counts of recklessly endangering safety.
Court records show he's also being charged with possession of a dangerous weapon while under the age of 18, which is a misdemeanor.
Click to expand...
 
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