Police are launching Tear Gas, shooting Rubber Bullets, using Water Cannons, and Pepper Spray on Protestors!

SleepWalkerX

Platinum Member
Jun 29, 2004
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http://www.dailykos.com/storyo...1/145223/3525?detail=f

video of the terrorists

They even attacked people leaving the Labor Day Concert (apparently by accident, it happened to be going on near the Xcel center). There are children there and they are using tear gas. Can someone remind me what a police state looks like? :|

Here's another link:

http://minnesota.publicradio.o...b/2008/09/01/rnc_day1/

Apparently some of the chaos came when protestors smashed a macy's window, a police car window, and a bus that were detaining some of the protestors.
 

quest55720

Golden Member
Nov 3, 2004
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Give me a real source not some left wing smear machine that is trying to destroy a teenage girl.
 

FuzzyBee

Diamond Member
Jan 22, 2000
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81

Nebor

Lifer
Jun 24, 2003
29,582
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76
Originally posted by: quest55720
Give me a real source not some left wing smear machine that is trying to destroy a teenage girl.

When I accidentally click on a dailykos link I feel like I'm being put on a list similar to the one I'm put on when I accidentally click a stormfront.org link, and the NSA guys making the lists are like "Who is this guy?"
 

Modelworks

Lifer
Feb 22, 2007
16,240
7
76
Originally posted by: FuzzyBee
Originally posted by: SleepWalkerX
http://www.dailykos.com/storyo...1/145223/3525?detail=f

video of the terrorists

They even attacked people leaving the Labor Day Concert (apparently by accident, it happened to be going on near the Xcel center). There are children there and they are using tear gas. Can someone remind me what a police state looks like? :|

Ooooh! Have they arrested any reporters for videotaping big-time donors meeting with Senators yet?

I don't think so yet.
They did that at the democratic convention though, so give them time :)
 

SleepWalkerX

Platinum Member
Jun 29, 2004
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Originally posted by: quest55720
Give me a real source not some left wing smear machine that is trying to destroy a teenage girl.

Did you watch the video? Is there something I missed before the police had the protestors dropped to the ground and declared them to be all arrested? I didn't exactly see any violence.
 

Sacrilege

Senior member
Sep 6, 2007
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So uh.... in the case of the Chinese police/military vs the students/protesters in Tienanmen, which side did you Republican tough guys root for? Just wondering.
 

XMan

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
12,513
49
91
Originally posted by: Sacrilege
So uh.... in the case of the Chinese police/military vs the students/protesters in Tienanmen, which side did you Republican tough guys root for? Just wondering.

The students, of course. I believe they were using the MLK/Ghandi protest method of civil disobedeience rather than the Medea Benjamin "throw piss on the cops" method. Generally you get a bit more sympathy when you're not throwing waste like a zoo monkey.

I bet those Chinese students would have preffered rubber bullets to tanks, however . . .
 

TechAZ

Golden Member
Sep 8, 2007
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Originally posted by: Sacrilege
So uh.... in the case of the Chinese police/military vs the students/protesters in Tienanmen, which side did you Republican tough guys root for? Just wondering.

I wish I could be driving a tank down St Paul right now.
 

Sacrilege

Senior member
Sep 6, 2007
647
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Originally posted by: XMan
Originally posted by: Sacrilege
So uh.... in the case of the Chinese police/military vs the students/protesters in Tienanmen, which side did you Republican tough guys root for? Just wondering.

The students, of course. I believe they were using the MLK/Ghandi protest method of civil disobedeience rather than the Medea Benjamin "throw piss on the cops" method. Generally you get a bit more sympathy when you're not throwing waste like a zoo monkey.

I bet those Chinese students would have preffered rubber bullets to tanks, however . . .

Haha revisionist right wing history at its finest.

As with protests in the West, some Tienanmen protesters were peaceful but they were mixed with violent anarchists. Are Chinese police allowed to restore law and order like US police?

If you were a Chinese conservative you know full well which side you would be cheering for. All that matters is where you were born.
 

Sacrilege

Senior member
Sep 6, 2007
647
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0
Originally posted by: TechAZ
Originally posted by: Sacrilege
So uh.... in the case of the Chinese police/military vs the students/protesters in Tienanmen, which side did you Republican tough guys root for? Just wondering.

I wish I could be driving a tank down St Paul right now.

Why do you hate Americans? Is it because you hate yourself? Some anger issues you need to sort out?
 

TechAZ

Golden Member
Sep 8, 2007
1,188
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71
Originally posted by: Sacrilege
Originally posted by: TechAZ
Originally posted by: Sacrilege
So uh.... in the case of the Chinese police/military vs the students/protesters in Tienanmen, which side did you Republican tough guys root for? Just wondering.

I wish I could be driving a tank down St Paul right now.

Why do you hate Americans? Is it because you hate yourself? Some anger issues you need to sort out?

I don't hate Americans. I would load the tank up with piss rockets and turn the tables onto those "peace loving protesters".
 

XMan

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
12,513
49
91
Originally posted by: Sacrilege
Originally posted by: XMan
Originally posted by: Sacrilege
So uh.... in the case of the Chinese police/military vs the students/protesters in Tienanmen, which side did you Republican tough guys root for? Just wondering.

The students, of course. I believe they were using the MLK/Ghandi protest method of civil disobedeience rather than the Medea Benjamin "throw piss on the cops" method. Generally you get a bit more sympathy when you're not throwing waste like a zoo monkey.

I bet those Chinese students would have preffered rubber bullets to tanks, however . . .

Haha revisionist right wing history at its finest.

As with protests in the West, some Tienanmen protesters were peaceful but they were mixed with violent anarchists. Are Chinese police allowed to restore law and order like US police?

If you were a Chinese conservative you know full well which side you would be cheering for. All that matters is where you were born.

The difference is that the United States is not a dictatorship. As long as you're polite about it you can stand on a street corner and compare the president to a monkey and not have to worry about reprisals from the state.

Try that in China. You'll be enjoying an all expense paid trip to a re-education camp, Comrade.
 

Modelworks

Lifer
Feb 22, 2007
16,240
7
76
Originally posted by: SleepWalkerX
Originally posted by: quest55720
Give me a real source not some left wing smear machine that is trying to destroy a teenage girl.

Did you watch the video? Is there something I missed before the police had the protestors dropped to the ground and declared them to be all arrested? I didn't exactly see any violence.

I'm not siding with anyone on this, because the details aren't really clear right now.
The one law I can tell you from experience they could have broken is failure to comply with a lawful order.

If you have a group of people , you can just be standing around, and if an officer tells you to disperse or break up the group and you fail to do that, then they have the right to arrest you.
It doesn't even matter if it is a public area. The officer has the right to ask you to leave in most cities if they feel you are causing a disturbance. It can be just talking or yelling with no physical violence.

 

Sacrilege

Senior member
Sep 6, 2007
647
0
0
Originally posted by: XMan
Originally posted by: Sacrilege
Originally posted by: XMan
Originally posted by: Sacrilege
So uh.... in the case of the Chinese police/military vs the students/protesters in Tienanmen, which side did you Republican tough guys root for? Just wondering.

The students, of course. I believe they were using the MLK/Ghandi protest method of civil disobedeience rather than the Medea Benjamin "throw piss on the cops" method. Generally you get a bit more sympathy when you're not throwing waste like a zoo monkey.

I bet those Chinese students would have preffered rubber bullets to tanks, however . . .

Haha revisionist right wing history at its finest.

As with protests in the West, some Tienanmen protesters were peaceful but they were mixed with violent anarchists. Are Chinese police allowed to restore law and order like US police?

If you were a Chinese conservative you know full well which side you would be cheering for. All that matters is where you were born.

The difference is that the United States is not a dictatorship. As long as you're polite about it you can stand on a street corner and compare the president to a monkey and not have to worry about reprisals from the state.

Try that in China. You'll be enjoying an all expense paid trip to a re-education camp, Comrade.

First of all, don't call me Comrade.

You seem to miss what I was saying. So you claim to make a conscious decision to pick and choose which "political classifications" you support. I propose that as an authoritarian, you would support the Chinese state if you lived there, "dictatorship" or not.
 

Napalm

Platinum Member
Oct 12, 1999
2,050
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I respect peoples' right to protest. Unfortunately, protest is a wasted exercise when the sole purpose is to provoke confrontation. The fact that so often this goal is blatantly obvious takes away from what might be a good cause.
 

XMan

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
12,513
49
91
Originally posted by: Sacrilege
Originally posted by: XMan
Originally posted by: Sacrilege
Originally posted by: XMan
Originally posted by: Sacrilege
So uh.... in the case of the Chinese police/military vs the students/protesters in Tienanmen, which side did you Republican tough guys root for? Just wondering.

The students, of course. I believe they were using the MLK/Ghandi protest method of civil disobedeience rather than the Medea Benjamin "throw piss on the cops" method. Generally you get a bit more sympathy when you're not throwing waste like a zoo monkey.

I bet those Chinese students would have preffered rubber bullets to tanks, however . . .

Haha revisionist right wing history at its finest.

As with protests in the West, some Tienanmen protesters were peaceful but they were mixed with violent anarchists. Are Chinese police allowed to restore law and order like US police?

If you were a Chinese conservative you know full well which side you would be cheering for. All that matters is where you were born.

The difference is that the United States is not a dictatorship. As long as you're polite about it you can stand on a street corner and compare the president to a monkey and not have to worry about reprisals from the state.

Try that in China. You'll be enjoying an all expense paid trip to a re-education camp, Comrade.

First of all, don't call me Comrade.

You seem to miss what I was saying. So you claim to make a conscious decision to pick and choose which "political classifications" you support. I propose that as an authoritarian, you would support the Chinese state if you lived there, "dictatorship" or not.

Your first mistake is assuming that I'm an authoritarian simply because I have conservative beliefs. Need a jump-to-conclusions mat?
 

XMan

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
12,513
49
91
Originally posted by: Napalm
I respect peoples' right to protest. Unfortunately, protest is a wasted exercise when the sole purpose is to provoke confrontation. The fact that so often this goal is blatantly obvious takes away from what might be a good cause.

Quite right. There's a huge difference between Chinese students protesting for freedom and some American folks with some extra free time trying to recreate the glory days of their youth.
 

SleepWalkerX

Platinum Member
Jun 29, 2004
2,649
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Federal government involved in raids on protesters

As the police attacks on protesters in Minnesota continue -- see this video of the police swarming a bus transporting members of Earth Justice, seizing the bus and leaving the group members stranded on the side of the highway -- it appears increasingly clear that it is the Federal Government that is directing this intimidation campaign. Minnesota Public Radio reported yesterday that "the searches were led by the Ramsey County Sheriff's office. Deputies coordinated searches with the Minneapolis and St. Paul police departments and the Federal Bureau of Investigation."

Today's Star Tribune added that the raids were specifically "aided by informants planted in protest groups." Back in May, Marcy Wheeler presciently noted that the Minneapolis Joint Terrorist Task Force -- an inter-agency group of federal, state and local law enforcement led by the FBI -- was actively recruiting Minneapolis residents to serve as plants, to infiltrate "vegan groups" and other left-wing activist groups and report back to the Task Force about what they were doing. There seems to be little doubt that it was this domestic spying by the Federal Government that led to the excessive and truly despicable home assaults by the police yesterday.

So here we have a massive assault led by Federal Government law enforcement agencies on left-wing dissidents and protesters who have committed no acts of violence or illegality whatsoever, preceded by months-long espionage efforts to track what they do. And as extraordinary as that conduct is, more extraordinary is the fact that they have received virtually no attention from the national media and little outcry from anyone. And it's not difficult to see why. As the recent "overhaul" of the 30-year-old FISA law illustrated -- preceded by the endless expansion of surveillance state powers, justified first by the War on Drugs and then the War on Terror -- we've essentially decided that we want our Government to spy on us without limits. There is literally no police power that the state can exercise that will cause much protest from the political and media class and, therefore, from the citizenry.

Beyond that, there is a widespread sense that the targets of these raids deserve what they get, even if nothing they've done is remotely illegal. We love to proclaim how much we cherish our "freedoms" in the abstract, but we despise those who actually exercise them. The Constitution, right in the very First Amendment, protects free speech and free assembly precisely because those liberties are central to a healthy republic -- but we've decided that anyone who would actually express truly dissident views or do anything other than sit meekly and quietly in their homes are dirty trouble-makers up to no good, and it's therefore probably for the best if our Government keeps them in check, spies on them, even gets a little rough with them.

After all, if you don't want the FBI spying on you, or the Police surrounding and then invading your home with rifles and seizing your computers, there's a very simple solution: don't protest the Government. Just sit quietly in your house and mind your own business. That way, the Government will have no reason to monitor what you say and feel the need to intimidate you by invading your home. Anyone who decides to protest -- especially with something as unruly and disrespectful as an unauthorized street march -- gets what they deserve.

Isn't it that mentality which very clearly is the cause of virtually everyone turning away as these police raids escalate against citizens -- including lawyers, journalists and activists -- who have broken no laws and whose only crime is that they intend vocally to protest what the Government is doing? Add to that the fact that many good establishment liberals are embarrassed by leftist protesters of this sort and wish that they would remain invisible, and there arises a widespread consensus that these Government attacks are perfectly tolerable if not desirable.

..

Any rational person planning to protest the GOP Convention would, in light of this Government spying and these police raids, think twice -- at least -- about whether to do so. That is the point of the raids -- to announce to citizens that they best stay in their homes and be good, quiet, meek, compliant people unless they want their homes to be invaded, their property seized, and have rifles pointed at them, too. The fact that this behavior is producing so little outcry only ensures, for obvious reasons, that it will continue in the future. We love our Surveillance State for keeping us safe and maintaining nice, quiet order.

The FBI is involved? Looks like they are not happy with the anti-war protestors as well. It makes sense though. Start intimidating the journalists first so they won't influence everyone else.
 

Sacrilege

Senior member
Sep 6, 2007
647
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0
Originally posted by: XMan
Originally posted by: Napalm
I respect peoples' right to protest. Unfortunately, protest is a wasted exercise when the sole purpose is to provoke confrontation. The fact that so often this goal is blatantly obvious takes away from what might be a good cause.

Quite right. There's a huge difference between Chinese students protesting for freedom and some American folks with some extra free time trying to recreate the glory days of their youth.

This goes back to my first comment. The fact is, there were a significant number of anarchists at Tienanmen. Should they have been shot, and the peaceful freedom lovers gently shepherded out of harm's way?
 

Modelworks

Lifer
Feb 22, 2007
16,240
7
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Not the way to make your point
Police also received reports that a group of 70 protesters, wearing all black clothing and gas masks blocked the intersection of Kellogg Street and Summit Avenue.

That is asking to get shot. Who wears a gas mask and all black clothing to try to make a point peacefully ? You don't bring a gas mask unless you are expecting to cause trouble.



 

Sacrilege

Senior member
Sep 6, 2007
647
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0
We love our Surveillance State for keeping us safe and maintaining nice, quiet order.

This is my overall point, XMan, nothing personal towards you.

I propose that the vast majority of Americans would be perfectly content living in Commie China, regardless of how much they demonize the Communist regime from their current situation in America.
 

XMan

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
12,513
49
91
Originally posted by: Sacrilege
Originally posted by: XMan
Originally posted by: Napalm
I respect peoples' right to protest. Unfortunately, protest is a wasted exercise when the sole purpose is to provoke confrontation. The fact that so often this goal is blatantly obvious takes away from what might be a good cause.

Quite right. There's a huge difference between Chinese students protesting for freedom and some American folks with some extra free time trying to recreate the glory days of their youth.

This goes back to my first comment. The fact is, there were a significant number of anarchists at Tienanmen. Should they have been shot, and the peaceful freedom lovers gently shepherded out of harm's way?

I'd need to see some verification that there were actually anarchists there. There's no reference to them on Wiki. The students that were killed by the Red Army were in the process of conducting a hunger strike. That's good old fashioned MLK-style civil disobedience right there, and in no way merited the response.