Paramedic’s Angry Post About "Burger Flippers" Making $15/hr Goes Viral

[BoberFett]

my understanding is that it's a combination of supply/demand (re: there are a lot of EMT's; it only requires taking a course that lasts a few months, not years of schooling like a nurse), most work for private companies, not necessarily hospitals, and the insurance aspect of it treats them more as transportation rather than emergency medical providers.

As I believe someone else pointed out, the bill you get for an ambulance ride is not quite the same as taking a taxi to the hospital.

Again, I know nothing of the training EMTs get, maybe it really is that easy a job.

 

[thraashman]

As I believe someone else pointed out, the bill you get for an ambulance ride is not quite the same as taking a taxi to the hospital.

Again, I know nothing of the training EMTs get, maybe it really is that easy a job.

I know my father drove an ambulance in college, he didn't have shit for training or medical knowledge. Granted this was in the late 60's/early 70's and in Detroit.

 

[ivwshane]

So what of the lower quality workers they displace? You aren't creating net new jobs, you're just shuffling the deck of who has those jobs and probably reducing the total number of jobs overall to boot.

What about them? You seem to be arguing against something I'm not claiming. I've never said anything about creating jobs. But just as a point of fact, raising the minimum wage has shown to have zero impact on the unemployment rate at best and a barely noticeable negative impact on teenagers at worst.

 

[ivwshane]

I don't know if you've ever seen an ambulance bill.

My contention was with your claim that the medic was complaining about someone else who makes as much as him. He wasn't complaining and was saying he was happy for FF workers who advocated and got a higher wage. He then later went on to talk about where people should direct their outrage and that is with the companies who pay them so little despite huge profits.

 

[MagickMan]

Enjoy your $8 Big Macs, bitches. Heh.

 

[nageov3t]

I know my father drove an ambulance in college, he didn't have shit for training or medical knowledge. Granted this was in the late 60's/early 70's and in Detroit.

I want to say that becoming an EMT today requires about 100 hours of training (which isn't nothing, but isn't in any way comparable to what nurses have to go through)

they're generally allowed to administer basic medicine (like insulin to a diabetic) and do their best to bandage wounds/stop bleeding, but they're typically not allowed to perform any operations that require puncturing the skin.

 

[BoberFett]

I want to say that becoming an EMT today requires about 100 hours of training (which isn't nothing, but isn't in any way comparable to what nurses have to go through)

they're generally allowed to administer basic medicine (like insulin to a diabetic) and do their best to bandage wounds/stop bleeding, but they're typically not allowed to perform any operations that require puncturing the skin.

They're probably still more valuable than burger flippers, even if it's not as big a job as I thought it was.

 

[Fern]

That is true but the actual hourly pay isn't the only factor. For example, with better performing employees your training costs go down, your retention goes up, and customer satisfaction also increases, all of these together lead to either a reduction in waste or an increase in profits. Obviously there is a balancing job but it's doubtful $15 an hour is tipping the equation toward waste or lack of ROI.

While I agree with your point that at a higher wage the fast food business should be able to get better employees and there is likely some benefit there, the question is how much benefit?

Training costs for entry level employees? There really is no such thing. I worked in fast food many years ago while college, I owned a half interest in a fast food restaurant (and worked there) and my son recently worked at one.

Firstly, even back in the 80's the tasks for minimum wage employees were uber simplistic. Secondly, the fast food industry has developed all kinds methodologies such as pre-measured bags of french fries or wings etc. and auto frying or pizza oven machines specifically to minimize the need for any training.

I.e., fast food businesses are built to handle min wage employees and high turnover.

So, I just don't see much 'fat on that bone'.

Fern

 

[ivwshane]

While I agree with your point that at a higher wage the fast food business should be able to get better employees and there is likely some benefit there, the question is how much benefit?

Training costs for entry level employees? There really is no such thing. I worked in fast food many years ago while college, I owned a half interest in a fast food restaurant (and worked there) and my son recently worked at one.

Firstly, even back in the 80's the tasks for minimum wage employees were uber simplistic. Secondly, the fast food industry has developed all kinds methodologies such as pre-measured bags of french fries or wings etc. and auto frying or pizza oven machines specifically to minimize the need for any training.

I.e., fast food businesses are built to handle min wage employees and high turnover.

So, I just don't see much 'fat on that bone'.

Fern

True but every job has gotten easier so difficulty is less of a factor.
With regards to meat on the bone, I'd disagree. The only businesses that don't seem to be able to handle higher wages are those that are paying a franchise fee. To me that business model appears to be failing anyway. Can they absorb $15 an hour? Sure but they would have to use a combination of tools including raising prices.

 

[werepossum]

everyone knows that if the minimum wage goes up for fast food workers, it will inevitably go up for all other workers commensurately, but the buying power for minimum wage earners won't go back down due to inflation because reasons.

This is correct. Frankly I'm really surprised that any politician would even propose raising minimum wage only on fast food workers, but I cannot believe that $15/hour would ever be implemented on they alone. In reality, everyone below $15 would be bumped to that level, with the understanding that anyone earning less than that is a drone interchangeable with every other drone. Those who previously made between minimum and $15 would of course demand proportional raises, but a lot of people couldn't get that - demand will certainly go down and business owners will find themselves strapped. In one fell swoop, we could see a third of the nation redefined as minimum wage workers. Those who were on the low end of that minimum to $15 range would have more buying power; those who were on the high end of that range would have less buying power. It would also stress the employer-employee dynamic for higher paid workers who would naturally want more money since so much just went way up in price, but many employers wouldn't be able to pay proportional raises, depending on how much demand dropped and how much payroll increased. For many, I suspect future raises would be much less than otherwise, further flattening the wage curve.

my understanding is that it's a combination of supply/demand (re: there are a lot of EMT's; it only requires taking a course that lasts a few months, not years of schooling like a nurse), most work for private companies, not necessarily hospitals, and the insurance aspect of it treats them more as transportation rather than emergency medical providers.

That is my understanding as well.

 

[MongGrel]

And I have to imagine the knowledge required is pretty high. With a van full of medical equipment, I wouldn't have a clue how to use it. But I've done roofing before. It can be learned in an afternoon. Sure you can get better and faster at it, but it's not difficult.

I'm kind of surprised paramedics haven't raised a fuss before, or maybe they have and I just haven't seen it. Seems like they should make at least as much as a nurse.

You seem to poke your nose into a lot of things your no expert in on a regular basis as if you are.

But that is well known of course.

 

[werepossum]

And I have to imagine the knowledge required is pretty high. With a van full of medical equipment, I wouldn't have a clue how to use it. But I've done roofing before. It can be learned in an afternoon. Sure you can get better and faster at it, but it's not difficult.

I'm kind of surprised paramedics haven't raised a fuss before, or maybe they have and I just haven't seen it. Seems like they should make at least as much as a nurse.

They do earn more than a nurse with the same amount of training. Most nurses go to school considerably longer.

Perhaps the question should be why aren't there higher standards for EMTs. But honestly, I can't recall a single incident when an incompetent EMT cost someone his life.

 

[BoberFett]

You seem to poke your nose into a lot of things your no expert in on a regular basis as if you are.

But that is well known of course.

You'd know all about sticking one's nose in things, eh you crotchsniffing bitch?

 

[FerrelGeek]

What I think is sad about this whole thing is that we're talking about (for all intents and purposes) fast food being a career path.

 

[CZroe]

What I think is sad about this whole thing is that we're talking about (for all intents and purposes) fast food being a career path.

It's also sad that people expect to make a living wage working that one job.

It is a career path for those willing to leave it behind. You work up and out.

 

[Strk]

I want to say that becoming an EMT today requires about 100 hours of training (which isn't nothing, but isn't in any way comparable to what nurses have to go through)

they're generally allowed to administer basic medicine (like insulin to a diabetic) and do their best to bandage wounds/stop bleeding, but they're typically not allowed to perform any operations that require puncturing the skin.

It depends which level they are. This site has a pretty simple summary

 

[ivwshane]

What I think is sad about this whole thing is that we're talking about (for all intents and purposes) fast food being a career path.

Why? Is fast food not on your list of approved careers?

 

[FerrelGeek]

Why? Is fast food not on your list of approved careers?

My approval has nothing to do with it as I'm not even close to being a snob. I've done menial work before and treat people fairly without regard to their 'position' in society

It's also sad that people expect to make a living wage working that one job.

It is a career path for those willing to leave it behind. You work up and out.

This! It's a great first job - seriously. Can teach you the basic disciplines of showing up, following instructions, and doing your work well. Disciplines that will serve well in future employment.

 

[Strk]

My approval has nothing to do with it as I'm not even close to being a snob. I've done menial work before and treat people fairly without regard to their 'position' in society



This! It's a great first job - seriously. Can teach you the basic disciplines of showing up, following instructions, and doing your work well. Disciplines that will serve well in future employment.

That last part is so true. It always makes me laugh when people don't take these jobs seriously (as the worker). If you agreed to do the job, do the job; qualifications are irrelevant. I wouldn't want someone who halfassed a job just because they thought they were better than it, since, as far as I'm concerned, it would eventually happen again (didn't get that promotion, so you figure screw it). It doesn't matter how good you look on paper if your work ethic sucks.

 

[who?]

A paramedic is much closer to being a doctor than an EMT. Paramedics should make much more than $15 an hour.

 

[ivwshane]

My approval has nothing to do with it as I'm not even close to being a snob. I've done menial work before and treat people fairly without regard to their 'position' in society



This! It's a great first job - seriously. Can teach you the basic disciplines of showing up, following instructions, and doing your work well. Disciplines that will serve well in future employment.

You didn't answer the question.

 

[MagickMan]

I guess social "science" graduates can now make enough to pay their student loans. That's a plus.

 

[MongGrel]

You'd know all about sticking one's nose in things, eh you crotchsniffing bitch?

Sounds like you need a sedagive...

 

[DCal430]

I know my father drove an ambulance in college, he didn't have shit for training or medical knowledge. Granted this was in the late 60's/early 70's and in Detroit.

There is a big difference between an EMT who drives an ambulance and a Paramedic who is medical professional, who studies for about a year.

 

[DCal430]

I want to say that becoming an EMT today requires about 100 hours of training (which isn't nothing, but isn't in any way comparable to what nurses have to go through)

they're generally allowed to administer basic medicine (like insulin to a diabetic) and do their best to bandage wounds/stop bleeding, but they're typically not allowed to perform any operations that require puncturing the skin.

The person in the OP is a Paramedic not an EMT. A paramedic is allowed to do things like tracheotomies, run IVs and such. They require 1500 to 2000 hours of training.