Palin bashing is women bashing - OP-ED

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jonks

Lifer
Feb 7, 2005
13,918
20
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what's it called when it's a woman doing the bashing? Noted conservative columnist and Reagan speech writer Peggy Noonan dispells the myths. Sexist!

http://online.wsj.com/article/...rations.html#printMode

A Farewell to Harms
Palin was bad for the Republicans?and the republic.
By PEGGY NOONAN

Sarah Palin's resignation gives Republicans a new opportunity to see her plain?to review the bidding, see her strengths, acknowledge her limits, and let go of her drama. It is an opportunity they should take. They mean to rebuild a great party. They need to do it on solid ground.

Her history does not need to be rehearsed at any length. Ten months ago she was embraced with friendliness by her party. The left and the media immediately overplayed their hand, with attacks on her children. The party rallied round, as a party should. She went on the trail a sensation but demonstrated in the ensuing months that she was not ready to go national and in fact never would be. She was hungry, loved politics, had charm and energy, loved walking onto the stage, waving and doing the stump speech. All good. But she was not thoughtful. She was a gifted retail politician who displayed the disadvantages of being born into a point of view (in her case a form of conservatism; elsewhere and in other circumstances, it could have been a form of liberalism) and swallowing it whole: She never learned how the other sides think, or why.

In television interviews she was out of her depth in a shallow pool. She was limited in her ability to explain and defend her positions, and sometimes in knowing them. She couldn't say what she read because she didn't read anything. She was utterly unconcerned by all this and seemed in fact rather proud of it: It was evidence of her authenticity. She experienced criticism as both partisan and cruel because she could see no truth in any of it. She wasn't thoughtful enough to know she wasn't thoughtful enough. Her presentation up to the end has been scattered, illogical, manipulative and self-referential to the point of self-reverence. "I'm not wired that way," "I'm not a quitter," "I'm standing up for our values." I'm, I'm, I'm.

In another age it might not have been terrible, but here and now it was actually rather horrifying.

McCain-Palin lost. Mrs. Palin has now stepped down, but she continues to poll high among some members of the Republican base, some of whom have taken to telling themselves Palin myths.

To wit, "I love her because she's so working-class." This is a favorite of some party intellectuals. She is not working class, never was, and even she, avid claimer of advantage that she is, never claimed to be and just lets others say it. Her father was a teacher and school track coach, her mother the school secretary. They were middle-class figures of respect, stability and local status. I think intellectuals call her working-class because they see the makeup, the hair, the heels and the sleds and think they're working class "tropes." Because, you know, that's what they teach in "Ways of the Working Class" at Yale and Dartmouth.

What she is, is a seemingly very nice middle-class girl with ambition, appetite and no sense of personal limits.

"She's not Ivy League, that's why her rise has been thwarted! She represented the democratic ideal that you don't have to go to Harvard or Brown to prosper, and her fall represents a failure of egalitarianism." This comes from intellectuals too. They need to be told something. Ronald Reagan went to Eureka College. Richard Nixon went to Whittier College, Joe Biden to the University of Delaware. Sarah Palin graduated in the end from the University of Idaho, a school that happily notes on its Web site that it's included in U.S. News and World Report's top national schools survey. They need to be told, too, that the first Republican president was named "Abe," and he went to Princeton and got a Fulbright. Oh wait, he was an impoverished backwoods autodidact!

America doesn't need Sarah Palin to prove it was, and is, a nation of unprecedented fluidity. Her rise and seeming fall do nothing to prove or refute this.

"The elites hate her." The elites made her. It was the elites of the party, the McCain campaign and the conservative media that picked her and pushed her. The base barely knew who she was. It was the elites, from party operatives to public intellectuals, who advanced her and attacked those who said she lacked heft. She is a complete elite confection. She might as well have been a bonbon.

"She makes the Republican Party look inclusive." She makes the party look stupid, a party of the easily manipulated.

"She shows our ingenuous interest in all classes." She shows your cynicism.

"Now she can prepare herself for higher office by studying up, reading in, boning up on the issues." Mrs. Palin's supporters have been ordering her to spend the next two years reflecting and pondering. But she is a ponder-free zone. She can memorize the names of the presidents of Pakistan, but she is not going to be able to know how to think about Pakistan. Why do her supporters not see this? Maybe they think "not thoughtful" is a working-class trope!

"The media did her in." Her lack of any appropriate modesty did her in. Actually, it's arguable that membership in the self-esteem generation harmed her. For 30 years the self-esteem movement told the young they're perfect in every way. It's yielding something new in history: an entire generation with no proper sense of inadequacy.

"Turning to others means the media won!" No, it means they lose. What the mainstream media wants is not to kill her but to keep her story going forever. She hurts, as they say, the Republican brand, with her mess and her rhetorical jabberwocky and her careless causing of division. Really, she is the most careless sower of discord since George W. Bush, who fractured the party and the movement that made him. Why wouldn't the media want to keep that going?

Here's why all this matters. The world is a dangerous place. It has never been more so, or more complicated, more straining of the reasoning powers of those with actual genius and true judgment. This is a time for conservative leaders who know how to think.

Here are a few examples of what we may face in the next 10 years: a profound and prolonged American crash, with the admission of bankruptcy and the spread of deep social unrest; one or more American cities getting hit with weapons of mass destruction from an unknown source; faint glimmers of actual secessionist movements as Americans for various reasons and in various areas decide the burdens and assumptions of the federal government are no longer attractive or legitimate.

The era we face, that is soon upon us, will require a great deal from our leaders. They had better be sturdy. They will have to be gifted. There will be many who cannot, and should not, make the cut. Now is the time to look for those who can. And so the Republican Party should get serious, as serious as the age, because that is what a grown-up, responsible party?a party that deserves to lead?would do.

It's not a time to be frivolous, or to feel the temptation of resentment, or the temptation of thinking next year will be more or less like last year, and the assumptions of our childhoods will more or less reign in our future. It won't be that way.

We are going to need the best.
 

MovingTarget

Diamond Member
Jun 22, 2003
9,002
115
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Originally posted by: umbrella39
Originally posted by: Slick5150
Believe me, if Sarah Palin was a guy I'd be just as frightened of the idea of him/her holding any elected office. She's just ignorant about WAY too many things and blames everyone else for that. That's not a woman thing, that's a Sarah Palin thing.

/thread and any chance of her ever becoming POTUS

This. Sometimes you do get legitimate complaints of sexism when it comes to coverage of female candidates. Sarah Palin has a few, but overall most of the criticism directed towards her was not based in that. Of course those who walk around wearing möbius panties around all day like to blame it all on sexism.
 
Feb 6, 2007
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Originally posted by: n yusef
The attacks on women are far more serious than calling Bush a monkey. More weight is given to their appearances. They are held to unreasonable standards as mothers (Palin was originally attacked for working while she had a young baby with special needs). In sum, sexism exists.

Was Sarah Palin attacked solely because of her gender? Of course not. It's not that she is called dumb that I find troubling, but that she is called a dumb bitch.

I've heard a lot of attacks about Hillary Clinton, one of the most prominent female politicians of the past 20 years, and virtually no mention is made of her appearance. She is attacked for her attitude, her manner of speaking, and even occasionally her policies. But not her appearance.

Palin, on the other hand, was attacked for her appearance... but then again, she did highlight it. She spent boatloads of money on a NYC shopping spree on the RNC dime, covered in full by the press, and highlighted the outing in speeches shortly thereafter. She seemed to be chosen, not for her policies or experience, but her appearance and "style." If that is what she brings to the table as a political candidate, you can't say that any such criticism of that is sexist. She marketed herself by her attractiveness and femininity, and when it gets turned back on her, now it's sexist? Bullshit.

As for the bitch thing... well, she was kind of a bitch to people, wasn't she? Reports from people near her paint her as someone who has to be in control, who won't listen to outside opinions, who demans perfection and is disgusted when she doesn't get her way. In colloquial terms, we tend to call women who exhibit those characteristics a bitch. We call men who exhibit those characteristics arrogant fuckers. If we called Sarah Palin an arrogant fucker, would it no longer be sexist? How about Harvey and his macros calling Bush a lying piece of shit? How about we call Palin that? Arguably, that's worse than bitch... but at least it's not sexist, right? Being overly politically correct to the point that you can't say anything negative about any minority or group that's been traditionally oppressed in this country is no better than being a complete bigot asshole; at least the bigot will tell you what he honestly thinks instead of trying to sugarcoat it so as not to appear "offensive."
 

ayabe

Diamond Member
Aug 10, 2005
7,449
0
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Originally posted by: Genx87
Originally posted by: ayabe
Originally posted by: OCguy
It isnt women bashing. It is bashing what she represents. (Country folk, religion, etc)

You left out ignorance, witchcraft, egomania, and dishonesty.

Those are certainly worth bashing.

Every politician has those qualities. When are you going to get on your soapbox and complain about Pelosi and Obama?

*facepalm*

Start an Obama thread and I'll have plenty to say, this thread is about Palin and why she's a joke.

The reflexive defensiveness about Palin just shows how far down the hole you guys really are. Give it up already and salvage some fucking dignity already, she's done, it was a horrible choice, best to look for better candidates in the future and hope the electorate forgets about 2008.

 

OutHouse

Lifer
Jun 5, 2000
36,410
616
126
Originally posted by: dali71
Originally posted by: dainthomas
Originally posted by: n yusef
ProfJohn is right, women politicians are victims of sexist attacks, and no, it isn't right, even against Palin.

The left has shown itself to have little high ground in this area, with the constant attacks on Palin's appearance, calling Coulter a man and a tranny, etc.

Who attacks Palin's appearance? She looks great for popping out so many kids. Every attack I heard centered on her complete ignorance of major national issues.

So you missed Sandra Bernhard's attack?

How about these classy folks who showed up at a Palin Rally?

Or this Obama campaign worker?

damn that is some fucked up shit right there. i bet those fucking idiots wearing those shirts have NO idea what Palin's policies were or have a clue where Alaska is.



 

jonks

Lifer
Feb 7, 2005
13,918
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Originally posted by: Citrix
Originally posted by: dali71
Originally posted by: dainthomas
Originally posted by: n yusef
ProfJohn is right, women politicians are victims of sexist attacks, and no, it isn't right, even against Palin.

The left has shown itself to have little high ground in this area, with the constant attacks on Palin's appearance, calling Coulter a man and a tranny, etc.

Who attacks Palin's appearance? She looks great for popping out so many kids. Every attack I heard centered on her complete ignorance of major national issues.

So you missed Sandra Bernhard's attack?

How about these classy folks who showed up at a Palin Rally?

Or this Obama campaign worker?

damn that is some fucked up shit right there. i bet those fucking idiots wearing those shirts have NO idea what Palin's policies were or have a clue where Alaska is.

I prefer this dignified critique of Hillary's foreign policy:
http://www.salon.com/mwt/broad...01/25/hillary_clinton/

The're politicians, they get called names. Most don't dignify every nutcase attack with a response.
 

Harvey

Administrator<br>Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
35,059
73
91
Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Ignore the title and read this article and look at the overall theme of this piece. It became very clear last year that women are treated very differently than men when it comes to politics.

That's true throughout society, and it's the legitimate basis of feminst causes, but it's NOT a reason to stop calling Palin out because she's dumber than a rock.

I know very smart, very accomplished women, starting with my four sisters, and I know what they've gone through to achieve what they have accomplished. Palin is simply unqualified for high public office regardless of her gender. :roll:
 

her209

No Lifer
Oct 11, 2000
56,336
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0
I thought were were an equal society now and that all our race and gender problems were solved.
 

tk149

Diamond Member
Apr 3, 2002
7,253
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I actually agree that for once, this is a non-partisan issue. The media bashes women.

To my mind, it seems that the media focuses more on women's appearance than men's, and I'm not just talking about the fashion police. When's the last time you saw an article talking about what kind of suit a guy was wearing and what kind of watch he had on?
 

Red Dawn

Elite Member
Jun 4, 2001
57,529
3
0
Originally posted by: tk149
I actually agree that for once, this is a non-partisan issue. The media bashes women.

To my mind, it seems that the media focuses more on women's appearance than men's, and I'm not just talking about the fashion police. When's the last time you saw an article talking about what kind of suit a guy was wearing and what kind of watch he had on?
Well in Palin's case it didn't help that she was uninformed and rather dim. Even Dan Quayle seemed an intellectual compared to her.

 

OCGuy

Lifer
Jul 12, 2000
27,224
37
91
Originally posted by: ayabe
Originally posted by: OCguy
It isnt women bashing. It is bashing what she represents. (Country folk, religion, etc)

You left out ignorance, witchcraft, egomania, and dishonesty.

Those are certainly worth bashing.

I thought ignorance was covered with religion, but to each their own.

Dishonesty and egomania are traits carried by all politicians.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
88,249
55,798
136
Originally posted by: jonks
Originally posted by: Citrix
Originally posted by: dali71
Originally posted by: dainthomas
Originally posted by: n yusef
ProfJohn is right, women politicians are victims of sexist attacks, and no, it isn't right, even against Palin.

The left has shown itself to have little high ground in this area, with the constant attacks on Palin's appearance, calling Coulter a man and a tranny, etc.

Who attacks Palin's appearance? She looks great for popping out so many kids. Every attack I heard centered on her complete ignorance of major national issues.

So you missed Sandra Bernhard's attack?

How about these classy folks who showed up at a Palin Rally?

Or this Obama campaign worker?

damn that is some fucked up shit right there. i bet those fucking idiots wearing those shirts have NO idea what Palin's policies were or have a clue where Alaska is.

I prefer this dignified critique of Hillary's foreign policy:
http://www.salon.com/mwt/broad...01/25/hillary_clinton/

The're politicians, they get called names. Most don't dignify every nutcase attack with a response.

I love how the people who spend all day crying about the 'political correctness police' run to find the nearest couch to faint on as soon as Palin gets attacked.

To be honest I can't think of a single politician on the national stage that deserves to be attacked more than that moron.
 

Lemon law

Lifer
Nov 6, 2005
20,984
3
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There are maybe not enough women in a male dominated pursuit like politics, and maybe some woman politicians have to overcome that bias that they should keep their Biscuits in the oven and their buns in bed.

But there are still hundreds of women in national political life, from people like Sanda Day O'Conner, Elinor Roosevelt and quite a pistol she was, we all remember Nancy Reagan, Barbara Bush, the Iron Magnolia, quite a few female senators and representatives, even the unforgettable Cynthia McKinney, and all of them were bashed to some extent, but only when they earned it.

Sarah Palin simply can't be taken as a serious politician when she talks about the poppy fields of N. Korea, revels in slogans like drill baby drill, panders to the RR by saying our ancestors rode dinosaurs 4000 years ago, and then dismiss it as mere sexism.
 

OrByte

Diamond Member
Jul 21, 2000
9,303
144
106
now that the repubs have an actual WOMAN in the spotlight they want to claim sexism?!

ummmmm no, sorry...I don't buy it.

The party of the frumpy old white men is not going to get away with throwing Palin in the media spotlight and whine about sexism.
 

dahunan

Lifer
Jan 10, 2002
18,191
3
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SO.. is she running on the VICTIM PLATFORM now?


I am saddened that the populous actually wants to vote for her AS MOST QUALIFIED.. WTF is wrong with you people /cry
 

Red Dawn

Elite Member
Jun 4, 2001
57,529
3
0
Originally posted by: OrByte
now that the repubs have an actual WOMAN in the spotlight they want to claim sexism?!

ummmmm no, sorry...I don't buy it.

The party of the frumpy old white men is not going to get away with throwing Palin in the media spotlight and whine about sexism.
Well besides the deluded fools like ProJo and the like but nobody is buying it. I suspect if Palin looked like Madeline Albright ProJo wouldn't be saying anything.
 

shrumpage

Golden Member
Mar 1, 2004
1,304
0
0
Originally posted by: dahunan
SO.. is she running on the VICTIM PLATFORM now?


I am saddened that the populous actually wants to vote for her AS MOST QUALIFIED.. WTF is wrong with you people /cry

That's odd. When asked about his executive experience, Obama just stated "i'm running a big campaign."

I don't see how a person who actually has successful executive experience at something could do any worse.
 

miniMUNCH

Diamond Member
Nov 16, 2000
4,159
0
0
Bottom line is... the press is harsh on politicians that are easy prey and/or cry about it. The press are vultures and smell out weakness to make themselves some easy money.

Palin is easy fodder.... too easy. If she doesn't want cracks made about her younger daughter... well tough shit... her older daughter got knocked up... the press is gonna be mean.

You don't see and didn't see the press trying to burn down Rice or Boxer or Feinstein... why? Because those ladies are fucking tough as nails politico's... that's why.
 

Genx87

Lifer
Apr 8, 2002
41,091
513
126
Originally posted by: miniMUNCH
Bottom line is... the press is harsh on politicians that are easy prey and/or cry about it. The press are vultures and smell out weakness to make themselves some easy money.

Palin is easy fodder.... too easy. If she doesn't want cracks made about her younger daughter... well tough shit... her older daughter got knocked up... the press is gonna be mean.

You don't see and didn't see the press trying to burn down Rice or Boxer or Feinstein... why? Because those ladies are fucking tough as nails politico's... that's why.

Children have been left out of the discussion in the past. How much do\did we hear about Gores drug addicted alcoholic degenerate of a son?

What the press did with the kids is undefendable.
 

dahunan

Lifer
Jan 10, 2002
18,191
3
0
Originally posted by: shrumpage
Originally posted by: dahunan
SO.. is she running on the VICTIM PLATFORM now?


I am saddened that the populous actually wants to vote for her AS MOST QUALIFIED.. WTF is wrong with you people /cry

That's odd. When asked about his executive experience, Obama just stated "i'm running a big campaign."

I don't see how a person who actually has successful executive experience at something could do any worse.

Where ??
700,000 IN THE WHOLE STATE??

Where did she even graduate from? BimboU?
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
88,249
55,798
136
Originally posted by: Genx87
Originally posted by: miniMUNCH
Bottom line is... the press is harsh on politicians that are easy prey and/or cry about it. The press are vultures and smell out weakness to make themselves some easy money.

Palin is easy fodder.... too easy. If she doesn't want cracks made about her younger daughter... well tough shit... her older daughter got knocked up... the press is gonna be mean.

You don't see and didn't see the press trying to burn down Rice or Boxer or Feinstein... why? Because those ladies are fucking tough as nails politico's... that's why.

Children have been left out of the discussion in the past. How much do\did we hear about Gores drug addicted alcoholic degenerate of a son?

What the press did with the kids is undefendable.

You realize that happened in 2007, right? It was out in every major news source. A quick google search shows a story on MSNBC, Reuters, ABC, Fox, Slate, People, LA times, etc... etc... etc... etc.....

Once again, you're just buying into the right's myth of persecution and victimhood at the hands of the media.
 

CallMeJoe

Diamond Member
Jul 30, 2004
6,938
5
81
Originally posted by: eskimospy
Originally posted by: Genx87
Originally posted by: miniMUNCH
Bottom line is... the press is harsh on politicians that are easy prey and/or cry about it. The press are vultures and smell out weakness to make themselves some easy money.
Palin is easy fodder.... too easy. If she doesn't want cracks made about her younger daughter... well tough shit... her older daughter got knocked up... the press is gonna be mean.
You don't see and didn't see the press trying to burn down Rice or Boxer or Feinstein... why? Because those ladies are fucking tough as nails politico's... that's why.
Children have been left out of the discussion in the past. How much do\did we hear about Gores drug addicted alcoholic degenerate of a son?
What the press did with the kids is undefendable.
You realize that happened in 2007, right? It was out in every major news source. A quick google search shows a story on MSNBC, Reuters, ABC, Fox, Slate, People, LA times, etc... etc... etc... etc.....
Once again, you're just buying into the right's myth of persecution and victimhood at the hands of the media.
One might also ask how many times Mr. Gore dragged his son out on stage during his political campaigns to demonstrate his Family Values.
 

ProfJohn

Lifer
Jul 28, 2006
18,161
7
0
Originally posted by: Balt
If Palin had been selected as the VP nom because of her qualifications then I might consider some of the attacks on her unfair (for the record I consider all of the attacks on her family to be unfair regardless).

The fact is, though, a factor of her selection was that she was a woman, and it was a lame attempt to court disenchanted Hillary voters. Would Palin still have been selected if she were a man? I very much doubt it. She was an awful choice from a multitude of perspectives, and there were male candidates who were far more qualified.

So if you want to leave sex out of it, then don't nominate someone based heavily on sex.
Did you really think this post out??

You have a legit reason to oppose Palin, she is a light weight and unqualified, but instead of focusing in on that legit reason you chose to focus in on another issue all together.

Doing so makes it seem that your legit reason is just an after thought.
 

ProfJohn

Lifer
Jul 28, 2006
18,161
7
0
Originally posted by: dahunan
Originally posted by: shrumpage
Originally posted by: dahunan
SO.. is she running on the VICTIM PLATFORM now?


I am saddened that the populous actually wants to vote for her AS MOST QUALIFIED.. WTF is wrong with you people /cry

That's odd. When asked about his executive experience, Obama just stated "i'm running a big campaign."

I don't see how a person who actually has successful executive experience at something could do any worse.
Where ??
700,000 IN THE WHOLE STATE??

Where did she even graduate from? BimboU?
Hey look! Perfect example of the kind of sexism we are talking about.

It isn't enough to attack her for going to some small state school, but you also have to attach the 'bimbo' label to it as well. Well done.
 

Balt

Lifer
Mar 12, 2000
12,673
482
126
Originally posted by: ProfJohn
Originally posted by: Balt
If Palin had been selected as the VP nom because of her qualifications then I might consider some of the attacks on her unfair (for the record I consider all of the attacks on her family to be unfair regardless).

The fact is, though, a factor of her selection was that she was a woman, and it was a lame attempt to court disenchanted Hillary voters. Would Palin still have been selected if she were a man? I very much doubt it. She was an awful choice from a multitude of perspectives, and there were male candidates who were far more qualified.

So if you want to leave sex out of it, then don't nominate someone based heavily on sex.
Did you really think this post out??

You have a legit reason to oppose Palin, she is a light weight and unqualified, but instead of focusing in on that legit reason you chose to focus in on another issue all together.

Doing so makes it seem that your legit reason is just an after thought.

We're supposed to think before we post?

Hmmm...