Overstock.com comercial is 'disturbing'.

Page 2 - Seeking answers? Join the AnandTech community: where nearly half-a-million members share solutions and discuss the latest tech.

glen

Lifer
Apr 28, 2000
15,995
1
81
Would you rather make Nike's for $5 a day or be a child prostituite for $5 a day?
Some liberals think that if the sweat shops were shut down, the children would suddenly be in nice American Public schools with a lunch program.
wtf are they thinking these kids will really be doing to generate money for food and medicine for their families?
 

mwtgg

Lifer
Dec 6, 2001
10,491
0
0
Originally posted by: BigJ
Originally posted by: Mo0o
Originally posted by: BigJ
Originally posted by: Mo0o
Maybe we should ask those working in the sweatshops whether they appreciate having at least something. Better yet, why dont we ask the average American consumer if they want to pay 400 dollars for a pair of nikes to save little timmy in indonesia (exaggeration of course).

This line of thinking got me crucified in a Sociology course I took.

Really? Is it fundamentally flawed? Or just not humanitarian enough?

Not humanitarian enough I guess. They just kept on telling me I was cold-hearted capitalist pig, that I didn't understand, people like me were the source of the problem, blah blah blah.

I understand perfectly well without these jobs, these people would be much, much worse off, possibly even dead. I also pointed out how everyone benefits from the work, not just greedy corporations. I also asked what these people actually wanted to do to stop the problem of exploitation, which they really didn't have an answer for. They just said that it had to stop, and had to stop now.

Granted this was an intro Sociology course.

Were these people who said you were a 'cold-hearted capitalist pig' wearing hemp clothing
 

Mo0o

Lifer
Jul 31, 2001
24,227
3
76
Originally posted by: glen
Would you rather make Nike's for $5 a day or be a child prostituite for $5 a day?
Some liberals think that if the sweat shops were shut down, the children would suddenly be in nice American Public schools with a lunch program.
wtf are they thinking these kids will really be doing to generate money for food and medicine for their families?

Exactly. THese kids arent working because its fun, they do it so the family can eat.
 

BigJ

Lifer
Nov 18, 2001
21,330
1
81
Originally posted by: mwtgg
Originally posted by: BigJ
Originally posted by: Mo0o
Originally posted by: BigJ
Originally posted by: Mo0o
Maybe we should ask those working in the sweatshops whether they appreciate having at least something. Better yet, why dont we ask the average American consumer if they want to pay 400 dollars for a pair of nikes to save little timmy in indonesia (exaggeration of course).

This line of thinking got me crucified in a Sociology course I took.

Really? Is it fundamentally flawed? Or just not humanitarian enough?

Not humanitarian enough I guess. They just kept on telling me I was cold-hearted capitalist pig, that I didn't understand, people like me were the source of the problem, blah blah blah.

I understand perfectly well without these jobs, these people would be much, much worse off, possibly even dead. I also pointed out how everyone benefits from the work, not just greedy corporations. I also asked what these people actually wanted to do to stop the problem of exploitation, which they really didn't have an answer for. They just said that it had to stop, and had to stop now.

Granted this was an intro Sociology course.

Were these people who said you were a 'cold-hearted capitalist pig' wearing hemp clothing

Beats the hell outta me. The girl who called me that looked like your average punk-dressed kid, nothing eccentric like tattoos or crazy hair. She was the only one who called me this, everyone else was relatively much more controlled and reasonable. She just decided to flip-out over this.

After class she tried to talk to me as I got up, but I just walked away.
 

alkemyst

No Lifer
Feb 13, 2001
83,769
19
81
Originally posted by: glen
Would you rather make Nike's for $5 a day or be a child prostituite for $5 a day?
Some liberals think that if the sweat shops were shut down, the children would suddenly be in nice American Public schools with a lunch program.
wtf are they thinking these kids will really be doing to generate money for food and medicine for their families?

The sad truth is the breakdown is more like $0.50 a day or $5 a day.

A lot of the sweatshops work on 'piece work', you make a 100 shoes that may be $1, make 99 and you get $0.

Also they play the count game as most of these kids/people can't count, so 150 pairs = 100.
 

azazyel

Diamond Member
Oct 6, 2000
5,872
1
81
well this is off topic but since we are talking about commericals I can't stand the geek squad one. When I first saw it I just saw all these young people in shirts and ties getting all freaked out. I was like WTF are these Mormons doing?
 

SKORPI0

Lifer
Jan 18, 2000
18,471
2,411
136
Originally posted by: azazyel
well this is off topic but since we are talking about commericals I can't stand the geek squad one. When I first saw it I just saw all these young people in shirts and ties getting all freaked out. I was like WTF are these Morons doing?

Fixed.... ;)
 

Landroval

Platinum Member
Feb 5, 2005
2,275
0
0
I love how they say families do this for generations and "finally have a market" for it. Are they implying people just made junk and stored it in their huts for decades before the miracle of "the Big O" ? :roll:
 

Mo0o

Lifer
Jul 31, 2001
24,227
3
76
Originally posted by: Landroval
I love how they say families do this for generations and "finally have a market" for it. Are they implying people just made junk and stored it in their huts for decades before the miracle of "the Big O" ? :roll:

Well probably just that they could only sell locally, no ties to international dealers.
 

Landroval

Platinum Member
Feb 5, 2005
2,275
0
0
Originally posted by: Mo0o
Originally posted by: Landroval
I love how they say families do this for generations and "finally have a market" for it. Are they implying people just made junk and stored it in their huts for decades before the miracle of "the Big O" ? :roll:

Well probably just that they could only sell locally, no ties to international dealers.

Most of the stuff would not have a reliable market. They train these families for sure. That in itself is not bad (good, since it gives then a source of income) but to stick a retarded line into the ad made me cringe. Listen to it next time, it just sounds silly, and I hate feeling manipulated :evil:
 

alkemyst

No Lifer
Feb 13, 2001
83,769
19
81
Originally posted by: Landroval
I love how they say families do this for generations and "finally have a market" for it. Are they implying people just made junk and stored it in their huts for decades before the miracle of "the Big O" ? :roll:

busting their as$es?
 
Aug 16, 2001
22,505
4
81
Originally posted by: rahvin
Originally posted by: FrustratedUser
I have no problem buying cheap stuff, that's not the point. The point is that O-stock is trying to sell a lie to us consumers.
They try to make you believe that they actually go to the local craftsman on the corner in a country and buys his weekly production of pots, pans, belts or whatever.

Worldstock (Overstock's division for locally produced goods) is legit. They are 60% of the GDP of afghanistan. They buy products made locally with a local story, most of the rugs purchased in afghanistan are purchased from people working out of their homes.

Why don't you go look at their site and see what they say about it.

Quote taken from Here. Afghan rug...:

Because of the high quality of material used and the popular designs, these rugs are sold for hundreds of dollars elsewhere, but only through Overstock.com can you own this rug at such a low price. Buy one today and give your room the look of a Central Asian Mahal. Don't forget to complement this rug with our beautiful Peruvian furniture also available through Overstock.com!

:Q
 

rahvin

Elite Member
Oct 10, 1999
8,475
1
0
http://www.overstock.com/cgi-bin/d2.cgi..._IID=5083&PAGE=STATICPAGE&PAGE_ID=2432

Around the world there are artisans who know how to make exquisite centerpiece items. Yet they have trouble accessing the US market because they are small-lot producers in an age of mass distribution. Often there is no way to get goods from their remote villages to here, and when there is, too many layers of mark-up make them unaffordable. The tragedy is that if we bought their goods, the artisans could prosper without abandoning their native crafts and culture, and without depending on charity.

Overstock's main business is bringing small lots to consumers at affordable prices. Three years ago we realized that that this capacity is exactly what artisans need. Thus was born Worldstock. We locate magnificent items made by craftswomen (and craftsmen) around the world. We emphasize sustainability: choosing items that are environmentally sound, and that don?t burn up the natural or human resources of their producers. We pride ourselves on being honest brokers: we don?t gouge producers with our clout, nor consumers with mark-ups, thereby allowing the artisans to receive an average of 60 - 70 percent of the money you spend in Worldstock. Our goal in Worldstock is not to make money, but to create tens of thousands (and someday millions) of jobs in the poorest regions of the world, while bringing customers unique products of which they can be proud ? hand-crafted clothing, jewelry, ceramics, furniture, and much more.

http://www.overstock.com/cgi-bin/d2.cgi?PAGE=STATICPAGE&PAGE_ID=1328

Worldstock Adoptive Principles

Corporations are often accused of disingenuousness concerning the socially responsible practices of which they boast, so suspicion haunts any firm making claims such as those outlined above. Consequently, along with the foregoing principles governing what products we acquire, we are also committed to the following principles governing our pricing, negotiations, and disclosure.

Razor-thin margin pricing

Some retailers buy goods that contribute to economic, cultural, or environmental sustainability, but then mark them up 300 or more, with the result that only a small fraction of the sales proceeds actually gets to the producers. We have decided on a radically different course. While a small profit is necessary to afford the ever larger inventories that growth requires, my dream is to price our Worldstock goods inexpensively so as to grow the department rapidly and spread the model to as many people as possible. So while the answer to the question, ?What percentage of the price actually goes to the producers?? varies by product, in general, it runs in the range of 60 - 70 of your purchase price goes to the producers. The remainder is pretty much entirely consumed in our own costs of importing, duties, handling, shipping, credit card fees and marketing.

Fair negotiation

I am a capitalist. As you read this, I?m doing everything I can to edge out the competition. That's how we sell TVs, jewelry, and computers at the prices we do. But that hypercompetitive mentality is not appropriate for Worldstock. When disparities in wealth, options, and information between two parties go beyond a certain level, negotiations can no longer be fair. We do not want to chisel Peruvian widows in order to ?get the goods,? and I have no doubt that socially conscious consumers don?t want us doing that on their behalf. Consequently, for this department, we do not negotiate roughly with suppliers, but rather remind them that if they charge us too much, we will not be able to sell their products or place reorders; lower prices to me will create higher volume for them. In effect, the buying behavior of our customers dictates how hard the producers themselves face pushback. I could think of no fairer system.

Transparency

Principled disagreement exists among proponents of fair trade.

For example, some Worldstock products are purchased from development organizations, NGOs, nonprofits and micro-credit banks, which organize producer associations and in some cases (landmine survivors, for example) provide training for producers. Some believe that socially responsible goods should be acquired only through such agencies to ensure credibility.

Others claim that limiting purchases to such agencies perpetuates a mindset of dependency, which says, ?An agency, not individual initiative, offers the only way to get ahead.? For example, imagine that in my own travels I find (as I have) a small workshop in a village in the Bekka Valley of eastern Lebanon, where a few women work together, making exquisite shawls. Their products do not carry the imprimatur of any UN organization or development agency, but in my view their wares are appropriate for Worldstock. Should I forgo the shawls because they lack the certification of an NGO, or should I trade in them to reward their initiative?

My answer to this dilemma is simple: transparency. We buy socially responsible products from reputable fair-trade importers, NGOs, micro-credit facilities, humanitarian organizations, and directly from artisans themselves. All producers sign a statement of principles concerning the manner in which the goods are produced, and we conduct our own investigation of such suppliers and their reputations. Therefore, a customer who trusts my claim that buying a given shawl contributes to the well-being of a village in eastern Lebanon can buy the shawl knowing where it came from. On the other hand, that customer might choose to buy only those products we acquire through formal channels, such as Rehab Craft Cambodia (an NGO building a self-sufficient business channel for Cambodians with disabilities). By providing sourcing information in our product descriptions, we minimize dilemmas about social responsibility: we are honest and transparent and let the customer decide.

It's sad that you couldn't find that "About Worldstock" link considering it was completely accessible from the page you linked. Like I said, try reading.
 
Aug 16, 2001
22,505
4
81
I still think it's a bit fishy......

Silver-plated Sugar Jar $29.99

Tea is an integral part of Moroccan hospitality and daily life. Moroccans jokingly refer to it as Moroccan 'whiskey' and many claim it is their only vice. As much as the consumption of tea is an obsession, so too is the ritual preparation and serving. A critical component to this process is the proper selection of a pot, glasses, tray and other accessories. Complete your Moroccan tea set with this lovely silver-plated sugar jar decorated with traditional Islamic engravings. The piece has been painstakingly handcrafted by artisans in Morocco.

What moron spend weeks making this pot and then selling it to the big O for $5 - $10 (my guess based on overhead, shipping, customs ......)
I like to know how many they have in stock. If it was truly handcrafted they would only have a few. It must be mass produced if they got hundreds or thousands of these.

Maybe I am way off but i think the comercial is pretty stupid.
 

rahvin

Elite Member
Oct 10, 1999
8,475
1
0
Originally posted by: FrustratedUser
What moron spend weeks making this pot and then selling it to the big O for $5 - $10 (my guess based on overhead, shipping, customs ......)

The same moron that spends that time making and hocking his wares in the bazzars of morocco, but it's clear you think everyone in the third world is stupid so what's the point of this discussion?
 
Aug 16, 2001
22,505
4
81
Originally posted by: rahvin
Originally posted by: FrustratedUser
What moron spend weeks making this pot and then selling it to the big O for $5 - $10 (my guess based on overhead, shipping, customs ......)

The same moron that spends that time making and hocking his wares in the bazzars of morocco, but it's clear you think everyone in the third world is stupid so what's the point of this discussion?

No I don't think they are stupid but why sell rugs for cheap to O-stock if they can get more in another place?
I just think there is more to it than the idealistic view the show in the comercial.
Hopefully I am wrong.
 

ghostman

Golden Member
Jul 12, 2000
1,819
1
76
Ever consider the workers might be making more money than they ever have before?

EDIT: Meaning, they might sell a rug for $5 to Overstock, but perhaps they would only get $2 at the local market. Unless you know how much they REALLY make (and not just "guess"), you really can't call it a sweatshop.
 

mwtgg

Lifer
Dec 6, 2001
10,491
0
0
Originally posted by: BigJ
Beats the hell outta me. The girl who called me that looked like your average punk-dressed kid, nothing eccentric like tattoos or crazy hair. She was the only one who called me this, everyone else was relatively much more controlled and reasonable. She just decided to flip-out over this.

After class she tried to talk to me as I got up, but I just walked away.

Ahh, a Hot Topic whore. I guess that's her way of "sticking it to the man"!
 

alkemyst

No Lifer
Feb 13, 2001
83,769
19
81
Originally posted by: FrustratedUser

No I don't think they are stupid but why sell rugs for cheap to O-stock if they can get more in another place?
I just think there is more to it than the idealistic view the show in the comercial.
Hopefully I am wrong.

hmmm...

no phone

no internet

 
Aug 16, 2001
22,505
4
81
Originally posted by: mwtgg
Originally posted by: BigJ
Beats the hell outta me. The girl who called me that looked like your average punk-dressed kid, nothing eccentric like tattoos or crazy hair. She was the only one who called me this, everyone else was relatively much more controlled and reasonable. She just decided to flip-out over this.

After class she tried to talk to me as I got up, but I just walked away.

Ahh, a Hot Topic whore. I guess that's her way of "sticking it to the man"!

OMGWTFPOST of the day. :confused: