Opinion on the teacher strikes?

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SNC

Platinum Member
Jan 14, 2001
2,166
202
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Hold the legislature's feet to the fire.
Interesting, how does one do that? Call or email, that will bother them about as much as a mosquito bite. Vote them out, OK long term it might be possible to replace every dumb fuck, but by that time the good ones you voted in will have been corrupted and be just as bad as those they replaced. Walk out, yah that worked.
 

SNC

Platinum Member
Jan 14, 2001
2,166
202
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Oh. And the right to withdraw ones labour is a fundamental human right.
I could not agree more. Where we differ is on those who block the ability of the employer to replace that person exercising that "right". I would have more respect for a person leaving the employ of someone they don't agree with then striking and forcing the employer to do X, Y or Z.
 

Zorba

Lifer
Oct 22, 1999
15,244
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I could not agree more. Where we differ is on those who block the ability of the employer to replace that person exercising that "right". I would have more respect for a person leaving the employ of someone they don't agree with then striking and forcing the employer to do X, Y or Z.
Again, at least in Oklahoma, it wasn't a strike. Second, the school boards are free to fire the teachers and find new ones, but as posted before, there are no new ones to replace them with because most people won't work for peanuts while dealing with all the BS teachers have to deal with.

One of the districts went back on Friday and had 400 teachers stay out, considering we are only going to graduate 309 new teachers this year, where are they going to find 400 replacements.

I'd personally rather the teachers strike than them all quit and leave the state or find a different career.
 

Jhhnn

IN MEMORIAM
Nov 11, 1999
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You obviously have no facts on the case in Oklahoma. First, the school boards almost all approved the walkout, making it a walkout not a strike. Second, Teacher pay in Oklahoma is terrible and has been for a very long time.

What finally pushed them over the edge was after being promised to have additional funding for years, every year over the last four education has taken MASSIVE cuts in funding. The current education funding in Oklahoma is lower in real dollars than it was 15 years ago. The funding situation is so bad that a quarter of the schools in the state only hold classes 4 days a week. The walkout started on the day the legislator by law had to fully fund school, which they didn't do.

Oklahoma has continued to push unfunded tax cuts year after year. Almost all of those tax cuts have been in the form of tax credits and exemptions to well off people. The capital gains exemption (no capital gains tax on Oklahoma businesses) alone costs the state $115M/yr and 89% of it goes to the top 1% of income earners. They have also made DOT funding the highest budget priority so it gets funding before education, health, etc, but they hadn't raised the gas tax since the 80s and it was the lowest in the country (they finally raised it by 3 whole cents). It also doesn't help that during this time the republican administration has authorized the creation of tons of new school districts so every tiny town has its own system (over 550 in the state).

The OKC school district has been averaging an annual turnover rate of 25%. One of the best school districts in the state (Edmond), has said they will need at least 300 new teachers next year to cover attrition and growth, but the entire state is only going to graduate 309 new teachers. Last year nearly 2000 teachers were certified through an emergency certification process because they were not actually qualified to be teachers.

The state constitution is also ridiculous in that it takes a 75% vote of each house to raise taxes, but only a simple majority to cut them. So even during a time when we've been having billion dollar budget gaps, they keep cutting revenue, while not raising any. Further, the only things republicans are willing to vote for are regressive taxes.

oklahoma.png

The Lootocracy rules Oklahoma. And Republican Jeezus, too.
 

Sunburn74

Diamond Member
Oct 5, 2009
5,037
2,615
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Interesting, how does one do that? Call or email, that will bother them about as much as a mosquito bite. Vote them out, OK long term it might be possible to replace every dumb fuck, but by that time the good ones you voted in will have been corrupted and be just as bad as those they replaced. Walk out, yah that worked.
Hold out longer than 9 days. Geez. 9 days is nothing. There is intermittently bad weather that shut down schools for longer that.
 

Zorba

Lifer
Oct 22, 1999
15,244
10,817
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Hold out longer than 9 days. Geez. 9 days is nothing. There is intermittently bad weather that shut down schools for longer that.
Yeah, the largest teachers union just declared it over, no vote and now won't answer any questions about why.
 

SNC

Platinum Member
Jan 14, 2001
2,166
202
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SNC has a real 90's outlook. 1890's that is.
So the new way of thinking is that if you don't get what you want, make the only group involved that can do NOTHING be the ones to suffer. Interesting. NOW, if you want to impress me have the teachers block the ability of the ones who are actually responsible from getting to work, like the board and the legislature who are actually responsible for the issues they are fighting about. Making a single mom or dad call off work because they cant find cheap enough daycare is a stupid way to get your point across, and garners no good will from me. If thats 1890s thinking, so be it.

Edit:
Speaking about the 1890s and being in it. I would be perfectly OK with the tax rate being the same as then until all schools and public services are running perfectly and funded as they should be.

I'm really not a dick, but making the most affected, least able to affect change suffer is a fucking stupid way to get something.
 
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Jhhnn

IN MEMORIAM
Nov 11, 1999
62,365
14,681
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So the new way of thinking is that if you don't get what you want, make the only group involved that can do NOTHING be the ones to suffer. Interesting. NOW, if you want to impress me have the teachers block the ability of the ones who are actually responsible from getting to work, like the board and the legislature who are actually responsible for the issues they are fighting about. Making a single mom or dad call off work because they cant find cheap enough daycare is a stupid way to get your point across, and garners no good will from me. If thats 1890s thinking, so be it.

Edit:
Speaking about the 1890s and being in it. I would be perfectly OK with the tax rate being the same as then until all schools and public services are running perfectly and funded as they should be.

I'm really not a dick, but making the most affected, least able to affect change suffer is a fucking stupid way to get something.

Moving the goalposts, huh?
 

Noah Abrams

Golden Member
Feb 15, 2018
1,041
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Even if I were from it, I would still say Oklahoma isn't the kind of place where you'd expect education to have much importance. Not just there, as a country we don't place that much emphasis on education. No I am not necessarily talking about politics / govt / tax dollars (though that is definitely part of it) but the attitude of parents as well.
 

Zorba

Lifer
Oct 22, 1999
15,244
10,817
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So the new way of thinking is that if you don't get what you want, make the only group involved that can do NOTHING be the ones to suffer. Interesting. NOW, if you want to impress me have the teachers block the ability of the ones who are actually responsible from getting to work, like the board and the legislature who are actually responsible for the issues they are fighting about. Making a single mom or dad call off work because they cant find cheap enough daycare is a stupid way to get your point across, and garners no good will from me. If thats 1890s thinking, so be it.

Edit:
Speaking about the 1890s and being in it. I would be perfectly OK with the tax rate being the same as then until all schools and public services are running perfectly and funded as they should be.

I'm really not a dick, but making the most affected, least able to affect change suffer is a fucking stupid way to get something.
This same crap gets said any time any union strikes. Protests and strikes are supposed to cause disruption, it's a feature not a bug. Oklahoma voted 60% for Republicans so if people are upset about the results of their votes, maybe they should vote for someone else.

Edit, I agree that they should've also blocked the entrances to all the oil companies that have owners who are actively looting the state, though.
 
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Zorba

Lifer
Oct 22, 1999
15,244
10,817
136
Got linked this article this morning. It's a pretty alarming read. I'm sure there's some level of FUD in this, but the premise is not inaccurate.
Look at what is happening and see how the chips are being distributed between the haves and have nots.

https://www.ineteconomics.org/persp...ping-out-public-schools#.Ws9QkLC2t0e.facebook
I'm sure there is some FUD in that, but seems legit. I wish it would've gone into how corporate welfare directly hurts schools too. A very common tax break is property tax waivers, which provide a big chunk of school funding. Then the really big guys also don't pay income tax, further hurting school funding.
 

Bitek

Lifer
Aug 2, 2001
10,676
5,238
136
What I learned is that OK kids are uneducated little r-tards because their parents don't GAF.

Duly noted.

That's what most employers/colleges should be keeping in mind when they evaluate potential recruits from OK or similar red states.

How much could i really expect from some miseducated hayseeds?
Can these barbarians even read?
Why should I waste my time on grade D talent?
Do i even want them in my community giving votes to stupidity?

Let me throw this application in the trash while I look for some liberals or Asian immigrants who actually value education...
 

Jhhnn

IN MEMORIAM
Nov 11, 1999
62,365
14,681
136
What I learned is that OK kids are uneducated little r-tards because their parents don't GAF.

Duly noted.

That's what most employers/colleges should be keeping in mind when they evaluate potential recruits from OK or similar red states.

How much could i really expect from some miseducated hayseeds?
Can these barbarians even read?
Why should I waste my time on grade D talent?
Do i even want them in my community giving votes to stupidity?

Let me throw this application in the trash while I look for some liberals or Asian immigrants who actually value education...

What a bullshit attitude. Everybody deserves to be judged on their character & qualifications, not where they were raised.
 

Bitek

Lifer
Aug 2, 2001
10,676
5,238
136
What a bullshit attitude. Everybody deserves to be judged on their character & qualifications, not where they were raised.
Sarcasm dude. Well, at least to a point. Many people will think it because that's what is being advertised.

The bullshit attitude is that of OK parents who don't take care of their children's education and the corrupt legislators who sell their citizens out.
 

Thebobo

Lifer
Jun 19, 2006
18,574
7,671
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The most significant impact in life I had was with one teacher. They are worth everything to this country and should be paid appropriately. Good for them.
 

mdram

Golden Member
Jan 2, 2014
1,512
208
106
anyone that strikes should be treated just like someone that quits
unions are there to pad the pockets of union officials

if you dont like the pay of your job, get a different job, its pretty simple really
 

fleshconsumed

Diamond Member
Feb 21, 2002
6,485
2,363
136
anyone that strikes should be treated just like someone that quits
unions are there to pad the pockets of union officials

if you dont like the pay of your job, get a different job, its pretty simple really
Meh, states are free to go out and hire replacements... I wonder why they don't just do that? Probably because no one wants to work for wages they're offering.
 

Thebobo

Lifer
Jun 19, 2006
18,574
7,671
136
anyone that strikes should be treated just like someone that quits
unions are there to pad the pockets of union officials

if you dont like the pay of your job, get a different job, its pretty simple really

lol
 

Noah Abrams

Golden Member
Feb 15, 2018
1,041
109
76
The most significant impact in life I had was with one teacher. They are worth everything to this country and should be paid appropriately. Good for them.

It says a lot about our society how we treat one of the most important people in the society - teachers. And it is not about making students better money making machines, which is what our society revolves around with. It is about character building. I know teachers aren't the only ones who are supposed to do that, but they are a very important part of it.
 

dawp

Lifer
Jul 2, 2005
11,347
2,709
136
anyone that strikes should be treated just like someone that quits
unions are there to pad the pockets of union officials

if you dont like the pay of your job, get a different job, its pretty simple really
you get what you pay for, if you don't pay teachers didly-squat they go elsewhere and leave you with lower quality and quantity and the education you kids get is lacking. they can't compete with students from states that actually give a damn.