On the topic of "Draw Prophet Mohammed Day"

[nakedfrog]

I hate writing things like this but I feel that I have to in order to make a point.

You should call black people n----r too. That will get you far in life. It's the same thing if you think about it. Show some respect for things people might get really, really pissed off about. Seriously, find a black drug dealer in a bad part of town and call him a n----r to his face. See where it gets you.

Irony ... South Park, nagger guy episode is on.

It's funny you talk about respect, I should respect their religious belief about not depicting Mohammed, but they shouldn't respect my right to satire? Should we ban Blazing Saddles?

 

[Zebo]

nm

 

[irishScott]

Douchebags will always be there, whether we enable them or not. The fact that this will be an outlet for them is irrelevant.

The bigger picture here is that Islam has, for some time, been treated as "special" among religions. Look at South Park and Family Guy. Jesus has reoccurring "offensive" roles on both shows regularly, and hell southpark had full shows dedicated to the words "great person" and "i love you". Yet Mohammad is censored, and Muslims in general (not saying even a majority is involved, but in general) are being more vocal about Muhammad dressed as a bear than they are about terrorism, in more than a few cases to the point of death threats, and in fewer cases assault. This is a problem, and tomorrow is a vocal mass protest against it. Like all protests, there will be infiltrators who try to use the protest to their own ends. Doesn't undermine the overall message.

 

[irishScott]

I have to agree with the OP. No reason to be a dick just for the sake of it. Yes, some muslims are evil fucks. So are some christians and some atheists. And no, I don't have much respect at all for the religion. But why be a dick to them? There's no reason. You wouldn't treat a muslim like this in person, but with the internet's anonymity you feel like you can be a fucktard with impunity. And that makes you a giant pussy.

Depends on the person. Given the chance, I would gladly make Osama a pop-up book with a pull-tab to see Bush ass-fuck Mohammad (for the record, I hate Bush as much as anyone), and demonstrate it in person. For any of the Muslims I know and respect, I wouldn't dream of doing it in the first place.

 

[GodlessAstronomer]

Depends on the person. Given the chance, I would gladly make Osama a pop-up book with a pull-tab to see Bush ass-fuck Mohammad (for the record, I hate Bush as much as anyone), and demonstrate it in person. For any of the Muslims I know and respect, I wouldn't dream of doing it in the first place.

That's what I mean. Most people know at least some muslims and for the most part they are fine people, with religious delusions that are remarkably similar to the people you Americans constantly vote to lead your country. Everyone talks tough about muslims on forums like this but they wouldn't say anything like this to their muslim coworkers. Because they are either liars and trying to look like tough guys on the forum, or they're giant pussies.

 

[halik]

I hate writing things like this but I feel that I have to in order to make a point.

You should call black people n----r too. That will get you far in life. It's the same thing if you think about it. Show some respect for things people might get really, really pissed off about. Seriously, find a black drug dealer in a bad part of town and call him a n----r to his face. See where it gets you.

Irony ... South Park, nagger guy episode is on.

People aren't upset that you can't draw Muhammad or say great person to black drug dealer. People are upset that there is structural push for censure due to threats of violence. If comedy central bleepd great person from that episode because they received death threats from some black org, it wouldn't fly either.

 

[Crono]

First amendment trumps political correctness, tact or respect.

First ammendment allows free speech, it doesn't dictate what should be said.

If you look at the intent and background of the writer's of the constitution, I doubt they desired people to exercise speech in all manners and for all purposes, even though the laws of the land do all allow for it.

There are benefits and consequences for what we say no matter what the law says, though, so obviously each individual has to exert his or her discretion.

The forums are a microcosm of this. I'm free enough to troll if I wanted to - to a degree.

 

[irishScott]

That's what I mean. Most people know at least some muslims and for the most part they are fine people, with religious delusions that are remarkably similar to the people you Americans constantly vote to lead your country. Everyone talks tough about muslims on forums like this but they wouldn't say anything like this to their muslim coworkers. Because they are either liars and trying to look like tough guys on the forum, or they're giant pussies.

Or we just wouldn't say it to them because they're not whom this is directed that.

 

[halik]

First ammendment allows free speech, it doesn't dictate what should be said.

If you look at the intent and background of the writer's of the constitution, I doubt they desired people to exercise speech in all manners and for all purposes, even though the laws of the land do all allow for it.

There are benefits and consequences for what we say no matter what the law says, though, so obviously each individual has to exert his or her discretion.

The forums are a microcosm of this. I'm free enough to troll if I wanted to - to a degree.

Exactly what other thing you can say/do that will lead you to fear for your life? In this country?

I mean look at the girl that started this thing - she's doing the hardest to back away from this thing for fear of her life. Just because she communicated an idea, a statement about censorship, she's now scared shitless what will happen to her.

If you don't understand how fundamentally wrong and unamerican this current situation is, you need to think long and hard about what this country stands for.

 

[GodlessAstronomer]

Exactly what other thing you can say/do that will lead you to fear for your life? In this country?

Go to the projects in Baltimore and yell some racial slurs, see how long you last.

 

[halik]

Go to the projects in Baltimore and yell some racial slurs, see how long you last.

Are you saying that the 2 guys form southpark can never walk through the hood? What about people at comedy central?

Is anyone that ever said great person now scared that a black person will kill them? Death squads for Kramer?

Come on, we both know that's an entirely false analogy.

 

[M0oG0oGaiPan]

#171987 +(13139)- [X]
<Th3No0b> Im going to be the next hitler
<Th3No0b> Im going to kill all the jews and 1 clown
<RageAgainsttheAmish> why the clown
<Th3No0b> See? no one cares about the jews
<RageAgainsttheAmish> lmao

I'm a Jew lover btw. I just thought everyone should take a second and relax.

 

[GodlessAstronomer]

Are you saying that the 2 guys form southpark can never walk through the hood? What about people at comedy central?

Is anyone that ever said great person now scared that a black person will kill them? Death squads for Kramer?

Come on, we both know that's an entirely false analogy.

Is that what I said? No.

 

[halik]

Is that what I said? No.

That's the essence of your argument, that saying great person will have the same presumed consequences as drawing muhammad. That is, if you say great person there's a chance some crazy black dude will sever you head.

 

[M0oG0oGaiPan]

rerax gais

 

[Crono]

I mean look at the girl that started this thing - she's doing the hardest to back away from this thing for fear of her life. Just because she communicated an idea, a statement about censorship, she's now scared shitless what will happen to her.

If you don't understand how fundamentally wrong and unamerican this current situation is, you need to think long and hard about what this country stands for.

While she shouldn't face threats or fear for her life, this situation doesn't justify the deliberate provocation of people. She isn't being persecuted for some noble cause, she made a stupid cartoon and call to action that was a mistake to print in the first place.

I'm not saying she doesn't have a right to do so, I'm saying it wasn't a wise or helpful thing to do.

Some people think it is up to comedians to test boundaries, but I think those boundaries should be tested only for the most important things, like basic human rights and the preservation of life. Not freedom of speech exercised in such a non-constructive fashion.

Again, I believe people have the right to exercise free speech, but be wise about what you say. Don't go poking people in the face for a reaction.

 

[alevasseur14]

That's what I mean. Most people know at least some muslims and for the most part they are fine people, with religious delusions that are remarkably similar to the people you Americans constantly vote to lead your country.

Generalize much? I didn't vote for Obama because I identified with his religion. I didn't vote for Gore because Bush's religion was at odds with mine. That's probably because I don't have one. I voted how I did for other reasons.

And just so we're clear, there are no religious people in your government? Right?

 

[DangerAardvark]

BTW, the point of stuff like this is to reiterate that THE PROBLEM IS WITH THE PEOPLE WHO TAKE OFFENSE AT CARTOONS, NOT THOSE WHO DRAW THEM. You know, sort of like the people who get bent out of shape over a cracker. Or a novel, which forces an author into protective custody for a decade.

Of course this wouldn't even be necessary if religions were capable of keeping their delusions to themselves.

 

[Crono]

BTW, the point of stuff like this is to reiterate that THE PROBLEM IS WITH THE PEOPLE WHO TAKE OFFENSE AT CARTOONS, NOT THOSE WHO DRAW THEM. You know, sort of like the people who get bent out of shape over a cracker. Or a novel, which forces an author into protective custody for a decade.

Of course this wouldn't even be necessary if religions were capable of keeping their delusions to themselves.

Yeah, I'm sure people don't get bent out of shape over politics...oh wait a minute...

All fundamental beliefs can cause deep offense, even to lead some to kill others.

 

[halik]

While she shouldn't face threats or fear for her life, this situation doesn't justify the deliberate provocation of people. She isn't being persecuted for some noble cause, she made a stupid cartoon and call to action that was a mistake to print in the first place.

I'm not saying she doesn't have a right to do so, I'm saying it wasn't a wise or helpful thing to do.

Some people think it is up to comedians to test boundaries, but I think those boundaries should be tested only for the most important things, like basic human rights and the preservation of life. Not freedom of speech exercised in such a non-constructive fashion.

Again, I believe people have the right to exercise free speech, but be wise about what you say. Don't go poking people in the face for a reaction.

She wasn't out to test boundaries, she was making a statement regarding censure via threats of violence. It is constructive in the sense that if everyone does it, it takes away from the perceived power these nutjobs gained via comedy central's actions.

That lady's goal wasn't to draw muhammad on the 20th, it was to destroy the notion that you can silence people and ideas with violence. That's why political correctness and tact are being trumped, because the threat was an attack on a constitutional right.

 

[halik]

Yeah, I'm sure people don't get bent out of shape over politics...oh wait a minute...

All fundamental beliefs can cause deep offense, even to lead some to kill others.

No, there is no other idea you can communicate that will lead you to permanently fear for your life. THAT's what people are standing up against.

 

[DangerAardvark]

Yeah, I'm sure people don't get bent out of shape over politics...oh wait a minute...

All fundamental beliefs can cause deep offense, even to lead some to kill others.

And yet it's perfectly acceptable to ridicule someone's political beliefs, but religions want special consideration.

 

[Phoenix86]

Ultimately what I am more concerned is that this truly isn't about freedom of speech - it is about using FOS as an excuse for bigots to come out of the woodwork and express hateful, generalized, and bigoted opinions about Muslims. We can see this EASILY in this thread with some great examples and stereotypes, and you can see the same in the facebook page.

That's EXACTLY what freedom of speech is about.

"I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it," It's one of the corner stone quotes on freedom of speech.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evelyn_Beatrice_Hall

Also, you're not too bright for starting a thread that was already locked.

 

[Phoenix86]

I have to agree with the OP. No reason to be a dick just for the sake of it. Yes, some muslims are evil fucks. So are some christians and some atheists. And no, I don't have much respect at all for the religion. But why be a dick to them? There's no reason. You wouldn't treat a muslim like this in person, but with the internet's anonymity you feel like you can be a fucktard with impunity. And that makes you a giant pussy.

There's a different in not wanting to do something (you're right, why be a dick?) and not being able to do it (censorship).

OP wants to censor, you sound like you simply choose not to do it. There's a huge difference.

 

[Beev]

OP seems to have fled after making the thread.

At any rate, I don't JUST make fun of Muslims for being fucktards. I do it for anyone who is religious. I don't "hate" on Mohammed because I'm bigoted. I do it because FUCK YOU I'll say whatever I want. All of this Mohammed shit is funny because of the uproar it causes.

In short: