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On crime and punishment - Misdemeanor cat abuse

A

alchemize

Lifer
For Christmas we let our daughter, who will be five in April, keep a little stray kitten that wandered into our garage. We've been very clear that this is her cat, and she bears the responsibility of cleaning the litter box, feeding it, etc. (with our help of course).

She's been OK - but she's had a problem with "treating it like a toy". i.e. swinging it around, being too rough with it.

Well, tonight she went overboard and threw it down the stairs. After discussion with my wife, we decided we would "take the cat away" for a while. We explained to her that the cat was going away for a while, and we would think about if she could have the responsibility again. She was devastated. I mean sobbing like I've never seen her cry before. It was heart wrenching 🙁 🙁

So my question is - are we being too strict? How long should we keep the cat away?

PS I usually post in P&N. I'm a bastard rich elitist neocon.
 
Where are you taking it? I say 2 days. Considering you are only supposed to punish kids 1 minute per year of age, 2 days sans kitty should be plenty.
 
Originally posted by: TwinkleToes77
Where are you taking it? I say 2 days. Considering you are only supposed to punish kids 1 minute per year of age, 2 days sans kitty should be plenty.
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does that mean youll give me 24 minutes of spankings? 😉
 
Originally posted by: TwinkleToes77
Where are you taking it? I say 2 days. Considering you are only supposed to punish kids 1 minute per year of age, 2 days sans kitty should be plenty.
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Probably to a neighbors. Two days was what we thought also - have her do some "responsibility" type things to show she can handle it.

dartworth: Almost 5 🙂 Yes, it is a lot of responsibility - but we remind her when to feed, etc. We never give her a hard time about that. It's just the rough stuff that has her getting in trouble.
 
That is a lot of responsibility for a 5 year old, but it's kind of odd that she's not past the typical child animal abuse.

I'm 5 years older than my brother, & my parents training for him started much younger than that ("No Brian, you pet the cat not beat it" type stuff, how to properly support an animal you're holding, etc.).

Has she had much exposure to animals?

Viper GTS
 
Originally posted by: Viper GTS
That is a lot of responsibility for a 5 year old, but it's kind of odd that she's not past the typical child animal abuse.

I'm 5 years older than my brother, & my parents training for him started much younger than that ("No Brian, you pet the cat not beat it" type stuff, how to properly support an animal you're holding, etc.).

Has she had much exposure to animals?

Viper GTS
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Yah, we have 2 dogs (bulldogs) and a persian cat. Obviously the bulldogs are never an issue for abuse 😀 And the persian learned to run away. I think it is because this cat is so small and tolerant of her abuses.
 
This is your first kid isnt it. I'll put money on it.
Trust me, after 3 kids, that little throw a tantrum antic doesnt even ruffle my feathers. Right to the room, go cry in there cause I dont wanna hear it.

No, your not being too strict. And dont give in. Send them to the room if they want to cry. Tell them go to the room, they can cry all DAY in there if they want.

Trust me, if they think they might even POSSIBLY get there way by playing on your emotions, your sunk.
 
As long as she understands why it happened, and that it was a direct result of her being too rough with it, then I think it's fine.

I'm sure you realize that the love affair with the cat will get to the point where, although she still likes it, she doesn't want to clean the litter and what not. My family had tons of pets and ultimately the pets' care was the responsibility of my parents. We still loved our dog, but we didn't care for it personally 🙂 And then with hamsters/fish, they'd uniformly get neglected, as small pets do in 99% of cases. Not starved or anything, but you know: dirty cages, don't give a crap for it, feel guilty that you don't care much when it dies, etc.
No, your not being too strict. And dont give in. Send them to the room if they want to cry. Tell them go to the room, they can cry all DAY in there if they want.
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LOL, but you're right.
 
Originally posted by: alchemize
For Christmas we let our daughter, who will be five in April, keep a little stray kitten that wandered into our garage. We've been very clear that this is her cat, and she bears the responsibility of cleaning the litter box, feeding it, etc. (with our help of course).

She's been OK - but she's had a problem with "treating it like a toy". i.e. swinging it around, being too rough with it.

Well, tonight she went overboard and threw it down the stairs. After discussion with my wife, we decided we would "take the cat away" for a while. We explained to her that the cat was going away for a while, and we would think about if she could have the responsibility again. She was devastated. I mean sobbing like I've never seen her cry before. It was heart wrenching 🙁 🙁

So my question is - are we being too strict? How long should we keep the cat away?

PS I usually post in P&N. I'm a bastard rich elitist neocon.
Click to expand...

Do kids that age have the cognitive capacity to actually understand what they're doing might hurt the cat? I mean, she's not even five. I just wonder if giving a < 5 year old kid the responsibility of looking after a cat is developmentally appropriate.

 
The worst thing you can do is give in to a child's crying ,especially if you know you're being reasonable and logical.
 
Originally posted by: alchemize
For Christmas we let our daughter, who will be five in April, keep a little stray kitten that wandered into our garage. We've been very clear that this is her cat, and she bears the responsibility of cleaning the litter box, feeding it, etc. (with our help of course).

She's been OK - but she's had a problem with "treating it like a toy". i.e. swinging it around, being too rough with it.

Well, tonight she went overboard and threw it down the stairs. After discussion with my wife, we decided we would "take the cat away" for a while. We explained to her that the cat was going away for a while, and we would think about if she could have the responsibility again. She was devastated. I mean sobbing like I've never seen her cry before. It was heart wrenching 🙁 🙁

So my question is - are we being too strict? How long should we keep the cat away?

PS I usually post in P&N. I'm a bastard rich elitist neocon.
Click to expand...

In addition to placing an inappropriate responsibility on a kid that age, I think your punishment techniques are also age inappropriate. Does this kid even understand what she did is wrong? Does she know her own strength? Does she know the cat might be hurt? And at that age, is she even able to make the connection between doing something "wrong" and having her cat suddenly disappear. It all seems pretty crazy to me. But then, you're a conservative, so I suppose I shouldn't be surprised.

 
WWGWBD? 😛

IMO, you are doing the right thing.

EDIT:

For a term of hours not days. A five year old cannot understand the principles behind the punishment, however she can grasp the effect of a behavior.
 
Originally posted by: Specop 007
This is your first kid isnt it. I'll put money on it.
Trust me, after 3 kids, that little throw a tantrum antic doesnt even ruffle my feathers. Right to the room, go cry in there cause I dont wanna hear it.

No, your not being too strict. And dont give in. Send them to the room if they want to cry. Tell them go to the room, they can cry all DAY in there if they want.

Trust me, if they think they might even POSSIBLY get there way by playing on your emotions, your sunk.
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First child, but we have 2. I win! $$ 😀

This isn't tantrum crying - trust me I know the difference. This is "I've lost my best friend" crying.
 
Originally posted by: aidanjm
And at that age, is she even able to make the connection between doing something "wrong" and having her cat suddenly disappear. It all seems pretty crazy to me. But then, you're a conservative, so I suppose I shouldn't be surprised.
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She's 5 YEARS old, not 5 months :roll:
 
Guys, give a 4-5 year old some credit 🙂 I know my neighbour's son, who's that age, definitely could understand the consequences of throwing a cat down the stairs. Kids that age are like cats - if the cat wants a treat or something it does what you ask, otherwise it ignores you; similarly the 4-5 year old can definitely understand why what they did was wrong. Whether it matters to them is another thing, but apparently the 4 year old in question has a good motivator to learn.
 
Originally posted by: aidanjm
Originally posted by: alchemize
For Christmas we let our daughter, who will be five in April, keep a little stray kitten that wandered into our garage. We've been very clear that this is her cat, and she bears the responsibility of cleaning the litter box, feeding it, etc. (with our help of course).

She's been OK - but she's had a problem with "treating it like a toy". i.e. swinging it around, being too rough with it.

Well, tonight she went overboard and threw it down the stairs. After discussion with my wife, we decided we would "take the cat away" for a while. We explained to her that the cat was going away for a while, and we would think about if she could have the responsibility again. She was devastated. I mean sobbing like I've never seen her cry before. It was heart wrenching 🙁 🙁

So my question is - are we being too strict? How long should we keep the cat away?

PS I usually post in P&N. I'm a bastard rich elitist neocon.
Click to expand...

In addition to placing an inappropriate responsibility on a kid that age, I think your punishment techniques are also age inappropriate. Does this kid even understand what she did is wrong? Does she know her own strength? Does she know the cat might be hurt? And at that age, is she even able to make the connection between doing something "wrong" and having her cat suddenly disappear. It all seems pretty crazy to me. But then, you're a conservative, so I suppose I shouldn't be surprised.
Click to expand...

Forgive me if I take any of your advice with a very large grain of salt...
 
Yes, 4 year olds are capable of understanding the basic principles of animal care. Now, actually remembering to do it is another issue. Our 4 year old son is very good with animals, we dont have to watch him at all.

Now, the 2 year old is a different story. I was cleaning house one day and she had our new bird. He was a baby. I KNEW better then to let her play with him, but you know, that whole "Oh, just for a little bit"......Yeah......
I suddenly notice its awful quite (Note to non parents, if you CANT hear your kids, their up to no good) so I peak out into the living room. The baby is laying down on the floor watchin TV, and her back is kinda arched like shes holding her tummy up....Hmm I think. I go over there....
"Whatchya doin punkin?"
"Watchin TV"
"Wheres the bird?"
"Right here"
*points under tummy*
*Spec peaks under tummy, sees closed DVD case*

Yeah, she put the bird in the DVD case then closed it and sat on it. :frown:
Spec was not happy. But, it was my own fault.
 
Originally posted by: aidanjm


In addition to placing an inappropriate responsibility on a kid that age, I think your punishment techniques are also age inappropriate. Does this kid even understand what she did is wrong? Does she know her own strength? Does she know the cat might be hurt? And at that age, is she even able to make the connection between doing something "wrong" and having her cat suddenly disappear. It all seems pretty crazy to me. But then, you're a conservative, so I suppose I shouldn't be surprised.
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Typical liberal. Never ever willing to accept somer responsibility.
I suppose you want the .gov to come over and feed the bird too for them right?
:rolls;
 
I can hear them (mom and daughter) having a conversation on it still over the baby monitor. They've been talking for almost an hour.

BTW my wife has a master's degree in counseling psychology and has read about every child development book on the planet, but applying these things IRL is always tough. I often defer final judgement to her.
 
My two year old can MORE than understand the consequenses of his actions.. Just the fact that he hides when he is doing something wrong should be more than enough proof that he at least understands that something he doesn't want will happen as a result.

aidanjm have you ever even MET a 5 year old?
 
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