Ok, Its my turn on the member contact thrust!

[osmo]

Again, this is the product of confusion.

I believe that DNET's policy is geared toward mailing people at addresses used on their site for stats purposes. Also in regards to advertising the contest openly. I don't think they have any jurisdiction over our own team getting organized by creating a communications channel. Therefore, I don't think we need to bother sending them a letter clearing this up.

I truely believe that the negative feedback to this whole email project has been due to the misconception of how this list is being assembled, and where the emails have been taken. Not wether DNET thinks we can talk amongst ourselves. So lets start at the begining and try to be clear.

Osmo.

 

[MWalkden]

mechbgon, from what I read Dnet's position was made clear about dnet made mailing lists here:.Moose. I will stand by that and support it (osmo). Mind you I don't agree with it, but I'm not DNet. They should indeed re-write their take on that policy as reading anything in their policy does not suggest Moose's explanation. I'm willing to bet nobody else thinks what Moose said is what that policy says.

This is something different and I believe using other means (as suggested) is in line. I also believe the newsletter stands its own ground and can be used. That might be a method to get folks on a mailing list even.

I still don't get where emailing a member is spam. This is really a bad take on the policy.

 

[Russ]

<< the Fed's are residing in Mika's house Presidental Suite >>



Engineer,

Be careful of the mini bar. Those little tiny bottles ain't cheap.😀

Russ, NCNE

 

[Russ]

<< I believe that DNET's policy is geared toward mailing people at addresses used on their site for stats purposes. >>



Osmo,

Dnet's policy does not state that anywhere. It says only that contacting those who had not expressed a &quot;prior&quot; interest would be considered spam. I'd just like them to at least have the courtesy and professionalism to respond to the eMails that have been sent.

Russ, NCNE

 

[Kilowatt]

Well, let's all email (spam) Dnet asking for them to clarify their &quot;Rules&quot;.
They would be hard pressed to ignore 50+ emails asking the same thing.

 

[MWalkden]

You made me laugh Kilowatt!🙂🙂🙂

Russ, see my Moose link. I agree with you that the Dnet policy does not concur with Moose's statements but Moose spoke in behalf of DNet on the matter and says otherwise.

I agree with osmo that there is nothing about our own mailing lists (mika's, newsletter etc) that concern DNet. That is our efforts not theirs.

 

[RaySun2Be]

Engineer,
I emailed DNET about this about a month ago. No replies. I emailed DNET about some concerns and questions about the Phantom Flusher. No replies. :|

maybe if DNET gets 50 emails from different people asking the same thing, they might reply to one of them. :Q

 

[networkman]

Osmo has probably mentioned something similar to what I'm about to say..

There's no reason that Anand can't sanction an email(to be sent out to ALL members of the TeamAnandtech site) courteously asking everyone to consider joining one or more distributed computing projects to help out the Anandtech teams. Obviously Anand may not wish to do so, and that's fine.. it's his site! But no one can reasonably expect NOT to get an email of SOME kind from a site that THEY CHOSE to sign up with in the first place. And it doesn't/shouldn't matter whether a person expresses an interest in RC5/SETI/OGR/GF/Folding/PopularPower/Flu etc.

'Nuff said. 🙂

 

[TOOCOOL]

To stop this family tiff in the future we should set up on a web site
a place to sign up for e-mails and newsletters. I realize that this will not stop the present differences of opinion but as time progresses it certainly will help 🙂

 

[Dale]

hi guys ; )

MWalkden
let me start by saying I am with you 100% and am not replyng to detract or take away or disagree with anything you have said

but sincerely with the intention of trying to help

if you have read this far let me add sometimes the best of intentions
often time fail : (

you seem overly occupied with the 'definition' of spam, let me offer the concept that my definition is not important and neither is yours
what is important is the definition of the ISP from which the email is sent AND the definition where the email is received

your ISP has a 'definition' most often published but it may not be published....

2.sending unsolicited bulk mail messages (&quot;junk mail&quot; or &quot;spam&quot😉. This includes
but is not limited to, bulk-mailing of commercial advertising, informational
announcements, political announcements and religious information. Such
material may only be sent to those who have explicitly requested it;



the above is not intended to be the 'Almighty' definition
just one example out of thousands in the US..

each member is encouraged to look at their own providers

the key words above are 'unsolicited' , 'bulk' , 'explicitly requested'

the word commercial is mentioned but it is only a courtesy to make the real spammers feel important

most spam complaints we receive are not from commercial mailings

bulk is easy to get around.. I can send you an email, then Russ,then Dan, and so on untill I have done it 657 times.. not bulk

but unsolicited and explicitly requested I cant get around

my post may be longer than yours

so if we just say it is not spam, then it brings the question should we do it??

1. does the benefit outweigh the costs?

that is really the only thing to discuss

I could send 1,568 emails in about 53 seconds(if I had something to say)

I am going to stop here... I know this is too long...


let me close in saying I am not against you... I am on your side

I am just trying to move the discussion from definitions to the issue

of benefit vs costs

the last time this was done there were no spam complaints, 1 or 2 ask not to be emailed again and about that many wrote thank yous

a couple of dozen sent 'valid' reasons of why they stopped
( I have said this about 3 times in the past 2 months, I promise I will not repeat it.. sorry)

again I am on your side

respectfully

Dale
dont hate the player, hate the game...

 

[MWalkden]

Everyone: I took up this cause because I felt the need to make some ground on some issues that are devastating our ability to grow. Since I started this thread I have come to realize that many feel what the email is Spam to them. In fact enough of them feel strongly enough about it that I actually regret starting this thread. Maybe if more folks would have posted in the several previous threads (which I researched at great length) I could have had the foresight on the matter. I guess one positive thing with this is that I better know my fellow crackers and their feelings.

Dale, thank you for the insight. I took it upon myself to look at both my ISPs policies and one is very similar. You are correct that &quot;request&quot; is a key word. It seems that is the only way to handle this issue. It maintains the dignity of TA history too. This is my final position concerning this matter.

Everyone again: This history is something we need to express more often. You old-timers need to find a way to express for public viewing the spirit of this team. What it was based on, what opinions it shared that made it grow and exist. You all did something to keep it alive and it is not documented. We have lost several members and many more are unhappy because new blood is changing the values of TA. The new blood doesn't think they are doing anything wrong and are totally confused when opposition repeatedly rises in their efforts to aid the team. It is hard for us newer folks to judge the rational/spirit of the existing team without being told. When several folks quit because of that very issue I spent as much time as I could trying to see what they were talking about. You old-timers bear responsibility to this lack of knowledge.

I want to say that since this is such a sensitive subject to all involved that I consider the proposed email attempt dead. Other discussions in this thread and on IRC have produced some good ideas about the future and I want to see those started ASAP. It is never to late to get a valid email list going and I am willing to bet it will get used sooner than anyone thinks.

Some ideas included posting notification on mika's stats page saying submittal through that proxy constitutes permission to receive emails related to DC. Another idea was to have an Opt-in on the upcoming Web box and or mika's stats pages. Of course the Web box itself has lots of different potential. Ken_g6's idea of getting profile names is a good one too. You have a choice to display an email address there and doing so to me says &quot;here is an email address if you need one&quot;. The newsletter list was another, however it may not contain many emails of the sort we are looking for. Creating a link in FAQ's to sign up for info is another good idea. Posting the same things on personal web sites will get some more. There are other ideas and alternatives to this situation. As a team I hope you will grab the positive things and work with them.

Thanks to everyone for your time and thoughts. I especially want to thank those that spent their time discussing this personally with me.

 

[Dale]

MWalkden

lets use the momentum from this thread and take the positives to a new thread and let the negatives lay here and sink to the bottom

I gotta to go help my son all day, you start the thread and I will bring it to the top when I return tonight

meanwhile email me xxx

thank you for your enthusiasm and wisdom and tenacious and courage

as a team we can reach our goal, on our own we will fail

Dale