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Official Thread of the Beijing 2008 Olympic Games (August 8-24)...

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Originally posted by: sammyunltd
Is it me or the American Women Swimming Team is TRULY underperforming at these games, especially compared to the US Men?

Only Coughlin so far is a standout. Rebecca Soni has the potential of being a standout too (possibility of gold medal).

What happened to Hoff? and... Where is Kate Ziegler (she got the WR in 800 and 1500m I believe)?
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yeah, Hoff really seems to be disappointing, however this might just be an unfair perspective because the media kept trying to hype her up as the female equivalent of Phelps...whereas, thus far, the only thing similar is the ambitious number of events that each are participating in, however she could still 'redeem' herself with a few more events to go...

Soni is looking good thus far for the 200m breaststroke (best semifinal time) and she did take silver in the 100m.

there was also Magnuson who took silver in the 100m butterfly...

however there are quite a few events still to come, Ziegler and the 800m for example (first heats begin several hours from now)...although I don't see a women's 1500m event scheduled...as well as Torres in the 50m free...and Margaret Hoelzer (bronze in the 100m backstroke - Coughlin took gold) looks to be a favorite for 200m back...

of course with so many swimmers strong in all the individual strokes, the US womens team should be also able to put up a pretty formidable 400 IM team much like the men (who should put up an absolute beast of an IM team), although I think they'll have a lot more competition than the men will, but they should definitely medal
 
Geeze...the water polo team hit the frame of the net more than the open net 🙁 but they stayed pretty close with Serbia....
 
Originally posted by: Ballatician
Do you think he could ever be competitive in the 100m free?
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Possibly, I think he could be the best at whatever event as long as he focuses much more attention on it. This will most likely be his last olympics with so many events, so he could have the opportunity to do something like that. He did break the American record in the 4x100m relay with the fastest lead off time, and of course the fact that he's been a constant member of the 4x100m free does indicate that he could compete there.

However the events he has been dominating for years now seem to be most compatible with his body structure (most of his events have him swimming at least 200m, where he isn't necessarily anything too impressive until after 150m), so maybe not.
 
What percentage of athletes do you think dope? The pressure must be unreal to do so and with the advances in drugs nowadays see Erythropoietin and others the chances of getting caught are only medium good at best. I was reading an article in Scientific American by Michael Shermer in which he seems to think that in some sports like cycling almost 100% of the athletes are doping. In the article was looking at the phenomenon from the point of game theory, mathematics, and suggesting that what should be done is the weighted punishment for getting caught doping need to be made so bad that they far outweigh the potential payout for not getting caught doping. Currently the tables are turned the other way.

http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?id=the-doping-dilemma
 
Anyone know what time the USA vs Greece basketball game is?

The TV Listing says 6am-Noon but I was looking for a slightly smaller interval.

edit: I believe it will be showing at 8am EST.
 
How is it possible that I've lived 38 years and not taken special notice of women's beach volleyball until just now??!??!?

College football just got bumped down to #2 on my list of favorite sports.
 
USA by 4....20-16 after the first lots of fouls being called....Kidd got three in about 90 seconds :/
 
Originally posted by: mugs
Originally posted by: bunnyfubbles
Originally posted by: dennilfloss
Funny how a wind-aided record won't be allowed in track & field but a suit+pool+starting block-aided record is kosher in swimming. Not much consistency between the different sport ruling associations.
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uh, suits and starting blocks are variables that can be controlled...
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Yeah, a suit to a swimmer is the same as shoes to a runner, and track cleats have improved over the years.
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I doubt track cleats have had much of an influence at all on times over the past few decades. They are minimalist shoes with grip on the ground. There is very little that can be done for, say, a sprinter. They are on their forefoot and all they need is the spikes.
What percentage of athletes do you think dope?
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Can't give a number, but I say a lot. When you have people who are at the top of riding doing a well--and this happens a lot--as people who are subsequently caught for doping, I just am sure that a lot of cyclists are on something but haven't been caught yet. When one is caught, it's a dirty secret, because how were the others keeping up with them?
 
Originally posted by: abaez
Originally posted by: Gigantopithecus
Originally posted by: dbk
So do the gymnasts benefit by being younger? Is there a relationship between talent and age? I'm not defending them but we dropped the ball there.
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Yes, gymnasts benefit by being younger, & a gymnastics team benefits by having a younger average age. In terms of individuals, every person's skeleton starts off as cartilage, & bone gradually replaces it. The less ossified (bony) a skeleton is, the more flexible it is. Ligaments & tendons also tighten as a person gets older, decreasing flexibility of joints. Of course, gymnasts benefit from being flexible. In terms of teams, the odds an individual will suffer a catastrophic, elite career ending injury only increase as that gymnast gets older. By raising the minimum age of team membership, the pool of potential members decreases. In other words, in this case, the potential pool of American gymnasts does not include phenomenally talented gymnasts who suffered career ending injuries at age 13, 14, 15... While for the Chinese, it does, because their 12 year olds haven't had those three years to get injured.
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Here's another little tidbit:

Why do younger gymnasts have an advantage?

They're lighter. The best gymnasts must be short and muscular with low body fat, which gives them a high strength-to-weight ratio and a greater ability to lift themselves into the air. Girls reach their ideal ratio before puberty; after that point, between ages 14 and 18, they gain weight and have difficulty keeping up their strength. Some coaches also believe that younger gymnasts worry less?making them psychologically less encumbered as well.

On Monday, former Olympic coach Bela Karolyi accused the Chinese of fielding 12- and 14-year-old gymnasts. If true, this wouldn't be a new practice: China's Yang Yun, for example, confessed during an interview on government-sponsored television that she was only 14 when she won two bronze medals at the 2000 Sydney Olympics.
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But there's also the argument that older gymnasts have experience and maturity on their side. In prior world competition, the China team had a reputation for choking -- that's why our US Team won the World Championships against them.

If age was the only determinate in how well a gymnast would perform then why didn't we fill our team with younger gymnasts? I watched our women's qualifiers and we had lots of younger gymnasts that didn't make our team.
 
Originally posted by: StormRider
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But there's also the argument that older gymnasts have experience and maturity on their side. In prior world competition, the China team had a reputation for choking -- that's why our US Team won the World Championships against them.

If age was the only determinate in how well a gymnast would perform then why didn't we fill our team with younger gymnasts? I watched our women's qualifiers and we had lots of younger gymnasts that didn't make our team.
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why didnt we fill our team wint younger gymnast? maybe because ITS AGAINST THE FUCKING RULES.

just because a peson is younger does not mean they are better. BUT it does give them a advantage. In such levle of competition evena slight advantage is going to help.
 
Originally posted by: waggy
Originally posted by: StormRider
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But there's also the argument that older gymnasts have experience and maturity on their side. In prior world competition, the China team had a reputation for choking -- that's why our US Team won the World Championships against them.

If age was the only determinate in how well a gymnast would perform then why didn't we fill our team with younger gymnasts? I watched our women's qualifiers and we had lots of younger gymnasts that didn't make our team.
Click to expand...

why didnt we fill our team wint younger gymnast? maybe because ITS AGAINST THE FUCKING RULES.

just because a peson is younger does not mean they are better. BUT it does give them a advantage. In such levle of competition evena slight advantage is going to help.
Click to expand...

I wanted to say that, but couldn't figure out how without yelling.

So QFT!
 
Originally posted by: Nitemare
Originally posted by: zoiks
Originally posted by: BlackTigers
Originally posted by: herkulease
When did the US coordinator bring it up? It comes off as sour grapes. We freaking choked. the Chinese girls had to check their balance and messed up enough times on the balance beam and gave the US an opportunity to steal the gold medal even with what looked like that chinese judge doing their best to help the chinese team.

Honestly I say let em compete at 14. I think its ridiculous to forbid people from competing at the Olympic level just because of their age. If some 14 y/o is able to take on the older athlete and make the qualifying marks in whatever event then let them.
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While I agree that they should be able to, going around a rule like that should NOT happen. The rule abiding countries were then at a possible disadvantage because of that, as their younger gymnasts may have competed better.

Maybe change the rule for future games, but China's blatant breaking of the rule should not be tolerated.
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Where's the proof that China broke the rule?
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Anyone at all with a pair of working eyes outside of China can see they broke the rule and one of their gymnasts competed in a jr nationals earlier in the year and was listed as 13 y/o
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Sorry but thats not proof. By your reasoning, it would be like convicting everyone who looks like a murderer to be a murderer.
Just because China has the most medal count is not reason enough to hate it.
 
Originally posted by: zoiks
Originally posted by: Nitemare
Originally posted by: zoiks
Originally posted by: BlackTigers
Originally posted by: herkulease
When did the US coordinator bring it up? It comes off as sour grapes. We freaking choked. the Chinese girls had to check their balance and messed up enough times on the balance beam and gave the US an opportunity to steal the gold medal even with what looked like that chinese judge doing their best to help the chinese team.

Honestly I say let em compete at 14. I think its ridiculous to forbid people from competing at the Olympic level just because of their age. If some 14 y/o is able to take on the older athlete and make the qualifying marks in whatever event then let them.
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While I agree that they should be able to, going around a rule like that should NOT happen. The rule abiding countries were then at a possible disadvantage because of that, as their younger gymnasts may have competed better.

Maybe change the rule for future games, but China's blatant breaking of the rule should not be tolerated.
Click to expand...

Where's the proof that China broke the rule?
Click to expand...

Anyone at all with a pair of working eyes outside of China can see they broke the rule and one of their gymnasts competed in a jr nationals earlier in the year and was listed as 13 y/o
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Sorry but thats not proof. By your reasoning, it would be like convicting everyone who looks like a murderer to be a murderer.
Just because China has the most medal count is not reason enough to hate it.
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How about all of the documents submitted for prior tournaments that conflict with the freshly printed passports?
 
Originally posted by: zoiks
Sorry but thats not proof. By your reasoning, it would be like convicting everyone who looks like a murderer to be a murderer.
Just because China has the most medal count is not reason enough to hate it.
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do you need proof first? Why can't it be investigated?

What is most scary about this is this is 100x worse than doping. Doping is the act of an individual athlete. This involves the Chinese goverment. And if they are cheating at this event, imagine how many others the government is helping the athletes cheat in.
 
Originally posted by: waggy
Originally posted by: StormRider
Click to expand...

But there's also the argument that older gymnasts have experience and maturity on their side. In prior world competition, the China team had a reputation for choking -- that's why our US Team won the World Championships against them.

If age was the only determinate in how well a gymnast would perform then why didn't we fill our team with younger gymnasts? I watched our women's qualifiers and we had lots of younger gymnasts that didn't make our team.
Click to expand...

why didnt we fill our team wint younger gymnast? maybe because ITS AGAINST THE FUCKING RULES.

just because a peson is younger does not mean they are better. BUT it does give them a advantage. In such levle of competition evena slight advantage is going to help.
Click to expand...

I'm NOT TALKING ABOUT GOING AGAINST THE FUCKING RULES. I'm talking about having 16 year old gymnast instead of the 20 year old gymnasts on our team. Both Chellsie Memmel and Alicia Sacramone are 20 years old. Jana Bieger (alternate) is 19. Nastia Liukin is 18. At the qualifiers, there were lots of gymnasts who were younger than them. If age was the primary factor in winning, then we should have only picked 16 year olds as team members.
 
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