Odds of Biden stepping down, being replaced. Choose.

[hal2kilo]

They're spending a buttload on skippable YouTube ads.

Well, since I only go to YouTube when I need to see how to repair something, or when someone posts a link here, I wouldn't know.

 

[MrSquished]

I think what we are seeing from this DNC is that the Dems have a strong group 'on the bench' - just a lot of talent and appeal type of candidates.

If Biden didn't steamroll over the will of his own party and pre-empt a true competitive primary, of which a majority of Dem voters didn't want him to run, there would have been a great primary. A lot of people were saying 'oh it has to be Biden who else could do it?' - And I always responded, if you think Biden is the best candidate for this election out of all the Democrats, why would you even be a Democrat? That's just sad. As we see now, all those people were completely wrong when you see the talent we have at the DNC now.

And we see, it was just Joe Biden keeping Trump in the race, also said many times. Now the Dems are inspired, it's something I haven't seen since Obama 2008. Never poo poo the need for inspiration. Anyway, what's done is done but it's also good to know history in context.

The way everything has worked out so far has been in the Dems favor. It didn't always happen for good reasons, but it happened. We have had a decent bit of luck and that's all good and fair. But we have a talented group of people in our party that with Biden stepping down has been unleashed. It's great to see.

 

[Indus]

I think what we are seeing from this DNC is that the Dems have a strong group 'on the bench' - just a lot of talent and appeal type of candidates.

If Biden didn't steamroll over the will of his own party and pre-empt a true competitive primary, of which a majority of Dem voters didn't want him to run, there would have been a great primary. A lot of people were saying 'oh it has to be Biden who else could do it?' - And I always responded, if you think Biden is the best candidate for this election out of all the Democrats, why would you even be a Democrat? That's just sad. As we see now, all those people were completely wrong when you see the talent we have at the DNC now.

And we see, it was just Joe Biden keeping Trump in the race, also said many times. Now the Dems are inspired, it's something I haven't seen since Obama 2008. Never poo poo the need for inspiration. Anyway, what's done is done but it's also good to know history in context.

The way everything has worked out so far has been in the Dems favor. It didn't always happen for good reasons, but it happened. We have had a decent bit of luck and that's all good and fair. But we have a talented group of people in our party that with Biden stepping down has been unleashed. It's great to see.

I think what the dems need to do is nominate someone new every 4 years.. the country is screaming for a new direction almost everyday and incumbency is starting to become a drag.

Honestly kinda felt the same way in 2012 too despite it working out well for us till 2014.

 

[nakedfrog]

I think what we are seeing from this DNC is that the Dems have a strong group 'on the bench' - just a lot of talent and appeal type of candidates.

If Biden didn't steamroll over the will of his own party and pre-empt a true competitive primary, of which a majority of Dem voters didn't want him to run, there would have been a great primary. A lot of people were saying 'oh it has to be Biden who else could do it?' - And I always responded, if you think Biden is the best candidate for this election out of all the Democrats, why would you even be a Democrat? That's just sad. As we see now, all those people were completely wrong when you see the talent we have at the DNC now.

And we see, it was just Joe Biden keeping Trump in the race, also said many times. Now the Dems are inspired, it's something I haven't seen since Obama 2008. Never poo poo the need for inspiration. Anyway, what's done is done but it's also good to know history in context.

The way everything has worked out so far has been in the Dems favor. It didn't always happen for good reasons, but it happened. We have had a decent bit of luck and that's all good and fair. But we have a talented group of people in our party that with Biden stepping down has been unleashed. It's great to see.

Is it finally over? Are we finally at the point where you'll shut the ever-loving fuck up about this now?

 

[MrSquished]

Is it finally over? Are we finally at the point where you'll shut the ever-loving fuck up about this now?

I'll mention it occasionally. You know since I was shit on constantly for even saying that we need inspiration, that Biden was keeping Trump in the race, to even question his candidacy I was a pariah to a bunch of people.

Considering the absolute amount of bullshit, misdirection, untruths, and gaslighting they managed to do in order to remain oblivious of reality, while shitting on me the entire time, I will certainly bring it up again. Because this is history, and this is the truth. And Dems need to learn this shit, those who haven't. This DNC convention is just more proof that their insane arguments that Biden was the best candidate the Dems could muster, and shitting on people who said otherwise, were completely insane, it's extremely relevant right now.

I find it sad you want to ignore this very important reality about the Dem party these people tried to gaslight us about. I find that sad. Bigly. You should try to do better.

So, the answer is, not really. I could give zero fucks that it bugs you at all either. I think I just took a shit with more fucks to give than I do right now.

 

[JujuFish]

these people tried to gaslight us about

Oh look, another person who doesn't know what gaslighting means.

 

[MrSquished]

Oh look, another person who doesn't know what gaslighting means.

You should check the dictionary more often. This is exactly what they did for some of their arguments (and it's quite perfect an example the literal dictionary says is about misrepresenting something politica, how apropo) :

Dictionary.com | Meanings & Definitions of English Words

The world's leading online dictionary: English definitions, synonyms, word origins, example sentences, word games, and more. A trusted authority for 25+ years!

www.dictionary.com

• to deceive (a person or group of people) through repetition of a constructed false narrative:
  The cable news networks have been gaslighting their viewers with partisan coverage of the bill.

 

[JujuFish]

You should check the dictionary more often. This is exactly what they did for some of their arguments (and it's quite perfect an example the literal dictionary says is about misrepresenting something politica, how apropo) :

Dictionary.com | Meanings & Definitions of English Words

The world's leading online dictionary: English definitions, synonyms, word origins, example sentences, word games, and more. A trusted authority for 25+ years!

www.dictionary.com

• to deceive (a person or group of people) through repetition of a constructed false narrative:
  The cable news networks have been gaslighting their viewers with partisan coverage of the bill.

Gaslighting specifically means to make someone doubt their sanity. Simply lying is not enough.

 

[Lost_in_the_HTTP]

"The way everything has worked out so far has been in the Dems favor. "


'Pubs have a LLLOOOTTTT of dirty tricks up their sleeves and the people in the places to apply them effectively.

Georgia for example ... new rules to allow review of even the smallest thing with no limitation on duration

I see court cases up to late January and maybe beyond. Kam could win the PV by 30% and 300+ EC and they'd still try to prove it didn't happen, or just ignore it and have their electors do as they please. Remember, this time, the Electors will probably be real and may not be bound by the PV.

 

[nakedfrog]

Gaslighting specifically means to make someone doubt their sanity. Simply lying is not enough.

What are you talking about? That's never what gaslighting has meant.

/s

 

[MrSquished]

Gaslighting specifically means to make someone doubt their sanity. Simply lying is not enough.

If you read a dictionary, single words can have multiple meanings. You know in a dictionary when a word has a 1. meaning and then a 2. meaning for example. In fact some words can function both as say a noun and a verb. Words are sometimes super simple and sometimes more complex. I did link you to the actual dictionary which shows just this about the word gaslight, and I also quoted the 2. definition - which is literally another usage of the word gaslight which, as it says, is quite apropo

Here, the dictionary even explains how using different numbers after definitions of one words works, they have different 'senses'

Help | Merriam-Webster

Merriam-Webster is the most reliable, trusted, easy-to-use dictionary and thesaurus online. Our products also include bilingual dictionaries and the Official Scrabble Dictionary. For over 150 years, Merriam-Webster has been America's leading and most-trusted provider of language information.

www.merriam-webster.com

from the link:

"Boldface Arabic numerals separate the senses of a word that has more than one sense:

1gloom . . . verb . . . 1 : to look, feel, or act sullen or despondent 2 : to be or become overcast 3 : to loom up dimly"

also for another technical term:

"When a word or phrase has several meanings, you can describe that word as polysemous."

Polysemous - Definition, Meaning & Synonyms

When a word or phrase has several meanings, you can describe that word as polysemous. One word that's famously polysemous is "bank."

www.vocabulary.com

 

[JujuFish]

*Snip*

Congratulations. If enough people don't understand a word and misuse it, it will eventually become accepted. And even by Merriam-Webster's second definition, the Dems didn't gaslight you.

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

If you read a dictionary, single words can have multiple meanings. You know in a dictionary when a word has a 1. meaning and then a 2. meaning for example. In fact some words can function both as say a noun and a verb. Words are sometimes super simple and sometimes more complex. I did link you to the actual dictionary which shows just this about the word gaslight, and I also quoted the 2. definition - which is literally another usage of the word gaslight which, as it says, is quite apropo

Here, the dictionary even explains how using different numbers after definitions of one words works, they have different 'senses'

Help | Merriam-Webster

Merriam-Webster is the most reliable, trusted, easy-to-use dictionary and thesaurus online. Our products also include bilingual dictionaries and the Official Scrabble Dictionary. For over 150 years, Merriam-Webster has been America's leading and most-trusted provider of language information.

www.merriam-webster.com

from the link:

"Boldface Arabic numerals separate the senses of a word that has more than one sense:

1gloom . . . verb . . . 1 : to look, feel, or act sullen or despondent 2 : to be or become overcast 3 : to loom up dimly"

also for another technical term:

"When a word or phrase has several meanings, you can describe that word as polysemous."

Polysemous - Definition, Meaning & Synonyms

When a word or phrase has several meanings, you can describe that word as polysemous. One word that's famously polysemous is "bank."

www.vocabulary.com

... Right, but gaslight isn't one of those things. It's a word to describe behavior presented in the movie of the same name, which is to use psychological abuse to alter a person's perception of reality to fit one you would prefer.

It's not just 'lying'.

 

[fskimospy]

What are you talking about? That's never what gaslighting has meant.

/s

Exactly - it's named after a movie where that's the whole plot! If it just means 'lying' then the word no longer has a useful meaning and should be retired.

 

[MrSquished]

... Right, but gaslight isn't one of those things. It's a word to describe behavior presented in the movie of the same name, which is to use psychological abuse to alter a person's perception of reality to fit one you would prefer.

It's not just 'lying'.

you should read the dictionary definitions. you do know words take on meanings and have multiple meanings and senses, I literally posted the links about that above. And I literally linked the actual dictionary definitions of the world gaslight. I mean why is this so hard?

Please try again, this is literally the number 2 definition in the actual dictionary, linked right below. So, the 2nd sense of the word gaslight also can be used as seen below. Which of you is going to email Merriam that you know better?

Definition of GASLIGHT

light made by burning illuminating gas; a gas flame; a gas lighting fixture… See the full definition

www.merriam-webster.com

2 : the act or practice of grossly misleading someone especially for one's own advantage
Election season can create emotions spanning from immense anxiety all the way to extreme apathy. The public arguing, divisiveness, and competition for votes, including political gaslighting, can be overwhelming and exhausting.—

Vernita Perkins and Leonard A. Jason


As the midterm elections approach, Americans have gotten an earful both about crime itself and how the other side is distorting the news about it for political gain. "Cherry-picking!" "Fearmongering!" "Gaslighting!"—
Chris Herrmann and Fritz Umbach


Intense gaslighting techniques are making it difficult for Montana's commoners to discern what's truth and what's propaganda.—
Steve Kelly


This corporate gaslighting effectively blames children for being addicted to social media and conveniently ignores how companies have intentionally designed their products to have addictive features …—
Nancy Kim

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

you should read the dictionary definitions. you do know words take on meanings and have multiple meanings and senses, I literally posted the links about that above. And I literally linked the actual dictionary definitions of the world gaslight. I mean why is this so hard?

Please try again, this is literally the number 2 definition in the actual dictionary, linked right below. So, the 2nd sense of the word gaslight also can be used as seen below. Which of you is going to email Merriam that you know better?

Definition of GASLIGHT

light made by burning illuminating gas; a gas flame; a gas lighting fixture… See the full definition

www.merriam-webster.com

2 : the act or practice of grossly misleading someone especially for one's own advantage
Election season can create emotions spanning from immense anxiety all the way to extreme apathy. The public arguing, divisiveness, and competition for votes, including political gaslighting, can be overwhelming and exhausting.—

Vernita Perkins and Leonard A. Jason


As the midterm elections approach, Americans have gotten an earful both about crime itself and how the other side is distorting the news about it for political gain. "Cherry-picking!" "Fearmongering!" "Gaslighting!"—
Chris Herrmann and Fritz Umbach


Intense gaslighting techniques are making it difficult for Montana's commoners to discern what's truth and what's propaganda.—
Steve Kelly


This corporate gaslighting effectively blames children for being addicted to social media and conveniently ignores how companies have intentionally designed their products to have addictive features …—
Nancy Kim

I'm not saying you can't use the word in reference to politics, just that using the word when you only mean 'lying' is using the wrong word. Those examples are missing a little context but I wouldn't say they're incorrect, I'd need to know what exactly they were talking about that they're referring to as gaslighting.

The last one about the kids is pretty appropriate though.

 

[fskimospy]

I'm not saying you can't use the word in reference to politics, just that using the word when you only mean 'lying' is using the wrong word. Those examples are missing a little context but I wouldn't say they're incorrect, I'd need to know what exactly they were talking about that they're referring to as gaslighting.

The last one about the kids is pretty appropriate though.

I don't even know why this is being argued. Language evolves over time and it's true that sufficient numbers of people didn't understand the term as originally constructed so now it's taken on a more general 'lying' meaning as well. That doesn't change the fact that using it in that way is stupid because it destroys the part of the word that made it notable.

 

[MrSquished]

I'm not saying you can't use the word in reference to politics, just that using the word when you only mean 'lying' is using the wrong word. Those examples are missing a little context but I wouldn't say they're incorrect, I'd need to know what exactly they were talking about that they're referring to as gaslighting.

The last one about the kids is pretty appropriate though.

Gaslighting is about presenting a different reality type of lying, especially in a political sense for an advantage in a discussion, something that was done repeatedly by people I was arguing with. I called it out a million times. If you continue to read the definition at merriam-webster, it goes into the origins and evolution of the word - the semantics. Of course it acknowledges it's from a 1938 play and subsequent movies. But it talks about how the word has evolved - in fact it was their word of the year in 2022, because of it's multiple meanings - language is fascinating and powerful, and one of the big reasons I said the Dems needed inspiration they were not getting from Biden, and part of inspiring is via words, especially during trying dark times.

Interesting read:

"The Origin and Semantic Development of Gaslighting

The origins of gaslighting are colorful: the term comes from the title of a 1938 play and the movies based on that play, the plots of which involve a man attempting to make his wife believe that she is going insane. His mysterious activities in the attic cause the house’s gas lights to dim, but he insists to his wife that the lights are not dimming and that she can’t trust her own perceptions.

When gaslighting was first used in the mid-20th century, it referred to a kind of deception like that in the plots mentioned above (sense 1). In the current century, the word has come to refer also to something simpler and broader: “the act or practice of grossly misleading someone, especially for a personal advantage” (sense 2).
In this use, the word is at home with other terms relating to modern forms of deception and manipulation, such as fake news and deepfake.

The idea of a deliberate conspiracy to mislead has made gaslighting useful in describing lies that are part of a larger plan. Unlike lying, which tends to be between individuals, and fraud, which tends to involve organizations, gaslighting applies in both personal and political contexts, and is found in formal and technical writing as well as in colloquial use.

Its increasing use in many contexts contributed to making gaslighting Merriam-Webster’s Word of the Year for 2022."

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

I don't even know why this is being argued. Language evolves over time and it's true that sufficient numbers of people didn't understand the term as originally constructed so now it's taken on a more general 'lying' meaning as well. That doesn't change the fact that using it in that way is stupid because it destroys the part of the word that made it notable.

Agreed.

Gaslighting is about presenting a different reality type of lying, especially in a political sense for an advantage in a discussion, something that was done repeatedly by people I was arguing with. I called it out a million times. If you continue to read the definition at merriam-webster, it goes into the origins and evolution of the word - the semantics. Of course it acknowledges it's from a 1938 play and subsequent movies. But it talks about how the word has evolved - in fact it was their word of the year in 2022, because of it's multiple meanings - language is fascinating and powerful, and one of the big reasons I said the Dems needed inspiration they were not getting from Biden, and part of inspiring is via words, especially during trying dark times.

Interesting read:

"The Origin and Semantic Development of Gaslighting

The origins of gaslighting are colorful: the term comes from the title of a 1938 play and the movies based on that play, the plots of which involve a man attempting to make his wife believe that she is going insane. His mysterious activities in the attic cause the house’s gas lights to dim, but he insists to his wife that the lights are not dimming and that she can’t trust her own perceptions.

When gaslighting was first used in the mid-20th century, it referred to a kind of deception like that in the plots mentioned above (sense 1). In the current century, the word has come to refer also to something simpler and broader: “the act or practice of grossly misleading someone, especially for a personal advantage” (sense 2).
In this use, the word is at home with other terms relating to modern forms of deception and manipulation, such as fake news and deepfake.

The idea of a deliberate conspiracy to mislead has made gaslighting useful in describing lies that are part of a larger plan. Unlike lying, which tends to be between individuals, and fraud, which tends to involve organizations, gaslighting applies in both personal and political contexts, and is found in formal and technical writing as well as in colloquial use.

Its increasing use in many contexts contributed to making gaslighting Merriam-Webster’s Word of the Year for 2022."

And unfortunately it completely dilutes the purpose of the word when you say 'lying to benefit oneself'. Like I get that language evolves but it shouldn't devolve. If you mean lying, say lie. If you mean being dishonest to benefit yourself specifically, say that, or come up with a neat word for it.

If you mean lying, manipulating a person, abusing a person psychologically, in order to change how they view reality long-term... Say gaslighting.

 

[MrSquished]

Agreed.

And unfortunately it completely dilutes the purpose of the word when you say 'lying to benefit oneself'. Like I get that language evolves but it shouldn't devolve. If you mean lying, say lie. If you mean being dishonest to benefit yourself specifically, say that, or come up with a neat word for it.

If you mean lying, manipulating a person, abusing a person psychologically, in order to change how they view reality long-term... Say gaslighting.

ahh so because some people want to say a certain word evolving is stupid to them, and also so they can win an argument for personal gain, that now changes what actually happens in the actual real world, where words evolve, and dictionaries capture that as a thing of record, including about this word gaslighting. But they must be wrong.

That is fascinating.

This is truly unbelievable lol

Now it's not just me that's wrong, but the actual recorded meaning in dictionaries of record, about things that any quality English PhD who studies language can tell you, and who dictionaries of record fucking employ for their expertise - that words evolved and the experts agree the word gaslight did too, and now they're all wrong too! So y'all can win an argument on the internet.

This is literally the definition of gaslighting 😂 😂

The irony of this is absolutely stupendous. Bigly sad

 

[JujuFish]

ahh so because some people want to say a certain word evolving is stupid to them, and also so they can win an argument for personal gain, that now changes what actually happens in the actual real world, where words evolve, and dictionaries capture that as a thing of record, including about this word gaslighting. But they must be wrong.

That is fascinating.

This is truly unbelievable lol

Now it's not just me that's wrong, but the actual recorded meaning in dictionaries of record, about things that any quality English PhD who studies language can tell you, and who dictionaries of record fucking emply for their expertise - that words evolved and the experts agree the word gaslight did too, and now they're all wrong too! So y'all can win an argument on the internet.

This is literally the definition of gaslighting 😂 😂

The irony of this is absolutely stupendous. Bigly sad

A whole lot of text for not saying much at all. You weren't being gaslit by anyone here, and by trying to claim it, you fall under your own definition of gaslighting.

Also your definition isn't in the OED, so it's clearly not a fully accepted definition. It'll surely get there eventually.

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

ahh so because some people want to say a certain word evolving is stupid to them, and also so they can win an argument for personal gain, that now changes what actually happens in the actual real world, where words evolve, and dictionaries capture that as a thing of record, including about this word gaslighting. But they must be wrong.

That is fascinating.

This is truly unbelievable lol

Now it's not just me that's wrong, but the actual recorded meaning in dictionaries of record, about things that any quality English PhD who studies language can tell you, and who dictionaries of record fucking emply for their expertise - that words evolved and the experts agree the word gaslight did too, and now they're all wrong too! So y'all can win an argument on the internet.

This is literally the definition of gaslighting 😂 😂

The irony of this is absolutely stupendous. Bigly sad

What I'm getting at, is if you have a word that means something general, then you have another word that's far more specific, if you start using the specific word when you mean the general one, it loses it's specificity over time until a point comes when nobody understands what the specific word meant anymore.

Fake news is another great example. When the term was coined, it very specifically meant actually non-real news sources, that were generated programmatically to look real in order to deliver (primarily Russian) disinformation to primarily Western audiences. Thanks to Trump and maga fascists, it now means 'things I don't like' to such an extent that most people have no idea what it originally meant. That isn't the evolution of language, it's just the misuse of words and concepts resulting in the loss of language fidelity (probably intentionally... By the same people who benefit from the lack of fidelity).

 

[fskimospy]

Wiki sums up this thread well, talking about how the word is frequently misused and misunderstood.

Gaslighting - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Gaslighting is a colloquialism, defined as manipulating someone into questioning their own perception of reality.[1][2] The expression, which derives from the title of the 1944 film Gaslight, became popular in the mid-2010s. Merriam-Webster cites deception of one's memory, perception of reality, or mental stability.[2] According to a 2022 Washington Post report, it had become a "trendy buzzword" frequently improperly used to describe ordinary disagreements, rather than those situations that align with the word's historical definition.[3]

 

[Pens1566]

Sometimes I really hate this place ...

 

[MrSquished]

Ok folks. Words don't evolve, or maybe they can, but especially not THIS SPECIFIC ONE.

Often how a word is used in a different way is literally how words change, by the actual usage - and it is being used in these multiple ways now - now some may not like how a word changes, but that doesn't change the fact it has and is changing. THere are a million articles and papers on how much language can evolve. Here is one.

Linguistics 001 -- Language Change and Historical Reconstruction

Literally, don't listen to me, listen to educators on this subject. And, btw, buzzwords can and do become part of the regular lexicon. This is also established by the experts in this field.