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OCZ's "Viral/Hype/Buzz" Marketing

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Isn't the JEDEC standard for DDR2 800 5-5-5-18? What's the latency on the OCZ stick you bought?

Why are you buying OCZ RAM to run at "standard" speeds? Couldn't you just buy some bargain bin junk for that?

Says right on the packaging and on their website (and most other websites) exactly how much voltage it requires to do the timings they advertise. As a consumer I'm not sure what else I could ask for; they provide all the details necessary to make the right purchasing decision.

Also, have you called to discuss it with them? They seem pretty receptive to assisting customers, even when the customer doesn't seem to have any logical ground to stand on. Look at Mr. Fox.
 
My motherboard does not support changing voltages, it relies on existing standards. I bought OCZ for stability and speed (no OC). DDR2-800 5 5 5 12 (altough it's SPD reports 14) won't run at standard voltages(JEDEC)...I'm working with support right now, and yes, they havehad decent support (which, imho, is the most important quality for a company to have). As it is, my expensive DDR2-800 runs at 667

I have an Intel DG965 motherboard (iirc, it's in my sister in laws PC about 150 miles away)
 
Originally posted by: Noubourne
Isn't the JEDEC standard for DDR2 800 5-5-5-18? What's the latency on the OCZ stick you bought?

Why are you buying OCZ RAM to run at "standard" speeds? Couldn't you just buy some bargain bin junk for that?

Says right on the packaging and on their website (and most other websites) exactly how much voltage it requires to do the timings they advertise. As a consumer I'm not sure what else I could ask for; they provide all the details necessary to make the right purchasing decision.

Also, have you called to discuss it with them? They seem pretty receptive to assisting customers, even when the customer doesn't seem to have any logical ground to stand on. Look at Mr. Fox.
Click to expand...



OCZ corrected the Ads... if I was that far off base they would have left them as is....

If I am so far out of touch...... You can buy your OCZ parts at Monarch Computer for all I care...

But as a Consumer, and as a Buisness Owner I expect more from my Suppliers and Reject any attempt at "Viral" Marketing or flat-out mis-representation.

Lack of oversight on your suppliers means that you are not checking them, and opens the door to abuse. There is no excuse for that kind of behavior.

Any ISO based quality system puts in place checks and balances that are obviously not in place at OCZ. Otherwise their Power Supplies would not have ripple that exceeds spec. straight out of the box.

http://www.jonnyguru.com/review_details.php?id=35


With no supplier oversight it is a system that is rife with issues.

It is not a place to be light on manpower.

I made the statement that their stuff is Marginal, and nothing has changed there.




 
Originally posted by: Mr FoxAny ISO based quality system puts in place checks and balances that are obviously not in place at OCZ. Otherwise their Power Supplies would not have ripple that exceeds spec. straight out of the box.

http://www.jonnyguru.com/review_details.php?id=35
Click to expand...
It really comes down to testing methods, etc ....here is a test showing 81 millivolts of Ripple: http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/other/display/atx-psu6_6.html
So who is right?

The office has a very state of the art piece of equipment called a Chroma (sp?) tester ( Link to Unit: http://www.chromausa.com/apsts.htm ) That also does not find this high ripple condition in the PSU's.
 
Originally posted by: Mr Fox
Originally posted by: Noubourne
Isn't the JEDEC standard for DDR2 800 5-5-5-18? What's the latency on the OCZ stick you bought?

Why are you buying OCZ RAM to run at "standard" speeds? Couldn't you just buy some bargain bin junk for that?

Says right on the packaging and on their website (and most other websites) exactly how much voltage it requires to do the timings they advertise. As a consumer I'm not sure what else I could ask for; they provide all the details necessary to make the right purchasing decision.

Also, have you called to discuss it with them? They seem pretty receptive to assisting customers, even when the customer doesn't seem to have any logical ground to stand on. Look at Mr. Fox.
Click to expand...



OCZ corrected the Ads... if I was that far off base they would have left them as is....

If I am so far out of touch...... You can buy your OCZ parts at Monarch Computer for all I care...

But as a Consumer, and as a Buisness Owner I expect more from my Suppliers and Reject any attempt at "Viral" Marketing or flat-out mis-representation.

Lack of oversight on your suppliers means that you are not checking them, and opens the door to abuse. There is no excuse for that kind of behavior.

Any ISO based quality system puts in place checks and balances that are obviously not in place at OCZ. Otherwise their Power Supplies would not have ripple that exceeds spec. straight out of the box.

http://www.jonnyguru.com/review_details.php?id=35


With no supplier oversight it is a system that is rife with issues.

It is not a place to be light on manpower.

I made the statement that their stuff is Marginal, and nothing has changed there.
Click to expand...

Mr. Fox, I can sense your anger at advertising in general and I'll bet OCZ is not soley at the root of it. Sucessful companies must advertise aggressively to compete in the marketplace. All of our ads are not aimed at high function computer literate enthusiasts such as yourself. If we were targeting you and yours with ATI approved memory you would still not buy it, correct? Some segments of the marketplace repsond to chest thumping gorillas and wind machines blowing your head nearly off. Remeber that old Bose stereo advertising campain?

OCZ is always open to ideas for marketing and new products. If you have any good suggestions we would love to hear them.

Thanks

 
Originally posted by: ryderOCZ
Originally posted by: Mr FoxAny ISO based quality system puts in place checks and balances that are obviously not in place at OCZ. Otherwise their Power Supplies would not have ripple that exceeds spec. straight out of the box.

http://www.jonnyguru.com/review_details.php?id=35
Click to expand...
It really comes down to testing methods, etc ....here is a test showing 81 millivolts of Ripple: http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/other/display/atx-psu6_6.html
So who is right?

The office has a very state of the art piece of equipment called a Chroma (sp?) tester ( Link to Unit: http://www.chromausa.com/apsts.htm ) That also does not find this high ripple condition in the PSU's.
Click to expand...





? If you actually use that PSU tester how many do you actually sample from a given lot when they are received?

? If there is a failure what is your reaction plan?



While I have seen PSU review methodologies that have run the gamut from ? We plugged it in, and it worked !! Three Thumbs Up !! ?

To the work of Oleg at X-Bit, and Jonny Guru.

While Oleg?s methodology is not well documented he also identifies the 700 watt Gamestream PSU as Borderline Acceptable.

Jonny Guru?s methodology is well documented and consistent. The two samples that were provided were not within specification.

These were Review Samples that were sent by OCZ. And the FSP Epsilon that your PSU is based on also exhibited this same issue.

With that in mind, anyone that has even a rudimentary knowledge of statistics would know that there will be a population that with falls Outside the Specifications.

The true PPM defective can be extrapolated given a better statistical sample.

But that is three PSU?s that demonstrate the same basic issue to one degree, or another.
 
First off, working in an industry that's truly regulated ISO is pretty much a joke. They're getting better, certainly, but they're not the audits that concern us. I bought OCZ memory 1 time, after reading tons of positive reviews on their product and CS. It was bad, I RMA'd it, went back to Kingston (which really seems to work well with my PC, despite running an "unsupported" config). My point is that I'm not an OCZ customer/fanboy, but they really do seem to have some of the best service in the industry as evidenced by... this thread (for example). Marketing is a lot of buzz words (is your stereo wiring THX certified?) amd I wouldn't fault them for pandering to a lower denomenator. I think, for my next build, I'll seriously consider OCZ as this thread has shown they really do seem to care about CS. Mr. Fox, your statements are so derogatory as to make me think you have an agenda in these posts beyond simply informing us of questionable business pratices. I applaud people who bring the abuses of manufacturers to our attention, but I do think you could approach this in a far more productive manner if your sole motivation is altruism. The net lends itself to exaggerated statements, but past a point it feels more like a manipulation than a helpful hint.
 
Originally posted by: Slammy1
First off, working in an industry that's truly regulated ISO is pretty much a joke. They're getting better, certainly, but they're not the audits that concern us. I bought OCZ memory 1 time, after reading tons of positive reviews on their product and CS. It was bad, I RMA'd it, went back to Kingston (which really seems to work well with my PC, despite running an "unsupported" config). My point is that I'm not an OCZ customer/fanboy, but they really do seem to have some of the best service in the industry as evidenced by... this thread (for example). Marketing is a lot of buzz words (is your stereo wiring THX certified?) amd I wouldn't fault them for pandering to a lower denomenator. I think, for my next build, I'll seriously consider OCZ as this thread has shown they really do seem to care about CS. Mr. Fox, your statements are so derogatory as to make me think you have an agenda in these posts beyond simply informing us of questionable business pratices. I applaud people who bring the abuses of manufacturers to our attention, but I do think you could approach this in a far more productive manner if your sole motivation is altruism. The net lends itself to exaggerated statements, but past a point it feels more like a manipulation than a helpful hint.
Click to expand...



OCZ has a history of "Issues" and they always seem to center around reality... or lack of.
OCZ started in Portage Indiana, as a Mom and Pop Shop that was long on tales, and short on reality again. This company is Incorporated in Indiana to this day.

While I will say that Ryan Peterson has tried to make this a much more upstanding outfit.... but they still seem to digress.....

But people seem to be short on memory, so it is someone such as myself that remembers this pattern, that is willing to challenge them within the ethical end, and the reality end...

They can Ignore me if they like... but there again reality seems to hit home.







 
Mr Fox I have read this thread off and on, every time it floats to the surface, and have resisted adding to the deplorable state of affairs contained within...but I finally have got to ask...

This thread reads like viral marketing against OCZ...

Mr Fox, you aren't the Rollo for an OCZ competitor are you? Because honestly dude, or ma'am, you have so thoroughly crossed a line here beyond risking discrediting yourself.

How can I care to beleive you at this point, YOU have become a viral marketing campaign against OCZ. Sorry you went so far, you seemed so likable early on, but so too was Rollo.
 
Originally posted by: Mr Fox
Video Rendering quality is derived Primarily from On Card GDDR3 Vram Performance, and GPU performance.

Yes the Health of the Total System effects the overall linearity of a given system... but has little to do with Actual Rendering and Visualization Sub System.

There is Nothing Proprietary here...... only Tested Compatability.

OCZ'z Boasts are Crapola... another method of attempting to Justify $320.00 For "Neat Red Heatspreaders"

You can buy the Same Chips from a JEDEC member using the same D9's starting at $ 260.00
Click to expand...
When did you become the wallet police for everyone in America? Oh, and you should take some reading comprehension classes. You'll find out that "stunning visual experience" can and does apply very well to something of beauty, as these sticks certainly are.

Also, once you learn a bit more about memory and computers, you'll learn that there is more than one type of Micron D9 IC. As a matter of fact, there are no fewer than 7 different types, and the higher the quality of the D9 module, the more Micron charges for them. Imagine that.

I'd definitely pay $11 more for OCZ D9 modules than for Corsair Promos or Kingston Infineon modules. Wouldn't you?
 
Originally posted by: Idontcare
Mr Fox I have read this thread off and on, every time it floats to the surface, and have resisted adding to the deplorable state of affairs contained within...but I finally have got to ask...

This thread reads like viral marketing against OCZ...

Mr Fox, you aren't the Rollo for an OCZ competitor are you? Because honestly dude, or ma'am, you have so thoroughly crossed a line here beyond risking discrediting yourself.

How can I care to beleive you at this point, YOU have become a viral marketing campaign against OCZ. Sorry you went so far, you seemed so likable early on, but so too was Rollo.
Click to expand...

For further irony, please note that this thread about OCZ's supposed viral marketing includes responses from 4 people that specifically identify themselves as being associated with OCZ.
 
as an FYI, OCZ did ANOTHER RMA on my modules, upgrading them to the ones that are speced to run 800 Mhz @ 1.8V.

So they made it right (Thumbs up, some companies really fail here)

But it's taken over a month, the modules for this RMA are on back order, and it's taken me multiple trips to my wife's family to resolve this (thumbs down, but really, the trips aren't OCZ's fault/problem) My only question is...why not get me the right modules the first time? I gave them the motherboard model on my first call, the first day I was putting the system together.

Again, a big big plus for service, minus for marketing overvolted memory without big disclaimers.
 
I have a great suggestion here. How about those that like OCZ products keep on purchasing and enjoying them. Those that don't, you have our blessing to go buy something else. What more can we say.

Mr. Fox, what possible good are you doing by continuing this. Do you feel you are the champion of justice in the hardware world? Do you wear a cape? OCZ will contnue to market, and will continue to do very well in the marketplace despite your comments.

As someone suggested above you appear to have a hidden agenda behind this rant of yours. Who exactly do you work for and or associate with that stands to benefit from yout tactics?
 
Originally posted by: Aluvus
Originally posted by: Idontcare
Mr Fox I have read this thread off and on, every time it floats to the surface, and have resisted adding to the deplorable state of affairs contained within...but I finally have got to ask...

This thread reads like viral marketing against OCZ...

Mr Fox, you aren't the Rollo for an OCZ competitor are you? Because honestly dude, or ma'am, you have so thoroughly crossed a line here beyond risking discrediting yourself.

How can I care to beleive you at this point, YOU have become a viral marketing campaign against OCZ. Sorry you went so far, you seemed so likable early on, but so too was Rollo.
Click to expand...

For further irony, please note that this thread about OCZ's supposed viral marketing includes responses from 4 people that specifically identify themselves as being associated with OCZ.
Click to expand...

We acould easily send 15 people in here and disguise them as regular users as others may be actually be doing. At least we are up front. I have taken over this thread, as I have been assigned to assist anyone here on Anandtech that needs info on new products and those that may have marketing questions. I have been with OCZ since the very beginning, I know the company and know what the truth is.

Thanks!
 
Don't get upset AndyT, OCZ has a good reputation to fall back on against these sorts of accusations. I'd just let the thread sink to page 2 oblivion...
 
Originally posted by: Slammy1
Don't get upset AndyT, OCZ has a good reputation to fall back on against these sorts of accusations. I'd just let the thread sink to page 2 oblivion...
Click to expand...

Thanks for your support. I'm not so upset as I am puzzled by all of this. I like your suggestion as well. 😉
 
Originally posted by: AndyT
...

Mr. Fox, ...

All of our ads are not aimed at high function computer literate enthusiasts such as yourself. .....
Click to expand...

HA!

Let me add that when I went to purchase the best overclocking DDR2 for low voltages, I found that TCCD/TCC5 was going to be my best option. One of the few companies at the time promising to provide TCCD/TCC5 in a specific model of memory was OCZ. That's why I purchased the sticks.

They do DDR600 with loose timings at low voltage. I did the research, used their support forums, and got EXACTLY what I wanted. Other companies, I believe, have now been forced to disclose as much about their products to compete.

In my opinion, OCZ has been good for the industry overall.
 
Originally posted by: AndyT
Originally posted by: Slammy1
Don't get upset AndyT, OCZ has a good reputation to fall back on against these sorts of accusations. I'd just let the thread sink to page 2 oblivion...
Click to expand...

Thanks for your support. I'm not so upset as I am puzzled by all of this. I like your suggestion as well. 😉
Click to expand...




Then please answer my two unanswered questions that were posted to Ryder since this is now your "Turf"....



? If you actually use that PSU tester how many do you actually sample from a given lot when they are received?


? If there is a failure what is your reaction plan?
 
Originally posted by: Mr Fox
Originally posted by: AndyT
Originally posted by: Slammy1
Don't get upset AndyT, OCZ has a good reputation to fall back on against these sorts of accusations. I'd just let the thread sink to page 2 oblivion...
Click to expand...

Thanks for your support. I'm not so upset as I am puzzled by all of this. I like your suggestion as well. 😉
Click to expand...




Then answer my two unanswered questions that were posted to Ryder since this is now your "Turf"....



? If you actually use that PSU tester how many do you actually sample from a given lot when they are received?


? If there is a failure what is your reaction plan?
Click to expand...

Personally I don't see why he should answer your questions at all - those things could be considered sensitive. Why do you think you are entitled to this information? Can you name another company that would even send a single representative to talk to you on a forum? Let alone answer things like that!

If you don't like OCZ I suggest you shut up and buy something else.

Originally posted by: nweaver
I'm a bit miffed...when I buy a product labeled as "DDR2-800" I don't expect "DDR2 that will run at 800 if you apply nonstandard voltages" like I'm getting now....

Although, thus far, support has been pretty good....lets just see if OCZ makes this one right...as it is, I have to run my memory at 667 or the box fails to POST.
Click to expand...

To be fair, I think those sticks say DDR2-800 at 2.1V... I bought some G Skill HZ that required 2.1 V to do 800Mhz and said so on the pack, but would also do 1000Mhz, unlike other lower voltage sticks.
 
Originally posted by: AndyT
I have a great suggestion here. How about those that like OCZ products keep on purchasing and enjoying them. Those that don't, you have our blessing to go buy something else. What more can we say.

Mr. Fox, what possible good are you doing by continuing this.

I belive that it teaches you something about your Potential Customers.

We are not all Ignorant Little Republicans.



Do you feel you are the champion of justice in the hardware world?

I forced you to change your little scheme of things.... I must be doing something correctly.

Do you wear a cape? OCZ will contnue to market, and will continue to do very well in the marketplace despite your comments.


OCZ will always have the following of the misinformed that fall for such Marginal Equiptment. and marketing tactics.


As someone suggested above you appear to have a hidden agenda behind this rant of yours. Who exactly do you work for and or associate with that stands to benefit from yout tactics?
Click to expand...

There is no hidden Agenda it is out there quite plainly all you need do is read, it is obvious that you are quite disturbed by this, otherwise you would not be Babysitting a Forum in this Manner.

This is part of the "Viral" scheme by being here to attempt to refute my claims...You have not done that on numerous points that were laid out... so there must be a certian truth to them.

You seem to fear the truth


Viral Marketing Defined : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viral_marketing

http://www.wilsonweb.com/wmt5/viral-principles.htm




I have asked Two simple questions, They remain un-answered..... You are the one that would actually be able to answer this Knowledgably.



? If you actually use that PSU tester how many do you actually sample from a given lot when they are received?


? If there is a failure what is your reaction plan?




 
I really like to see bad marketing attacked. Far too many people fail to hold any company accountable, which helps to cause more bad marketing.

Having said that, I have to compliment OCZ on responding as they did; it wasn't that they had to.

I can't comment on the legitimacy of Mr. Fox's specific issue. I do see a lot of clueless responses from posters about the aspects of OCZ unrelated to the marketing issue, or attacking Mr. Fox and attacking the attempt to raise an issue with marketing at all.

It reminds me a bit of a Razer campaign that was utterly false and misleading about purported benefits their mice would have in games, involving technology to detect certain mouse activity at levels far above what any hand can do; they specifically mentioned RTS games which would be unaffected because of the number being higher than to have any practical effect, and they even mentioned MMORPG's, which are not dependant on those very higher number of mouse activities almost at all. I saw a review of their product which specifically attacked the marketing as some of the most hyped he'd seen for any product, and he listed that as a negative in the review. Good for him. I wrote the president of Razer, and got an unsatisfactory response, but to his credit some response; I posted about it and some posters missed the point, with posts along the lines of 'they have good products'. Having good products has nothing to do with false advertising and excessive hype. Consumers should oppose the wrong behavior.

Again it's good to see OCZ demonstrate concern about the issue.
 
ZOMG, BOLD TEXT RULES

Seriously dude, your formatting is a slight eye sore. What's with all the triple line breaks?

BTW, the JonnyGuru review states this little point too:

ATX specification has an "allowance" for 120mV. Mind you, test 6 was very stressful, pushing the power supply to it's limits, but it doesn't change the fact that the ripple exceeded spec and this is the first power supply to date I have had do this."
Click to expand...

The one test that DID cause the PSU to go out of spec was Test 6, a whopping 695W of load. He does say that this was the first unit he tested that exceeded the spec but at the same time, it is a very unrealistic load that almost nobody would see, even in a ultra-high-end machine. The bottom line is, it might be an average PSU (with better options available) - but JonnyGuru doesn't say this is the anti-christ and should be treated as such. The review you mention gives it a 75% rating in performance - good but there's better.

I think your agenda, Mr Fox, is to reduce General Hardware discussions to the same ATi/nVidia & AMD/Intel mindless fests of moronic travesty that flood the internet. This isn't even a thread about someone buying a product, getting something sub-par and warning fellow members about it for the purpose of knowledge. You are just...trolling.
 
Originally posted by: Idontcare
Mr Fox I have read this thread off and on, every time it floats to the surface, and have resisted adding to the deplorable state of affairs contained within...but I finally have got to ask...

This thread reads like viral marketing against OCZ...

Mr Fox, you aren't the Rollo for an OCZ competitor are you? Because honestly dude, or ma'am, you have so thoroughly crossed a line here beyond risking discrediting yourself.

How can I care to beleive you at this point, YOU have become a viral marketing campaign against OCZ. Sorry you went so far, you seemed so likable early on, but so too was Rollo.
Click to expand...

Thats how people are who have hidden agendas.....
This thread doesn`t require a response from anybody at OCZ........
Ot`s obvious the guy never intended to do anything more than yo slam over and over again OCZ!!!


Thats just too bad.
 
Originally posted by: Mr Fox
Originally posted by: AndyT
Originally posted by: Slammy1
Don't get upset AndyT, OCZ has a good reputation to fall back on against these sorts of accusations. I'd just let the thread sink to page 2 oblivion...
Click to expand...

Thanks for your support. I'm not so upset as I am puzzled by all of this. I like your suggestion as well. 😉
Click to expand...




Then please answer my two unanswered questions that were posted to Ryder since this is now your "Turf"....



? If you actually use that PSU tester how many do you actually sample from a given lot when they are received?


? If there is a failure what is your reaction plan?
Click to expand...

I get the feeling that you have burned a bridge or 2 and nobody really cares whether you get or even deserve an answer......

Nice try at slamming a company though......would still like to know what competitor of OCZ`s that you work for....

This ought to be interesting..lol
 
Originally posted by: theprodigalrebel
ZOMG, BOLD TEXT RULES

Seriously dude, your formatting is a slight eye sore. What's with all the triple line breaks?

BTW, the JonnyGuru review states this little point too:

ATX specification has an "allowance" for 120mV. Mind you, test 6 was very stressful, pushing the power supply to it's limits, but it doesn't change the fact that the ripple exceeded spec and this is the first power supply to date I have had do this."
Click to expand...

The one test that DID cause the PSU to go out of spec was Test 6, a whopping 695W of load. He does say that this was the first unit he tested that exceeded the spec but at the same time, it is a very unrealistic load that almost nobody would see, even in a ultra-high-end machine. The bottom line is, it might be an average PSU (with better options available) - but JonnyGuru doesn't say this is the anti-christ and should be treated as such. The review you mention gives it a 75% rating in performance - good but there's better.

I think your agenda, Mr Fox, is to reduce General Hardware discussions to the same ATi/nVidia & AMD/Intel mindless fests of moronic travesty that flood the internet. This isn't even a thread about someone buying a product, getting something sub-par and warning fellow members about it for the purpose of knowledge. You are just...trolling.
Click to expand...

well said!!
 
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