ProfJohn
Lifer
Yes he did, for about eight months and you know what they did with that power??
Passed a healthcare bill that most Americans opposed.
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Obama: "If I don't have this done in 3 years"
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Passed a healthcare bill that most Americans opposed.
so, uhh, do you intend to offer some point, some bit of wisdom wrt the topic at hand, or is simple mindless derision sufficient for your purposes? Why else would you offer that alone, if not as a mechanism of denial?
Jaskalas
Lifer
We'll expect nothing less from you, this is war after all.
ProfJohn
Lifer
Don't give me that bull shit excuse.
What was Obama's big plan to save jobs? The one where he went in front of a joint session of congress? The one that his own party leaders in the Senate refuse to bring up for a vote?
It was to do more of what didn't work the first time!
Obama and his liberal friends are clueless on what to do. The spent $666 billion to 'fix' the economy and got 2-3 million jobs in return. They have NO idea what else to do. All their charts and multiplier theories and everything else suggested that spending money would fix the problem, but it didn't and they have no back up plan because their is none in their ideology.
Since FDR the liberal solution to a slow economy is to spend money and that solution isn't working anymore and they don't know what else to do.
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sportage
Lifer
How much time does it take to burn down a house? How long does it take to rebuild a house? How long does it take to blow up a bridge? How long does it take to rebuild a bridge? How long does it take to vote stupid i.e. GW Bush? How long does it take the democrat to repair the damage?
In this day and age when we want it all yesterday, when we expect UPS to deliver overnight, when we want our pizza within 20 minutes, this voting stupid thing just doesn’t work that way... sorry bout that reality check.
If it took GW 8 years to destroy our country, then expect 12 years to repair the damage (if not more).
So what should a wise man do? Stop voting stupid in the first place.
As we know all too well, it does have the potential to backfire long term.
ops... gotta go. My pizza is here. And it's 2 minutes late... damn them!!!!
In this day and age when we want it all yesterday, when we expect UPS to deliver overnight, when we want our pizza within 20 minutes, this voting stupid thing just doesn’t work that way... sorry bout that reality check.
If it took GW 8 years to destroy our country, then expect 12 years to repair the damage (if not more).
So what should a wise man do? Stop voting stupid in the first place.
As we know all too well, it does have the potential to backfire long term.
ops... gotta go. My pizza is here. And it's 2 minutes late... damn them!!!!
shira
Diamond Member
So you're saying that a President's policies always have a more powerful effect on the economy than external events?
Please provide proof of this claim.
Jaskalas
Lifer
Huh!? Is that to suggest it EVER worked?
Are you so ignorant to assume that America is insulated to the rest of the world? The entire world economy is sucking major dick. As a result, America is suffering along with it.
That's the problem with globalization, nitwit.
HomerJS
Lifer
Eight months is hardly enough time to fix eight years of fuck ups. Probably should have focused more on jobs during that time. His theory was for long term economic health health care needed to be dealt with.
Maybe better strategy to get jobs looking better and have healthcare for 2nd term.
Of course the stimulus didn't work terribly well- it was too small and over 1/3 was in taxcuts, which most people either used to pay off debt or saved in banks that weren't lending, anyway. Another 1/3 was in extended UI benefits- only 1/3 of the $787B package was actually dispensed in terms of job preservation or creation.
Had the much ballyhooed Job Creators stepped up and created some jobs, rather than cutting more, it might have turned out differently. Had Repubs shown some actual concern for the populace, supported Obama's efforts to govern, allowed him his due wrt appointments, it might have soothed business jitters. Had repubs not nearly forced default over the debt ceiling, that might have helped, too. Had they not threatened the FRB, it might have strengthened business confidence, as well.
What's happened is that Repubs have paralyzed govt every chance they could, taken every political and economic hostage they could, because they want Obama to fail. If that means the whole country fails, other than those at the top, they figure it's just the price the rest of us will have to pay for them to get what they want, which is a new Gilded Age, where the vast majority of us get beat down, anyway.
These are not ordinary times in Postwar America, at all. We're on the verge of another Great Depression, and Repubs merely offer the same means & methods of the Hoover years, means that obviously failed spectacularly.
Even poorly educated dirt farmers of the era could figure it out, identify the people who'd screwed over the entire country with greed & financial shenanigans, and acted on it in 1932. If we can't figure it out ourselves, now, then Repubs will return to power, and keep on keepin' on, create a catastrophe maybe greater than the great depression.
Maybe then we'll come to our senses, huh? Or will Repubs be able to just Blame Obama for their own actions?
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KlokWyze
Diamond Member
Yeah, my thoughts as well. I think when they were working on the healthcare bill they didn't realize the economy was as bad as it was. Honestly though, the healthcare bill was complete garbage anyways. So WTF. What a waste. Obama was selfish in trying to pursue personal goals instead of really taking care of the right things....
I want CHANGE for the Dem ticket, but all we'll get is more Obama. 😀
Good @ giving speeches (lol Bush), but he seems like a complete bitch in terms of actual policy. You got to have balls to do shit. Attempting to compromise with right-wingers is like arguing with a brick wall. Dumb fucking move. :|
You're really really digging into a post that was nothing more than a mere assumption of what another poster was saying taken in jest. So yeah, what conditioning and lies? tool.
People wonder why I call it the right-wing cult, with such idiots.
It's almost funny to watch how badly these people are suckers.
The people who want to steal the wealth of America - the ones who have bought the Republican party - hire political organizations to come up with 'slogans to get votes'.
For Obama, the recommendation was, 'make him seem foreign to people, like he's not really an American. This will prevent the American people from forming a bond with him, and create a desire to get rid of that person they feel isn't one of them, who they're afraid of, next election'.
And right on cue here's a sucker parroting the very line they said to use, "oh my gosh, he's not really an American, he's.. Kenyan!' Not to mention the role of unstated racism.
What a disgrace not only as an American but to the human race to be so idiotic, so easily manipulated by the crooks.
Who cares about the issues? He's a FOREIGNER! HATE! HATE! FEAR and HATE MORE!
It's just sad to watch how the modern propaganda machine is so effective, trashing the system of 'freedom' and 'democracy' relying on informed and sensible voters.
You know, there's a funny coincidence. 94% of Congressional elections go to the candidate with more money. Coincidentally, those are also the best candidates. It just so happens the candidates who can spend the most on propaganda - name recognition, sloganeering, spreaidng the propaganda - are also the candidates who sensible voters would prefer. It just so happens that the special interests who donate nearly the entire cost of elections are looking out for the best interests of the country, and give to the best candidates.
The system is so compromised that even the 'opposition' to the monied interests have to choose to either serve the same interests and take the same money, or largely lose elections, and even if they will, like Obama did, it's not enough, it's still worth it to these interests to replace him with someone even more in their pocket. And the American people - well, ones like the one above - fall for it. 'Create propaganda to look at Obama like someone foreign and strange and scary'. Sucker Poster: 'Obama is foreign and scary!'
What a pathetic group of people who do not deserve the title 'citizens', suckers for the propaganda paid for by the people who are taking their wealth.
It's remarkable we even have the 80 or so members of the Congressional 'Progressive Caucus', who are representing the people and not these interests mostly. Now with Citizens United, they can be removed one after another, and any alernative to the corporate whores might be lost, like 'liberal Republicans' are today.
Money 1, Democracy 0.
That's the score with the sort of idiot citizen above. We need money out of politics.
As long as the people with money can buy our government by hiring these propaganda firms that so many idiot citizens (and not just idiots) are vulnerable to, it's not Lincon's 'government of the people, by the people, for the people', in fact it's not any one of those things.
Economic opportunity is part of freedom - a part the right wants to destroy, while they wrap themselves in the flag and call the people who are for the people names.
Who were our choices in 2008, 2004, 1996, 1992, elections back to Carter? The only one we've had with anything like a populist agenda was Al Gore, since Mondale, who lost 49 of 50 states to the man who introduced the nation to the terrible policies from debt to deregulating the financial industry and the government being called 'the enemy' to serve the rich interests who wanted people to adopt that opinion to benefit themselves from having the government serve the people. And the money in politics is worse than ever.
Karl Rove just doubled his goal for money in 2012 again. It was $60 million, then $120 million, now it's $240 million he plans to have - nearly all has come from the Kock brothers and one other billionare so far - to use for lying to the American people to hire servants of the rich. We saw a recent ad the Rove group paid for - it has a simple message, Obama is tax crazy, middle America should be afraid of him taxing them like crazy. They do things like totally distort the comments of a CNN reporter to make her say that, through editing.
Nevermind that in the time of the lowest taxes in many decades, Obama has not followed the advice of leading economists to raise taxes, and is said to have actually 'given middle income Americans the biggest tax cut in history'. He's propsed slight tax increases - something like $30 of each $1000 - on income above $250K per family, at a time when those people have taken nearly all the economic growth in the country for decades, so the top 0.1% are up many hundreds of percent. That's 'tax crazy' for the Rove billionares.
The Republicans are so corrupt for these interests that they'll vote for anything to win elecitons and serve the rich over the people. They'll ridicuously impeach a President (Clinton), they'll deny funding for the treaty or the agency that helps prevent terrorists getting their hands on materials for a nuclear bomb, they'll shut down the government, they'll cause the first-ever reduction in the credit rating of the US, they'll oppose measures to help the economy recover or helping lower unemployment, for winning the election.
And all the idiot citizen can say is 'Obama is an American/Kenyan', parroting the racist propaganda of the hired political agencies serving the rich.
Want to do a little good on the issue? There's a web site for a constitutional amendment:
www.getmoneyout.com
I'm opposed to a lot of the compromises of the health plan, but would it be better to have a better plan that didn't pass, so we got nothing? That was possibly the choice.
Obama deserves some blame IMO, but blaming him too much for compromises he was faced with probably being needed to get 60 Senate votes is ignoring the problem.
Continuing TARP/bailouts - agains, the problem there was allowing banks to get 'too big to fail' to begin with allowing them to blackmail the economy - once that mistake had happened, before Obama, if we didn't largely do those programs, the alternative was a worse economic disaster. TARP was too bank-friendly, and the stimulus had way too many 'compromises' with Republicans - like a big part just being 'tax cuts' - but both were important to do for the economy.
Closing Gitmo - this is an area Obama deserves criticism IMO, but it's no reason to vote for the people who created, embrace, and would love to expand GITMOs.
You should be helping support a push for more voters to vote for progressives - for Congress and the Presidency, though yes, the first chance is 2016 for the presidency.
Double Trouble
Elite Member
Anyone who's seen my posts knows I'm not a fan of Obama, but to pin everything we're going through economically on him simply isn't logical or fair. Much of what's going on is beyond his control, and with a country as big as the US -- much like a big ship -- it takes a long time to change course. Not that I think he's the guy to get us on the right course, but lets not go crazy pinning everything on him either.
Double Trouble
Elite Member
Yes, staying where you are is better than taking a step backwards. "something" is not always better than "nothing", if that "something" is a bad thing.
No, I think the idea is to fix things, not completely screw this country up with so called "progressives" pushing more idiocy.
If I wasn't clear, Obama had a well funded campaign making effective slogans, too.
But I'll take his hyped 'change' over trying to paint him as not a real American, trying to drive a false wedge between the people and the President for politics.
(Real wedges, like over legitimate differences, not 'Kenyan', are ok.)
BladeVenom
Lifer
And Obama is no Ronald Reagan.
Obama has done more damage in 3 years than Bush did in 8.
Of course you're correct, but if Obama runs as the messiah, then he should be judged as such. Why do Democrats suggest gov't is the cure to most of society's problems, and yet complain when they're judged by that same standard? See sig.
No, it's not. When you cloud someone's mind with rage, there's little chance reason will triumph. You seem smart enough to understand that, which makes me wonder why you continue to represent your side as a complete @$$hole. Sometimes I wonder if you're not a Hannity/Limbaugh disciple trying to parody a liberal. That certainly seems to be the aim.
You're not bright are you....Do you realize it took a Super majority to get anything passed through the Senate do to the Republicans abuse of the filibuster.
... and that's exactly what they had, a super majority and full control of both houses of congress and an adoring throng of main stream media supporters. And yet, they managed to do nothing positive to help get the economy on track, they just managed to pass a horrible health care bill that's going to damage our economy even further. Nice going.
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