Obama Flip Flops Again

[Carbo]

Flip flopping about his flip flopping. This guy is the ultimate politician. Changes his position more times than a hooker at a sailor's convention.

 

[Vette73]

Another troll post, nothing to see here.

 

[fskimospy]

You getting paid to post these?

 

[SP33Demon]

lawl.

 

[Whoozyerdaddy]

I'm officially tired of the word 'flip-flop'.

Let's call it what it is... He had to pander to the left of his party to get the nom. Now he has to pander to the undecideds in the middle to win the general election. He's a panderer, not a <F word I hate>er. There's a difference. One shows an indecisive n00b who doesn't have a clue and the other shows a cool, calculating politician who knows how to deftly position himself to grab the most votes.

The latter is probably worse IMO...

 

[Moonbeam]

Dat gul damn Obama flip flops so much I's starten ta think he's Buckwheat.

 

[Tab]

His views haven't changed, this is nothing but FUD.

 

[Whoozyerdaddy]

Originally posted by: Tab
His views haven't changed, this is nothing but FUD.

Maybe if he just said what he meant instead of couching it all behind so much lawyerly phrase turning nobody would be confused as to whether or not he's changing his mind.

 

[fskimospy]

Originally posted by: Whoozyerdaddy

Originally posted by: Tab
His views haven't changed, this is nothing but FUD.

Maybe if he just said what he meant instead of couching it all behind so much lawyerly phrase turning nobody would be confused as to whether or not he's changing his mind.

Maybe he was just being smart by not making definitive proclamations on what he was going to do in a war two years in advance.

 

[ProfJohn]

"this whole notion that I am shifting to the center, or that I am flip-flopping."

oh please, he is getting attacked by the left for flip-flopping.
NY Times, Huffington Post etc etc.

There is an editorial by Bob Hubert, super liberal, saying that Obama has flip-flopped.

Obama is turning into a joke, the sad thing is that McCain isn't taking advantage of this chance to nail the flip-flop and pandering labels on Obama.

 

[ProfJohn]

link
BOB HERBERT

In one of the numbers from ?Fiddler on the Roof,? Tevye sings, with a mixture of emotions: ?We haven?t got the man ... we had when we began.?

Back in January when Barack Obama pulled off his stunning win in the Iowa caucuses, and people were lining up in the cold and snow for hours just to get a glimpse of him, there was a wide and growing belief ? encouraged to the max by the candidate ? that something new in American politics had arrived.

His brilliant, nationally televised victory speech in Des Moines sent a shiver of hope through much of the electorate. ?The time has come for a president who will be honest about the choices and the challenges we face,? said Senator Obama, ?who will listen to you and learn from you, even when we disagree, who won?t just tell you what you want to hear, but what you need to know.?

Only an idiot would think or hope that a politician going through the crucible of a presidential campaign could hold fast to every position, steer clear of the stumbling blocks of nuance and never make a mistake. But Barack Obama went out of his way to create the impression that he was a new kind of political leader ? more honest, less cynical and less relentlessly calculating than most.

You would be able to listen to him without worrying about what the meaning of ?is? is.

This is why so many of Senator Obama?s strongest supporters are uneasy, upset, dismayed and even angry at the candidate who is now emerging in the bright light of summer.

One issue or another might not have made much difference. Tacking toward the center in a general election is as common as kissing babies in a campaign, and lord knows the Democrats need to expand their coalition.

But Senator Obama is not just tacking gently toward the center. He?s lurching right when it suits him, and he?s zigging with the kind of reckless abandon that?s guaranteed to cause disillusion, if not whiplash.

So there he was in Zanesville, Ohio, pandering to evangelicals by promising not just to maintain the Bush program of investing taxpayer dollars in religious-based initiatives, but to expand it. Separation of church and state? Forget about it.

And there he was, in the midst of an election campaign in which the makeup of the Supreme Court is as important as it has ever been, agreeing with Justices Antonin Scalia and Clarence Thomas that the death penalty could be imposed for crimes other than murder. What was the man thinking?

Thankfully, a majority on the court left the barbaric Scalia-Thomas-Obama (and John McCain) reasoning behind and held that capital punishment would apply only to homicides.

?What?s he doing?? is the most common question heard recently from Obama supporters.

For one thing, he?s taking his base for granted, apparently believing that such stalwart supporters as blacks, progressives and pumped-up younger voters will be with him no matter what. A taste of the backlash this can produce erupted on the candidate?s own Web site.

Thousands of Obama supporters flooded the site with protests over his decision to support an electronic surveillance bill that gives retroactive immunity to telecommunications companies that participated in the Bush administration?s warrantless wiretapping program. The senator had previously promised to filibuster the bill if it contained the immunity clause.

There has been a reluctance among blacks to openly criticize Senator Obama, the first black candidate with a real shot at the presidency. But behind the scenes, there is discontent among African-Americans, as well, over Mr. Obama?s move away from progressive issues, including his support of the Supreme Court?s decision affirming the constitutional right of individuals to bear arms.

There?s even concern that he?s doing the Obama two-step on the issue that has been the cornerstone of his campaign: his opposition to the war in Iraq. But the senator denied that any significant change should be inferred from his comment that he would ?continue to refine? his policy on the war.

Mr. Obama is betting that in the long run none of this will matter, that the most important thing is winning the White House, that his staunchest supporters (horrified at the very idea of a President McCain) will be there when he needs them.

He seems to believe that his shifts and twists and clever panders ? as opposed to bold, principled leadership on important matters ? will entice large numbers of independent and conservative voters to climb off the fence and run into his yard.

Maybe. But that?s a very dangerous game for a man who first turned voters on by presenting himself as someone who was different, who wouldn?t engage in the terminal emptiness of politics as usual.

Time flies and the Iowa caucuses seem a very long time ago.

 

[OrByte]

hehehe

what we have here is a clear cut PERFECT example of how Obama employs common sense to evaluate critical issues facing Americans.

And those americans that employ illogical, irrational, and nonsensical thinking can't understand him.

Is he elitist? well, I can now see how some of you think so.

 

[RightIsWrong]

Richard Nixon famously said: When you are seeking the nomination for president of the Republican Party, you run to the far right; once you?ve secured the nomination, you run to right of center during the election campaign; once you?ve won the presidency, you govern from the center.

 

[bamacre]

"Now, assuming that I take office in January, then that means that we would still have our troops there for about two more year from now."

Whoa, what happened to 16 months?

 

[Taejin]

Seriously, is this constant chatter of 'Obama flipflops' the right's attempt to try to paint Obama as a flipflopper like they did to Kerry?

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: bamacre
"Now, assuming that I take office in January, then that means that we would still have our troops there for about two more year from now."

Whoa, what happened to 16 months?

What month is it now?

 

[bamacre]

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: bamacre
"Now, assuming that I take office in January, then that means that we would still have our troops there for about two more year from now."

Whoa, what happened to 16 months?

What month is it now?

:laugh:

Oh, you're right.

Or should I say, ?

 

[ProfJohn]

Originally posted by: Taejin
Seriously, is this constant chatter of 'Obama flipflops' the right's attempt to try to paint Obama as a flipflopper like they did to Kerry?

ummm it is the New York Times and the blogs that are going after him and keeping this in the news.

If it was just a bunch of right wingers it would not be as big of a story.

It is similar to 'man bites dog' people expect the right to attack Obama, they don't expect the left to attack Obama. That is why this is such a big story.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: bamacre

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: bamacre
"Now, assuming that I take office in January, then that means that we would still have our troops there for about two more year from now."

Whoa, what happened to 16 months?

What month is it now?

:laugh:

Oh, you're right.

Or should I say, ?

Well, admittedly, 2 years from now would be a couple weeks more than 17 months after the inauguration, but he did say "about."

There was never a flip-flop. Just more lies from desperate Republicans, and a couple on the far left who were hoping for a faster timeline. The dog days of summer always come earlier and last longer in an election year.

 

[OrByte]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Originally posted by: Taejin
Seriously, is this constant chatter of 'Obama flipflops' the right's attempt to try to paint Obama as a flipflopper like they did to Kerry?

ummm it is the New York Times and the blogs that are going after him and keeping this in the news.

If it was just a bunch of right wingers it would not be as big of a story.

It is similar to 'man bites dog' people expect the right to attack Obama, they don't expect the left to attack Obama. That is why this is such a big story.

we are in the (edit) beginning of July.

This isn't as big a story as you wish.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Originally posted by: Taejin
Seriously, is this constant chatter of 'Obama flipflops' the right's attempt to try to paint Obama as a flipflopper like they did to Kerry?

ummm it is the New York Times and the blogs that are going after him and keeping this in the news.

If it was just a bunch of right wingers it would not be as big of a story.

It is similar to 'man bites dog' people expect the right to attack Obama, they don't expect the left to attack Obama. That is why this is such a big story.

The NY Times is a Clinton/DLC rag, idiot. They've been attacking Obama and the DNC on their OP-Ed pages all year. Hell, they're the ones who spread the "no fried foods at the Democratic convention" lie just recently as well.

 

[Stoneburner]

This is a stupid topic filled with stupid people stupidly spreading stupid information.

Obama's positions have not changed. He has always stated he will allow circumstances on the ground to determine the best course of action. Anybody who calls this a flip flop is filthy taint.

ANd Profjohn, I know logic isn't your strongsuit but who cares if the NY times is attacking him for it? The NYTIMES is also partially responsible for the iraq war.

 

[AAjax]

Originally posted by: Stoneburner
This is a stupid topic filled with stupid people stupidly spreading stupid information.

Obama's positions have not changed. He has always stated he will allow circumstances on the ground to determine the best course of action. Anybody who calls this a flip flop is filthy taint.

ANd Profjohn, I know logic isn't your strongsuit but who cares if the NY times is attacking him for it? The NYTIMES is also partially responsible for the iraq war.

Yeah, he didnt change on FISA. He didnt change on NAFTA. Who could think such things?

(Oh and by the way, Im being sarcastic. I felt I had to explain that to you since you so duly pointed out that there are so many stupid people about)

My Gosh, this is getting pathetic.

 

[Robor]

Originally posted by: Whoozyerdaddy
Maybe if he just said what he meant instead of couching it all behind so much lawyerly phrase turning nobody would be confused as to whether or not he's changing his mind.

We saw how well his straight talk did with the 'bitter' comment don't we?

Originally posted by: ProfJohn
"this whole notion that I am shifting to the center, or that I am flip-flopping."

oh please, he is getting attacked by the left for flip-flopping.
NY Times, Huffington Post etc etc.

There is an editorial by Bob Hubert, super liberal, saying that Obama has flip-flopped.

Obama is turning into a joke, the sad thing is that McCain isn't taking advantage of this chance to nail the flip-flop and pandering labels on Obama.

Senior citizen McCain is probably taking a nap.

Originally posted by: Taejin
Seriously, is this constant chatter of 'Obama flipflops' the right's attempt to try to paint Obama as a flipflopper like they did to Kerry?

Sure looks like it to me. See, the right is used to their guys sticking to their guns even if it's unpopular or outright wrong. It's much better to be stubborn and wrong than a dirty, stinkin' flip-flopper!

 

[Stoneburner]

Originally posted by: AAjax

Originally posted by: Stoneburner
This is a stupid topic filled with stupid people stupidly spreading stupid information.

Obama's positions have not changed. He has always stated he will allow circumstances on the ground to determine the best course of action. Anybody who calls this a flip flop is filthy taint.

ANd Profjohn, I know logic isn't your strongsuit but who cares if the NY times is attacking him for it? The NYTIMES is also partially responsible for the iraq war.

Yeah, he didnt change on FISA. He didnt change on NAFTA. Who could think such things?

(Oh and by the way, Im being sarcastic. I felt I had to explain that to you since you so duly pointed out that there are so many stupid people about)

My Gosh, this is getting pathetic.

Where was I talking about FISA?

I'll be waiting for your response.