Obama finally throws Rev. Wright under the bus

[Rio Rebel]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Originally posted by: glutenberg
Please, before making a fool of yourself, feel free to educate yourself by reading the rest of the thread. Vic has explained multiple times in multiple threads, that still can't get through your multiple layers of skull, what the church is all about. He's described its affiliations, its parent organization, the message the church actually preaches, and the congregation that attends it (professors, scholars, wealthy liberals, etc.). You make yourself look like a complete imbecile when you compare Obama's church to the KKK.

bwahahaha ummm Oprah left his church years ago, if he is so great why did she do that?

umm....fixed.

 

[BMW540I6speed]

Originally posted by: chucky2

Originally posted by: Rio Rebel

Originally posted by: rchiu

Originally posted by: BMW540I6speed

Originally posted by: Starbuck1975
This was non-issue from the get-go...the media needed a controversy to knock Obama from his pedestal, and Clinton needed a divisive issue to rally the blue collar white vote against Obama.

Congratulations to the Democrats for exploiting racism within their own ranks, and the media for ensuring the nomination process extends to the DNC.

Essentially, the Wright controversy is the only thing keeping Hillary in the competition at this point.

Spot on..

The outrageous behavior of Rev. Wright these past few days is matched only by the irresponsible behavior of the media which has given him a platform. This is a vain, arrogant, befuddled, and misguided man whose only cause is his own ego. He is profoundly jealous of Obama. He has bared himself for all to see in these latest rantings.

In this way, in fact Wright is much like Hillary Clinton. They both believe that Obama is a young, untried upstart who has not properly acknowledged his lower place in the pecking order. Like Clinton, Wright believes that Obama should have waited his turn before trying for a prominent place on the national stage.

This is a difficult but paradoxically good thing for Sen. Obama. The bizarre behavior of Wright clearly establishes how far apart the two men are. Obama is nothing like Wright in temperment, outlook, personal politics, historical analysis, or ethics. The continued attempt by the Republicans and supporters of Sen. Clinton to associate Wright with Obama will fall apart because the differences between the two have now been established with scorching clarity by the rabid Wright.

After this weekend's media extravaganza, only the pathetically partisan or the racist will continue to insist that somehow Wright = Obama.

Bwahahaha, yeah sure, Obama and Wright is far apart. Obama attended Wright's church for 20 years, baptized by him, have the wedding officiated by him, kids baptized by him, book's name from his sermon, and have him advise the decision to run as well as the campaign. Sure that's something two people far apart do together.

And what's curious is that Obama wasn't outraged by Wright's view, comments during the entire 20 years sitting in Wrights church and the close relationship with Wright. But oh when big primaries are a week away and Clinton winning the big prize just ended, all of the sudden he is outraged, and Wrights view contradict to what he believes.

Yeah, okay.....I am sure you Obama people still feel nothing wrong with that.

Has anyone ever noticed how many remarkably stupid posts begin with "bwahahaha"?

That's because when the RP Obamians start making every excuse under the sun, and then get called on it, it is funny.

To rchiu: You are exactly spot on.

Chuck

Heh, I guess he "owned" the old "Obamian"(whatever that is). Zinged me a good one!, hey, neato!. Pointing out the "Fantasyland" we live in this country. Lest we claim some paradoxal "victory".

I guess if there's been one unifying characteristic of Obama's campaign, it's that he's forcing us to reconcile the comfortable lies we've been living on the surface with the uncomfortable truths that lurk below. I don't think that was necessarily by design, but it's happening.

It's like there are two Americas - the one that we see on TV, and the one that we live in every day. Voters seem to want a president that reflects the Fantasyland that we see on TV - the happy place where everyone is perfect, where no flaws exist, where a candidate can simultaneously be everything to everyone. We don't want to admit that such a candidate is an impossible figment of our imagination, so we let politicians pander to us knowing that they are completely full of shit, but accepting it nonetheless because that's how the script goes.

Now along comes Obama and he tries "lifting" the veil. He does so under a message of hope and unification, stating that this is not going to be easy, but it is a worthwhile goal we can hope to attain. He says what he feels. He has off days. He gets annoyed with assholes. He doesn't have the perfectly prepared answer to every question. He stammers. He stutters. He thinks about what he is saying. He means what he says.

Hillary & McCain are capable individuals who represents the politics of "Fantasyland" - they are cut from the old mold of duality in which you smile and pander and lie through your teeth to the public and do the real bidding in the back rooms where the real power is concentrated. they have the perfectly rehearsed answer to everything. They refuse to make apologies. Nothing is their fault because in "Fantasyland", the President makes no mistakes.

Obama is betting on the American public being sick and tired of the same old crap. The same campaign promises that are instantly forgotten the moment the oath is taken. The same way our elections are determined by irrelevant manufactured controversies. The same knee-jerk reactions.

Of course there are lots and lots of people who aren't ready for this. People who prefer to stay in the cozy confines of "Fantasyland". But you can only live a lie for so long before the jig is up. It's up ... it's been up for a long time, and people are finally starting to realize it.

Let's hope people can take this Reverend Wright saga for what it is - a manufactured political distraction made specifically to destroy someone who makes us feel uncomfortable about the lie we know we've been living.

 

[glutenberg]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Originally posted by: glutenberg
Please, before making a fool of yourself, feel free to educate yourself by reading the rest of the thread. Vic has explained multiple times in multiple threads, that still can't get through your multiple layers of skull, what the church is all about. He's described its affiliations, its parent organization, the message the church actually preaches, and the congregation that attends it (professors, scholars, wealthy liberals, etc.). You make yourself look like a complete imbecile when you compare Obama's church to the KKK.

ummm Oprah left his church years ago, if he is so great why did she do that?

Can you link me the quote where Oprah explains why she left the church?

Also, she also supports Obama who has ties with Wright. Does that mean she needs to take back her support because of guilt by association?

 

[glutenberg]

Originally posted by: Drift3r
Wright is the perfect example of giving someone enough rope (air time) so that they can hang themselves. Unfortunately Wright is taking Obama with him in the end and it seems he doesn't care. A lot of American voters base their vote on the decision making capabilities of a candidate. Obama has shown that his decision making ability is extremely flawed for a person running for the presidency of the Untied States of America in this regard. I hope he has better judgment when picking a VP or cabinet members if he gets that far.

Let me see, his decision making lead him to choose his current campaign managers, his economic policy makers, and his many advisers (Wright being one of many) that have helped him go from Presidential hopeful to Presidential front-runner (on the number scale). Seems like he made some great judgment calls right there.

 

[1EZduzit]

Originally posted by: glutenberg

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Originally posted by: glutenberg
Please, before making a fool of yourself, feel free to educate yourself by reading the rest of the thread. Vic has explained multiple times in multiple threads, that still can't get through your multiple layers of skull, what the church is all about. He's described its affiliations, its parent organization, the message the church actually preaches, and the congregation that attends it (professors, scholars, wealthy liberals, etc.). You make yourself look like a complete imbecile when you compare Obama's church to the KKK.

ummm Oprah left his church years ago, if he is so great why did she do that?

Can you link me the quote where Oprah explains why she left the church?

Why does anyone leave a church unless you move out of town? i'd guess that you must disagree with what is being preached enough to no longer want to support that church.

Why do you think Oprah left the church?

 

[Caminetto]

Originally posted by: eskimospy
How about Obama stood up for someone who was being unfairly maligned in the press and said that the measure of the man was more and better then that. Anyone who listens to the entirety of the sermons in question will undoubtedly come to the same conclusion. Individually the comments were bad, but taken in context of the whole idea they were much less then that. That's the point he's always been trying to make.

Now that Wright has continued to stir things up and is now talking trash to Obama for attempting to distance himself from those things, what do you expect? Obama stood up for him and now Wright threw mud in his face. I think this shows that not only is Obama principled for standing up for people even when it's unpopular, but he's also no pushover. When someone shits on him, he shits back.

QFT

 

[daveymark]

Originally posted by: Starbuck1975
I have one question for everyone in this thread...is the Wright controversy really how we want the Democrats to achieve closure in determining their nominee?

Shouldn't we be hearing what each candidate brings to the table in terms of solutions for health care, the economy, the housing crisis, the war in Iraq, etc.

they are carbon copies of each other when it comes to the issues, so voters are looking at character differences now. obama is supposed to be the candidate of change, but when he makes decisions like this based on political expediency, he becomes just another politician in the voter's eyes.

 

[spittledip]

Originally posted by: eskimospy
How about Obama stood up for someone who was being unfairly maligned in the press and said that the measure of the man was more and better then that. Anyone who listens to the entirety of the sermons in question will undoubtedly come to the same conclusion. Individually the comments were bad, but taken in context of the whole idea they were much less then that. That's the point he's always been trying to make.

Now that Wright has continued to stir things up and is now talking trash to Obama for attempting to distance himself from those things, what do you expect? Obama stood up for him and now Wright threw mud in his face. I think this shows that not only is Obama principled for standing up for people even when it's unpopular, but he's also no pushover. When someone shits on him, he shits back.

Yes, You are 100% correct on this. Wright is a low-down dog for doing tis to Obama. I don't quite understand what is motivating him to do this. Is he just trying to clear his name? Or is someone paying him to spread some muck around? One or the other, he is a sad specimin and it is horrible to think that this selfish man leads a religious congregation.

 

[Starbuck1975]

obama is supposed to be the candidate of change, but when he makes decisions like this based on political expediency, he becomes just another politician in the voter's eyes.

Yet to be fair, the media, and later Clinton, cornered him on this issue...which, in the grand scheme of things, is a minor issue...all of us have associates, mentors or friends who, when examined under a microscope, could project a perception of negative character judgement.

Wright got attention because it keeps the race issue fire burning brightly. Clinton has some fairly shady associates from the past...just look at some of the Clinton pardons...but none of those play to media sensationalism...at least, not yet.

 

[Madwand1]

Originally posted by: BMW540I6speed
Let's hope people can take this Reverend Wright saga for what it is - a manufactured political distraction made specifically to destroy someone who makes us feel uncomfortable about the lie we know we've been living.

I don't think you mean this in a positive way about Reverend Wright, but that's how I can see it -- that he's one who makes people uncomfortable, and he's one who's being destroyed in the political process.

It is only in ignorance and some caution or cowardice that I can say that I don't entirely agree with Wright, but having heard his speech and answers to questions, I see more of a person to admire and a position to want to learn about and discuss than to denounce and throw under the rug or bus or what have you.

 

[Craig234]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Originally posted by: Superrock
Personally I couldn't care less about Rev. Wright nor speeches. I wish the news and the propaganda machine that is Fox would stop turning the camera on him. I really don't care what he thinks. I am sick of him and don't want to hear anymore about him.

Can it with the FOX BS.

It was PBS that gave Wright the big interview this weekend and the press club that gave him the platform the other day. Fox has nothing to do with it.

You want a sense of how big this story is then go over to Realclearpolitics and look at the number of stories about this mess. NY Times, LA Time, Washington Post, CBS News, The Nation, National Review everyone is writing/talking about this.

PJ's misleading in this thread:

Equating the Fox sensationalized repitition of the most provocative, misleading sound bites, and the thoughtful, informative, in-depth interview by Bill Moyers on PBS.

He tries to trick the reader into simply measuring the issue byt the time, and ignores the slant.

 

[Craig234]

Originally posted by: Fern

Originally posted by: Craig234

Originally posted by: Fern

I'll add that there is an additional difficulty in that the Repubs were just getting an endorsement, and did not atend the church(s) of these RR preachers. Obama OTOH, is/was far more involved with this crazy Wright fellow.

See my post on why this makes the Republicans' behavior *worse*, not better.

Understand, I'm not excusing Obama, if Wright were actually comparable to Hagee.

It's not as if it's ok to choose a church which is about hateful bigotry. It's a combination that the Obama-Wright relationship was based on a lot of things other than that - the evidence shows there's a lot of other things - and that Wright is far more, though not completely, defensible than Hagee, as well as the fact that McCain has no such 'other reasons' justifying his relationship with Hagee, which is purely political and therefore makes Hagee's bigotry front and center. As I noted, a better comparison is Obama and Farrakhan, which Obama rejected.

The "difficulty" I refer to above is that with the general electorate, either in the primary or the general.

I'm not sure your point would gain much, if any, traction.

The whole McCain's afilitation was just "political" while Obama's was much deeper seems precisely the wrong way to go. You'll scare the sh!t out of the average voter with that.

Fern

I think that the political culture by which McCain's pursuing an endorsement by a terrible nutty bigot can be dismissed as harmless 'just politics' needs to be fought, not accepted.

 

[Craig234]

Originally posted by: JS80
I now believe the recent Wright showing at the Press Club was all a pre-planned ploy by Obama and Wright so Obama can come out and do what he is doing now.

I considered that theory, and reject it as unlikley, as it's way too risky, and I think it was in Obama's interest for Wright to lay low more than to bring this in the public again.

Apart from the deceipt, it can raise questions about 'Obama's judgement' in not knowing his pastor well after 20 years (how can we trust him to evaluate appointees and enemies?) etc.

 

[RY62]

Originally posted by: spittledip

Originally posted by: eskimospy
How about Obama stood up for someone who was being unfairly maligned in the press and said that the measure of the man was more and better then that. Anyone who listens to the entirety of the sermons in question will undoubtedly come to the same conclusion. Individually the comments were bad, but taken in context of the whole idea they were much less then that. That's the point he's always been trying to make.

Now that Wright has continued to stir things up and is now talking trash to Obama for attempting to distance himself from those things, what do you expect? Obama stood up for him and now Wright threw mud in his face. I think this shows that not only is Obama principled for standing up for people even when it's unpopular, but he's also no pushover. When someone shits on him, he shits back.

Yes, You are 100% correct on this. Wright is a low-down dog for doing tis to Obama. I don't quite understand what is motivating him to do this. Is he just trying to clear his name? Or is someone paying him to spread some muck around? One or the other, he is a sad specimin and it is horrible to think that this selfish man leads a religious congregation.

Wright hasn't done anything to hurt Obama. I believe Wright's recent outbursts have done nothing but benefit Obama. These events couldn't have been scripted any better if they had been working with a top PR firm....Oh wait, they were working with a top PR firm...Jasculca-Terman and Associates, a major Chicago P.R. outfit that specializes in doing crisis P.R. management for corporations and large institutions.

About a month ago, top Obama adviser David Axelrod privately tried to help Trinity with its raging public relations problem by asking one of Chicago's top P.R. firms to go in and help the church deal with its P.R. mess.
http://tpmelectioncentral.talk...viser_suggested_ou.php

The Wright problem has been dogging Obama for a while and it appeared there was no end in sight. This issue has been causing super delegates to ponder the electability issue. Obama tried to shake the issue with his race speach where he said he could no more disown Wright than he could disown the black community or his own grandmother. The speach failed to rid him of the Wright problem and only made it more difficult to distance himself.

Time for some crisis PR management... What better way to disown Wright than to have him start ranting again. This time it wouldn't be sound bites from old sermons. It would be the same rants, live and all over public television. Now, who could fault Obama for throwing the good reverend under the bus.

 

[chowderhead]

Originally posted by: RY62

Originally posted by: spittledip

Originally posted by: eskimospy
How about Obama stood up for someone who was being unfairly maligned in the press and said that the measure of the man was more and better then that. Anyone who listens to the entirety of the sermons in question will undoubtedly come to the same conclusion. Individually the comments were bad, but taken in context of the whole idea they were much less then that. That's the point he's always been trying to make.

Now that Wright has continued to stir things up and is now talking trash to Obama for attempting to distance himself from those things, what do you expect? Obama stood up for him and now Wright threw mud in his face. I think this shows that not only is Obama principled for standing up for people even when it's unpopular, but he's also no pushover. When someone shits on him, he shits back.

Yes, You are 100% correct on this. Wright is a low-down dog for doing tis to Obama. I don't quite understand what is motivating him to do this. Is he just trying to clear his name? Or is someone paying him to spread some muck around? One or the other, he is a sad specimin and it is horrible to think that this selfish man leads a religious congregation.

Wright hasn't done anything to hurt Obama. I believe Wright's recent outbursts have done nothing but benefit Obama. These events couldn't have been scripted any better if they had been working with a top PR firm....Oh wait, they were working with a top PR firm...Jasculca-Terman and Associates, a major Chicago P.R. outfit that specializes in doing crisis P.R. management for corporations and large institutions.

About a month ago, top Obama adviser David Axelrod privately tried to help Trinity with its raging public relations problem by asking one of Chicago's top P.R. firms to go in and help the church deal with its P.R. mess.
http://tpmelectioncentral.talk...viser_suggested_ou.php

The Wright problem has been dogging Obama for a while and it appeared there was no end in sight. This issue has been causing super delegates to ponder the electability issue. Obama tried to shake the issue with his race speach where he said he could no more disown Wright than he could disown the black community or his own grandmother. The speach failed to rid him of the Wright problem and only made it more difficult to distance himself.

Time for some crisis PR management... What better way to disown Wright than to have him start ranting again. This time it wouldn't be sound bites from old sermons. It would be the same rants, live and all over public television. Now, who could fault Obama for throwing the good reverend under the bus.

what! You mean the Obama speech that was compared to Gettysburg and which the talking heads couldn't stop fawning over didn't do the trick? I thought the more we got to know Obama, the more we would love his great oratory.

There was no condemnation when Wright said G-D America or the US brought 9-11 on ourselves, but once Wright called Obama a politician who will say what he needs to say, Obama then decides to come out and condemn what Wright said. How politically expedient.

 

[glutenberg]

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit


Why does anyone leave a church unless you move out of town? i'd guess that you must disagree with what is being preached enough to no longer want to support that church.

Why do you think Oprah left the church?

Strange, most of the people I know have tried out multiple churches and yet stay in the same city. Anecdotal evidence versus anecdotal evidence, this is going to be good.

 

[glutenberg]

Originally posted by: chowderhead

what! You mean the Obama speech that was compared to Gettysburg and which the talking heads couldn't stop fawning over didn't do the trick? I thought the more we got to know Obama, the more we would love his great oratory.

There was no condemnation when Wright said G-D America or the US brought 9-11 on ourselves, but once Wright called Obama a politician who will say what he needs to say, Obama then decides to come out and condemn what Wright said. How politically expedient.

Did you even read his speech?

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: RY62

Time for some crisis PR management... What better way to disown Wright than to have him start ranting again. This time it wouldn't be sound bites from old sermons. It would be the same rants, live and all over public television. Now, who could fault Obama for throwing the good reverend under the bus.

Wright "anticipated" Obama by saying [in effect], "Look, Obama and i see "eye to eye" and we were ALL in the basement praying that night before Obama announced his candidacy"

Worse, MUCH worse, the Good Rev also said Obama was "a Politician" - "i am a Preacher; in November or January i will still be a Preacher"


and then he did the final CUT by saying "Obama is a Black person .. when Farrakhan Speaks - like EF Hutton - Black people listen"

no wonder Obama threw him under the bus
.. he is pretty P.O.'d at his current pastor - friend and consoler for many years - who put him out to pasture

Obama is shown not to be a good leader for "white folks" who are alarmed at his "crazy associates now"

Obama cannot win [period] .. not in '08 .. if he has sense he will cut a deal with Hitlery for a VP spot and the Pres in '16.
-anything else is premature and i think the Rev Wright is also Right

 

[jamesall]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Originally posted by: jamesall
Barbara Reynolds, who arrange Wright?s to be on National Press Club, is a Clinton supporter. a hit piece my clinton machine?

That story is dead already...
link

National Press Club president Sylvia Smith responded today to a Daily News article reporting that club member Barbara Reynolds, a Hillary Clinton supporter, organized yesterday?s breakfast talk with Dr. Jeremiah Wright Jr.

Smith said by phone this morning that she still doesn?t know if Reynolds supports Clinton, and doesn?t care either way.

?Reverend Wright is newsworthy, period,? Smith said.

and

Earlier today I reported that National Press Club member Barbara Reynolds brought up Dr. Jeremiah Wright speaking back in 2006, but it was not pursued.

But Wright did speak there in 2007 on a panel, as part of the Samuel Dewitt Proctor Conference (which Wright is attending this week in Washington D.C). This was not an NPC-sponsored event, but held at the club.

that's too bad, I was going to give kodos to clinton for this strategy move. You need to be tough and cunning to be president to deal with the likes of putin, north korea, and Iran.

 

[apoppin]

Wright's own Big EGO - his belief that the Black Church was Under Attack - and possibly also his belief that Obama is not yet ready apparently did it
- NOT Clinton although Hitlery DOES approve of the right Wright .. who i guess is Left

personally i like Wright .. i would like to go to his church!! - he speaks his mind well, is superbly perceptive and is also eloquent
- and i am neither black nor christian - i just think i could learn from him like Obama does
- i would never give Jerry up and say i was "outraged and saddened" by ANYTHING he said - as a preacher

 

[lopri]

I didn't read this thread but my observation on this is:

- Young Obama seeks Wright's help for his political future.
- Wright becomes Obama's father. Note that Obama's father left him when he was a kid. Marrying him and his wife, baptizing his kids, praying together, etc. (i.e. 'Father Figure')
- Obama planned his presidential bid with Wright, and Wright agrees to stay behind knowing that he won't be much of a help.
- Then comes the NBC (ABC?) news.
- Obama did his best to put out the fire, but of course it won't go away. Pubs will try to secure every possible information available to them.
- Meanwhile, pundits and media keep the issue alive. Unfortunately for Obama, there is a subtle, but common, underlying implication between this and his ignorant comment from SF.
- Obama constantly has to defend himself with regard to Wright and the church.
- Wright naturally feels that he wasn't treated fairly, especially by Obama. After all, he was Obama's father for 20 years. And it looks like, if he doesn't do anything now, Obama will forget about him for the rest of his life, leaving him cold. Plus, his own work through out his entire life will get an unfair label.
- Rest of the story unfolds. Wright is no longer a mere pastor, but now in the center of politics. Obama has no choice but to address the issue.

Now, going to the future..

- What is Wright going to do, now that he's totally abandoned? National platform is wide open for him.
- Whose side, between Wright and Obama, will the church members take? I am sure the press will go after the 'truth'.
- Especially, how much does Wright know about Obama? This is critical, and I am sure it's one of the reasons Obama initially try to defend him to a degree. You know, everyone makes mistakes when young, but anything goes in elections as we know.
- Will the Pubs (and possibly Hillary) try to lure Wright with carrots, with the obvious intention? Although at this point Wright has already lost a lot of credibility. (So has Obama)

 

[apoppin]

good analysis, lopri

don't read the thread, it will just confuse anyone

*The problem* for Obama is that Wright will NOT go away and the press keeps on picking on it - The Rev Wright *molded* Obama's own Visionary Views .. i would prefer Jerry to Barrak as a friend .. i know who will tell me the truth - no matter what; and it is not a "politician" i want as a friend

Bye-Bye Obama
--Make your deal ASAP! We'll see you in '12 - older and wiser!

 

[lopri]

You know, I feel sorry for Obama supporters to say this, but I'm glad that Hillary has hung around without giving up. And to tell the truth, this has been her argument anyway. Now Obama is at the exact opposite position with the upcoming Indiana and North Carolina Primaries. If he loses Indiana and/or doesn't win North Carolina with a convincing margin, there will be an enormous pressure on his campaign. Plus, the Pubs are testing waters with their own ads in North Carolina.

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: lopri
You know, I feel sorry for Obama supporters to say this, but I'm glad that Hillary has hung around without giving up. And to tell the truth, this has been her argument anyway. Now Obama is at the exact opposite position with the upcoming Indiana and North Carolina Primaries. If he loses Indiana and/or doesn't win North Carolina with a convincing margin, there will be an enormous pressure on his campaign. Plus, the Pubs are testing waters with their own ads in North Carolina.

Amen .. preach on!!

Hitlery is a little "taste" of what Obama would get IF he managed to win
thankfully it appears he is going under the bus instead

in time to get OUT of the race for Pres this time

Hitlery is a nasty little pit bull dog - she was created to savage McLame .. that is her purpose

 

[lopri]

My feeling is that this issue will be on-going should Obama becomes the nominee. Because, if you think about it, there is nothing really new came out from the past few days. Basically Rev. Wright repeated what's already known about him for over a month. (9/11, AIDS, etc.) The only thing that differentiates it this time, is that he asserted that Obama was nothing but an opportunistic politician. This, if true, completely undermines the base of Obama's presidential bid. Because of that, there will be this 'vetting' process until everyone is beat to death..