• We’re currently investigating an issue related to the forum theme and styling that is impacting page layout and visual formatting. The problem has been identified, and we are actively working on a resolution. There is no impact to user data or functionality, this is strictly a front-end display issue. We’ll post an update once the fix has been deployed. Thanks for your patience while we get this sorted.

Nvidia to sell their own branded Geforce cards

Page 4 - Seeking answers? Join the AnandTech community: where nearly half-a-million members share solutions and discuss the latest tech.
What with the loss of market leadership,AIBs going bust,low end graphics being displaced by CPU/GPU chips and no credible alternative to AMD's new 6 series cards,it looks like the wheels are beginning to fall off the NVDA wagon.
 
Will Robinson said:
What with the loss of market leadership,AIBs going bust,low end graphics being displaced by CPU/GPU chips and no credible alternative to AMD's new 6 series cards,it looks like the wheels are beginning to fall off the NVDA wagon.
Click to expand...

Lets not be too hasty with this claim 🙂
 
Last edited:
Anyone mention if this is strictly their brick and mortar stores or if BB online will have these as well?
 
n0x1ous said:
Lets not be too hasty with this claim 🙂
Click to expand...
I don't think it's too hasty. Things look very bad for NV. They are selling large GPUs like the GTX460 for dirt cheap. Their margins must not be good, and the R&D budget on such a massive chip must be enormous.

I hope NV survives and I would honestly buy an NV branded card, but really things do not look like they are going to bode well for them.

Also, Will Robinson forgot to mention that NV has been booted out of the chipset business as well.
 
SickBeast said:
I don't think it's too hasty. Things look very bad for NV. They are selling large GPUs like the GTX460 for dirt cheap. Their margins must not be good, and the R&D budget on such a massive chip must be enormous.

I hope NV survives and I would honestly buy an NV branded card, but really things do not look like they are going to bode well for them.

Also, Will Robinson forgot to mention that NV has been booted out of the chipset business as well.
Click to expand...

this would make a good entry in the "moral/ethics" thread if Intel was included. "Hmmm we don't like Nvidia taking away some of our high end chipset marketshare so we will just not allow them to compete anymore" I found it interesting that there was no mention of this in Intel's FTC settlement. anyway back on topic..

I hear what you are saying. But, we've been hearing this same line (Nvidia is done, they'll never recover, their finished..yada yada etc) ever since HD 5000 came out. But Nvidia is still here, they still have a very significant piece of market share.

Your statement on margins are all guesses and assumptions. We DON'T know what Nvidia's margins are and we don't know what they pay per wafer from TSMC. What we do know is that they are TSMC's number 1 preferred customer, so while they are at a disadvantage with larger dies for the performance compared to ATI, they may be getting better pricing from TSMC to make up for it.

All I'm saying, is all the doom and gloom is a little too much right now. Yes they have had a rough year, but we all know in this business how quickly things can change. A couple years ago this conversation was the other way around when HD 3000 was getting destroyed by G80/G92 and look at how well ATI is doing now (though AMD rarely ever makes any money, but hey at least there graphics division can make a few bucks)
 
I agree that the doomsday scenarios are premature, but they are well within the realm of possibility at this point, which is intriguing.
 
SickBeast said:
I agree that the doomsday scenarios are premature, but they are well within the realm of possibility at this point, which is intriguing.
Click to expand...

Yes it is possible.

On a related note, I wonder why no one ever talks about AMD going under despite them losing money seemingly every quarter for the last 5 years.

Is it because the government wouldn't let them go under because they need someone to keep chipzilla (intel) in check?
 
n0x1ous said:
Yes it is possible.

On a related note, I wonder why no one ever talks about AMD going under despite them losing money seemingly every quarter for the last 5 years.

Is it because the government wouldn't let them go under because they need someone to keep chipzilla (intel) in check?
Click to expand...
Lots of people talk about it, where have you been?

Right after AMD bought ATI, there were a *ton* of doomsday threads about AMD.

AMD is "allowed" to go broke. Intel is just not allowed to be a monopoly. I'm not sure how they can be punished simply because no other company exists, though.
 
n0x1ous said:
Yes it is possible.

On a related note, I wonder why no one ever talks about AMD going under despite them losing money seemingly every quarter for the last 5 years.

Is it because the government wouldn't let them go under because they need someone to keep chipzilla (intel) in check?
Click to expand...

Actually, people have talked about AMD going under over the years. You should know though that the loss of money is after paying their employees, investments in R&D, etc. and dealing with Intel payola. So it has enough to keep surviving as a going concern so long as INTC doesn't engage in too much of a long-term price war.

Also, INTC is too smart to crush AMD, even though INTC could bury AMD at any time if it so chose. An old-school monopolist might kill all competitors, but a 21st-century monopolist might want to keep around one ailing competitor to provide it cover should the DOJ come knocking with anti-trust allegations. Meanwhile, INTC keeps raking in the dough. INTC doesn't need 100.0% marketshare to do that.

Meanwhile the graphics division in AMD is highly profitable right now and looks to be so for many more months, at minimum.
 
Last edited:
SickBeast said:
Lots of people talk about it, where have you been?

Right after AMD bought ATI, there were a *ton* of doomsday threads about AMD.

AMD is "allowed" to go broke. Intel is just not allowed to be a monopoly. I'm not sure how they can be punished simply because no other company exists, though.
Click to expand...

I didn't get into hardware until late 2006 around G80 so I must have missed all that.

I guess I mean more now...they still lose money all the time so aren't they in even worse shape then 2005/2006? At least then, they were coming off of recent success with Athlon stuff, and Core 2 was just coming around. They have been getting destroyed on the CPU side for the last 4 years.

But its not a hot topic currently.....you know what i mean?

I know what your saying, but I just wonder if the government would step in like they did for GM or something if AMD was about to go under....
 
blastingcap said:
Actually, people have talked about AMD going under over the years. You should know thought that the loss of money is after paying their employees, investments in R&D, etc. and dealing with Intel payola. So it has enough to keep surviving as a going concern so long as INTC doesn't engage in too much of a long-term price war.

Also, INTC is too smart to crush AMD, even though INTC could bury AMD at any time if it so chose. An old-school monopolist might kill all competitors, but a 21st-century monopolist might want to keep around one ailing competitor to provide it cover should the DOJ come knocking with anti-trust allegations. Meanwhile, INTC keeps raking in the dough. INTC doesn't need 100.0% marketshare to do that.

Meanwhile the graphics division in AMD is highly profitable right now and looks to be so for many more months, at minimum.
Click to expand...

I certainly agree about Intel not wanting to deliver a knock out blow to keep the government off their backs, but AMD is still in a rougher financial position than NV is right now which has a few billion in the bank....

sorry if i got off topic a bit!
 
Last edited:
n0x1ous said:
I didn't get into hardware until late 2006 around G80 so I must have missed all that.
Click to expand...

AMD and ATI merged in 2006. Per wikipedia: "On July 24, 2006, Advanced Micro Devices and ATI announced a plan to merge together in a deal valued at $5.4 billion. The merger closed on October 25, 2006."
 
n0x1ous said:
I certainly agree about Intel not wanting to deliver a knock out blow to keep the government off their backs, but AMD is still in a rougher financial position than NV is right now which has a few billion in the bank....
Click to expand...

Yeah, the old AMD would be on the ropes right around now. But with the INTC settlement cash and spinning off its fabs, the new AMD is in a better position in the long term. GloFo is backed by rivers of Middle Eastern oil money and has a better chance of keeping its fabs busy and up to date than AMD ever would by itself. All the R&D to try to catch up to INTC's process technology was bleeding AMD dry, and fabs are expensive and don't pay for themselves unless they are highly utilized.
 
Last edited:
blastingcap said:
AMD and ATI merged in 2006. Per wikipedia: "On July 24, 2006, Advanced Micro Devices and ATI announced a plan to merge together in a deal valued at $5.4 billion. The merger closed on October 25, 2006."
Click to expand...

correct, i know they merged earlier in 2006 and all, but by November 2006 is when i got into it and i didn't follow forums or news back then. i was just trying to learn how to put a PC together and stuff back then. so thats why i wouldnt have read any AMD doom discussions back then.
 
blastingcap said:
Yeah, old AMD would be on the ropes right around now. But with the INTC settlement cash and spinning off its fabs, AMD is in a better position in the long term. GloFo is backed by rivers of Middle Eastern oil money and has a better chance of keeping its fabs busy and up to date than AMD ever would by itself. All the R&D to try to catch up to INTC's process technology was bleeding AMD dry, and fabs are expensive and don't pay for themselves unless they are highly utilized.
Click to expand...

true true
 
n0x1ous said:
correct, i know they merged earlier in 2006 and all, but by November 2006 is when i got into it and i didn't follow forums or news back then. i was just trying to learn how to put a PC together and stuff back then. so thats why i wouldnt have read any AMD doom discussions back then.
Click to expand...

Well by then the merger would have been old news, so no wonder you didn't hear as much doom and glooming. 🙂
 
n0x1ous said:
I didn't get into hardware until late 2006 around G80 so I must have missed all that.

I guess I mean more now...they still lose money all the time so aren't they in even worse shape then 2005/2006? At least then, they were coming off of recent success with Athlon stuff, and Core 2 was just coming around. They have been getting destroyed on the CPU side for the last 4 years.

But its not a hot topic currently.....you know what i mean?

I know what your saying, but I just wonder if the government would step in like they did for GM or something if AMD was about to go under....
Click to expand...
AMD is no longer losing money at an alarming rate, and they did some serious restructuring which seems to have helped them. They are gaining a ton of traction in the mobile arena; you've probably seen the plethora of AMD "Vision" laptops in stores.

The focus has been more on NV lately because their situation is probably considered by most people to be more "dire" than that of AMD at this point.
 
IMO if AMD were really backed into a corner by intel, they could sell their CPU division to IBM and continue on as a profitable GPU maker.
 
SickBeast said:
AMD is no longer losing money at an alarming rate, and they did some serious restructuring which seems to have helped them. They are gaining a ton of traction in the mobile arena; you've probably seen the plethora of AMD "Vision" laptops in stores.

The focus has been more on NV lately because their situation is probably considered by most people to be more "dire" than that of AMD at this point.
Click to expand...

Imho, NV's situation is not dire (what it lost in low-margin chipsets it can gain back and more in mobile/GPGPU in the long run; it also has a deathgrip on the professional graphics market; and though Fermi might not be making much money, it's competitive with ATI's offering and GF104 is doing a good job of holding the fort w/r/t market share). But NV is a troubled company, I agree. That's in part because NV's CEO is an arrogant jerk who seems to enjoy burning bridges, whether it's by calling out INTC publicly ("can of whoop ass" and intelsinsides.com, and who knows what he said privately before then), severing XFX from its AIB stable, or acting rather ambivalently during bumpgate (which contributed to NV losing contracts with Apple).
 
SickBeast said:
IMO if AMD were really backed into a corner by intel, they could sell their CPU division to IBM and continue on as a profitable GPU maker.
Click to expand...

They could, but wouldn't they be in a similar situation as NV then since alot of the forecasted problems for NV stem around the fact that the entry level market for discreet GPU's is going to disappear due to the CPU/GPU hybrids?

they would only have the smaller mid/high discreet market as an option then. Perhaps if that ever happened they could put some more emphasis on HPC/Professional markets that they don't worry too much about right now.
 
n0x1ous said:
They could, but wouldn't they be in a similar situation as NV then since alot of the forecasted problems for NV stem around the fact that the entry level market for discreet GPU's is going to disappear due to the CPU/GPU hybrids?

they would only have the smaller mid/high discreet market as an option then. Perhaps if that ever happened they could put some more emphasis on HPC/Professional markets that they don't worry too much about right now.
Click to expand...
That's a fair point.

There are other areas where AMD could make money though, such as SOC's for things like the iPhone. The same goes for NV, and they are doing just that with "Tegra".
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

TRENDING THREADS

Back
Top