nVidia Keeps Rehashing the 9xxx Series

[apoppin]

How about another option?

[X] -This flamebait thread Sucks and the Poll is even worse ... :|
:thumbsdown:

 

[Tempered81]

Whats the 5th option, apoppin?

edit: check out this post. Makes the most sense I've seen.

Originally posted by: Demoth
From an enthusiast point of view, this last several months has been boring. However, I like the trend of cheap near top end performance with lower power reqs. I also like seeing these companies focusing more on crossfire/sli.

Let's see some real performance out of the 9500GS levels and make CF/SLI a viable option for expandability for the budget gamer.

Right now, it is possible to mix and match ATI in a generation, so even a 3850, which could be selling for under $90 within the year, will give a noticeable improvement to the 3870X2. The future of this industry is to be able to swap in any new card in a multi-GPU solution while retaining the power from the previous purchased card.

Rumors on the late Q2 ATI HD 4000 series look promising. Fewer designs and more emphasis on crossfire means better drivers and faster driver fixes.

http://www.nordichardware.com/news,7356.html

All I have to say is don't worry too much about Nvidia. If they want to be lazy and rake in a few extra bucks by holding back R&D and design, they may just have to be spanked around a bit by the RV770 to be given a wake up call. And, wake up they will.

edit again:

@apoppin: sorry for the flamebait-nature of the poll. I mean for it to read like this:

1.Nvidia = bad, 9800gtx = good

2.Nvidia = good, 9800gtx = good

3.Nvidia = bad, 9800gtx = bad

4.Nvidia = good, 9800gtx = bad

 

[bryanW1995]

it doesn't matter if all you care about is single gpu. AMD has stated numerous times that r700 is going to multi-gpu. As long as they make the drivers work then it will be nice, if they don't then everyone will be back to nvidia.

edit: ah, you just posted about that. so mult gpu is ok now as long as it's amd?

 

[Rubycon]

Goodbye six month cycle... (it departed long ago)

Too bad - it used to be fun. WTH is Matrox up to these days? Are they developing a GPU?

 

[Rusin]

9600 GT = 87% of 8800 GT in DX9 (1600x1200 4xAA 16xAF)
9600 GT = 94% of 8800 GT in DX10 -''-
9800 GT = 105% of 8800 GT
9800 GTS = 104% of 8800 GTS 512
9800 GX2 = 135% of HD3870 X2

Last one could be understatement. Since 9600 GT SLI already beats HD3870 X2. I think it's Nvidia's first card that scales better than it's equivalent card [HD3870] from AMD..for some time at least.

 

[Rusin]

Originally posted by: Rubycon

Too bad - it used to be fun. WTH is Matrox up to these days? Are they developing a GPU?

Nothing for gaming markets.


Btw. there are now two manufacturers making DX10.1 chips before Nvidia..AMD is one, but the other one is S3. Though this card is not meant for gaming (htpc-monster with ultra low powerconsumption)..if that 64-bit mem bandwith indicates something.

 

[Syntax Error]

Originally posted by: jaredpace

Originally posted by: Syntax Error
There are diminishing returns in the upper end of Nvidia cards, if the 8-series were any indication. The Ultra wasn't THAT much better over the GTX. I would put the scale more towards this:

9600GT = 90% of 8800GT
9800GT = 125% of 8800GT
9800GX2 = 150% of 8800GT
9800GTX = 175% of 8800GT
9800GTX2 = 200% of 8800GT

what card is that?

I just copy-pasted the previous poster's list of future "cards", I suppose it would make sense that this "9800GTX2" would be something like a 9900 or whatever, as Nvidia seems to follow up on its x800 series after for some improvements or what-not.

In all honestness, the G92 cards (8800GT and the 8800GTS) should've been called "8900s" but I suppose it was a combination of name-brand recognition of the beast that was the 8800 series and to confuse buyers into buying older and outdated stock.

 

[n7]

Originally posted by: Rubycon

Originally posted by: jaredpace

Originally posted by: Rubycon
Intel is buying nvidia.

QWWAAAHHHHH?????

This changes everything. I feel like i am in the matrix

Yes it's the Dot Matrix. It has a huge impact on everything.

Ahaha

So corny yet i laughed :laugh:

 

[NinjaJedi]

Originally posted by: taltamir
AMD is just as quick to shaft you.. AMD, nVidia, Intel.... they all did their share of shafting... yes their tri-sli method right now is extra shafty... don't buy it.

It is kinda stupid of them, because the extra money they make from selling those few extra 8800 GTX cards doesn't make up for all those extra 8800GTS 512 and GT they would have sold to people wanting to tri SLI their rig...

Although maybe, just maybe, the reason is that they simply don't have the time and budget to make drivers for that (drivers being the biggest issue with multi GPU implementation) and thus limit it only to their fastest cards. Scaling in tri sli is pretty bad. And they are spending much too much time on optimizing it... time that should be spent designing a better GPU instead.

heh heh... he said shaft.

 

[Quiksilver]

Originally posted by: Syntax Error

Originally posted by: jaredpace

Originally posted by: Syntax Error
There are diminishing returns in the upper end of Nvidia cards, if the 8-series were any indication. The Ultra wasn't THAT much better over the GTX. I would put the scale more towards this:

9600GT = 90% of 8800GT
9800GT = 125% of 8800GT
9800GX2 = 150% of 8800GT
9800GTX = 175% of 8800GT
9800GTX2 = 200% of 8800GT

what card is that?

I just copy-pasted the previous poster's list of future "cards"

????

I didn't list a 9800GTX2...

 

[soccerballtux]

Originally posted by: sisq0kidd
Insightful thread. A++++++++++ WILL READ AGAIN!

Haha that made me laugh out loud

 

[kmmatney]

That site you linked to is awesome!! I finally get to see benchmarks to see how my overlocked 2900Pro compares to other cards. My overclock is about the same as the "HD 2900Pro OC 512 810/975" entry, a great card for $135.

 

[Soulkeeper]

none of them poll options work for me

nvidia sucks i'm getting a hd3870

 

[Syntax Error]

Originally posted by: Quiksilver

Originally posted by: Syntax Error

Originally posted by: jaredpace

Originally posted by: Syntax Error
There are diminishing returns in the upper end of Nvidia cards, if the 8-series were any indication. The Ultra wasn't THAT much better over the GTX. I would put the scale more towards this:

9600GT = 90% of 8800GT
9800GT = 125% of 8800GT
9800GX2 = 150% of 8800GT
9800GTX = 175% of 8800GT
9800GTX2 = 200% of 8800GT

what card is that?

I just copy-pasted the previous poster's list of future "cards"

????

I didn't list a 9800GTX2...

Originally posted by: Quiksilver

Originally posted by: taltamir
are you kidding me?
And the current release is their new budget card.. the 9600GT is competing with the 8600GT in price and intent (their naming) and is twice the performance for similar price... thats a GREAT start for the GF9...
Lets wait until the GTX is released before proclaiming it as good or bad... If it can maintain the trend the 9600 set then I would be happy. (twice the performance for similar price that is)

QFT.

Despite it being just another g92 core, we don't know what kind of performance tweaks will be happening behind the scenes on the 9800GTX. I said this in another thread when I stated my performance estimate; that it would be equal if not better than a 8800GTS 512 that is overclocked. Even if it does turn out to be that, it will still have those performance tweaks that will put it ahead and it will be cooler running (at least should be). Which means their will still be more headroom for you to overclock it more.

I mean I'm not expecting much out of this release either but if it happens to be less than $400 I'll take it over the 8800GTS 512 just because they will be within a small amount of each other ($50 to $100 [100 for price gouging e-tailers]).

I'm just kind of hoping ATI's 4000 series come out around the same time, not because I'm a ATI fanboy but because it will probably be within the same performance amount for cheaper.

Edit:

In a perfect world and going by how the 9600GT's performance was...

Guess 1)

9600GT = 75% of 8800GT
9800GT = 125% of 8800GT
9800GTX = 175% of 8800GT
9800GTX2 = 225% of 8800GT

Guess 2)

9600GT = 75% of 8800GT
9800GT = 150% of 8800GT
9800GTX = 225% of 8800GT
9800GTX2 = 300% of 8800GT

Guess 1 looks more realistic to me though.

Meh, doesn't really matter anyways, it's all wishful thinking at this point. :|

 

[Quiksilver]

Originally posted by: Syntax Error

Originally posted by: Quiksilver

Originally posted by: Syntax Error

Originally posted by: jaredpace

Originally posted by: Syntax Error
There are diminishing returns in the upper end of Nvidia cards, if the 8-series were any indication. The Ultra wasn't THAT much better over the GTX. I would put the scale more towards this:

9600GT = 90% of 8800GT
9800GT = 125% of 8800GT
9800GX2 = 150% of 8800GT
9800GTX = 175% of 8800GT
9800GTX2 = 200% of 8800GT

what card is that?

I just copy-pasted the previous poster's list of future "cards"

????

I didn't list a 9800GTX2...

Originally posted by: Quiksilver

Originally posted by: taltamir
are you kidding me?
And the current release is their new budget card.. the 9600GT is competing with the 8600GT in price and intent (their naming) and is twice the performance for similar price... thats a GREAT start for the GF9...
Lets wait until the GTX is released before proclaiming it as good or bad... If it can maintain the trend the 9600 set then I would be happy. (twice the performance for similar price that is)

QFT.

Despite it being just another g92 core, we don't know what kind of performance tweaks will be happening behind the scenes on the 9800GTX. I said this in another thread when I stated my performance estimate; that it would be equal if not better than a 8800GTS 512 that is overclocked. Even if it does turn out to be that, it will still have those performance tweaks that will put it ahead and it will be cooler running (at least should be). Which means their will still be more headroom for you to overclock it more.

I mean I'm not expecting much out of this release either but if it happens to be less than $400 I'll take it over the 8800GTS 512 just because they will be within a small amount of each other ($50 to $100 [100 for price gouging e-tailers]).

I'm just kind of hoping ATI's 4000 series come out around the same time, not because I'm a ATI fanboy but because it will probably be within the same performance amount for cheaper.

Edit:

In a perfect world and going by how the 9600GT's performance was...

Guess 1)

9600GT = 75% of 8800GT
9800GT = 125% of 8800GT
9800GTX = 175% of 8800GT
9800GTX2 = 225% of 8800GT

Guess 2)

9600GT = 75% of 8800GT
9800GT = 150% of 8800GT
9800GTX = 225% of 8800GT
9800GTX2 = 300% of 8800GT

Guess 1 looks more realistic to me though.

Meh, doesn't really matter anyways, it's all wishful thinking at this point. :|

Can I buy a pair of glasses off you? :laugh:

 

[Rusin]

Originally posted by: jaredpace

Originally posted by: BassBomb
Win what?

I hope they come out ahead with the R700 in single gpu competition versus the 9800gtx.

If they don't come ahead..then they are screwed with Nvidia's G100 that comes around same time.

 

[Apocalypse23]

i think it ultimately depends on the elite pc enthusiast that doesn't want to wait too long to get his rig. He would be considering the following thoughts:

1)I want to buy a great video card system to run Crysis at smooth framerates, atleast 30 fps average with 2x AA and 8 x AF at 1920x1080 on VERY HIGH. I want to be able to build this video card setup with either a 3 card SLI, 2 - 3 card Crossfire or a 4 way crossfire. If crossfire, then hell yes 4 way crossfire (it's cheaper than an nvidia setup). (THIS IS ALL ASSUMING THE CROSSFIRE DRIVERS ARE OUT AND THERE IS A 4 WAY OR 3 WAY CROSSFIRE MOBO OUT FOR THE INTEL CHIPSETS, LOL) . Anyway this elite enthusaist would already have a quad or dual core ocd to 4 ghz. So basically this tri SLI setup would be needed with the latest 9800 GTX's or higher, or an elite futureistic CROSSFIRE setup.

2)Whichever company (ATI or NVIDIA) releases the best video cards ASAP within 1 month I'll go for that, i can only wait about a month more for both companies to release their cards, then I am building my system. (SO WHICHEVER COMPANY RELEASES THEIR TOP END CARDS THE QUICKEST WILL ALSO PLAY A BIG FACTOR.) So Time plays as a factor.

Now for me as a eye candy guy, I have seen how demanding Crysis really is, now most of the other games out there run fine with the newer cards, except for Crysis which bleeds like crazy with the top line cards today. If there is a solution to smooth playable fps with very high settings and some AA and AF with Crysis with ANY video card setup, SLI or CRoSSFIRE, then i will hands down blow the cash on the the dream system.

 

[qbfx]

Originally posted by: Quiksilver

Originally posted by: Syntax Error
9800GTX2 = 150% of 8800GT

New card no one knows about yet?

Edit...

Arr.... quoted wrong card, damn auto-correctness of brain.

[...]

Guess 1)

9600GT = 75% of 8800GT
9800GT = 125% of 8800GT
9800GTX = 175% of 8800GT
9800GT2 = 225% of 8800GT

[...]

9800GT2 - New card no one knows about yet?

 

[nRollo]

People really make too much of naming conventions, parts should be purchased for the price/performance they offer in the current market.

Things like "well they should have offered a part with double top end performance for $50 by now, because it only took X months for card Y to launch" are faulty reasoning at best.

1. R&D time is different for every part, not like they can say "invent faster you slackers!".
2. Except for Crysis, the game only Jesus can run, how many people here are inconvenienced by current levels of performance? By that I mean you have games that can't be run on current hardware at your resolution 4X16X?

I'm sure NVIDIA wants to sell you parts and they are likely delivering them as fast as they can. They can't just say "Uh oh, ATi launched the 3870X2, we need to launch a part!"

 

[WelshBloke]

Hmmmmmmmm

 

[Rusin]

We have a balance

 

[nitromullet]

Originally posted by: nRollo
1. R&D time is different for every part, not like they can say "invent faster you slackers!".

How do you figure? That's pretty much the way R&D has been at every company I've worked for. Schedules driving development is most apparent at NVIDIA, which is the only reason for cutting them any slack on some of the crappy driver releases. Case in point, the 8800GTS 512MB has been out for almost two months, and the only WHQL driver (Vista x64) for it still doesn't support forcing AA via application profiles. You simply can not force AA options with the NVIDIA control panel except in the Global settings, but they brought the card to market right before Xmas.

I'm sure NVIDIA wants to sell you parts and they are likely delivering them as fast as they can. They can't just say "Uh oh, ATi launched the 3870X2, we need to launch a part!"

I'm sure they do too, but they don't just develop and launch with a complete disregard for what the competition is doing. I'm sure both companies "spy" and try to keep tabs on what the other is doing to tailor their R&D and launch efforts accordingly. It makes sense too, look at how much badmouthing NVIDIA is getting in exchange for launching the 8800GTX, which arguably offered performance ahead of its time and completely crushed the competition. Instead of crowning the 8800GTX the way people did (still do) the 9800Pro, people are bitching about NVIDIA's lack of ability to top the 8800GTX quick enough.

 

[v8envy]

Yup, sums it up. The people who bought 8800GTXes at launch are having their PCs apply for social security benefits. Beards popping out of cases, that sort of thing.

There hasn't been a high end card released in going on 2 years.

People have an unbearable upgrade itchies and wallets bursting with upgrade cash. They're cranky that they have nothing to spend it on. And the rumored products are slight refreshes of existing parts offering nowhere near the kind of compelling performance over 'last gen' parts enthusiasts have come to expect over the last 10 years.

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: v8envy
Yup, sums it up. The people who bought 8800GTXes at launch are having their PCs apply for social security benefits. Beards popping out of cases, that sort of thing.

There hasn't been a high end card released in going on 2 years.

People have an unbearable upgrade itchies and wallets bursting with upgrade cash. They're cranky that they have nothing to spend it on. And the rumored products are slight refreshes of existing parts offering nowhere near the kind of compelling performance over 'last gen' parts enthusiasts have come to expect over the last 10 years.

surely you exaggerate
- in 9 months it will be "going on 2 years"
:clock:
... and more nonsense ... those people already have SLi and tr-Sli

and those rumors are ... rumors ... no one has any idea what r700 will be really like

 

[Tempered81]

Radeon HD Shaders Core(s) VRAM GFLOPS Frequency (MHz)
4870X2 2x480 2xRV770 1GB GDDR5 2016 1050/1800
4870 480 RV770 1GB GDDR5 1008 1050/2200
4850 480 RV770 512MB GDDR5 816 850/1800
4670 240 RV740 512MB GDDR4 480 1000/1200
4650 240 RV740 256MB GDDR4 384 800/1000
4470 40 RV710 256MB GDDR3 - 900/800
4450 40 RV710 128MB GDDR2 - 700/500



--
RV770 will break 1TFLOPS, while the R700, with two RV770, should be capable of twice that, more than 2TFLOPS. This is higher than what he had expected, but then again the core frequencies are also higher than expected. All cores are made by TSMC and their 55nm process. We're still trying to hunt down more reliable information on the design of the "core".
--
The idle power consumptions of all cards are extremely low and even the dual-core Radeon HD 4870X2 will consume less than 25W when idle.
--
The number of TMUs have finally been increased, actually doubled, to 32 with RV770, while RV740 sports 24 TMUs, and the low-end RV710 has 8 TMUs
--
To end this long and speculative post, we would like to say that if not all, most of the variables here are subject to change and should be considered with a "tiny" pinch of salt. We're still 4 month away from the launch.


even with all this info/speculation you still don't know what it's like in games.