NVIDIA 9800GTX+ Review Thread

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: bryanW1995

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: munky

Originally posted by: Wreckage

Originally posted by: Spartan Niner


You do realize that AMD has made their cards on 55nm since the 38xx series, right? From the AnandTech preview article:

You do realize that the 4850 runs 25% hotter than a standard GTX right?

So, I'm not sure what your point is.

I also realize the 9800gtx runs 10dB louder, which puts the whole cooler/quieter thing in a different perspective.

If you ran the 4850's fan where it's supposed to be to adequately cool it, i guarantee that would change. According to the article you linked to, how high would you need to run the 4850 fan to get it from 68C to 48.7C. A 20C drop. Check the noise then.

They should have just made the reference cards with Dual slot coolers. Charge 15 bux more. Big deal. That would have been preferable to a single slot cooler that can barely do the job. And look how small that fan is. That annoys me. I felt the same way about the 8800GT's with that single slot cooler and super tiny fan.

When I fold on my 3870 I have to bump my fan up from 37% (80c +) to 42 % (69c). you should soon (if not now) be able to manually set your 4850 fan in rivatuner to an acceptable level with something significantly less than a 10db penalty.

having said that, we definitely agree on our feelings about that horrible fan on both 4850 and 8800gt. :thumbsdown: to both teams on that call :|

Doesn't your 3870 has a dual slot cooler though? Raising fan speed will have a better effect than a single slot. Or even if you have one of those vendors who use their own unique cooling solutions. Like HIS, or ASUS. There is that much more air, and more metal square area to run the air over.

 

[Wreckage]

Originally posted by: bryanW1995


having said that, we definitely agree on our feelings about that horrible fan on both 4850 and 8800gt. :thumbsdown: to both teams on that call :|

Looking at newegg there are at least 3 or 4 different fan types offered on various models of the 8800GT including a passive heatsink.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...A=0&Description=8800GT

ASUS Glaciator Fansink - Ultra cool and quiet 25 dB

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: Wreckage

Originally posted by: bryanW1995


having said that, we definitely agree on our feelings about that horrible fan on both 4850 and 8800gt. :thumbsdown: to both teams on that call :|

Looking at newegg there are at least 3 or 4 different fan types offered on various models of the 8800GT including a passive heatsink.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...A=0&Description=8800GT

ASUS Glaciator Fansink - Ultra cool and quiet 25 dB

We are talking reference models here. And talking about when the 8800GT was first released. Much the same as this newly released HD4850. In time, vendors will surely offer improved cooling/dual slot cooling just as some have done with the 8800GT.

 

[Mem]

Originally posted by: Wreckage
Considering how hot the 4850 runs at this may be a much better option for people.

Trade off both ways,I'm sure some people hate a two slot design in general ie 9800GTX +,also you can bet there will be better cooling systems/solutions for the 4850 soon enough from some of their partners.


I'm still leaning towards AMD/ATi at the moment,using some of their older video cards from both companies makes me neutral,some things I really like about AMD/ATi like their driver support,some things I hate about Nvidia,in the end its all Pros and Cons when you can right down to it.

 

[Denithor]

Originally posted by: bryanW1995
Having said that, we definitely agree on our feelings about that horrible fan on both 4850 and 8800gt. :thumbsdown: to both teams on that call :|

I agree 100% and think that maybe the days of the single-slot cooler are limited.

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: tuteja1986
http://www.computerbase.de/art...v770/#abschnitt_prolog


Unreal Tournament 3 1600x1200 4xAA/16xAF:
GTX 280 : 145
HD4850 : 65
9800GTX : 81

Unreal Tournament 3 1600x1200 8xAA/16xAF:
GTX 280 : 72
HD4850 : 63
9800GTX : 34

Lost planet 1600x1200 4xAA/16xAF:
GTX 280 : 58
HD4850 : 31
9800GTX : 34

Lost planet 1600x1200 8xAA/16xAF:
GTX 280 : 45
HD4850 : 29
9800GTX : 24


Company of heroes 1600x1200 8xAA/16xAF
GTX 280 : 84
HD4850 : 46
9800GTX : 47

Company of heroes 1600x1200 8xAA/16xAF
GTX 280 : 66
HD4850 : 42
9800GTX : 35


No wonder Nvidia is happy that everyone benchmark games in 4xAA , look at huge drop for nvidia card soon you go to 8xAA. ATI only looses few FPS :!

Umm Tut? I just benched Lost planet at 1600x1200 at 8xAA and 16xAF.
Snow Average framerate was 75, and Cave Average framerate was 76.

What am I doing wrong? Computerbase shows 45fps on a GTX280. Whats up?

There are a lot of AA options in this game. Wow. I could do 3 types of 8xAA.
Theres 8xAA, C8xAA, C8xQAA. Same thing for 16x. Pretty cool.

One other question. How is Computerbase using a 1xAA setting in most games here? I don't see that option in Lost Planet either in the game settings, nor the NV control panel.
Any thoughts?

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: Mem

Originally posted by: Wreckage
Considering how hot the 4850 runs at this may be a much better option for people.

Trade off both ways,I'm sure some people hate a two slot design in general ie 9800GTX +,also you can bet there will be better cooling systems/solutions for the 4850 soon enough from some of their partners.


I'm still leaning towards AMD/ATi at the moment,using some of their older video cards from both companies makes me neutral,some things I really like about AMD/ATi like their driver support,some things I hate about Nvidia,in the end its all Pros and Cons when you can right down to it.

I'm not against single slot coolers. Some folks require them, especially those with SFF rigs.
But for the most part, I don't like single slot coolers that are borderline cutting it. Where you actually have to worry about the temps getting too high. Not only do they not cool efficiently, but do not exhaust any air out of the case. Getting even "some" of that air out of the case is better than none. These days, unless your rig "requires" a single slot cooler, there is no reason to want one just out of preference when it doesn't hinder you one way or the other.

 

[imaheadcase]

Originally posted by: ElFenix
meh, watts matters more than raw temperature.

I thought it was speed of card that mattered most.. When you fork over $300+ for a video card, temp and voltage are the least of your concern. If they are a concern for you, you should not be spending that much for a card.

 

[Mem]

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: Mem

Originally posted by: Wreckage
Considering how hot the 4850 runs at this may be a much better option for people.

Trade off both ways,I'm sure some people hate a two slot design in general ie 9800GTX +,also you can bet there will be better cooling systems/solutions for the 4850 soon enough from some of their partners.


I'm still leaning towards AMD/ATi at the moment,using some of their older video cards from both companies makes me neutral,some things I really like about AMD/ATi like their driver support,some things I hate about Nvidia,in the end its all Pros and Cons when you can right down to it.

I'm not against single slot coolers. Some folks require them, especially those with SFF rigs.
But for the most part, I don't like single slot coolers that are borderline cutting it. Where you actually have to worry about the temps getting too high. Not only do they not cool efficiently, but do not exhaust any air out of the case. Getting even "some" of that air out of the case is better than none. These days, unless your rig "requires" a single slot cooler, there is no reason to want one just out of preference when it doesn't hinder you one way or the other.

I see your point,however in my case I have plenty of internal case cooling,I just hate bulky hardware in general,I guess we can thank Nvidia's famous dustblower for how popular the two slot design has become,as too two slot solution I would probably go with 4870 ,however we have yet to see some real benchmarks at this time.

I wonder how long before we see 3 slot design then 4 slot design for a single card,scarey

 

[thilanliyan]

Originally posted by: Wreckage
Considering how hot the 4850 runs at this may be a much better option for people.

Yes because the hotter the card the slower it runs right? :disgust:

 

[allies]

Originally posted by: Wreckage
Wow it pretty much stomps the 4850 especially in DX10. Crysis is a huge gap.

It's a 55nm chip so it should be a lot cooler than the 4850 which is pretty much the hottest running chip you can buy.

Still these are "preview numbers". Techreport said they got a card today for testing, so I'm sure more will show up.

Put the 4850's cooler on the 9800GTX+ and see how cool it runs.... my estimate is ambient temperature because it will fail after 10 minutes.

 

[allies]

Originally posted by: chizow

Originally posted by: ElFenix
meh, watts matters more than raw temperature.

The 9800GTX+ should win both as its now on a 55nm process as well and was only drawing 10W more under load at 65nm process. As for temps there is no doubt the 9800GTX+ will be MUCH cooler while the 3850 is borderline fire hazard. The 9800GTX/GTX 200 coolers are simply amazing.

Fire hazard? LMAO. Were you saying this when the 8800GTs were pushing 90C?

 

[Wreckage]

Originally posted by: allies


Put the 4850's cooler on the 9800GTX+ and see how cool it runs.... my estimate is ambient temperature because it will fail after 10 minutes.

Put the 4850 on the sun and...... :roll:

The 4850 is the hottest graphics card out now. Your comment is without merit.

There are plenty of people concerned with too much heat in their computer, do a search about it sometime.

 

[allies]

Originally posted by: Wreckage

Originally posted by: allies


Put the 4850's cooler on the 9800GTX+ and see how cool it runs.... my estimate is ambient temperature because it will fail after 10 minutes.

Put the 4850 on the sun and...... :roll:

The 4850 is the hottest graphics card out now. Your comment is without merit.

I'll agree with that (along with reference cooled 8800GTs). But what you first said was "chip". You gotta bone up on your semantics.

 

[Mem]

Originally posted by: Wreckage

Originally posted by: allies


Put the 4850's cooler on the 9800GTX+ and see how cool it runs.... my estimate is ambient temperature because it will fail after 10 minutes.

Put the 4850 on the sun and...... :roll:

The 4850 is the hottest graphics card out now. Your comment is without merit.

There are plenty of people concerned with too much heat in their computer, do a search about it sometime.

Don't forget noise too,that also concerns me regardless of manufacturer.

Apparently the cooler of the MSI Radeon HD 4850 is slightly better than the one installed on the Powercolor HD 4850. It delivers a bit lower temperatures which means that the fan can run quieter. Also it is a possibility that another fan is used which produces a tiny bit less noise. Or the thermal paste is just applied better and the heatsinks are perfectly identical in performance. This would also mean a lower GPU temperature, resulting in less fan noise.

Link, quote taken from near the bottom of page.

 

[bryanW1995]

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: bryanW1995

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: munky

Originally posted by: Wreckage

Originally posted by: Spartan Niner


You do realize that AMD has made their cards on 55nm since the 38xx series, right? From the AnandTech preview article:

You do realize that the 4850 runs 25% hotter than a standard GTX right?

So, I'm not sure what your point is.

I also realize the 9800gtx runs 10dB louder, which puts the whole cooler/quieter thing in a different perspective.

If you ran the 4850's fan where it's supposed to be to adequately cool it, i guarantee that would change. According to the article you linked to, how high would you need to run the 4850 fan to get it from 68C to 48.7C. A 20C drop. Check the noise then.

They should have just made the reference cards with Dual slot coolers. Charge 15 bux more. Big deal. That would have been preferable to a single slot cooler that can barely do the job. And look how small that fan is. That annoys me. I felt the same way about the 8800GT's with that single slot cooler and super tiny fan.

When I fold on my 3870 I have to bump my fan up from 37% (80c +) to 42 % (69c). you should soon (if not now) be able to manually set your 4850 fan in rivatuner to an acceptable level with something significantly less than a 10db penalty.

having said that, we definitely agree on our feelings about that horrible fan on both 4850 and 8800gt. :thumbsdown: to both teams on that call :|

Doesn't your 3870 has a dual slot cooler though? Raising fan speed will have a better effect than a single slot. Or even if you have one of those vendors who use their own unique cooling solutions. Like HIS, or ASUS. There is that much more air, and more metal square area to run the air over.

no doubt that is correct. you might have to go to, say, 47% or 50% to get "reasonable" temps on the 4850. That would still be much quieter than the 9800gtx (+). As I've stated several times recently (and when I purchased the 3870), I personally would not want a single slot cooling solution on ANY performance card. on my 6600gt, sure, ok, but for a 4850 or 8800gt I would just hold out for a nice dual slot solution or at LEAST consider a card with a zalman or something similar on it. As a worst case scenario I would buy a stock unit and immediately put an aftermarket cooler on it. For some people who don't go for massive cpu overclocks on quads a stock 4850 or 8800gt is probably acceptable, just for me it's worth paying a few $$ more to get better cooling.

Phew. Having gone through all that, it's tough to ignore the 110w tdp of the 4850. I frankly have never looked at 9800gtx, but my understanding is that it has an 8 pin pci-e connector so I'm fairly certain that it dissipates much more heat than the 4850. The 9800gtx+ at 55nm will certainly be better.

Keys & Rollo: please go bitch-slap somebody at nvidia marketing for me. WHY CAN'T THEY JUST CALL THE 55NM REFRESH THE 9900GTX????? Ok, I feel better now. If they just hired nemesis away from daamit then I understand what they're doing, if not then I feel that there is still some hope that they're open to new ideas like "reason" or "simplicity".

 

[bryanW1995]

dp

 

[SlowSpyder]

Originally posted by: Wreckage

Originally posted by: allies


Put the 4850's cooler on the 9800GTX+ and see how cool it runs.... my estimate is ambient temperature because it will fail after 10 minutes.

Put the 4850 on the sun and...... :roll:

The 4850 is the hottest graphics card out now. Your comment is without merit.

There are plenty of people concerned with too much heat in their computer, do a search about it sometime.

What does it matter what temp the GPU is at, if it is within spec?

 

[AzN]

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: tuteja1986
http://www.computerbase.de/art...v770/#abschnitt_prolog


Unreal Tournament 3 1600x1200 4xAA/16xAF:
GTX 280 : 145
HD4850 : 65
9800GTX : 81

Unreal Tournament 3 1600x1200 8xAA/16xAF:
GTX 280 : 72
HD4850 : 63
9800GTX : 34

Lost planet 1600x1200 4xAA/16xAF:
GTX 280 : 58
HD4850 : 31
9800GTX : 34

Lost planet 1600x1200 8xAA/16xAF:
GTX 280 : 45
HD4850 : 29
9800GTX : 24


Company of heroes 1600x1200 8xAA/16xAF
GTX 280 : 84
HD4850 : 46
9800GTX : 47

Company of heroes 1600x1200 8xAA/16xAF
GTX 280 : 66
HD4850 : 42
9800GTX : 35


No wonder Nvidia is happy that everyone benchmark games in 4xAA , look at huge drop for nvidia card soon you go to 8xAA. ATI only looses few FPS :!

Umm Tut? I just benched Lost planet at 1600x1200 at 8xAA and 16xAF.
Snow Average framerate was 75, and Cave Average framerate was 76.

What am I doing wrong? Computerbase shows 45fps on a GTX280. Whats up?

There are a lot of AA options in this game. Wow. I could do 3 types of 8xAA.
Theres 8xAA, C8xAA, C8xQAA. Same thing for 16x. Pretty cool.

One other question. How is Computerbase using a 1xAA setting in most games here? I don't see that option in Lost Planet either in the game settings, nor the NV control panel.
Any thoughts?

You might be using CSAA instead of MSAA.

 

[tuteja1986]

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: tuteja1986
http://www.computerbase.de/art...v770/#abschnitt_prolog


Unreal Tournament 3 1600x1200 4xAA/16xAF:
GTX 280 : 145
HD4850 : 65
9800GTX : 81

Unreal Tournament 3 1600x1200 8xAA/16xAF:
GTX 280 : 72
HD4850 : 63
9800GTX : 34

Lost planet 1600x1200 4xAA/16xAF:
GTX 280 : 58
HD4850 : 31
9800GTX : 34

Lost planet 1600x1200 8xAA/16xAF:
GTX 280 : 45
HD4850 : 29
9800GTX : 24


Company of heroes 1600x1200 8xAA/16xAF
GTX 280 : 84
HD4850 : 46
9800GTX : 47

Company of heroes 1600x1200 8xAA/16xAF
GTX 280 : 66
HD4850 : 42
9800GTX : 35


No wonder Nvidia is happy that everyone benchmark games in 4xAA , look at huge drop for nvidia card soon you go to 8xAA. ATI only looses few FPS :!

Umm Tut? I just benched Lost planet at 1600x1200 at 8xAA and 16xAF.
Snow Average framerate was 75, and Cave Average framerate was 76.

What am I doing wrong? Computerbase shows 45fps on a GTX280. Whats up?

There are a lot of AA options in this game. Wow. I could do 3 types of 8xAA.
Theres 8xAA, C8xAA, C8xQAA. Same thing for 16x. Pretty cool.

One other question. How is Computerbase using a 1xAA setting in most games here? I don't see that option in Lost Planet either in the game settings, nor the NV control panel.
Any thoughts?

How is Computerbase using a 1xAA setting in most games here?

IF you don't answer of that question, then i feel sorry for nvidia hiring you as focus member.

1X anti-aliasing means no anti-aliasing. The multiplier number generally refers to the number of samples used to generate each output pixel.

There are a lot of AA options in this game. Wow. I could do 3 types of 8xAA. Theres 8xAA, C8xAA, C8xQAA. Same thing for 16x. Pretty cool.

ATI also have different type of AA option. But their huge difference techniques used. MSAA being the best.

Lost planet 1600x1200 1xAA/1xAF:
GTX 280 : 77
HD4850 : 33
9800GTX : 44

Lost planet 1600x1200 4xAA/16xAF:
GTX 280 : 58
HD4850 : 31
9800GTX : 34

Lost planet 1600x1200 8xAA/16xAF:
GTX 280 : 45
HD4850 : 29
9800GTX : 24

Firingsquad
Lost planet DX10 1600x1200x32 4xAA 16xAF
9800GTX : 27.8
4850 : 22.3

As for your benchmarking. I really don't know... maybe you aren't using MSAA ? also computerbase doesn't do usually use stock benchmarking because they know ATI and Nvidia can use driver cheat to get a higher score.

 

[DaveSimmons]

Power usage is up with the 9800GTX+ according to PC Perspective

D'oh!

At least the reference GTX+ uses a dual-slot cooler instead of the case heater of the reference 4850.

 

[Piano Man]

Originally posted by: DaveSimmons
Power usage is up with the 9800GTX+ according to PC Perspective

D'oh!

At least the reference GTX+ uses a dual-slot cooler instead of the case heater of the reference 4850.

Yea, at this point I really want to like the ATI card, but I'm not about to install a vid card that doesn't directly exhaust air out the back of the case. I really hope some after market coolers come out for ATI, ASAP.

 

[AzN]

Originally posted by: Piano Man

Originally posted by: DaveSimmons
Power usage is up with the 9800GTX+ according to PC Perspective

D'oh!

At least the reference GTX+ uses a dual-slot cooler instead of the case heater of the reference 4850.

Yea, at this point I really want to like the ATI card, but I'm not about to install a vid card that doesn't directly exhaust air out the back of the case. I really hope some after market coolers come out for ATI, ASAP.

Just say you don't like ATI cards. No need to make excuse.

 

[error8]

Originally posted by: Piano Man

Originally posted by: DaveSimmons
Power usage is up with the 9800GTX+ according to PC Perspective

D'oh!

At least the reference GTX+ uses a dual-slot cooler instead of the case heater of the reference 4850.

Yea, at this point I really want to like the ATI card, but I'm not about to install a vid card that doesn't directly exhaust air out the back of the case. I really hope some after market coolers come out for ATI, ASAP.

Actually there are very few cards that have a cooler exhausting the hot air outside the case. ALL aftermarket coolers (most efficient ones) are spitting the hot air inside the case, so really, I think you just hate ATI.

 

[bryanW1995]

there are many non-reference coolers available today for 3850, I think that's what he meant. I agree that an aftermarket cooling solution that still vents the hot air into the case is no desirable. I recommend waiting until you can buy a 4850 with a dual slot cooler. remember that msi 8800gt OC edition with the dual slot cooler? That thing had a HUGE number of sales, I think that it might have even beaten the evga reference card.