NPR Boss Who Fired Juan Williams Resigns (Under pressure from board)

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Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
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OMG YOU'RE RIGHT! In 08 the UN President totally thought Gordon Brown was a communist!

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/politics/article2641823.ece
(well atleast times uk did)

PS red can also mean stop, as in don't cross this line.

If you google the phrase "red line in the sand", at least on the first page, the ONLY one item using the phrase is the one you linked. I've never heard the phrase.

So, the assumption for my point is that 'red' has the normal meaning, used millions of times in "red-baiting" (get the name? red?).

However, the fact it was even used ONCE, and the lack of one other reference to it on google, suggests MAYBE it has another meaning I haven't heard.

If that's the case, I'd withdraw that point.

My point about the rest of his comments - which in that case made it unfortunate to use 'red' as an example - remain.

Just for one, to replace 'red', "She had an executioner's knife" is no better than her saying he should not air his 'fear of Muslims' with the phrase, obviously meant as a sayind and not literally, that he should 'keep his fear of Muslims to himself' and his psychiatrist, meaning the psychiatrist is where you discuss irrational fears - not accusing Williams of being 'crazy', as liars hyped the comment into, dishonestly. And note it was Williams himself who was not advocating people to fear Muslims.

Indeed, anyone who attacks Williams as 'anti-Muslim' for these comments I think is also exaggerating their attacks.

It's many other things he's done, as laid out in later comments she made, that are the problem.

His comments on this - hyperbolic - sound like any other right-wing propagandist. But he knows where he gets paid a lot better. Blood money - guess that's 'red', eh?
 

Tom

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
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Try googling
thin red line
Big Red one.

You can refer to Juan Williams as a right wing propogandist if you want; if you had any credibilty to lose it would only affect that; no rational person could read anything Williams ever wrote or listen to anything he's ever said and come to that conclusion.
 

JD50

Lifer
Sep 4, 2005
11,925
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Apparently in Craigs world stop signs are meant to stop communists from crossing an intersection.
 

Bowfinger

Lifer
Nov 17, 2002
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If you google the phrase "red line in the sand", at least on the first page, the ONLY one item using the phrase is the one you linked. I've never heard the phrase.

So, the assumption for my point is that 'red' has the normal meaning, used millions of times in "red-baiting" (get the name? red?).

However, the fact it was even used ONCE, and the lack of one other reference to it on google, suggests MAYBE it has another meaning I haven't heard.

If that's the case, I'd withdraw that point. ...
Other possibilities I could see include journalism editing -- you red-line copy when you mark changes -- or perhaps red as in Republican, he crossed from the blue, Democratic world to the red, Republican one. Then there's the classic literary "thin red line" referring to the forces defending a border or boundary. Who knows what he intended, but I wouldn't assume it was suggesting Communism.
 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
38,548
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Other possibilities I could see include journalism editing -- you red-line copy when you mark changes -- or perhaps red as in Republican, he crossed from the blue, Democratic world to the red, Republican one. Then there's the classic literary "thin red line" referring to the forces defending a border or boundary. Who knows what he intended, but I wouldn't assume it was suggesting Communism.

Yes, I'm open to the possibility that my first reaction - fueled by his hyperbole of her alleged left-wing extremism - that he was red-baiting her was wrong in that example.

In context, his remarks were at a level which seems a little different than his inventing the phrase 'red line in the sand' - he wasn't calling her a communist elsewhere.

At this point, whatever he meant, I suspect it wasn't to allege she was a communist - though Republican pundits are notorious for working in that sort of 'subtle attack implication', but even that he could not have meant in the comment - and so I suspend that one example, assuming he more than likely did not mean that.

But his comments sounding like any right-wing propagandist is still an issue.

It's a major right-wing propaganda myth about the 'liberal media', they justify lies with the myth that they're just 'countering' some left-wing media machine.

NPR IMO is much too 'soft' and 'neutral' at the expense of accuracy on Republican errors; I'm all for coverage that's fair and large of Republicans, but not for ignoring errors, falsehoods, etc. in the name of disproving that they're a 'liberal' source - an attack designed for only one purpose, to create cover for them to lie.

Anyone who points out their lies is 'liberal'. It's quite dishonest.

In contrast, if I made an error on the 'red line' interpretation - it was an error, and I'm more than happy to correct and withdraw it as an error, as I do when it happens.

Edit: I should probably explain how I reached the opinion that he meant it as red-baiting.

He was spewing a long standard right-wing attack of 'she's an extreme liberal, she's an extreme leftist, she's an extreme liberal', followed by the comment about his only error being that he did not fit her leftists politics, and she had a 'line in the sand' he as a person more to the right than her had crossed.

Except he didn't say 'line in the sand', he added 'red line'. Why? Since I haven't heard the phrase, and the entire point he was making was that her 'line' was one about liberal positions, he was saying she had a 'very liberal line in the sand'. So the use of the word 'red' to modify that liberal line could clearly be red-baiting. It's a close fit.

But as I say, looking at it again, as good a fit as it is, he doesn't cross the 'red line' himself of calling her 'commie' elsewhere, just very liberal, and it seems more likely than not he did not mean that. He did say a lot of other hyperbole in attacking her that is a little short of red-baiting, but still spreads the 'liberal media' myth.

Ironically, his comments are reported on Fox, which is a major propaganda outlet - making false attacks on a far better outlet for bias.
 
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Tom

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
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you know she fired him, right ?

you seem to fault him for being human. Who wouldn't take some satisfaction in seeing one's executioner head role ?
 

EagleKeeper

Discussion Club Moderator<br>Elite Member
Staff member
Oct 30, 2000
42,589
5
0
By the way, not to go over the old issue, but my reasons for supporting her action are not his comments in that incident, but the long pattern of voicing non left wing opinions.

Fixed for you

Not fixed - you are lying about my position. Which says a lot about your position that you have to lie about mine to make your case.[/QUOTE]

Your positions are that the left can do no wrong and the right is alwaysw a failure.

Anyone that challenges such is a liar.

With respect to the line there is the political difference that he loves to bring up but has overlooked

Blue vs Red
 

Throckmorton

Lifer
Aug 23, 2007
16,829
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Juan's crime was appearing on Fox as a liberal pundit, and contributing to NPR's "liberal" reputation. But Weiss and Schiller apparently affirmed it even more...


BTW, Schiller didn't get fired... She's the one who said he should take it up with his psychiatrist
 

piasabird

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
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We should just cut all funding for NPR. Seems like a good place to start cutting the budget.
 

halik

Lifer
Oct 10, 2000
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Good riddance. Now remove Democracy Now (?!?!) from the programming.
 

halik

Lifer
Oct 10, 2000
25,696
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Good Ridden, what happened and they way it happened was VERY wrong and they have worked towards correcting their mistake.
I am a loyal NPR listener, I spend atleast 2 to3 hours every day listening to it. I decided not to renew my membership after this incident. But for the last couple of months I noticed NPR starting to move to the center from far left, they started respecting Republicans coming to their show and other right wing ideas. They stopped mocking and dismissing everything Right. They have been trying to maintain the same attitude towards both right and felt. And now the firing/resignation, I am back on board with them now, I will continue to support NPR.

My sentiments exactly. I've been listening for the last decade or so and only last year or two the left slant was starting to become apparent.

For a long time NPR has been the one impartial source of good policy discourse (no, not the "debates" you see on tv) and they need to continue doing that.
 
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spidey07

No Lifer
Aug 4, 2000
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My sentiments exactly. I've been listening for the last decade or so and only last year or two the left slant was starting to become apparent.

For a long time NPR has been the one impartial source of good policy discourse (no, not the "debates" you see on tv) and they need to continue doing that.

Agree. They don't even try to hide the bias anymore. It's blatant.
 

Throckmorton

Lifer
Aug 23, 2007
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We should just cut all funding for NPR. Seems like a good place to start cutting the budget.

I agree that the federal government shouldn't fund NPR. It only sullies their journalistic integrity. It's only like 2% of their budget anyway...
 

halik

Lifer
Oct 10, 2000
25,696
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WTF does Democracy Now have to do with NPR? Have you been listening to Pacifica and thinking it's NPR?

One local NPR station was carrying it as part of their line up. It's like the anti-rush limbaugh show; can't stand that nonsense.
 

bfdd

Lifer
Feb 3, 2007
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Umm ... maybe girls and Republican Speakers. ;)
lol
Other possibilities I could see include journalism editing -- you red-line copy when you mark changes -- or perhaps red as in Republican, he crossed from the blue, Democratic world to the red, Republican one. Then there's the classic literary "thin red line" referring to the forces defending a border or boundary. Who knows what he intended, but I wouldn't assume it was suggesting Communism.

pretty much what I was getting at. If you think red = communist you're going to see him calling her a communist, that's what Craig did because he views Juan as an enemy and he needs to discredit his enemy. Craig obviously has never heard of what happens when you assume to much.
 

trenchfoot

Lifer
Aug 5, 2000
16,005
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Yep, anything (in the true sense of the word) that seemingly threatens the republican party and its agenda should be gotten rid of.

NPR=Acorn.

FOX=Fair and balanced.

Rush Limbuagh=Conservative Pillar of Truth and Integrity

Juan Williams=Completely innocent victim of liberal bias
 
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Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
38,548
350
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lol


pretty much what I was getting at. If you think red = communist you're going to see him calling her a communist, that's what Craig did because he views Juan as an enemy and he needs to discredit his enemy. Craig obviously has never heard of what happens when you assume to much.

No, you're a liar. (I guess that is because I'm your 'enemy' so you 'have to lie about me'.)

If something good about Williams is true, that's what I'll say. Something bad, the same.
 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
38,548
350
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Craig234 wrote:
Not fixed - you are lying about my position. Which says a lot about your position that you have to lie about mine to make your case.

Lie #1:
Your positions are that the left can do no wrong and the right is alwaysw a failure.

I think the left is far better than the right. It also does wrong, the and the right does right.

Lie #2:
Anyone that challenges such is a liar.

Most of the time, people who disagree - I'll use that instead of your version - are not lying.

Lying is a word to use carefully, for intentional or reckless disregard of the truth.

You fall under the 'reckless disregard for the truth' type of liar about my positions.
 

bfdd

Lifer
Feb 3, 2007
13,312
1
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No, you're a liar. (I guess that is because I'm your 'enemy' so you 'have to lie about me'.)

If something good about Williams is true, that's what I'll say. Something bad, the same.

So you pull him calling her a communist out of your ass and I'm the liar?