now is the best time ever for Nintendo to be prototyping a new system

[zerocool84]

I think mobile games have really cannibalized Nintendo's sales, even though nobody wants to admit it. The casual gamers came for the Wii, but moved on to smartphones. Now they play things like Candy Crush and Clash of Clans.

When you look at sales figures comparing the Wii U to the GameCube, they're very similar. Which means Nintendo didn't build any brand loyalty with the Wii. I think part of that is software. Once the initial novelty of Wii Sports wore off, a lot of people just let their systems collect dust. Simply because those people don't want to play Mario or Zelda. Those games are either too complicated for them, or take up too much time.

Nintendo's problem isn't their hardware. Rather it's the entire way they operate. Namely how slow they are to adapt to industry trends (online especially) and their over focus on the Japanese market.

Well their only gimmick this time hasn't panned out well. Less than a handful of games actually make decent use of the second screen on the controller. Other than that it's been relegated to map duty and playing games on the controller.

 

[ImpulsE69]

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/for...dcore-Casual-Gamers-Passive-Attitude-Pathetic

 

[Exophase]

Have you thought much about why the CPU cores are clocked as they are? It's because they have to fit eight of them next to a GPU that is by all means a lot bigger than SoC or even APU class, along with some other system stuff. Sony and MS both want a console that can be cooled cheaply, reliably, and without making too much noise. There are some real thermal barriers at work here.

Kind of ironic that you call this hypothetical Nintendo console killer SNES 2, seeing as how SNES had a terrible CPU for its time.

 

[Sonikku]

Nintendo seems to have a sort of royalty hubris. Who, now that the shit has hit the fan, is running around like a chicken with it's head cut off. Floundering, reaching desperately for life, but not having any idea how to get there after decades of traditionalist, inflexible thinking.

 

[mmntech]

Nintendo seems to have a sort of royalty hubris. Who, now that the shit has hit the fan, is running around like a chicken with it's head cut off. Floundering, reaching desperately for life, but not having any idea how to get there after decades of traditionalist, inflexible thinking.

They are the only surviving console maker from the 8-bit generation so they must be doing something right. The downward trend though really started way back with the N64. Especially when they insisted it use cartridges instead of CDs. Which was done less for technical reasons and more to throw a hissy fit at Sony for stealing their idea. While I still prefer the N64's library to the PlayStation, I feel it could have been better if developers had more space to work with. It shows just how inflexible they can be.

Nintendo had also built a long standing animosity with third parties which I think extends to this day. That's why they all bailed to the PlayStation, while N64 and GameCube saw very few third party games. The GCN also had the problem of being launched too late after the PS2, and once again space constraints on non-standard storage media caused problems.

The Wii was a fluke. It did bring something genuinely new to the table, motion control. Which attracted casual gamers who had never played a video game before. But as I said, it failed to keep them. I also feel that the Wii's library was much weaker than its predecessors, and a lot of Nintendo fans moved on because they weren't making the kind of games they wanted. Especially ones with traditional control.

Nintendo did have a very strong showing at E3 this year. Now they've just got to deliver on their promises. I think the Wii U has the potential to be a great system. However, it shares a lot of the same issues the Vita does IMO. A slow stream of games combined with a company that doesn't seem to be 100% dedicated to it. They just need to start making the right kind of games for it, as well as attracting developers from outside Japan.

 

[smackababy]

Kind of ironic that you call this hypothetical Nintendo console killer SNES 2, seeing as how SNES had a terrible CPU for its time.

The SNES CPU was genius. It was slow on it's own, but Nintendo understood regardless of how fast they made it, it would be obsolete in a couple years anyway. However, the allowed it to be able to interface with coprocessors included on the game cartridge. Super FX was probably the most well known. Such a great idea!

 

[Exophase]

The SNES CPU was genius. It was slow on it's own, but Nintendo understood regardless of how fast they made it, it would be obsolete in a couple years anyway. However, the allowed it to be able to interface with coprocessors included on the game cartridge. Super FX was probably the most well known. Such a great idea!

The expansions of the SNES have nothing at all to do with the CPU. That's an innovation allowed by a common (reasonably fast) external bus. Which was the case for pretty much every system using cartridges.

And lots of systems got expansions. Atari 2600 and NES both got bank switchers and audio chips. Genesis got entire new systems growing out of the cart port. Or if you want an SNES-style processor on a cart, Virtua Racing with the SVP processor.

The only reason SNES got so many more add-on processor games was because its CPU sucked. And the game makers took the extra cost on the chin for each and every game.

 

[mmntech]

Blast processing FTW. Lol.

I think if Nintendo were to build a new console, they really need to get rid of the PowerPC. Espresso is basically a tripled up G3 with a die shrink. Very similar to the ones used in the Wii and GameCube. Nobody uses those chips anymore. Even Apple had the good sense to switch to x86.

ARM would probably be a good choice for them since TV top and handheld would share a common programming language. Would also make it significantly easier to program for. Custom Tegra with more powerful GPU would work nicely.

Or, just adopt x86 chips like Microsoft and Sony did. Would make cross porting games very straight forward.

 

[futurefields]

Have you thought much about why the CPU cores are clocked as they are? It's because they have to fit eight of them...

yes I know, that's the problem

they went with more cores

 

[Exophase]

yes I know, that's the problem

they went with more cores

Which for game consoles is the better tradeoff. If you can utilize the cores well you will get more throughput for the same power budget with more cores. It also lets them partition out a core or two for system stuff which console makers like to do because it's low overhead and doesn't interfere with the compute time partitioning balance.

Suffice it to say, they probably understand what works better for games than you do.

 

[smackababy]

yes I know, that's the problem

they went with more cores

Because, the obvious answer is more megahertz! It is like you missed an entire generation of processor wars...

 

[ImpulsE69]

Did anyone read the article? The stance has completely changed...but it doesn't make sense because if they want to capture hardcore audiences these days they need power. That's practically all anyone cares about anymore unless you are a uber gamer, which is such a small percentage they'd still lose money. I just don't see them doing it, they are too stuck in their culture. Also, until they get away from trying to "innovate" controllers every iteration, they will not capture many hard core gamers. They also need a broader selection of games. Sure people love Mario and Zelda, but come on....

 

[mmntech]

Did anyone read the article? The stance has completely changed...but it doesn't make sense because if they want to capture hardcore audiences these days they need power. That's practically all anyone cares about anymore unless you are a uber gamer, which is such a small percentage they'd still lose money. I just don't see them doing it, they are too stuck in their culture. Also, until they get away from trying to "innovate" controllers every iteration, they will not capture many hard core gamers. They also need a broader selection of games. Sure people love Mario and Zelda, but come on....

That's why they need to be buying up more studios. Nintendo is becoming a bit of a one trick pony. I get the feeling that NoA is probably screaming everything mentioned here at NoJ, but it's falling on deaf ears.

 

[cmdrdredd]

That's why they need to be buying up more studios. Nintendo is becoming a bit of a one trick pony. I get the feeling that NoA is probably screaming everything mentioned here at NoJ, but it's falling on deaf ears.

Cause they need to go through a translator and don't get an answer for a week by which time Sony already bought the studio or MS paid $25,000,000 to get the games as exclusive lol

 

[Bman123]

Why don't they just sell out their library to Sony or MS and be done with it? Take the money and run. Keep your handhelds which do good and give up on making consoles. I'd enjoy Mario on xbone or ps4 a lot more then a Wii u

 

[mmntech]

Cause they need to go through a translator and don't get an answer for a week by which time Sony already bought the studio or MS paid $25,000,000 to get the games as exclusive lol

Lol. Nintendo is becoming such a dinosaur though, it's not even funny any more. Look at their recent news about the "NEW" 3DS.

 

[MeldarthX]

They are the only surviving console maker from the 8-bit generation so they must be doing something right. The downward trend though really started way back with the N64. Especially when they insisted it use cartridges instead of CDs. Which was done less for technical reasons and more to throw a hissy fit at Sony for stealing their idea. While I still prefer the N64's library to the PlayStation, I feel it could have been better if developers had more space to work with. It shows just how inflexible they can be.

Nintendo had also built a long standing animosity with third parties which I think extends to this day. That's why they all bailed to the PlayStation, while N64 and GameCube saw very few third party games. The GCN also had the problem of being launched too late after the PS2, and once again space constraints on non-standard storage media caused problems.

The Wii was a fluke. It did bring something genuinely new to the table, motion control. Which attracted casual gamers who had never played a video game before. But as I said, it failed to keep them. I also feel that the Wii's library was much weaker than its predecessors, and a lot of Nintendo fans moved on because they weren't making the kind of games they wanted. Especially ones with traditional control.

Nintendo did have a very strong showing at E3 this year. Now they've just got to deliver on their promises. I think the Wii U has the potential to be a great system. However, it shares a lot of the same issues the Vita does IMO. A slow stream of games combined with a company that doesn't seem to be 100% dedicated to it. They just need to start making the right kind of games for it, as well as attracting developers from outside Japan.

Wait what?!?! Lets try real history. PS1; was supposed to be Nin next console; something happened; *Sony says Nin backed out of the deal at last minute* *Nin says Sony wanted too much money for it* Nin backed out and brought out N64........Sony did all this research; said fine....screw you Nintendo we'll bring out our own console. Nintendo is at times their own worst enemy....

 

[cmdrdredd]

Wait what?!?! Lets try real history. PS1; was supposed to be Nin next console; something happened; *Sony says Nin backed out of the deal at last minute* *Nin says Sony wanted too much money for it* Nin backed out and brought out N64........Sony did all this research; said fine....screw you Nintendo we'll bring out our own console. Nintendo is at times their own worst enemy....

The PlayStation was supposed to be an add on to the SNES but the price was considered too high and CD technology not really ready. Just imagine if Nintendo kept going with it, all the PlayStation games would have been Nintendo's property most likely and Zelda, metroid, Mario etc would have been HD for 7 years now. If the partnership worked out we could have potentially been playing Zelda on ps4 now.

 

[smackababy]

Just imagine if Nintendo kept going with it, all the PlayStation games would have been Nintendo's property most likely and Zelda, metroid, Mario etc would have been HD for 7 years now. If the partnership worked out we could have potentially been playing Zelda on ps4 now.

Doubtful. Had the SNES CD emerged, it would have been similar to the Sega CD and largely irrelevant. It would have cost Nintento and Sony a ton of money and Sony would have stayed out of the console game. That would leave Nintendo as the sole console maker after Sega folded. Bad news for console gaming. MS might have never even entered the realm either. Truly one console to rule them all. We'd still get the gimmicky crap Nintendo loves to pull, but we'd get even fewer third party developers and less good games.

 

[cmdrdredd]

Doubtful. Had the SNES CD emerged, it would have been similar to the Sega CD and largely irrelevant. It would have cost Nintento and Sony a ton of money and Sony would have stayed out of the console game. That would leave Nintendo as the sole console maker after Sega folded. Bad news for console gaming. MS might have never even entered the realm either. Truly one console to rule them all. We'd still get the gimmicky crap Nintendo loves to pull, but we'd get even fewer third party developers and less good games.

Not sure about that..look at what Sony did with the PlayStation. That could have been Sony + nintendo but we will never know.

 

[smackababy]

Not sure about that..look at what Sony did with the PlayStation. That could have been Sony + nintendo but we will never know.

I am basing my entire idea off of console add-ons generally not selling well. Sega did almost exactly what it sounded like Nintendo was trying to achieve with Sony in the Sega CD. And, for all purposes, that failed miserably. But, who knows, it could have ended up giving us a wonderful Nintendo system. I just don't have all that much faith in the idea though.

 

[cmdrdredd]

If it had as much support as the PlayStation enjoyed and had the capabilities of the PlayStation maybe it could have been something.

 

[zerocool84]

Yea add-ons normally don't do well so it's good that the deal fell through with Sony and Nintendo.

 

[mmntech]

The PlayStation was supposed to be an add on to the SNES but the price was considered too high and CD technology not really ready. Just imagine if Nintendo kept going with it, all the PlayStation games would have been Nintendo's property most likely and Zelda, metroid, Mario etc would have been HD for 7 years now. If the partnership worked out we could have potentially been playing Zelda on ps4 now.

That and then CEO Hiroshi Yamauchi thought Sony was getting too sweet a deal. So they cut them off and hired Phillips instead. Which turned out to be a huge mistake. Ken Kutaragi got support from Sony to keep developing it as a stand alone system.

Peripherals just don't do very well. SNES CD would have come out too late in the system's life and would have cost too much to really grab anybody. Though I still do think Nintendo went with cartridges for the sole purpose of differentiating the N64 from the PlayStation. Even if it was to their detriment.

 

[poofyhairguy]

Nintendo needs to sell an Android tablet that can optionally connect to an app store with their classic games.

So basically Sony's idea, but done better.