Not to Open This Canna Worms Again, But...

[WilliamM2]

You can watch videos on youtube, or test it for yourself. Windows 8 can boot in several seconds, as opposed to Windows 7 taking 20+ seconds on the same machine. Many other tasks are obviously very similar to Windows 7 - but I wouldn't go as far as to say that 7 runs slower, it's definitely not something I have come across, and one of the core goals of each OS is to improve and optimise performance over the last OS.

I use both, and the difference in boot time is about 3 seconds. Windows 7 takes no where near 20 seconds to boot on my system. Also, with 8 I notice I have to wait a couple of seconds to do anything once it boots. 7 is instantly ready, as soon as I see the desktop. Plus I have to take a couple seconds to switch to the desktop when using 8. So overall I find 7 boots just as fast.

Is that all?

 

[sm625]

I think the board of MSFT must hold lots of apple and google call options as well as put options on their own company.

 

[flexy]

So what would we do about the Millions of people (and their numbers are growing by the hour) that Like touch?

When the bases of Penicillin was discovered it was rejected. Millions could be saved if it was early adopted.

Oh lord, you're working for MS ..and still didn't learn a thing?

Let's state simple, obvious facts:

Touch, as the name implies, is for (mostly) mobile devices with a touch-input. Agree?

Fact: Not all devices HAVE touch. This includes notebooks, laptops and of course desktops.

No one of those users can "like touch" because touch for them doesn't exist/is not relevant.

Fact: Yes, mobile devices are growing in numbers- fact, there is justification for a mobile optimized OS for touch, but this doesn't mean that the "no touch" market has disappeared. Your latest OS release obviously assumed that for some odd reason.

Your penicillin example doesn't work...you sound like a sales-man who tries to sell something entirely un-necessary and un-needed like..like...a tea kettle to someone who wants a coffee maker. And rather than satisfying the coffee lover you try to convince them that tea is better...

 

[Virgorising]

I use both, and the difference in boot time is about 3 seconds. Windows 7 takes no where near 20 seconds to boot on my system. Also, with 8 I notice I have to wait a couple of seconds to do anything once it boots. 7 is instantly ready, as soon as I see the desktop. Plus I have to take a couple seconds to switch to the desktop when using 8. So overall I find 7 boots just as fast.

Is that all?

No, it is not all, William. Stay there until the hugs I am sending U arrive.

Sometimes, the cure for frustration....is hugs. But, they gotta come from the toes.:biggrin:

 

[Virgorising]

Oh lord, you're working for MS ..and still didn't learn a thing?

Let's state simple, obvious facts:

Touch, as the name implies, is for (mostly) mobile devices with a touch-input. Agree?

Fact: Not all devices HAVE touch. This includes notebooks, laptops and of course desktops.

No one of those users can "like touch" because touch for them doesn't exist/is not relevant.

Fact: Yes, mobile devices are growing in numbers- fact, there is justification for a mobile optimized OS for touch, but this doesn't mean that the "no touch" market has disappeared. Your latest OS release obviously assumed that for some odd reason.

Your penicillin example doesn't work...you sound like a sales-man who tries to sell something entirely un-necessary and un-needed like..like...a tea kettle to someone who wants a coffee maker. And rather than satisfying the coffee lover you try to convince them that tea is better...

I am sending you hugs as I just did re William. Some people dig in with weedlike tap roots and do blind combat/shadow boxing. Those people do not work to reclaim Eyes by Marcel Proust.

That they then try to manufacture ersatz analogies, in this case with no knowledge of actual, medical history......is what it is. Brings me great sadness.

Forget, someone like me gets accused of not being open or discerning.....or being some naif novice.

Deep Breaths, do some cardio. As opposed, I mean, to RESISTANCE WORK.

 

[Virgorising]

If you get a faster computer so that Windows 7 runs faster....Windows 8 is only going to run faster on that same machine. A 5 year old will never grow older than their 10 year old sibling...

This is the fastest system I have ever owned as it stands and as I have configured it. I have no need for faster. Plus the extent to which some people, not all, say 8 is faster, remains very small. When SDDs evolve/mature to the point I feel they are "cooked" properly, I will get one.

I come to nothing capriciously.

 

[Virgorising]

Just came upon this, remember, the real model for Capitalism is consumers (discerning ones) rule and determine the worth of a given item.

http://techcrunch.com/2013/10/01/wi...hare-but-windows-7-grows-faster-in-september/

And, I would only consider going to the Windows store if they had an uber sale on low risers, NWT. Text me when that happens.

 

[Virgorising]

Your opening statement and reference shows us what you 'think' of windows 8, and what you 'think' is or isn't, which doesn't actually ring a whole lot of truth in reality - clearly there is some learning to do on your part. Implying that all CAD Designers must now use touch screens in windows 8 to do their work shows how little they actually know about Windows 8.

Again, I arrive at nothing cavalierly, and wish you would not assume I do.

 

[Imaginer]

Seriously, it is like the XP and Vista early days all over. If 8 really doesn't offer anything, you don't need to buy it to replace 7 on a current machine. I did not do so on my previous Envy 14.

You do not need to slander things based on personal preference and trying to pass it on to everyone you see. 7 will see extensive support much like XP so it isn't going away.

And if 8 is already there, there is absolutely no reason not to keep it. It is just as useful and a bit more so than 7. And if 8 can be had for cheap, it is not a bad thing to give it a try (if Microsoft ever offered the $15 special again).

And yes, I also have another HTPC and a two monitor workstation running 8, no touch input, and doing any work I did before, and in some ways a bit better of interfacing with programs. (and I am not alone in this sentiment) However, it is nice to know that between the three, and accessing network-wise with 7 machines, all play nicely still. And my Windows store apps can cross over to all three 8 devices if I choose.

XP/Vista days. Or hell if one to slander the OS look, XP/2000/98/95 days.

 

[Virgorising]

Seriously, it is like the XP and Vista early days all over. If 8 really doesn't offer anything, you don't need to buy it to replace 7 on a current machine. I did not do so on my previous Envy 14.

You do not need to slander things based on personal preference and trying to pass it on to everyone you see. 7 will see extensive support much like XP so it isn't going away.

And if 8 is already there, there is absolutely no reason not to keep it. It is just as useful and a bit more so than 7. And if 8 can be had for cheap, it is not a bad thing to give it a try (if Microsoft ever offered the $15 special again).

And yes, I also have another HTPC and a two monitor workstation running 8, no touch input, and doing any work I did before, and in some ways a bit better of interfacing with programs. (and I am not alone in this sentiment) However, it is nice to know that between the three, and accessing network-wise with 7 machines, all play nicely still. And my Windows store apps can cross over to all three 8 devices if I choose.

XP/Vista days. Or hell if one to slander the OS look, XP/2000/98/95 days.

First, slander is a verbal utterance, always based on malice and lies. It is legally actionable.

Next, sharing your take on any given thing, always offering details, nothing cavalierly arrived at, is the linchpin, the dynamic of human discourse. Forget, the reality of the net.

It is not what someone "prefers," (or disdains), it is WHY. I am always interested in the first if the second is offered by default.

 

[Imaginer]

First, slander is a verbal utterance, always based on malice and lies. It is legally actionable.

Next, sharing your take on any given thing, always offering details, nothing cavalierly arrived at, is the linchpin, the dynamic of human discourse. Forget, the reality of the net.

It is not what someone "prefers," (or disdains), it is WHY. I am always interested in the first if the second is offered by default.

Clearly, you are out for attention.

" it's the Faustian capitulation to lame tablet/touchscreen"

"I just came upon below, and it, more than anything so far, speaks my take on W8:"

"but instead takes one back to the hated, execrable, productivity-killing, single-window, touchy-feely, flashy-jumpy-blinky, no-taskbar Metro UI"

"Inferior---in this case, GRATUITOUS and so, inferior---is in the eye of the beholder."

"Bingo/Fist bump."

And...

"I hope, people avoid being inadvertent slaves to commerce in all things."

Ditch your internet service, ditch your current support structure, ditch buying from any established store, go hunt in the wild, go establish your own food production means, and go live off the land with only you as a sole support with the time and effort to do it.

Because, by this definition, we are all are to any product, service, or infrastructure to a degree.

 

[Virgorising]

Ditch your internet service, ditch your current support structure, ditch buying from any established store, go hunt in the wild, go establish your own food production means, and go live off the land with only you as a sole support with the time and effort to do it.

Because, by this definition, we are all are to any product, service, or infrastructure to a degree.

The above is quantum leap defining Not to mention, a true, crash the boards, whistle on the play, offensive foul. How can any such earn any credibility at all?

Delving, assessing in detail and in perspective takes work. But without that, what do we earn of value in our journey?

And, being moved to share the result of that work has nothing whatsoever to do with wanting ATTENTION. Again, it is the core dynamic of life and human discourse, and in every arena. It nourishes empowerment; power is in earning clarity & SO, AUTONOMY, never something POLITICAL involving any other being.

The real goal of formal education is to help humans learn how to do the heady work of learning---not an obligation, but a privilege. And then, the related privilege of maybe bringing illumination to others as a result.
__________________________________________
Edit: as my BF observed a while back---it blew me away, cause it was right and not something I was consciously aware of: I do not care if anyone gets anything right; I care intensely about people making honest efforts. For me, there is nothing more glorious, nourishing and fabulous, and I would walk thru fire for any such human.

Truth is, none of this need BE a Canna Worms.

 

[darkewaffle]

Not to Open This Canna Worms Again, But..

Reposting a nigh yellow-journalistic quote and not bothering to even formulate your own opinion or present any new information seems pretty specifically intended to do nothing but re-open a can of worms.

 

[Virgorising]

Reposting a nigh yellow-journalistic quote and not bothering to even formulate your own opinion or present any new information seems pretty specifically intended to do nothing but re-open a can of worms.

Do you actually believe that? Is that actually your take away? That I don't evolve and formulate my own opinions????

I pasted links to what spoke what I have come to read deal on my own. That you disagree with it, which you clearly do, changes nothing.

This is akin to the not discerning lashing out at socially progressive activists....Communists/Socialists.

But you are welcome to think it.

 

[JackMDS]

@flexy

Thank you for your post it helps to exemplify the ignorance and dogmatic processes that are plaguing threads like this.

Obviously, you do not know what Microsoft MVP means and you base your posting on me being an Employee of Microsoft. I do not work for Microsoft and never worked for them.

I go under JackMDS, it might be that the latter part of my name (combined with the penicillin) can give you a clue about my line of work.

In any case, the Desdk Top PCs' are "dying" and the future has to be prepared.

There is No real conceptual evolution in Desktop PC for more than 5 years.

As an example, the Spreadsheet was introduce to our live by Dan Bricklin and Bob Frankston in 1979. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dan_Bricklin ).

That was evolution, since then the concept was further developed to the level of the current state of the the art like in Microsoft Excel. It is much better today than it was in 1979, but that is a process of making it Better Not Evolution.

Similarly are Word, Photo Sshop, Power Point, Browsers, etc., they all get better but evolution wise the Desktop is stuck.

Nobody is taking away your Win7 (I have about 6 computers all running Win 7).

On the other hand, I cannot understand the “Cry Baby” approach to Win 8.

It will get better in time just like it took time for antibiotics to evolve from Penicillin to Cipro.

 

[Virgorising]

I'm surprised more OEMs aren't selling laptops with Linux on them, or without an OS at all. This is exactly the time when people are looking for other options! Manufacturers must all be in bed with Microsoft. Before Windows 8, Chromebooks didn't sell well at all, and now they're doing great. I'm thinking Google must have paid Steve Ballmer to make the dumbest looking OS possible and force all Windows laptops to have useless touchscreen for a large sum of money.

Sorry, jus caught this.

Of course Mfgs are in bed with MS! That is the main source of MS's revenue!!!!

Re Google, as I have posted here often, I found all of it intolerable way back. but I do truly like android phones and ebook readers.

And never think MS is the most invested of all in forcing touch screen on everyone beyond our phones. They envisioned herding sheep convinced that swiping, pinching are just amazing.... to the MS store and buying all those lame apps.

 

[Virgorising]

@flexy

Thank you for your post it helps to exemplify the ignorance and dogmatic processes that are plaguing threads like this.

Obviously, you do not know what Microsoft MVP means and you base your posting on me being an Employee of Microsoft. I do not work for Microsoft and never worked for them.

I go under JackMDS, it might be that the latter part of my name (combined with the penicillin) can give you a clue about my line of work.

In any case, the Desdk Top PCs' are "dying" and the future has to be prepared.

There is No real conceptual evolution in Desktop PC for more than 5 years.

As an example, the Spreadsheet was introduce to our live by Dan Bricklin and Bob Frankston in 1979. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dan_Bricklin ).

That was evolution, since then the concept was further developed to the level of the current state of the the art like in Microsoft Excel. It is much better today than it was in 1979, but that is a process of making it Better Not Evolution.

Similarly are Word, Photo Sshop, Power Point, Browsers, etc., they all get better but evolution wise the Desktop is stuck.

Nobody is taking away your Win7 (I have about 6 computers all running Win 7).

On the other hand, I cannot understand the “Cry Baby” approach to Win 8.

It will get better in time just like it took time for antibiotics to evolve from Penicillin to Cipro.

I never thought you worked for MS. THAT boggles. Take that with a grain of salt and pls do not extend it to everyone posting in this thread.

My take, is for serious computer users and all businesses worldwide, nothing will ever replace the desktop. Forget, most individuals and businesses now have all the computer they need or ever might need. PC sales have been declining steadily for a long time. Not because PCs (desktops esp) are anachronistic.

As always, it is not the WHAT, it is the WHY.

As for newer antibiotics, the orthodox pharms are hell bent on developing them, largely in response to that overuse of earlier ones has lead to microbes evolving into more and more virulent and resistant strains.

Same deal with antivirals/antiretrovirals.

Not to mention, all antibiotics, like all pharmaceuticals, have side effects. These are not innocuous agents. Savvy medical professionals are very careful re risk-reward.

 

[JackMDS]

Hmmm...

It states..

@flexy

.

 

[flexy]

Jack,

I knew what MVP meant but actually took a double-take at your sig which says:

Jack
Microsoft, MVP - Networking.


Notice the "," before the MVP. I read it as Jack/Microsoft and MVP Networking. It's indeed the "," which (to me) implies you're associated with MS *beyond* being a MVP.

 

[JackMDS]

Jack,

I knew what MVP meant but actually took a double-take at your sig which says:

Jack
Microsoft, MVP - Networking.


Notice the "," before the MVP. I read it as Jack/Microsoft and MVP Networking. It's indeed the "," which (to me) implies you're associated with MS *beyond* being a MVP.

Actually Microsoft does Not allowi Employees to be MVPs.

If MVP gets a Job in Microosoft he/she are losing thier MVP award.

That said My specialty is Humans Intellectual/Cognitive functioning.

I.e., I understand better thread like this that really has nothing to do with tangible Technology.

 

[ninaholic37]

Jack,

I knew what MVP meant but actually took a double-take at your sig which says:

Jack
Microsoft, MVP - Networking.


Notice the "," before the MVP. I read it as Jack/Microsoft and MVP Networking. It's indeed the "," which (to me) implies you're associated with MS *beyond* being a MVP.

That's how I read it too. It is ironic that someone who works at "Humans Intellectual/Cognitive functioning" cannot communicate properly with their audience. Maybe he's still in training

 

[Danmansonman]

That's fine, Windows 8.x may not appeal to you. That's all there is to it. Some people still use 98 or XP. There's no discrimination against them. What we do have is discrimination against windows 8, that's the whole reason this particular thread was started, to bash windows 8. I don't like seafood, I hate it, but I don't go around posting threads about how stupid seafood is and I can't believe people actually eat it.

"All these things are doable in 8"

It's not a question whether something is "doable".

Do you buy a car with rectangle shaped wheels because it still can drive?

I want to get a new OS because it is an IMPROVEMENT (a significant one over an older OS) not because "things are doable". If you need a workaround (3rd party tools) to get things going, something must be wrong.

Explain the reasoning to me why MS releases an OS with tablet features but forces tablet features onto desktop users? (As opposed to...having this as an option..not by having to install 3rd party tools).

Again..you may now argue "but you can do all this if...."..but this is not the question. I want to know what the obvious BENEFITS of Win8.1 would be over Win7. (And the benefits must be significant so I can accept the negatives). And I simply don't see those benefits.

 

[Danmansonman]

You don't have to use picture password, I don't use it on any of my windows 8 devices. There's no excuse for anyone getting their hopes up for 8.1 to bring back the old start menu as it was well documented that it was not happening. Those who got their hopes up didn't read properly. Start is no slower for running apps than the previous start menu so it works wells for me. I always used type to run since vista, so 8 was not shock to me.

Its the first Microsoft OS that did not improve a damn thing for desktops. I was forced to learn about it because it is used at work and when working with clients I have to be able to direct them on whatto do via phone. Even finding interesting features like picture password I still think its a steamy pile of Rottweiler dung. The only rreal improvement Microsoft should be lauded is the standard inclusion of security essentials though naming it defender can confuse people because precious defender versions were useless.

I find it so comical they got everyone's hopes up with 8.1 and the startbutton only tto make it waste space as a vehicle for pulling up the metrosexual interface.

 

[Danmansonman]

I would love to see a video of your 7 machine booting in 10 seconds or less. The difference is not 3 seconds, I also use 7 and 8 on similar spec machines with SSD's. 7 is great, it's fast, but it's definitely more than 3 seconds behind on a cold boot. If it takes you a few seconds to click in to desktop from Start, then there is something you doing wrong. Not to mention 8.1 boots straight to desktop, like 7.

I use both, and the difference in boot time is about 3 seconds. Windows 7 takes no where near 20 seconds to boot on my system. Also, with 8 I notice I have to wait a couple of seconds to do anything once it boots. 7 is instantly ready, as soon as I see the desktop. Plus I have to take a couple seconds to switch to the desktop when using 8. So overall I find 7 boots just as fast.

Is that all?

 

[JEDIYoda]

perhaps a mod should re-seal this can of worms...heheheheeeeee