North Carolina bans same-sex marriage

[Abraxas]

Wow, do you actually believe this tripe?

Yes, I believe the imposition of one religious law on America is much the same as another.

But it is okay for you to impose your convictions on society? :hmm:

My conviction is the absence of imposition; in a word, liberty.

 

[cybrsage]

Yes, I believe the imposition of one religious law on America is much the same as another.

My conviction is the absence of imposition; in a word, liberty.

Your conviction forces others to not do as they want, so you are imposing your view on them. In a word, imposition.

 

[Abraxas]

Your conviction forces others to not do as they want, so you are imposing your view on them. In a word, imposition.

Who is being forced to do what by permitting same sex marriages? Nobody is being forced to like them, perform them, attend them, etc. What force is being used by whom to do what?

 

[nehalem256]

My conviction is the absence of imposition; in a word, liberty.

Isnt this what George Bush did to Iraq? 😛

 

[Abraxas]

Isnt this what George Bush did to Iraq? 😛

If you consider sending hundreds of thousands of troops in to be "the absence of imposition".

 

[cybrsage]

Who is being forced to do what by permitting same sex marriages? Nobody is being forced to like them, perform them, attend them, etc. What force is being used by whom to do what?

People are forced to accept them. I expect you to play the liberal handbook step by step, so I will cut past your next statement (which would have been along the lines of "you do not have to accept them") and move forward.

The owners of a company are forced to accept them and treat the newly created type of marriage the same as traditional marriage or else face the wrath of the legal system.

You now need to skip ahead in your well used playbook.

 

[cybrsage]

If you consider sending hundreds of thousands of troops in to be "the absence of imposition".

He gave them liberty, which you claim is the absense of imposition. Make up your mind, is it or is it not how you defined it?

 

[Abraxas]

People are forced to accept them. I expect you to play the liberal handbook step by step, so I will cut past your next statement (which would have been along the lines of "you do not have to accept them") and move forward.

The owners of a company are forced to accept them and treat the newly created type of marriage the same as traditional marriage or else face the wrath of the legal system.

You now need to skip ahead in your well used playbook.

Accepting them is one option, removing marriage related considerations is another.

He gave them liberty, which you claim is the absense of imposition. Make up your mind, is it or is it not how you defined it?

No, he lied about giving them liberty and instead just invaded and bombed them.

 

[cybrsage]

Accepting them is one option, removing marriage related considerations is another.

You did not even skip that number in your playbook, even though I already addressed it. You apparently need to go number by number, like the phone operators in tech support who must ask you every question even if it obviously does not apply.

You are free to move onto your next argument, I already answered that one.

No, he lied about giving them liberty and instead just invaded and bombed them.

So your version of liberty does not include elections...interesting. What else does your version of liberty not include that everyone elses includes?

 

[Abraxas]

You did not even skip that number in your playbook, even though I already addressed it. You apparently need to go number by number, like the phone operators in tech support who must ask you every question even if it obviously does not apply.

You are free to move onto your next argument, I already answered that one.

Let me rephrase, I forgot English wasn't your first language.

Businesses need not consider marital status at all in their practices. If they do not consider marriage at all, whether the person is same sex married should have no impact on them.

So your version of liberty does not include elections...interesting. What else does your version of liberty not include that everyone elses includes?

My version of liberty does not include foreign occupying armies. Did Iraq have occupying armies under Bush? Yes? Then they didn't have liberty. Democracy is a necessary condition of liberty but not a sufficient one, do you understand the difference?

 

[cybrsage]

Let me rephrase, I forgot English wasn't your first language.

Sadly, it appears to be yours but your teachers failed you. I blame the union dominated school system.

Businesses need not consider marital status at all in their practices. If they do not consider marriage at all, whether the person is same sex married should have no impact on them.

Goalpost shift detected and ignored. Original discussion continued without movement of goalpost.

You have just admitted that if a business agrees with hetero marriage and thereby provides healthcare to the spouse of the employee, but does not agree with homo marriage and thereby does not provide healthcare to the spouse of the employee, that the business will be forced to provide it. You therefor admit that people will be forced to accept homo marriages. This does not support your statement where you said people will not be forced to accept it.

My version of liberty does not include foreign occupying armies. Did Iraq have occupying armies under Bush? Yes? Then they didn't have liberty. Democracy is a necessary condition of liberty but not a sufficient one, do you understand the difference?

So again you agree that your version of liberty does not include having democracry and freedom...things everyone else's version of libery includes. It explains much about your positions.

 

[Abraxas]

Sadly, it appears to be yours but your teachers failed you. I blame the union dominated school system.

You must be a moderately well trained monkey because I refuse to believe a human could be this stupid.

Goalpost shift detected and ignored. Original discussion continued without movement of goalpost.

You have just admitted that if a business agrees with hetero marriage and thereby provides healthcare to the spouse of the employee, but does not agree with homo marriage and thereby does not provide healthcare to the spouse of the employee, that the business will be forced to provide it. You therefor admit that people will be forced to accept homo marriages. This does not support your statement where you said people will not be forced to accept it.

Or they could stop providing it. Or they could provide it for a plus one regardless of marital status. Pointing out you are artificially railroading the options to avoid having to admit you are wrong is not moving the goalposts, but rather demonstrating you are as poor with logic as you are with language.

So again you agree that your version of liberty does not include having democracry and freedom...things everyone else's version of libery includes. It explains much about your positions.

You know, if I could, I would, but I don't think there is a way for me to make this into a sentence as simple as you are.

Democracy is a necessary condition for liberty, it is not a sufficient one. Being a polygon with four sides is a necessary condition to be a square, it is not a sufficient one. More than democracy is required for liberty and Iraq didn't have enough to qualify.

Is any of this sinking in or can I expect another post demonstrating a near masterful ignorance of everything in the near future?

 

[cybrsage]

You must be a moderately well trained monkey because I refuse to believe a human could be this stupid.

And yet here you are, a living example of what the failed school system creates. I agree, it is sad.

Or they could stop providing it. Or they could provide it for a plus one regardless of marital status. Pointing out you are artificially railroading the options to avoid having to admit you are wrong is not moving the goalposts, but rather demonstrating you are as poor with logic as you are with language.

I see that you still admit that if a company only provided benefits for the hetero marriage, they would face the judicial system and be forced to accept the homo marriage as equal to the hetero marriage.

This does not coincide with your previous statement that they do not have to accept it.

Which is it, do they have to accept homo marriages as equal to hetero marriages or not? You cannot claim both as they are diametrically opposed views.

You know, if I could, I would, but I don't think there is a way for me to make this into a sentence as simple as you are.

Democracy is a necessary condition for liberty, it is not a sufficient one. Being a polygon with four sides is a necessary condition to be a square, it is not a sufficient one. More than democracy is required for liberty and Iraq didn't have enough to qualify.

State all the requirements for liberty in your version of liberty then. This will be quite entertaining for all.

Is any of this sinking in or can I expect another post demonstrating a near masterful ignorance of everything in the near future?

Your English teachers really failed you, as you are using ignorance when you mean to use understanding. I weep silently for what they did to you.

 

[Abraxas]

And yet here you are, a living example of what the failed school system creates. I agree, it is sad.

Indeed, it created someone used to dealing with people holding all the mental capacity of your average floral arrangement as demonstrated by my continued indulgence of you.

I see that you still admit that if a company only provided benefits for the hetero marriage, they would face the judicial system and be forced to accept the homo marriage as equal to the hetero marriage.

This does not coincide with your previous statement that they do not have to accept it.

Which is it, do they have to accept homo marriages as equal to hetero marriages or not? You cannot claim both as they are diametrically opposed views.

Once again, they can stop recognizing marriage all together instead of recognizing same sex marriages. They are not forced to recognize the two as equal. However, not doing so would mean marriage would have to be eliminated as a consideration for whatever they are offering.

State all the requirements for liberty in your version of liberty then. This will be quite entertaining for all.

Control of state (democracy), control of self (independence), control of labor (emancipation), and control of surroundings (mobility and safety). This is a start, I am unsure if it is comprehensive but I would consider all of these to be necessary for a person or people to have liberty. Anything here you disagree with?

Your English teachers really failed you, as you are using ignorance when you mean to use understanding. I weep silently for what they did to you.

No. LOL God no. I am using words to describe an individual who by all appearances has spent their entire life in the belief exposure to knowledge of any sort will cause them the pain of ten thousand ravenous driver ants pumped into their sinuses.

 

[cybrsage]

Indeed, it created someone used to dealing with people holding all the mental capacity of your average floral arrangement as demonstrated by my continued indulgence of you.

At least you admit your mental capacity is not very high. That is the first step to seeking the real help you need.

Once again, they can stop recognizing marriage all together instead of recognizing same sex marriages. They are not forced to recognize the two as equal. However, not doing so would mean marriage would have to be eliminated as a consideration for whatever they are offering.

You just said they have to accept them as equal or they cannot accept hetero marriage. They already accept hetero marraige, therefor your statement fails.

I still weep over what your teachers did to you. You could have been so much more, but alas, what is done is done.

 

[Abraxas]

At least you admit your mental capacity is not very high. That is the first step to seeking the real help you need.

Reading fail.

You just said they have to accept them as equal or they cannot accept hetero marriage. They already accept hetero marraige, therefor your statement fails.

They can stop. This is not a difficult concept to grasp.

I still weep over what your teachers did to you. You could have been so much more, but alas, what is done is done.

Let's see; unreasoned conservative viewpoints, irrational loathing of teachers, weeps a lot... are you John Boehner? That would explain so much.

 

[cybrsage]

So, according to you, they either have to accept homo marriage and equal to hetero marriage or give up their believe that hetero marriage deserves benefits that homo marriage does not since they are not equal.

You are using the force of law on them to force your view onto others. You would do well to simply admit it rather than continue to show your fail.

 

[Abraxas]

So, according to you, they either have to accept homo marriage and equal to hetero marriage or give up their believe that hetero marriage deserves benefits that homo marriage does not since they are not equal.

You are using the force of law on them to force your view onto others. You would do well to simply admit it rather than continue to show your fail.

They can believe whatever they want, nobody is stopping them.

 

[Moonbeam]

So, according to you, they either have to accept homo marriage and equal to hetero marriage or give up their believe that hetero marriage deserves benefits that homo marriage does not since they are not equal.

You are using the force of law on them to force your view onto others. You would do well to simply admit it rather than continue to show your fail.

They are equal. You don't want to grant their equality but the law will force you to because that is what the law does.

"Society can and does execute its own mandates: and if it issues wrong mandates instead of right, or any mandates at all in things with which it ought not to meddle, it practises a social tyranny more formidable than many kinds of political oppression, since, though not usually upheld by such extreme penalties, it leaves fewer means of escape, penetrating much more deeply into the details of life, and enslaving the soul itself. Protection, therefore, against the tyranny of the magistrate is not enough: there needs protection also against the tyranny of the prevailing opinion and feeling; against the tendency of society to impose, by other means than civil penalties, its own ideas and practices as rules of conduct on those who dissent from them; to fetter the development, and, if possible, prevent the formation, of any individuality not in harmony with its ways, and compel all characters to fashion themselves upon the model of its own. There is a limit to the legitimate interference of collective opinion with individual independence: and to find that limit, and maintain it against encroachment, is as indispensable to a good condition of human affairs, as protection against political despotism."

In short, to maintain a balance against your tyranny of prevailing opinion, political despotism is needed. Sorry! That will go the other way when you are allowed only to marry a person of the same sex.

 

[cybrsage]

They are equal.

Nope, not in North Carolina. Try again, only this time with a lot less obvious fail. 🙂

 

[Moonbeam]

Nope, not in North Carolina. Try again, only this time with a lot less obvious fail. 🙂

North Carolina, when, during the time of slavery? Try again, only this time with a lot less brain defect.

 

[cybrsage]

North Carolina, when, during the time of slavery?

Read the thread title, you may understand at that point.

Try again, only this time with a lot less brain defect.

Please stop projecting your own failures onto others, it is unbecoming. You do it often, and it makes me sad to see you crying out for help so often and still being unwilling to go and obtain it. 🙁

There are many well trained psychologists who are willing to help you, no need to continue to project onto others.

 

[Moonbeam]

cybrsage: Read the thread title, you may understand at that point.

M: Sadly, it wouldn't really matter how many times you read mine. You would still wind up thinking I was the one lacking comprehension because that's how your defect works.

c😛lease stop projecting your own failures onto others, it is unbecoming. You do it often, and it makes me sad to see you crying out for help so often and still being unwilling to go and obtain it. 🙁

There are many well trained psychologists who are willing to help you, no need to continue to project onto others.

M: Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery. Too bad, though, that you see a need for psychological help as a weakness. But again, that's all part and parcel of a conservative brain defect. Nobody seeks help when they are ashamed to have a need.

 

[Newbian]

Just wait until the federal government gets off it's ass and makes it legal and then we can point and laugh at the racist states that tried to stop it. 😛

No different between those that tried to block interracial marriages or wanted to count people as property or prevented blacks / women from voting.

Not every state will agree on the right thing to do until someone else forces them to accept what is viewed as the right thing and usually when the majority of the people in the country believe it should be legal and a right as most believe that same sex marriage should be allowed like it has been for awhile.

 

[cybrsage]

cybrsage: Read the thread title, you may understand at that point.

M: Sadly, it wouldn't really matter how many times you read mine. You would still wind up thinking I was the one lacking comprehension because that's how your defect works.

c😛lease stop projecting your own failures onto others, it is unbecoming. You do it often, and it makes me sad to see you crying out for help so often and still being unwilling to go and obtain it. 🙁

There are many well trained psychologists who are willing to help you, no need to continue to project onto others.

M: Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery. Too bad, though, that you see a need for psychological help as a weakness. But again, that's all part and parcel of a conservative brain defect. Nobody seeks help when they are ashamed to have a need.

And you continue to project your faults and flaws onto others. A thousand psychologists cry silently at night for you. 🙁

Out of curiosity, what is the name of the mental failing which forces you toquite frequently be unable to use to the quote function properly?