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BUTCH1

Lifer
Jul 15, 2000
20,433
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Captante said:
I didn't bother to watch this game since the Browns had nothing to play for but pride .... which apparently is in short supply in Cleveland!

:rolleyes:

And I've been saying that I was expecting some shenanigans from the league around Ben retiring POTENTIALLY ruining the AFC playoffs by "fixing" calls to favor the Steelers. It's happened before in big games.
Click to expand...
I have to see actual evidence before I can give any "fixing" thought any serious weight, the NFL is a multi-billion dollar business, players get paid decently and TV contracts are very lucrative, if any evidence was brought forward all that $$ and all those contracts would be null and void.
 
Captante

Captante

Lifer
Oct 20, 2003
30,276
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BUTCH1 said:
I have to see actual evidence before I can give any "fixing" thought any serious weight, the NFL is a multi-billion dollar business, players get paid decently and TV contracts are very lucrative, if any evidence was brought forward all that $$ and all those contracts would be null and void.
Click to expand...


Did you see Super Bowl XL ?? ;)

That game nearly resulted in my not watching NFL football anymore.

(I'll never forget seeing an ad proclaiming Jerome Bettis a "great superbowl champion" PRIOR to the game starting!)


And don't forget the "Music City Miracle forward-lateral" :p



EDIT: I'd like to be able to say things have gotten better BUT that travesty in the NFC championship game between the Saints and the Rams was NOT long ago at all either.
 
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B

BUTCH1

Lifer
Jul 15, 2000
20,433
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126
Captante said:
Did you see Super Bowl XL ?? ;)

That game nearly resulted in my not watching NFL football anymore.

(I'll never forget seeing an ad proclaiming Jerome Bettis a "great superbowl champion" PRIOR to the game starting!)


And don't forget the "Music City Miracle forward-lateral" :p



EDIT: I'd like to be able to say things have gotten better BUT that travesty in the NFC championship game between the Saints and the Rams was NOT long ago at all either.
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Yea, I remember SB XL, some of the worst officiating ever but again, not enough evidence for a conspiracy. I think the main reason I'd have a hard time seriously considering it comes down to one word, GREED. Anyone with solid evidence
of an NFL "fix" could sell that story/evidence for a small fortune, no one ever has. Oh, the lateral, yea, the ball can move along a straight line but cannot advance one bit, it seemed like it was extremely close that's for sure.
 
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Captante

Captante

Lifer
Oct 20, 2003
30,276
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BUTCH1 said:
Yea, I remember SB XL, some of the worst officiating ever but again, not enough evidence for a conspiracy. I think the main reason I'd have a hard time seriously considering it comes down to one word, GREED. Anyone with solid evidence
of an NFL "fix" could sell that story/evidence for a small fortune, no one ever has. Oh, the lateral, yea, the ball can move along a straight line but cannot advance one bit, it seemed like it was extremely close that's for sure.
Click to expand...


I can't really argue with anything you've said here logically and I would think the league would be smart enough to realize that getting caught playing around would "kill the golden goose".

Thing is a LOT of people bet on things like professional wrestling which is 100% scripted so MAYBE the NFL knows something we don't?
 
Torn Mind

Torn Mind

Lifer
Nov 25, 2012
11,643
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I just remembered Butch is a Pats fan. He must be very pleased the NFL destroyed the Spygate tapes. Of course "Greed" will make sure nothing egregious gets out.:rolleyes:
 
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BUTCH1

Lifer
Jul 15, 2000
20,433
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Captante said:
I can't really argue with anything you've said here logically and I would think the league would be smart enough to realize that getting caught playing around would "kill the golden goose".

Thing is a LOT of people bet on things like professional wrestling which is 100% scripted so MAYBE the NFL knows something we don't?
Click to expand...
LOL, yea, that's a bit too "convenient" for Roger to destroy those tapes before anyone else saw them but I did go back
and re watched the "miracle" lateral and it does look like a lateral, though not by much!.
 
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BUTCH1

Lifer
Jul 15, 2000
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zinfamous said:
The Pure Magic of The Great Russell Wilson's brilliance, will never be topped.

Ever.

:D
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Wilson's always been one of the best deep-ball throwers ever but in that case Packers got robbed, Jennings caught it and held it all the way to the ground, that was the replacement Ref's if I remember.
 
zinfamous

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
110,592
29,218
146
BUTCH1 said:
Wilson's always been one of the best deep-ball throwers ever but in that case Packers got robbed, Jennings caught it and held it all the way to the ground, that was the replacement Ref's if I remember.
Click to expand...

You don't understand. It was the undisputed greatness of Russell Wilson that even made that call possible. ne, necessary. It was always going to be a touchdown, as it was ordained before the ball left his hands. The refs were just there to make sure it happened.
 
Scarpozzi

Scarpozzi

Lifer
Jun 13, 2000
26,389
1,778
126
Captante said:
Did you see Super Bowl XL ?? ;)

That game nearly resulted in my not watching NFL football anymore.

(I'll never forget seeing an ad proclaiming Jerome Bettis a "great superbowl champion" PRIOR to the game starting!)


And don't forget the "Music City Miracle forward-lateral" :p



EDIT: I'd like to be able to say things have gotten better BUT that travesty in the NFC championship game between the Saints and the Rams was NOT long ago at all either.
Click to expand...
Camera angles always mess with perception because they're always elevated and the field itself is usually raised in the middle to allow for water runoff/drainage. This is one of the best short views.
Copy/paste this after youtube.com: /watch?v=K_zg-J0q42M

Even moreso...I think the whole point of a "lateral" pass shouldn't be nitpicked and should be given about a yard of variance. The point of a lateral pass is that you're not really passing downfield. You're passing behind the line of scrimmage.....and if the other team was worth a damn, they'd tackle you there....but alas, those were Bills on the others side of said scrimmage line.
 
Captante

Captante

Lifer
Oct 20, 2003
30,276
10,783
136
Scarpozzi said:
Camera angles always mess with perception because they're always elevated and the field itself is usually raised in the middle to allow for water runoff/drainage. This is one of the best short views.
Copy/paste this after youtube.com: /watch?v=K_zg-J0q42M

Even moreso...I think the whole point of a "lateral" pass shouldn't be nitpicked and should be given about a yard of variance. The point of a lateral pass is that you're not really passing downfield. You're passing behind the line of scrimmage.....and if the other team was worth a damn, they'd tackle you there....but alas, those were Bills on the others side of said scrimmage line.
Click to expand...


The league wanted ANYTHING but the Bills in the Super Bowl again. It was clearly an illegal forward pass by the Titans and I've already seen the play several hundred times including watching it happen in real-time.

If you genuinely believe that "a lateral pass shouldn't be nitpicked" then why stop there? "Accuracy" should no longer matter in the NFL right?

From now on TD's should count for 6 points if the receiver just gets close to the end-zone or ALMOST hangs onto the pass? Will save a lot of game-time since there will no longer be any need to "measure" for first downs as they'll ALL be successful provided they get close?

Sorry but this is one of the silliest ideas I've ever heard.

:p
 
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Scarpozzi

Scarpozzi

Lifer
Jun 13, 2000
26,389
1,778
126
Captante said:
The league wanted ANYTHING but the Bills in the Super Bowl again. It was clearly an illegal forward pass by the Titans and I've already seen the play several hundred times including watching it happen in real-time.

If you genuinely believe that "a lateral pass shouldn't be nitpicked" then why stop there? "Accuracy" should no longer matter in the NFL right?

From now on TD's should count for 6 points if the receiver just gets close to the end-zone or ALMOST hangs onto the pass? Will save a lot of game-time since there will no longer be any need to "measure" for first downs as they'll ALL be successful provided they get close?

Sorry but this is one of the silliest ideas I've ever heard.

:p
Click to expand...
The problem is that the ball was released over the line from a TE with longer than average arms and taller than average height. When you factor all of that in with the angle of the camera, the footage isn't reliable without more 3D reference points. I forgot that play was on a kick return and not a regular play. That's why I was poking fun at the line of scrimmage.

Honestly, I'm exhausted with the NFL's arbitrary ball spotting and judgements on what's a first down vs forward progress. I've seen plays where a runner makes a second push for yards when the play should have been blown dead...or when it's blown dead too soon. My point is officiating crews can really deflate an offense by being jerks or punish a defense the same way.
 
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BUTCH1

Lifer
Jul 15, 2000
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Scarpozzi said:
The problem is that the ball was released over the line from a TE with longer than average arms and taller than average height. When you factor all of that in with the angle of the camera, the footage isn't reliable without more 3D reference points. I forgot that play was on a kick return and not a regular play. That's why I was poking fun at the line of scrimmage.

Honestly, I'm exhausted with the NFL's arbitrary ball spotting and judgements on what's a first down vs forward progress. I've seen plays where a runner makes a second push for yards when the play should have been blown dead...or when it's blown dead too soon. My point is officiating crews can really deflate an offense by being jerks or punish a defense the same way.
Click to expand...
I re-watched it several more times yesterday and the most important point made was to watch from where the ball itself
is released and where it winds up, it is a lateral. Can't fault the Bills much, in 50 years of watching the NFL I've never seen that attempted before, I highly doubt any other team would have defended it better either. Couple in the fact that
it's a championship game and the final kickoff, all they were thinking was "get that guy down and we win" so they naturally all flocked to the one side of the field.
 
JujuFish

JujuFish

Lifer
Feb 3, 2005
11,003
735
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As the resident Bills fan, all I can say is that the Music City Miracle started a 17-year playoff drought for Buffalo. Screw that play. Screw it every way possible.
 
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BUTCH1

Lifer
Jul 15, 2000
20,433
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JujuFish said:
As the resident Bills fan, all I can say is that the Music City Miracle started a 17-year playoff drought for Buffalo. Screw that play. Screw it every way possible.
Click to expand...
Sorry, didn't want to throw salt in anyone's wounds, I was just discussing weather it was legit or not. With Allen signed long term and a much better than average coach I'd expect the Bills to be playoff participants every year going forward. Can't see them losing to the Jets at home so the AFC east will be theirs as well.
 
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