Newt Gingrich or Barack Obama?

Page 8 - Seeking answers? Join the AnandTech community: where nearly half-a-million members share solutions and discuss the latest tech.

Newt Gingrich or Barack Obama?

  • Newt Gingrich

  • Barack Obama

  • neither


Results are only viewable after voting.

GarfieldtheCat

Diamond Member
Jan 7, 2005
3,708
1
0
Can you quote where cyber said we found WMD's after the start of the war? I looked back a few pages and didnt see it. Thanks.

Near the top of this page...where he says the lying about Hans Blix.

The fact is, no WMD were found in Iraq. The intel was wrong, and probably intentionaly manipulated by Bush and his team to get the data they wanted, which was then used to scare everyone into thinking he had them.

For several years afterwards, no one found anything. Everyone admits that no WMD were found, even Bush himself admits it now. 20-year old corroded non-working lost munitions doesn't count, as everyone in the government readily admits to.
 

cybrsage

Lifer
Nov 17, 2011
13,021
0
0
Hans Blix disagrees with you. I know you think you know more about WMDs than the UN Inspector in charge of the group searching for them, but you are wrong.

Hans Blix documented his finds and reported them to the UN. I quoted the report and linked to the UN website where it is found.

What we did not find was a robust WMD creation system or huge stockpiles. Hans Blix DID find WMDs, and documented his finds.

EDIT: Sine you obviously did not actually READ the post, here is a link to it:

http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=32655723&postcount=160
 

airdata

Diamond Member
Jul 11, 2010
4,987
0
0
Cyber : should I bother quoting from your post where it says the warheads were filled with water?

The falsification of WMD data has been a well known situation. To find out that people actually think we found WMD or that what was found was the same stuff that they sold the war over, it's just amazing. At least come at us with the old " They moved the wmd to syria" bs.

Yellow cake, blah blah blah

Hey guys, lets just change the name to operation iraqi freedom !!!
 

cybrsage

Lifer
Nov 17, 2011
13,021
0
0
Cyber : should I bother quoting from your post where it says the warheads were filled with water?

Irrelevant. The bomb itself is a WMD. It could be filled with flowers and pink unicorn dust and not change what it is.

Hans Blix listed it as a WMD.

The falsification of WMD data has been a well known situation. To find out that people actually think we found WMD or that what was found was the same stuff that they sold the war over, it's just amazing. At least come at us with the old " They moved the wmd to syria" bs.

Which is why everyone was surprised more was not found. It acutally is why all the major intelligence agencies were wrong (not lying, wrong), and why Bush was wrong (not lying, wrong).

However, the huge stockpiles of WMDs not being there does not magically make the ones found go away. They WMDs Hans Blix found, documented, and sent for destruction did still exist.

If you have a problem with Hans Blix's report, contact him and get him to rescind it. Of course, he will probably ignore you, since he actually DID find WMDs per his report to the UN.



Now, there is the possibility Hans Blix way lying in order to keep his cushy, high paying job forever. Each time he found another WMD his group was allowed to continue looking. But that sounds too much like a conspiracy theory to entertain with some type of supporting evidence.
 

airdata

Diamond Member
Jul 11, 2010
4,987
0
0
Look at the last page, there's plenty of other people saying you're wrong.

If Hans Blix is really all you've got, please...

And no... warheads are not WMD if they have water in them. The "MASS DESTRUCTION" part of WMD entails that they would have some sort of agent in them to cause mass destruction. Without that component, you're talking about a small explosion w\ minimal destruction.

Listing stuff like that and labelling it as WMD was a failed attempt to cover the lies that had not come to light at the time. It's 2011 now and alot of people think we went to war w\ iraq to liberate the iraqi people.
 

cybrsage

Lifer
Nov 17, 2011
13,021
0
0
Look at the last page, there's plenty of other people saying you're wrong.

If Hans Blix is really all you've got, please...

If all I have is the guy in charge of finding and destroying WMDs in Iraq...who was personally in Iraq searching for WMDs...

Umm...ok....wow.


And no... warheads are not WMD if they have water in them. The "MASS DESTRUCTION" part of WMD entails that they would have some sort of agent in them to cause mass destruction. Without that component, you're talking about a small explosion w\ minimal destruction.

Actually, it is.

Listing stuff like that and labelling it as WMD was a failed attempt to cover the lies that had not come to light at the time. It's 2011 now and alot of people think we went to war w\ iraq to liberate the iraqi people.

Wait...are you claiming Hans Blix is part of a WMD in Iraq cover up? :D
 

DominionSeraph

Diamond Member
Jul 22, 2009
8,386
32
91
The fact is, no WMD were found in Iraq. The intel was wrong, and probably intentionaly manipulated by Bush and his team to get the data they wanted, which was then used to scare everyone into thinking he had them.

Manipulation was not needed.

Post Gulf War I, Saddam went total passive-aggressive against the West. He refused to play nice in any respect He couldn't just build country with a normal civilian economy and normal internal policies, he had to tweak the West's nose at every opportunity, playing the spoiled baby acting out because it didn't get its way. We had to put up no-fly zones, protect his neighbors, stop his smuggling, and deal with him playing "you can't catch me" with weapons inspectors. When someone is playing "you can't catch me" and you know he started out with some, during the game you've caught him several times with some and caught him smuggling in all sorts of prohibited components and caught him at attempts to make more, and then the game continues and you go through a short stretch where, no, you haven't found any fully finalized and functional WMD's, do you wrap up and go home on the assumption that you got them and that everything is in order and will be hunky-dory until the end of time, or do you take the safe route and keep looking under the real possibility that maybe he just got better at hiding these things? The inspectors did NOT have free reign to go wherever they wanted in Iraq at whatever time, and weapons ARE portable.

Saddam played these games down to a very short fuse, then 9/11 happened and the concept of the threat posed by WMD's out in the world suddenly came crashing home. What if someone set off a chemical weapon bomb in the Manhattan subways? What if a dirty bomb was set off on the streets above, contaminating everything for hundreds of years? This isn't some distant concept of science fiction.

Saddam thought he could play his games in safety. He thought we were soft -- that as long as he didn't do anything directly against us that we wouldn't have the balls to step up against him. He was wrong. 9/11 pissed us off in general and we took it out on that fucker. No cutsie -- he repeatedly violated several U.N. resolutions and so made it clear that the only way to get him to ever be in compliance was to invade, and the civilized nations of the world were with us in that. WMD's or not did not matter at that point; his system alone posed a threat -- that of the endless babysitting of an unruly child -- so his system had to be removed. The weight of his history and his continued actions did strongly support the notion that there still were WMD's in Iraq so why wouldn't that belong in the pile against him? There was certainly nothing to say, "Holy shit, Iraq has been scrubbed clean! We looked in his mouth to see if Saddam brushed, and he did! What a good boy!" His mouth was clamped shut, he was dragging his heels -- it looked like he was hiding something so we went with, "He's hiding something," on that front. If he had been completely transparent on that front it still would not have excused everything else, so the invasion was still completely justified.
 

blackangst1

Lifer
Feb 23, 2005
22,902
2,359
126
Near the top of this page...where he says the lying about Hans Blix.

The fact is, no WMD were found in Iraq. The intel was wrong, and probably intentionaly manipulated by Bush and his team to get the data they wanted, which was then used to scare everyone into thinking he had them.

For several years afterwards, no one found anything. Everyone admits that no WMD were found, even Bush himself admits it now. 20-year old corroded non-working lost munitions doesn't count, as everyone in the government readily admits to.

Ah OK. Then it is as I thought...you misread it.
His last report to the UN prior to the US invasion documented finding WMDs.

PRIOR.

As far as the bolded is concerned, youre out of your friggin mind. Youre no worse than the far right loonies you shake your head at.
 

werepossum

Elite Member
Jul 10, 2006
29,873
463
126
Hans Blix disagrees with you. I know you think you know more about WMDs than the UN Inspector in charge of the group searching for them, but you are wrong.

Hans Blix documented his finds and reported them to the UN. I quoted the report and linked to the UN website where it is found.

What we did not find was a robust WMD creation system or huge stockpiles. Hans Blix DID find WMDs, and documented his finds.

EDIT: Sine you obviously did not actually READ the post, here is a link to it:

http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=32655723&postcount=160
Wasting your time, dude, he's certifiably insane. It does no good to post links, even assuming he is theoretically capable of reading them. It's like arguing with a Birther; for standing up to Bush, Hussein has achieved near Sainthood among the less rational members (pun intended) of the left. He never had any WMDs, and if he did have some, then America gave them to him - probably as a condition for getting milk for starving Iraqi babies. And he certainly never used them - unless the CIA made him use them. More likely the CIA actually attacked the Kurds and the Shi'ia. Word is Reagan was personally the bombardier . . .

Besides, our main target (among SEVERAL justifications given in his speech) were the WMDs we THOUGHT Hussein had manufactured after the Gulf War Round 1. It's always worth pointing out to the rational that Iraq did in fact have WMD, and that we found most of the WMDs we KNEW they had, but we got gulled pretty badly on the ongoing weapons program. The expat informants had compelling reasons to lie about WMDs (the ability to go home without being slowly fed feet-first into an industrial plastics shredder, revenge on the man/party who murdered their loved ones, etc.) but it's pretty clear they did lie and, hearing what we suspected, we bought it. Almost certainly there were no significant WMD weapons produced after the mid 1990s.
 

0roo0roo

No Lifer
Sep 21, 2002
64,795
84
91
don't care, no one knew for certain, its very convenient to say you knew after the fact.

newt gingrich is still insane though.