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Newegg has refurb Llano A6-3600 FM1 APUs! (2.1/2.4Ghz, 65W, FM1)

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VirtualLarry said:
What's an N5000? Is that even released yet? The newest one that I know of that I've seen in mini-PCs, is an N4200 Apollo Lake CPU. I know that Intel is coming out with a newer generation, I assume that the N5000 is that? Where can you find mini-PCs with that CPU? I might pick one up "for science".
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That's the new Gemini Lake, with Goldmont+ CPU. It's looking like a big step up from the last generation. It's launching around now, so not really available yet- I imagine it will show up in a bucket of laptops at CES.
 
NTMBK said:
That's the new Gemini Lake, with Goldmont+ CPU. It's looking like a big step up from the last generation. It's launching around now, so not really available yet- I imagine it will show up in a bucket of laptops at CES.
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How is the Linux support for Gemini Lake, supported yet?
 
VirtualLarry said:
In fact, Llano has higher IPC than Athlon II / Phenom II
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Llano's IPC is a touch better than the Athlon II's but definitely not Phenom II's on average. IIRC they only did some buffer optimizations with Llano giving them 0-4% higher IPC compared to the Athlon II. The Phenom II's L3 cache still keeps its it out of Llano's reach.
 
formulav8 said:
Llano's IPC is a touch better than the Athlon II's but definitely not Phenom II's on average. IIRC they only did some buffer optimizations with Llano giving them 0-4% higher IPC compared to the Athlon II. The Phenom II's L3 cache still keeps its it out of Llano's reach.
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But is that IPC or ST performance? I guess I tend to associate IPC with architecture, and the Athlon II and Phenom II have the same architecture, but Llano's was a tweaked version of such. That's why I said Llano had higher IPC.

I agree that in practice, Phenom II probably has better performance, at least for games, due to the L3 cache present. But I think that the right code sequences, utilizing the tweaked opcodes in Llano, and staying within registers, could outrun Phenom II. Maybe. I guess that's really just pointing out that "IPC" measurements, also depend on the code sequence being measured, as well as the architecture.
 
llano also had problems going over 3.4GHz in OC I think, while PII had stock CPUs at 3.7GHz, and you could OC many PII and AII to around 4GHz.
 
The only reason to get a llano is if the entire system is nearly free. It doesnt clock well, doesnt have any single core frequency boost, and the vliw5 gpu is not supported by new amd gpu drivers on either windows or linux (anything older than GCN is EOL).
Even trinity/richland are not apus to recommend for the same reason. No good gpu driver support.
Dont aim to buy generations old motherboards either. Good ones cost a fortune if even available, and cheap ones are not likely to last long, ruining any value proposition.
 
I've seen Haswell or newer based refurbished systems for not that much on Newegg and elsewhere that will be a more suitable purchase then trying to build preAM4 systems.
 
Old crap is old crap. The box in most standard people's home is supposed to be an allrounder that sits there until it dies. Saddling it with some old AMD has been is a poor choice. Buy something that is at least an actual quad core with a modern chipset. Its a false economy to save a few hundred over the course of a few years for a daily box.
 
Now, when will VirtualLarry test my Phenom II X2 570 going at 4.3GHz. Llanos are only 2.1GHz, that's half the ST speed of my Phenom.
 
escrow4 said:
Old crap is old crap. The box in most standard people's home is supposed to be an allrounder that sits there until it dies. Saddling it with some old AMD has been is a poor choice. Buy something that is at least an actual quad core with a modern chipset. Its a false economy to save a few hundred over the course of a few years for a daily box.
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Well, this is an "actual quad core" (remember, this is FM1, no "module" BS), and as far as Modern chipsets go, the A75 boards I planned on picking up (new), have SATA6G and USB3.0. What more could an-user reasonably want, besides an "Ultra M.2" socket?

This would be intended for new desktop users, or Pentium 4 / Core2 owners.

My Mom's using a quad-core Llano rig, it works fine for her.

Edit: You're right though, it is old tech. But it still (on the edge of) viable, being a quad-core with respectable big-core IPC, iGPU with reasonable graphics. Only downsides that I can see are, low clocks, and lack of HEVC / VP9 / 4K decode support.
 
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VirtualLarry said:
Well, this is an "actual quad core" (remember, this is FM1, no "module" BS), and as far as Modern chipsets go, the A75 boards I planned on picking up (new), have SATA6G and USB3.0. What more could an-user reasonably want, besides an "Ultra M.2" socket?

This would be intended for new desktop users, or Pentium 4 / Core2 owners.

My Mom's using a quad-core Llano rig, it works fine for her.

Edit: You're right though, it is old tech. But it still (on the edge of) viable, being a quad-core with respectable big-core IPC, iGPU with reasonable graphics. Only downsides that I can see are, low clocks, and lack of HEVC / VP9 / 4K decode support.
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Put it up against an i3 8100 and H270 system will murder it thrice over. It simply isn't worth being cheap on certain things, especially ones you use daily.
 
Well, if the i3-8100 would work with an H270, then that would be a great combo. Since it doesn't, and requires a Z370 motherboard, which are a minimum of $100... try again?

But still, we're talking about an FM1 quad-core system, with a small-ish SSD, that can be put together for around $200 (without Windows cost), whereas an i3-8100 quad-core and Z370 mobo, and $$$ DDR4 RAM, starts at like $350-400 just for the core components. Add $200 for case / PSU / SSD / DVD.

You're talking over double the cost. And if a person is just using it for web-browsing, and not AAA gaming or video-editing, with an SSD, there probably isn't that huge a difference in experience.

After all, I was SO IMPRESSED with my i3-8100 rig, I promptly put it away after a week and mothballled it. 😛 (That's with DDR4-2800 RAM, a Z370 chipset, and an SM951 OEM PCI-E M.2 AHCI SSD.)
 
VirtualLarry said:
Well, if the i3-8100 would work with an H270, then that would be a great combo. Since it doesn't, and requires a Z370 motherboard, which are a minimum of $100... try again?

After all, I was SO IMPRESSED with my i3-8100 rig, I promptly put it away after a week and mothballled it. 😛 (That's with DDR4-2800 RAM, a Z370 chipset, and an SM951 OEM PCI-E M.2 AHCI SSD.)
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How much the DDR4 RAMs cost? Motherboard cost isn't the biggest concern, it's DDR4 memory RAMS, so I'm sticking to DDR3 only for now and all the sockets using DDR3. And all the new leftover AM3+ motherboards appreciate their value and running at $250 now, which VirtualLarry declined to stock some, despite I already warned him.
 
I have an a8-3850 itx system, 8gb ram, 120gb ssd, uses the onboard video. works very well for a tv box. I got no complaints from fm1. its very good for a tv box
 
kwalkingcraze said:
How much the DDR4 RAMs cost? Motherboard cost isn't the biggest concern, it's DDR4 memory RAMS, so I'm sticking to DDR3 only for now and all the sockets using DDR3. And all the new leftover AM3+ motherboards appreciate their value and running at $250 now, which VirtualLarry declined to stock some, despite I already warned him.
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That's the thing... DDR4 prices have up and gone insane.

I'm not so sure about motherboards, though. I've got some Z97 ATX boards, BNIB in my FS thread, and despite Newegg marketplace prices of $400+, I have had any bites at $150 or so.
 
Yeah... no. The year is 2018, not 2011. C'mon Larry. You're not trying to outfit the third world. If someone would pick an inexpensive processor to power their system, this would not be it. There's a reason it's dirt cheap.
 
I finally put one of the A6-3600 quad-core APUs into a rig, at stock speed, with an SSD, running Windows 10, it's actually quite nice for a 1080P browser-box, with Firefox Nightly 59a1. I didn't really watch any videos though, but given that the iGPU is limited to 1080P display output, I don't think that online videos would be a problem, even if it has to software-decode them. (Maybe 1080P HEVC?)

Edit: with a 2x2GB DDR3 RAM kit ($20-ish on ebay.)
 
maddogmcgee said:
Why would you build a Llano...
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As DDR4 RAM prices continue to go up unfavorably, switching back to old FM1 (or latest FM2+ platform) looks more ethical each day. 16GB DDR3 is only $80 used, while 16GB DDR4 will touch $220 new by late-2018. I only paid $85 for 16GB DDR4 back on November 2016, this was the last and final DDR4 RAMs I bought. I have not looked another since.
 
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The legend lives on... 2018+ Gigabyte 78LMB-USB3 R2 AM3/AM3+ (just released) with Ryzen box packaging, this time with USB 3.1 port. I wonder whether this board works for Windows 10 this time?

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813145049

Let's put in all the $5 Athlon II X2 220 2.8GHz out there, a few can be unlocked to quad-core from dual-core, and bus-overclock up to 3.5GHz. Life's good, right? No more DDR4 price worry.

13-145-049-V05.jpg
 
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Interesting though, building AM3/AM3+ boards. Maybe there will be a fire-sale on FX CPUs, I can't imagine building AM3 rigs with anything less these days, if you want them to remain even tangentally relevant.

But still, with Ryzen 2200G for only $99, and a B350 micro-ATX on sale for $60 or $70, what's the point of AM3 again? Like going back to High School in your 40s. Sure, maybe some people want to do that, but... for most, it makes no sense.

Edit: Well, it's got a real IDE port on it, maybe it will be useful for data-recovery firms, or DVR mfgs.
Onboard SATA is still SATAII though, worthless board in this day and age.
 
VirtualLarry said:
Interesting though, building AM3/AM3+ boards. Maybe there will be a fire-sale on FX CPUs, I can't imagine building AM3 rigs with anything less these days, if you want them to remain even tangentally relevant.
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Do you really want to use a 125W 8 core FX chip on a cheapo motherboard with 4+1 VRMs? That's just asking for overheating and trouble. Power hungry CPUs plus bargain bin motherboards is a bad combination.
 
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