Newbie + Workout = Advice Needed

Overkiller

Platinum Member
Feb 22, 2003
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Hi All-

This is to those that have been doing it for a while and know what they are talking about.

-I eat healthy, take multi-vitamins, and run 2 miles at a time.
-I have been the same weight for about 5 years.
-I am 21, 5'8", 145 pds.
-I have recently started going to the gym 3x a week and was wondering about a few things.

I do not use free weights as generally I am on my own and I would prefer the machines. I do 3 reps of 10 on the machines with increasing weight each set. The first is the warm-up, 2nd is comfortably heavy, and the last is to failure.
I alternate upper and lower body along with different muscle groups so that I do not pull, rip, wear one out too fast.

Questions:

I do not have a lot of time to go through most of the BS out there so here are questions to those that have been building up for a while:

--What sort of protein supplement should i go for. Whey protein is the best? Any particular brand that I should be using? Links to purchase would be great (I have a "Vitamin Shoppe" nearby along with a GNC)

--Currently taking " From the Earth " Multivatins as they seemed to have the best balance of everything in the store. When I go to the bathroom afterwards the urine is very yellow no matter the amount of water I have drunk (normal? I presume just excess/unnecessary minerals/etc ). Here they are: Multivitamins

--Omega 3 Fish Oils are supposed to be good for the body. What about mercury content? Are there any that at least make an effort at guaranteeing a safer amount? Are they worth it?

--Any other supplements you can think of?

---Essentially I am looking to turn what I have into lean muscle and add more. I do not believe I have the body type to get too big but i would not mind bulking up to an extent (165-170) which is why I asked about the whey protein. I realize that the running might interfere with the weight lifting but I will keep the 2 miles as is.---

Thanks all
 

Koing

Elite Member <br> Super Moderator<br> Health and F
Oct 11, 2000
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Your not doing much training with the way your working. 3 sets should be 'work sets'.

Your warm up sets DO NOT COUNT to your 'training sets' as they are too low and 'warm you up for THAT specific exercise'.

My bro is 5"6 and @ 143lbs is stacked.

You need to eat a lot more food first and foremost. You can not gain mass without eating A LOT and PUTTING ON SOME FAT. Put on some fat and you will bulk out better.

This 'lean bulk' is mostly BS and 'marketing' for companies. Lean bulking is a LONG LONG AND DRAWN out process. It takes peoples years to put on lean muscle mass without adding fat. People FREAK OUT at the first sign of putting on any fat so they cut back on food = cut back on bulking = then they wonder WHY they can't getting bigger...

SQUAT if you don't do anything else. Squat. You don't need 5 exercises for your legs. Squats with Deadlifts on another session is MORE THEN ENOUGH for your legs.

The running will definatley interfere with gaining mass as it will eat in to your 'calorie' supply. Remember you only eat XXX amount per day so whatever you do exercise wise will eat in to it.

Eat your carbs. If you do not eat your carbs your body will use the protein for energy = bad as that will give you even less for the protein for repair and growth.

Learn how to use free weights. Just lift LESS until you are better at the exercise.

Go with any brand of why protein as long as the % is high. I don't take any supplements myself but most of the brands are similar, unless you want to spend a lot more for argueable results for the £££.

Koing
 

Gravity

Diamond Member
Mar 21, 2003
5,685
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Good work!!

I'd go to Sam's or COSTCO and get a 5 lb tub of protein powder for $20.00. You can shop GNC for brand names, MetRX is on sale for a few more days.

I think your vitamins are fine, I'd drop the fish oils and sub in Flaxseed oil. I'd also start taking ZMA at night before bed.

Get 7-8 hours of sleep per day and try to break you meals up to 4-6 meal intervals.

You're young so I wouldn't recommend Creatine or other supplements, your body is nearing its peak of testosterone producction so naturally, you'll put on weight.

Good luck!

Gravity
 

Sukhoi

Elite Member
Dec 5, 1999
15,348
106
106
I buy 10 lb bags of Optimum Nutrition double chocolate whey from www.bulknutrition.com. Get a 5 lb container first and then use the bags to refill it. The stuff mixes well and tastes good.

Use free weights!!!! Again. Use free weights!!!! About the only thing you really need a spotter for is bench press but you can still almost get to failure without a spotter. I used machines when I first starting lifting and I regret it now...almost like a waste of time.
 

Koing

Elite Member <br> Super Moderator<br> Health and F
Oct 11, 2000
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You don't have to go to failure...

The weights will go up over time and THAT is what matters. When you can say do 10reps x 3sets of this exercise well then it is time to move the weight up. You will probably only do 8 or maybe 7 o some of the sets but KEEP AT IT. Then when you can hit 10reps x 3 sets with that weight stay for a few sessions. Say 5-10 then move the weight up and start over again.

Koing
 

Literati

Golden Member
Jan 13, 2005
1,864
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Originally posted by: Sukhoi
Use free weights!!!!

Yup!

That and diet.

With those two my son, you will find your way in no time.

Learn the ways of the Jedi diet and freeweights and there's nothing you can't do!
 

Agnostos Insania

Golden Member
Oct 29, 2005
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Originally posted by: Koing

SQUAT if you don't do anything else. Squat. You don't need 5 exercises for your legs. Squats with Deadlifts on another session is MORE THEN ENOUGH for your legs.

I strongly disagree. Many, many times guys think that upper body is the most important thing in the world and pay very little attention to their lower body. They look like an action hero from the waist up but a woman from the waist down. Gyms are full of those types.
Leg curls, squats, lunges, leg extensions, calf raises are all good work-outs that lead to stronger and better-looking legs. Do those for 3 weeks and you'll already have stronger legs than most the guys at the gym.

Also, remember that your body can only absorb so many vitamins and protein in so much time. Many times people consume way too much protein that can be absorbed by the body at a time. I don't have the number, but I'll look for it right now.
 

rmrfhomeoops

Senior member
Jul 5, 2001
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Like to add one point not yet mentioned yet. Get enough rest so that your body will recover from the workout; usually 8 hours of sleep/day. Alternating between upper body and lower body is good routine if you just beginning to lift. Lifting 3x/weeks is good start. Be sure to have at least one day where you're not working out nor go out and run. Having this rest day will allow you to look forward to next workout as oppose to feel drained while working out.
 

Koing

Elite Member <br> Super Moderator<br> Health and F
Oct 11, 2000
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Originally posted by: Agnostos Insania
Originally posted by: Koing

SQUAT if you don't do anything else. Squat. You don't need 5 exercises for your legs. Squats with Deadlifts on another session is MORE THEN ENOUGH for your legs.

I strongly disagree. Many, many times guys think that upper body is the most important thing in the world and pay very little attention to their lower body. They look like an action hero from the waist up but a woman from the waist down. Gyms are full of those types.
Leg curls, squats, lunges, leg extensions, calf raises are all good work-outs that lead to stronger and better-looking legs. Do those for 3 weeks and you'll already have stronger legs than most the guys at the gym.

Also, remember that your body can only absorb so many vitamins and protein in so much time. Many times people consume way too much protein that can be absorbed by the body at a time. I don't have the number, but I'll look for it right now.

What are you disagreeing on?

Squat + Deadlift > leg curls, leg extensions (poor mans squat, no one will disagree with this one), calf raises (worthless exercise, you do realise that your 'calves' are almost basically set through your genetecs. Your calf muslces; gastrocmemius and soleus go through a very little rang of movement = poor for muscle growth but are consequently VERY VERY strong due to the short lever with your ankle and foot.). Lunches are alright but squat + deadlift are so much better then doing a lot.

You don't need to do a lot of exercises to work out properly.

Koing
 

Sukhoi

Elite Member
Dec 5, 1999
15,348
106
106
Alright question here on the calf stuff.

My right calf is significantly smaller than my left. I do not believe it is genetically different. When I was born my right ankle was all fvcked up and consequently my lower right leg was in casts for a couple of years. This meant that my right calf never really developed much. Since it shouldn't be genetically small but rather is small from disusage during the inital growing, can I fix that now? If I do extensive calf raises with just my right leg do you think it'd be possible to get it back up to normal size? Or am I just wasting my time?
 

Ricemarine

Lifer
Sep 10, 2004
10,507
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Meh, all I care about, is if I can lift more than the previous time...

bench pressing 150 lbs for a 5'6 asian isn't bad that weighs only 138 lbs.
 

ItTheCow

Senior member
Apr 7, 2002
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How long have you been using machines? If you're just starting out, I wouldn't object to using them. They'll serve to help you strengthen the basic muscles, but as you progress you'll want to start replacing your machines with free weights. That'll help ensure that your dominant side of your body won't be larger than your recessive side, and you'll work out a wider range of muscles.

If you're looking to bulk, eat a lot and do 3x6-8 reps, or even more sets. Also, it's very important to make sure that you do exercises with the correct form else you'll be cheating yourself.
 
Mar 9, 2005
2,809
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Originally posted by: Koing
Originally posted by: Agnostos Insania
Originally posted by: Koing

SQUAT if you don't do anything else. Squat. You don't need 5 exercises for your legs. Squats with Deadlifts on another session is MORE THEN ENOUGH for your legs.

I strongly disagree. Many, many times guys think that upper body is the most important thing in the world and pay very little attention to their lower body. They look like an action hero from the waist up but a woman from the waist down. Gyms are full of those types.
Leg curls, squats, lunges, leg extensions, calf raises are all good work-outs that lead to stronger and better-looking legs. Do those for 3 weeks and you'll already have stronger legs than most the guys at the gym.

Also, remember that your body can only absorb so many vitamins and protein in so much time. Many times people consume way too much protein that can be absorbed by the body at a time. I don't have the number, but I'll look for it right now.

What are you disagreeing on?

Squat + Deadlift > leg curls, leg extensions (poor mans squat, no one will disagree with this one), calf raises (worthless exercise, you do realise that your 'calves' are almost basically set through your genetecs. Your calf muslces; gastrocmemius and soleus go through a very little rang of movement = poor for muscle growth but are consequently VERY VERY strong due to the short lever with your ankle and foot.). Lunches are alright but squat + deadlift are so much better then doing a lot.

You don't need to do a lot of exercises to work out properly.

Koing

I have to agree witH Koing here
 

Koing

Elite Member <br> Super Moderator<br> Health and F
Oct 11, 2000
16,843
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Originally posted by: Sukhoi
Alright question here on the calf stuff.

My right calf is significantly smaller than my left. I do not believe it is genetically different. When I was born my right ankle was all fvcked up and consequently my lower right leg was in casts for a couple of years. This meant that my right calf never really developed much. Since it shouldn't be genetically small but rather is small from disusage during the inital growing, can I fix that now? If I do extensive calf raises with just my right leg do you think it'd be possible to get it back up to normal size? Or am I just wasting my time?

Your body will even itself up naturally. BUT you can focus on the right leg but the calves are very very hard to 'bulk' out much like a persons wrists/ forearms are. It is REALLY tough to work them they are such strong muscles (well not so much your forearms but they do little in the way of muscle movement).

Don't worry about it so much and it will catch up.

Koing
 

Overkiller

Platinum Member
Feb 22, 2003
2,461
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Thanks for everyone's responses. A couple of more points/questions.

-I have been running for a while but everyone is correct in assuming I have just started weight lifting.
-Eating more is not a problem.
-I have heard/read that fish oil is better for general health than the flaxseed that was recommended; with flaxseed also having some negative consequences. Should I just stay away from both altogether?
-Whey Protein it is.
-Any good sites detailing the various PROPER free-weight lifts? I would hate to be doing them with improper form which would be more damaging/or useless than doing them properly.
-Also, why is using free weights that much better than the machines? Couldn't you just offset the easier time with more weight or is it that you also have to balance your body during free-weights?

Essentially I need to get the most bang for the buck as time is valuable between work full-time and college at the same time (which is why I find the response that "my years of machine use was almost worthless" sort of saddening :()

I would want to avoid actually paying for a trainer to show me everything "properly" if I can just pick it up from here and there.

Thanks again for the input
 

drsafety

Senior member
Aug 23, 2005
456
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Originally posted by: Agnostos Insania
Originally posted by: Koing

SQUAT if you don't do anything else. Squat. You don't need 5 exercises for your legs. Squats with Deadlifts on another session is MORE THEN ENOUGH for your legs.

I strongly disagree. Many, many times guys think that upper body is the most important thing in the world and pay very little attention to their lower body. They look like an action hero from the waist up but a woman from the waist down. Gyms are full of those types.
Leg curls, squats, lunges, leg extensions, calf raises are all good work-outs that lead to stronger and better-looking legs. Do those for 3 weeks and you'll already have stronger legs than most the guys at the gym.

Also, remember that your body can only absorb so many vitamins and protein in so much time. Many times people consume way too much protein that can be absorbed by the body at a time. I don't have the number, but I'll look for it right now.

you disagree because you are ignorant.

Squats and deadlifts are essential for a lower body workout. Leg curls, lunges, and leg extensions are a distant second in terms of importance for weight gain/stregth increase.
 

cyclistca

Platinum Member
Dec 5, 2000
2,885
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81
Originally posted by: Overkiller
Thanks for everyone's responses. A couple of more points/questions.

-Also, why is using free weights that much better than the machines? Couldn't you just offset the easier time with more weight or is it that you also have to balance your body during free-weights?

I would want to avoid actually paying for a trainer to show me everything "properly" if I can just pick it up from here and there.

Thanks again for the input

Free weights are better because they bring more muscles into play. As well as working the specific muscles you work the supporting ones.

Most gyms will have monitors that you should be able to get weight lifting advice from without paying anything.

 

Legend

Platinum Member
Apr 21, 2005
2,254
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Those vitamins likely do more harm than good.


If you eat healthy, none of the ingredients in those vitamins will be deficient in your body. You're just spamming your body with a mess to clean up.
 

Agnostos Insania

Golden Member
Oct 29, 2005
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Originally posted by: Koing
What are you disagreeing on?

The lumping all the leg muscles into a single work-out. I might've learned wrong, but I was taught that muscle growth is about isolation. I think it's dumb to devote 90% of time to doing 30 different arm/chest routines and then lump all leg muscle growth into one simple movement. Maybe that's just me and the people I've talked to and the guides I've read... :confused:
Originally posted by: drsafety

you disagree because you are ignorant.

Squats and deadlifts are essential for a lower body workout. Leg curls, lunges, and leg extensions are a distant second in terms of importance for weight gain/stregth increase.

Thanks for the lovely remark. I expect nothing else from the people of this board.
I never said squats and deadlifts were bad, but I did say you shouldn't be doing one single routine for legs.
 
Mar 9, 2005
2,809
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I think people should stop coming here for exercise advice and go to an EXERCISE board. This thread always start trouble.
 

Agnostos Insania

Golden Member
Oct 29, 2005
1,207
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Originally posted by: shortspanishguy
I think people should stop coming here for exercise advice and go to an EXERCISE board. This thread always start trouble.

Good idea. The unbridled arrogance and pettiness of the average AT member is ill-suited for arguments.
 

dxkj

Lifer
Feb 17, 2001
11,772
2
81
Originally posted by: Agnostos Insania
Originally posted by: Koing
What are you disagreeing on?

The lumping all the leg muscles into a single work-out. I might've learned wrong, but I was taught that muscle growth is about isolation. I think it's dumb to devote 90% of time to doing 30 different arm/chest routines and then lump all leg muscle growth into one simple movement. Maybe that's just me and the people I've talked to and the guides I've read... :confused:
Originally posted by: drsafety

you disagree because you are ignorant.

Squats and deadlifts are essential for a lower body workout. Leg curls, lunges, and leg extensions are a distant second in terms of importance for weight gain/stregth increase.

Thanks for the lovely remark. I expect nothing else from the people of this board.
I never said squats and deadlifts were bad, but I did say you shouldn't be doing one single routine for legs.



I may be wrong here, but I think the point was if you just do squats and deadlifts, you will have covered 90% of the various workouts you would need to work your legs.... Similarly if I was st arting a beginning workout, I wouldnt do 5 different chest exercises 5 bicepexercises, etc..

I
 

dxkj

Lifer
Feb 17, 2001
11,772
2
81
Originally posted by: ItTheCow
How long have you been using machines? If you're just starting out, I wouldn't object to using them. They'll serve to help you strengthen the basic muscles, but as you progress you'll want to start replacing your machines with free weights. That'll help ensure that your dominant side of your body won't be larger than your recessive side, and you'll work out a wider range of muscles.

If you're looking to bulk, eat a lot and do 3x6-8 reps, or even more sets. Also, it's very important to make sure that you do exercises with the correct form else you'll be cheating yourself.

I disagree, dont start out on machines because you WONT be strengthening the control muscles that are needed for higher weights... if anything just start much lower with free weights and build up or else you will have to drp back down again when you switch to free weights because you have little/no control built to maintain the form, or you end up breaking the form and diminishing your results.
 

Legend

Platinum Member
Apr 21, 2005
2,254
1
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Originally posted by: Pepsi90919
it's the 8,333% of your daily recommended intake of B12 that's turning your urine yellow.


Wow, I didn't see that one.

Stop taking those bullshit vitamins.


I think these vitamins are a much better strategy:

http://dan.xtend-life.com/products.asp?product=tb&page=mens_plus

Offer a broad arrange of nutrients found in fruits and vegetables that we don't get everyday. Much better than supplying yourself with 2.5 months worth of minerals per day. It really is bad for you. There was a study showing that 500 mcg of vitamin C at once makes Vitamin C act as an oxidant, the exact opposite of what it should do.

http://www.biomed.lib.umn.edu/hmed/1998/04/19980409_proox.html

oxidizing DNA = aging.

But for body building, that's not a cost effective way to benefit it. Load up on healthy foods, whey protein, fish oil or walnuts, etc. Screw vitamins