New start-up's battery may triple EV range

werepossum

Elite Member
Jul 10, 2006
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http://www.designnews.com/author.as...lectronics+&+Test&doc_id=240075&page_number=1


A startup company has created a low-cost electric car battery with an energy density they say is almost three times as high as that of the Nissan Leaf battery.

California-based Envia Systems said that in tests performed under the sponsorship of the US Advanced Research Projects Agency, its new battery achieved energy densities of about 400Wh/kg. If the company is able to carry its battery's energy levels forward to high production volumes, it could enable creation of electric cars with a 300-mile all-electric range. What's more, Envia said it could create the new battery for less than half the cost of existing technology.

"If you double the energy density, then the amount of active material in the cell is cut in half," Atul Kapadia, chairman and CEO of Envia Systems, told us. "So if you have the same material, your cost gets reduced by half."

The creation of such a battery would be a huge step forward for the electric vehicle (EV) community. Today, electric cars are limited by short range and high battery costs. The Leaf, for example, has a range of 73 miles to 100 miles, and its battery offers an energy density of about 140Wh/kg. Costs are more difficult to gauge, but big, cooled, battery packs with structural protection and electronic control can cost as much as $1,000/kWh, while cells alone have been known to sell for $280/kWh from some overseas suppliers.

Thought I'd put this in P&N since, although it is automobile related, it's also news and relevant to many ATP&N threads. IF it holds up to production in yield, cost, capacity, deep cycle capacity and life, this is exactly the kind of game changing breakthrough that moves people into a new technology, especially combined with high gas prices. It uses silicon, carbon, and manganese, all fairly inexpensive materials, with some cobalt and nickle. More than double the capacity, less expensive to build - this is where battery technology needs to be to provide practical electric and hybrid electric vehicles.
 

Thump553

Lifer
Jun 2, 2000
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Very interesting. It's little known, but noone has made any quantum leap type advance in batteries in decades, and for years battery companies, universities, etc. have been trying hard to do so.

Let's hope this is real, and not a cold fusion sort of thing.
 

Doppel

Lifer
Feb 5, 2011
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Articles like this are thrown out constantly. There are so many promising technologies for this but until they are delivered a reasonable prices they are just pipe dreams. I read a couple years ago about nano technology increasing capacity by 10X. It means nothing until it's here.
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
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Hopefully it pans out and/or doesn't have some downside that negates its' advantages.
 

Howard

Lifer
Oct 14, 1999
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If only we took the DoD's money and put it into this, we could've severed all ties with the ME long ago.
 

Nebor

Lifer
Jun 24, 2003
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If only we took the DoD's money and put it into this, we could've severed all ties with the ME long ago.

I agree, the weaponization possibilities of this technology could be enormous. Though rather than cut ties, this technology could enable us to conquer the entire middle east.
 

woolfe9999

Diamond Member
Mar 28, 2005
7,164
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Articles like this are thrown out constantly. There are so many promising technologies for this but until they are delivered a reasonable prices they are just pipe dreams. I read a couple years ago about nano technology increasing capacity by 10X. It means nothing until it's here.

Yeah was going to say something similar to this. Most of these new technologies highlighted in articles do not pan out. Still, some small percentage pan out as advertised, and some percentage are not as good as advertised but still better than what's currently out there. Would be very cool if this is even half true.
 

hal2kilo

Lifer
Feb 24, 2009
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Aikouka

Lifer
Nov 27, 2001
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...and life...

I read what you quoted, and unless I skimmed over it, I noticed that this is one factor that they didn't mention. Is there a possibility that these batteries don't have the necessary longevity yet?
 

tweaker2

Lifer
Aug 5, 2000
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@ werepossum - Nice find. Thanks. I hope the technology trickle down includes ultra long life batteries for power hungry hi-perf laptops. That would encourage gaming laptop makers to really go wild with their performance capabilities. This has been a sore point for me for the longest time.
 

Mani

Diamond Member
Aug 9, 2001
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I'm friends with the co-founder. He's got a LOT of very interested buyers and is about to become a pretty wealthy guy.
 

Generator

Senior member
Mar 4, 2005
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Even a minor improvement in charge of batteries could have a exponential leap in our every day lives. Imagine a battery that charges in 15 minutes and doesn't require another charge in a month. The next year 6 months, then the third year...a battery in name only because it never discharges in ones lifetime.
 

Exterous

Super Moderator
Jun 20, 2006
20,374
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If only we took the DoD's money and put it into this, we could've severed all ties with the ME long ago.

If only we took the Social Security's money and put it into this, we could've severed all ties with the ME long ago

If only we took the Medicare's money and put it into this, we could've severed all ties with the ME long ago

If only we took the Political Lobby's money and put it into this, we could've severed all ties with the ME long ago

If only we took the SuperPac's money and put it into this, we could've severed all ties with the ME long ago

It comes down to priorities and we have chosen to not invest a lot of money in a high risk investment. That money could have come from many sources other than the DoD is we really wanted to
 

werepossum

Elite Member
Jul 10, 2006
29,873
463
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How many pounds of Chinese rare earth materials does it require?
None; there are no rare earths used.

I read what you quoted, and unless I skimmed over it, I noticed that this is one factor that they didn't mention. Is there a possibility that these batteries don't have the necessary longevity yet?
Real world life is of course still an unknown, but the ARPA grant program actually had stringent life cycle requirements which Envia satisfied.

I'm friends with the co-founder. He's got a LOT of very interested buyers and is about to become a pretty wealthy guy.
As well he should, assuming this holds up.
 

Aikouka

Lifer
Nov 27, 2001
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Real world life is of course still an unknown, but the ARPA grant program actually had stringent life cycle requirements which Envia satisfied.

That's good to hear at least. I certainly don't mean to be a Negative Nancy about it, but most products that I hear about in regard to battery technology tend to follow the two-out-of-three problem where you can almost always get two out of three of the benefits (for batteries: capacity, price, life).

I've probably mentioned it in a few threads on things such as EVs or the efficient vehicle tax credits, but I would definitely much rather see money go toward battery technology or other technologies required for "greener tech." I get the feeling that the tax credit was only done because it's much easier to show how "green" an administration is since it's much easier to rely on an end-product than to actually do your legwork and find viable investment opportunities (Solyndra anyone? :p).

Is there any word on whether this technology can apply to smaller batteries such as those in laptops or mobile devices?
 

werepossum

Elite Member
Jul 10, 2006
29,873
463
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Articles like this are thrown out constantly. There are so many promising technologies for this but until they are delivered a reasonable prices they are just pipe dreams. I read a couple years ago about nano technology increasing capacity by 10X. It means nothing until it's here.
True, but the ARPA program required actual constructed batteries, not merely demonstration of lab technology. So this is a different critter from your typical lab announcement about an improvement in one particular component of a battery, it's an announcement about an improvement in the battery as an assembly. Interestingly enough, one major part of this technological breakthrough is in nano-scale construction of the anode and cathode to provide conductivity, longevity and fire resistance in a scalable-to-production package.

If only we took the DoD's money and put it into this, we could've severed all ties with the ME long ago.
This was done in part with an ARPA grant, which is of course the sister to DARPA, as well as with some Government Motors investment. The military is very interested in hybrid vehicles. In my opinion, funding this kind of application research (in conjunction with basic research of course) is a much better use of tax dollars than is subsidizing existing products which are not yet commercially viable, such as Solyndra. It's axiomatic that as a society we can't adopt technology that requires subsidization to be viable; it should also be axiomatic that this kind of technological break-through, more performance for less money and resources, is what drives societal progress. I don't know I'd place it even with, say, the spray jet carburetor in internal combustion engines, but assuming it holds up it's going to be close. By that I mean that before the spray jet carburetor IC engines had significant problems and limitations; whereas after the spray jet carburetor IC engines became practical for a wide variety of applications. A $30,000 EV with an 80 mile range (to use Envia's example) has significant limitations and is practical for only a few applications, whereas a $20,000 EV with an 300 mile range is practical for many applications. Commercial vehicles are another major market; currently the size and cost of batteries prevents heavy vehicles, which are often used only in local markets or on fixed routes, from utilizing all-electric drive. This might well allow those vehicles to be all-electric, reducing local pollution, increasing overall efficiency, and insulating the operators from petroleum price fluctuations. One can easily imagine buses and delivery vans where quick-swap batteries are exchanged at each depot stop and provide all the energy.

This has big implications for hybrids too. Electric vehicles by their nature are best suited for lower speed city driving where regenerative braking recovers some of your expensive energy, but most vehicles encounter a mix of driving conditions. On open roads the batteries are just dead weight, so cutting that weight in half (not to mention cutting cost) reduces the efficiency penalty. Alternately, a manufacturer might choose to double energy storage, to use electric energy for most if not virtually all city driving.

I read what you quoted, and unless I skimmed over it, I noticed that this is one factor that they didn't mention. Is there a possibility that these batteries don't have the necessary longevity yet?
Charge-discharge cycle life was part of the ARPA requirements. The technology looks promising, it's just that we don't yet know the real world cycle life. There are numerous things that can still go wrong. For instance, failure of the nano-layering techniques in production scale might significantly cut life, or there might be idiosyncratic problems with a particular usage aspect necessary to automobile usage. It might work great with full recharge at high voltage, but not so great with incremental charges at lower voltage from on-board regenerative braking. But again, this is an actual battery being tested, not merely a component. While it might possibly end up being useless for EV or hybrid vehicles, a technological jump like this is virtually certain to have significant commercial and/or military applications. It's a good thing.

EDIT: We crossed posts, but I definitely agree with your last post. This technology seems to deliver on all three, but it's too soon to know for sure. As for smaller batteries, the technology can definitely work for smaller batteries, but perhaps not for small AND low cost batteries. The nano-layering technology seems to me to be quite expensive for use on small, low cost batteries, but we'll have to see how well it works. Some incredibly involved technology can be automated and produce extremely detailed parts at very low cost (e.g. CPUs and GPUs) so it might well prove to be expandable into even the lowest cost Li-Ion batteries given the reduction in materials.
 
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Genx87

Lifer
Apr 8, 2002
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I dont want to derail this too much. But why hasnt fuel cell technology been getting press or as much attention as battery? It seems to me it solves a lot of the issues with moving to another source of energy for cars and trucks where battery technology sounds like an uphill struggle.

I look at range as a big drawback of battery technology. Fuel Cell technology can solve that today. The ability to refuel the car like we do with fossil fuels in a short time span is solved by fuel cell technology. And there isnt as big a disposal issue with a fuel cell compared to battery technology. And the emissions in a fuel cell should be low to none where battery requires a coal plant to be a source of power. I acknolwedge the issue of a lack of infrastructure is a problem with fuel cell technology. But that can be changed within a few years of building it.
 

MovingTarget

Diamond Member
Jun 22, 2003
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Lets hope this pans out, it would be good news, not just for cars.

Indeed. But let's not underestimate the effect that this would have on electric cars should it pan out. It is already getting to a point were a small electric is practical for a lot of people's commute. Even if this battery would only double EV range, imagine how many more i-MiEVs, Leafs, or Volts would be sold - and how that would affect city air quality or people's pocketbooks by not using gasoline for transport.
 

K1052

Elite Member
Aug 21, 2003
46,066
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I dont want to derail this too much. But why hasnt fuel cell technology been getting press or as much attention as battery? It seems to me it solves a lot of the issues with moving to another source of energy for cars and trucks where battery technology sounds like an uphill struggle.

I look at range as a big drawback of battery technology. Fuel Cell technology can solve that today. The ability to refuel the car like we do with fossil fuels in a short time span is solved by fuel cell technology. And there isnt as big a disposal issue with a fuel cell compared to battery technology. And the emissions in a fuel cell should be low to none where battery requires a coal plant to be a source of power. I acknolwedge the issue of a lack of infrastructure is a problem with fuel cell technology. But that can be changed within a few years of building it.

Hydrogen infrastructure is going to be a pretty big ticket. Electric and NG vehicles are much easier to deploy since their fueling infrastructure largely already exists. Also there is the problem that most hydrogen for industrial use is made by steam reforming natural gas so we are still stuck on fossil fuels.
 

Atreus21

Lifer
Aug 21, 2007
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Yawn. Let me know when I can implant it in my chest and build a flight-suit around it.

Whatever happened to those insects-that-produce-gasoline technology?