New Orleans Still Needs Help

thecoroner

Banned
Feb 2, 2006
153
0
0
I am a New Orleans area resident and while people have done a lot to help out Katrina survivors, not nearly enough aid has been given. This is mostly the thought of the federal government of course.

1. Schools, hospitals, and other organizations are not getting the money FEMA has promised them. In fact, large New Orleans hospitals (the only few left open) are running very short on money and are having trouble paying their doctors!

2. Hurricane season is 3 months away. There are thousands of people living in tents and small trailers. Little has been done to fix the levees to withstand another hurricane.

3. Believe it or not, New Orleans is still over due for a major hit. The last time they were hit by a hurricane was in 1963 (Hurricane Betsey). That hurricane went up the mouth of the Mississippi River. Katrina, on the other hand, did not directly hit New Orleans.

4. People are not getting money for their insurance companies. Apparantly your in good hands with Allstate and State Farm is your neighbor as long as you want to wait a long time before getting your check.

5. FEMA has no clue what they are doing. They worked fine until George Bush put them under the Department of Homeland Security instead of letting them be their own department. They literally waste millions of dollars. One stupid thing I remember they're doing is instead of hiring contractors from hurricane-effected areas, they're bringing in contractors from out of state!

It's a shame that George Bush wants to play tic tac toe in Iraq when our own people need help. 1400 people and counting have died from Katrina (bodies are still being found believe it or not) and 2700 people are still missing. Many more have lost their homes. Like I said earlier, people are literally living in tents!

Post what you think here. I've given a bit of what I've heard and know of about Katrina. I live about 30 miles from New Orleans. Lucky for me, my town made it out ok for the most part. The only damage suffered to my house is the loss of two trees and the fact it needs a new roof now.
 

her209

No Lifer
Oct 11, 2000
56,336
11
0
Originally posted by: thecoroner
It's a shame that George Bush wants to play tic tac toe in Iraq when our own people need help. 1400 people and counting have died from Katrina (bodies are still being found believe it or not) and 2700 people are still missing. Many more have lost their homes. Like I said earlier, people are literally living in tents!
Stupid liberals blame everything that has gone bad on Bush.

(Sorry, couldn't resist)

On a more serious note, its a shame that the Federal government isn't stepping in to do more for the victims of Katrina... especially with the poor performance of FEMA as of late.
 

glenn1

Lifer
Sep 6, 2000
25,383
1,013
126
On a more serious note, its a shame that the Federal government isn't stepping in to do more for the victims of Katrina...

Personally I'd just as soon see the federal government evacuate it and let Lake Ponchatrain take it. Create a New New Orleans if you must, but let the old one die, it was mortally wounded by the corruption of its government anyway.
 

RichardE

Banned
Dec 31, 2005
10,246
2
0
Originally posted by: glenn1
On a more serious note, its a shame that the Federal government isn't stepping in to do more for the victims of Katrina...

Personally I'd just as soon see the federal government evacuate it and let Lake Ponchatrain take it. Create a New New Orleans if you must, but let the old one die, it was mortally wounded by the corruption of its government anyway.

Might as well just make a new American too!
 

thecoroner

Banned
Feb 2, 2006
153
0
0
Originally posted by: her209
Originally posted by: thecoroner
It's a shame that George Bush wants to play tic tac toe in Iraq when our own people need help. 1400 people and counting have died from Katrina (bodies are still being found believe it or not) and 2700 people are still missing. Many more have lost their homes. Like I said earlier, people are literally living in tents!
Stupid liberals blame everything that has gone bad on Bush.

(Sorry, couldn't resist)

On a more serious note, its a shame that the Federal government isn't stepping in to do more for the victims of Katrina... especially with the poor performance of FEMA as of late.


No offense, but I think Bush bears some of the responsibility here. I agree sometimes Bush is needlessly bashed (but hey it can be fun lol).

1. In recent terms, he seems to have forgotten about Katrina. In his State of the Union address, he made absolutely no mention of Katrina or even hurricanes or New Orleans. His only reference to Louisiana was about something someone at a Baptist church in Baton Rouge (the capital) said.

2. He appointed a horse rancher as the head of FEMA. No further explanation needed!

3. Numerous other things that have slipped my weary mind for now.
 

rahvin

Elite Member
Oct 10, 1999
8,475
1
0
It's not the responsibility of government to rebuild a destroyed city. Government has the responsibility to repair infastructure (roads, highways, bridges), not improve levees that keep a city dry that is below sea level, it's also not their responsiblity to bail out hospitals or homeowners. Those tasks lie with the residents of new orleans.

The smart residents have moved on and relocated, they should have never pumped the city dry.
 

judasmachine

Diamond Member
Sep 15, 2002
8,515
3
81
It's no longer politically relevant. And it already proved to be a big embarrassment for the local, state, and federal governments, so they are going to stay away and pray it goes away. We saw the storm coming, and could tell it was going to be a doozy and everyone from many residents to the president sat on their hands, no one with a political career wants to replay that. But the worst thing about this is that if someone was to 'save' NO from it's current problems, they'd have all the votes they could stand.
 

loup garou

Lifer
Feb 17, 2000
35,132
1
81
Originally posted by: rahvin
not improve levees that keep a city dry that is below sea level
Yes, it is, considering New Orleans is protected by federally installed and maintained levees that are supposed to be able to withstand a Category 3 hurricane, which Katrina was when it made landfall and they failed.
it's also not their responsiblity to bail out...homeowners.
Yes, it is, if the homeowner had federally funded flood insurance (surprise, people are still waiting for their insurance checks, do be fair fault lies both with insurance companies & the government).
The smart residents have moved on and relocated, they should have never pumped the city dry.
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA....man, you don't know how funny the first part of that sentence is. And just how sad the second part is.
 

zendari

Banned
May 27, 2005
6,558
0
0
Originally posted by: RichardE
Originally posted by: glenn1
On a more serious note, its a shame that the Federal government isn't stepping in to do more for the victims of Katrina...

Personally I'd just as soon see the federal government evacuate it and let Lake Ponchatrain take it. Create a New New Orleans if you must, but let the old one die, it was mortally wounded by the corruption of its government anyway.

Might as well just make a new American too!

I didnt realize america was hit by a hurricane.

The city is lost.
 

thecoroner

Banned
Feb 2, 2006
153
0
0
New Orleans is the second largest port in the world (the title of largest belongs to Rotterdam). It is also important historically. Before Katrina, it was the 28th most populous city in the United States.

And besides, we PAY TAXES TO THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT. How is someone we pay money to for protection not responsible for helping us after a hurricane?

And like loup garou said, the federal government didn't do its job with the levees. They should have withstoud the hurricane (it was under category 3 strength in New Orleans). The Army Core of Engineers did a piss poor job. Why are we constructing our levees with dirt and steel when the Netherlands have much more advanced levees than us? Are we not the richest nation in the world?
 

charrison

Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
17,033
1
81
Originally posted by: thecoroner
New Orleans is the second largest port in the world (the title of largest belongs to Rotterdam). It is also important historically. Before Katrina, it was the 28th most populous city in the United States.

And besides, we PAY TAXES TO THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT. How is someone we pay money to for protection not responsible for helping us after a hurricane?

And like loup garou said, the federal government didn't do its job with the levees. They should have withstoud the hurricane (it was under category 3 strength in New Orleans). The Army Core of Engineers did a piss poor job. Why are we constructing our levees with dirt and steel when the Netherlands have much more advanced levees than us? Are we not the richest nation in the world?



The better question is, why is the state of LA leaving something as important as levee that protects the 2nd largest port in the world to the federal goverment. And just as an FYI when the levees were built, there was no such thing as a rated cat 4 or cat5 hurricane.
 

loup garou

Lifer
Feb 17, 2000
35,132
1
81
Originally posted by: charrison
Originally posted by: thecoroner
New Orleans is the second largest port in the world (the title of largest belongs to Rotterdam). It is also important historically. Before Katrina, it was the 28th most populous city in the United States.

And besides, we PAY TAXES TO THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT. How is someone we pay money to for protection not responsible for helping us after a hurricane?

And like loup garou said, the federal government didn't do its job with the levees. They should have withstoud the hurricane (it was under category 3 strength in New Orleans). The Army Core of Engineers did a piss poor job. Why are we constructing our levees with dirt and steel when the Netherlands have much more advanced levees than us? Are we not the richest nation in the world?



The better question is, why is the state of LA leaving something as important as levee that protects the 2nd largest port in the world to the federal goverment. And just as an FYI when the levees were built, there was no such thing as a rated cat 4 or cat5 hurricane.
Because Louisiana cannot afford to maintain them themselves.

However, if Louisiana got a fair cut of far-offshore oil and gas royalties, they could.
 

charrison

Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
17,033
1
81
Originally posted by: loup garou
Originally posted by: charrison
Originally posted by: thecoroner
New Orleans is the second largest port in the world (the title of largest belongs to Rotterdam). It is also important historically. Before Katrina, it was the 28th most populous city in the United States.

And besides, we PAY TAXES TO THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT. How is someone we pay money to for protection not responsible for helping us after a hurricane?

And like loup garou said, the federal government didn't do its job with the levees. They should have withstoud the hurricane (it was under category 3 strength in New Orleans). The Army Core of Engineers did a piss poor job. Why are we constructing our levees with dirt and steel when the Netherlands have much more advanced levees than us? Are we not the richest nation in the world?



The better question is, why is the state of LA leaving something as important as levee that protects the 2nd largest port in the world to the federal goverment. And just as an FYI when the levees were built, there was no such thing as a rated cat 4 or cat5 hurricane.
Because Louisiana cannot afford to maintain them themselves.

However, if Louisiana got a fair cut of far-offshore oil and gas royalties, they could.



That is BS. A new levee system would only cost a few billion over the course of several years. Small fee attached to that 2nd largest port or all the oil and gas would easily pay for such a project. However a several billion project over several years is quite affordable by a state. LA is just looking for someone else to build what they need.
 

Genx87

Lifer
Apr 8, 2002
41,091
513
126
Originally posted by: thecoroner
New Orleans is the second largest port in the world (the title of largest belongs to Rotterdam). It is also important historically. Before Katrina, it was the 28th most populous city in the United States.

And besides, we PAY TAXES TO THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT. How is someone we pay money to for protection not responsible for helping us after a hurricane?

And like loup garou said, the federal government didn't do its job with the levees. They should have withstoud the hurricane (it was under category 3 strength in New Orleans). The Army Core of Engineers did a piss poor job. Why are we constructing our levees with dirt and steel when the Netherlands have much more advanced levees than us? Are we not the richest nation in the world?


We pay taxes as well and wonder why the money is being put into a sinkhole in a swamp.
If I go and build a house below the water table and it floods out should you pay for me to have it rebuilt?
 

thecoroner

Banned
Feb 2, 2006
153
0
0
The better question is, why is the state of LA leaving something as important as levee that protects the 2nd largest port in the world to the federal goverment. And just as an FYI when the levees were built, there was no such thing as a rated cat 4 or cat5 hurricane.

Easy, it's called money. Louisiana is one of the poorest states in the country. They can't afford the whole thing by themselves.

If terrorists destroyed 3/4 of New York City tomorrow morning, would you expect New York to pay for it entirely because they knew they were a big target for terrorism?


 

Genx87

Lifer
Apr 8, 2002
41,091
513
126
Originally posted by: thecoroner
The better question is, why is the state of LA leaving something as important as levee that protects the 2nd largest port in the world to the federal goverment. And just as an FYI when the levees were built, there was no such thing as a rated cat 4 or cat5 hurricane.

Easy, it's called money. Louisiana is one of the poorest states in the country. They can't afford the whole thing by themselves.

If terrorists destroyed 3/4 of New York City tomorrow morning, would you expect New York to pay for it entirely because they knew they were a big target for terrorism?

If 3/4ths of NYC was destroyed tomorrow that means a nuke just went off and nobody will be living there anytime soon.

 

rahvin

Elite Member
Oct 10, 1999
8,475
1
0
Originally posted by: loup garou
Yes, it is, considering New Orleans is protected by federally installed and maintained levees that are supposed to be able to withstand a Category 3 hurricane, which Katrina was when it made landfall.

The Army Core of Engineers (ACE) is responsible for the maintence of the navigable channels. They maintain the levees to protect the mississipi channel. The levee's that breached were on canals that I doubt they have any responsibility for. Yes the ACE may have built the original levees and likely constructed the ones on the canal, but they aren't responsible for them. The city was and is most likely responsible for them.

Originally posted by: loup garou
Yes, it is, if the homeowner had federally funded flood insurance (surprise, people are still waiting for their insurance checks, do be fair fault lies both with insurance companies & the government).

Many weren't upto date on payment of the insurance and won't be getting checks. Those that deserve checks and haven't received them should, no question about that.

And as far as your little humor keep in mind I was talking about moving on with their lives, not moving their property.
 

loup garou

Lifer
Feb 17, 2000
35,132
1
81
Originally posted by: charrison
Originally posted by: loup garou
Originally posted by: charrison
Originally posted by: thecoroner
New Orleans is the second largest port in the world (the title of largest belongs to Rotterdam). It is also important historically. Before Katrina, it was the 28th most populous city in the United States.

And besides, we PAY TAXES TO THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT. How is someone we pay money to for protection not responsible for helping us after a hurricane?

And like loup garou said, the federal government didn't do its job with the levees. They should have withstoud the hurricane (it was under category 3 strength in New Orleans). The Army Core of Engineers did a piss poor job. Why are we constructing our levees with dirt and steel when the Netherlands have much more advanced levees than us? Are we not the richest nation in the world?



The better question is, why is the state of LA leaving something as important as levee that protects the 2nd largest port in the world to the federal goverment. And just as an FYI when the levees were built, there was no such thing as a rated cat 4 or cat5 hurricane.
Because Louisiana cannot afford to maintain them themselves.

However, if Louisiana got a fair cut of far-offshore oil and gas royalties, they could.



That is BS. A new levee system would only cost a few billion over the course of several years. Small fee attached to that 2nd largest port or all the oil and gas would easily pay for such a project. However a several billion project over several years is quite affordable by a state. LA is just looking for someone else to build what they need.
A new Cat5 levee system would cost tens of billions of dollars over a period of decades.
Right now the state can't even pay FEMA back because it has next to no income.

Right now, it is the federal government's responsibility to fix what is currently broken and bring it up to the state it should have been when Katrina struck. They are doing so, which is great. I would find an arrangement where LA gets a respectable cut of offshore oil and gas royalties and provides a good part of that to a new levee system a more than agreeable compromise.
 

jimkyser

Senior member
Nov 13, 2004
547
0
0
Originally posted by: charrison
The better question is, why is the state of LA leaving something as important as levee that protects the 2nd largest port in the world to the federal goverment. And just as an FYI when the levees were built, there was no such thing as a rated cat 4 or cat5 hurricane.

It's simple. Many of these large 'public works projects' like dams and levees are built and controlled by the Army Corps of Engineers. And they don't give up that control willingly.

The truly sad thing is that outside of NO, like along the southern LA and MS coast, many people are being denied insurance coverage because the the insurance companies have claimed the storm surge was a flood, not a hurricane and these people only have hurricane insurance. Something like 90% of the people with damaged homes in southern MS fall into this category. They will pay to repair a damaged roof, but not the interior of your home if there was flooding. Of course, that assumes you even have a roof. Along Route 90 in southern MS there's not many buildings left standing for the first 3 or 4 blocks. Those that are tend to be larger hotels, though they are still mostly damaged beyond repair.

And from what I saw last week, first hand, NO is still largely a ghost town. Many huge apartment complexes sit damaged, unlivable and vacant. Same for many busnesses. The few cars you see in the apartment complex parking lots are covered in dirt from being submerged.
 

loup garou

Lifer
Feb 17, 2000
35,132
1
81
Originally posted by: rahvin
Originally posted by: loup garou
Yes, it is, considering New Orleans is protected by federally installed and maintained levees that are supposed to be able to withstand a Category 3 hurricane, which Katrina was when it made landfall.

The Army Core of Engineers (ACE) is responsible for the maintence of the navigable channels. They maintain the levees to protect the mississipi channel. The levee's that breached were on canals that I doubt they have any responsibility for. Yes the ACE may have built the original levees and likely constructed the ones on the canal, but they aren't responsible for them. The city was and is most likely responsible for them.
Actually it is an unbearably complicated and beauracratic program shared by both the local levee districts and the ACE. Yes, the majority of the maintenance and inspection is done by the Orleans Levee Board. The ACE designed and built all the levees. Maintenance problems did not cause the failures, design problems did.

Originally posted by: loup garou
Yes, it is, if the homeowner had federally funded flood insurance (surprise, people are still waiting for their insurance checks, do be fair fault lies both with insurance companies & the government).

Many weren't upto date on payment of the insurance and won't be getting checks. Those that deserve checks and haven't received them should, no question about that.[/quote]
Yay, we agree on something!
And as far as your little humor keep in mind I was talking about moving on with their lives, not moving their property.
You said they relocated.
 

Queasy

Moderator<br>Console Gaming
Aug 24, 2001
31,796
2
0
Originally posted by: thecoroner
5. FEMA has no clue what they are doing. They worked fine until George Bush put them under the Department of Homeland Security instead of letting them be their own department. They literally waste millions of dollars. One stupid thing I remember they're doing is instead of hiring contractors from hurricane-effected areas, they're bringing in contractors from out of state!

I don't agree with the whole Homeland Security thing either (larger bureaucracy) but it wasn't just Bush. Democrats were pushing for it too. I actually laughed at the criticisms of Hillary Clinton and others about FEMA being in the Dept. of Homeland Security since they were just as responsible for its creation.

Many more have lost their homes. Like I said earlier, people are literally living in tents!
My Dad is down in LA right now. His company is contracting with FEMA to setup the travel trailers for people who's homes have been damaged or lost. He's got guys working for him all across the state. His number one complaint - Local Louisiana politicians and bureaucrats. They make his and others work more difficult through incompetence, bureaucracy, and corruption.

 

jimkyser

Senior member
Nov 13, 2004
547
0
0
Originally posted by: rahvin
The Army Core of Engineers (ACE) is responsible for the maintence of the navigable channels. They maintain the levees to protect the mississipi channel. The levee's that breached were on canals that I doubt they have any responsibility for. Yes the ACE may have built the original levees and likely constructed the ones on the canal, but they aren't responsible for them. The city was and is most likely responsible for them.

Originally posted by: loup garou
Yes, it is, if the homeowner had federally funded flood insurance (surprise, people are still waiting for their insurance checks, do be fair fault lies both with insurance companies & the government).

Many weren't upto date on payment of the insurance and won't be getting checks. Those that deserve checks and haven't received them should, no question about that.

And as far as your little humor keep in mind I was talking about moving on with their lives, not moving their property.

No, the ACE was responsible for the levees. The had a block of money to improve them that wass taken away a year or two ago.

And the line about being behind on insurance is just crap. I was just down there for a week helping people who the insurance companies are screwing over fix there houses. The insurance companies paid an 86 year old lady on a fixed income, who paid her insurance premiums on time for 40+ years, $623.14 to cover damage to her house in Biloxi, MS. The damage ruined all of the flooring, all of the walls, all of the applicances and a portion of the roof. Then they expect her to drive to Hattiesburg if she want to protest. The loser agency doesn't even dare show their face in town.

Then there was the family in Gulfport. The hurricane damaged their roof. Water got into the attic and soaked all of the ceiling wallboard. Then it collapsed and flooded all that was below it. They have estimates to repair the house and they're all over $60k. The insurance company wants to give them $12k.
 

loup garou

Lifer
Feb 17, 2000
35,132
1
81
Originally posted by: Queasy
Many more have lost their homes. Like I said earlier, people are literally living in tents!
My Dad is down in LA right now. His company is contracting with FEMA to setup the travel trailers for people who's homes have been damaged or lost. He's got guys working for him all across the state. His number one complaint - Local Louisiana politicians and bureaucrats. They make his and others work more difficult through incompetence, bureaucracy, and corruption.
I think we can all agree on that! I don't think anyone (well, anyone with a clue) can honestly defend state and city government in this mess.

In other news, my parents just got their trailer last week. No power hookups yet though.