New book about Trump: Con man breaking America

[zinfamous]

It's not at all, you answered it right here. Has no redeeming qualities, but you simply don't care.

"He put babies in cages and the government in women's uteruses--that's what I like and glad he did it."

--greenman

 

[Saylick]

Fact check: Which U.S. presidents led the nation into new wars? | Reuters

Trump managed NOT to start a war, which I was fully expecting him to.

Does he have it in him to start a war, if he returns as POTUS?

He failed in how he handled the "war" on COVID-19.

Who knows how many thousands of deaths could have been prevented if he didn't fuck that one up as bad as he did. He probably would have been reelected too if he just let the experts do the talking and he took a backseat, but noooo, Man Child had to have the spotlight.

 

[MrSquished]

It's not at all, you answered it right here. Has no redeeming qualities, but you simply don't care.

And his 'results' have been horrific for the most part, including the actual undermining of democracy in a major way.

And he likes those things and if Trump ran again in 2024 in a competitive state where Greenman lived, he'd vote for him again. He likes the results by Trump.

This is why I keep calling this turd out for what he is while he pretends to be something else.

 

[ch33zw1z]

He failed in how he handled the "war" on COVID-19.

Who knows how many thousands of deaths could have been prevented if he didn't fuck that one up as bad as he did. He probably would have been reelected too if he just let the experts do the talking and he took a backseat, but noooo, Man Child had to have the spotlight.

he politicized Covid and damn near everything else possible, and if we’re being real here, most conservatives love him for it. They’ve been gaslit for decades to believe that they’re the “real” Americans and USA is being “stolen“ from them. It was only a matter of time before someone like trump came along and capitalized on years and years of hard work by the “burn it down” crowd, who are really just old establishment GOP members that are “patriots”

 

[Greenman]

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!! Yup useful idiot

Pfizer wasn’t part of warp speed project. Woohoo on expiring tax breaks. Sure he got judges done. But he was a lapdog to Moscow Mitch for this.

And this demonstration of near 5th grade communication is supposed to make me feel bad? Shouldn't it have ended with "pwned" and a few exclamation points to really drive home your version of scathing rhetoric?

 

[uclaLabrat]

And this demonstration of near 5th grade communication is supposed to make me feel bad? Shouldn't it have ended with "pwned" and a few exclamation points to really drive home your version of scathing rhetoric?

The idea that youre expecting him to use rational arguments to refute your irrational positions is equally asinine; claiming trump "got results" doesnt seem to be based on empirical evidence, so why should his retort be? Thays a massive double standard.

 

[Greenman]

The idea that youre expecting him to use rational arguments to refute your irrational positions is equally asinine; claiming trump "got results" doesnt seem to be based on empirical evidence, so why should his retort be? Thays a massive double standard.

P&N in a nutshell. Approved positions are accepted at face value, non conforming opinions requires concrete proof that will be dismissed, and almost universally ends with anger and personal attacks. It's exactly the same over at the Q idiots forum, though it takes them a bit longer to work up a good outrage, they seem to be a bit slower about everything over there.

I understand that this is a far left forum and that my opinions will be rejected out of hand, but the anger and resentment are wasted on me. I don't need or seek validation of my opinions, and the same applies to rejection of them.

 

[fskimospy]

P&N in a nutshell. Approved positions are accepted at face value, non conforming opinions requires concrete proof that will be dismissed, and almost universally ends with anger and personal attacks. It's exactly the same over at the Q idiots forum, though it takes them a bit longer to work up a good outrage, they seem to be a bit slower about everything over there.

I understand that this is a far left forum and that my opinions will be rejected out of hand, but the anger and resentment are wasted on me. I don't need or seek validation of my opinions, and the same applies to rejection of them.

Really though, what results did he achieve that you approve of, specifically? I think operation warp speed is genuinely praiseworthy but other than that he was a miserable failure, including the entire rest of his COVID response.

Like seriously it's hard to think of a more disastrous single term presidency in modern history.

 

[ch33zw1z]

And this demonstration of near 5th grade communication is supposed to make me feel bad? Shouldn't it have ended with "pwned" and a few exclamation points to really drive home your version of scathing rhetoric?

haha, votes for trump, complains people on a tech forum are mean.

 

[soundforbjt]

haha, votes for trump, complains people on a tech forum are mean.

He’s got the “victim” act down pat.

 

[ch33zw1z]

He’s got the “victim” act down pat.

It's not about being mean, it's about WHO you're being mean to that counts!

 

[uclaLabrat]

P&N in a nutshell. Approved positions are accepted at face value, non conforming opinions requires concrete proof that will be dismissed, and almost universally ends with anger and personal attacks. It's exactly the same over at the Q idiots forum, though it takes them a bit longer to work up a good outrage, they seem to be a bit slower about everything over there.

I understand that this is a far left forum and that my opinions will be rejected out of hand, but the anger and resentment are wasted on me. I don't need or seek validation of my opinions, and the same applies to rejection of them.

Your positions are dismissed out of hand when they are unsubstantiated by evidence, as should be expected. When you dont support them with data or facts, we're not obligated to take them at face value, period.

Further, when you dismiss opinions that ARE substantiated by evidence, you just show that youre not serious.


In short, look in the mirror dude.

 

[MrSquished]

Really though, what results did he achieve that you approve of, specifically? I think operation warp speed is genuinely praiseworthy but other than that he was a miserable failure, including the entire rest of his COVID response.

Like seriously it's hard to think of a more disastrous single term presidency in modern history.

I hope you are starting to see that Greenman is in no way an actual moderate, he likes what Trump has done to this country, just thinks he is a bit distasteful. He will certainly not stand up to Trump-like policies perpetrated by any GQP politician, policies of any kind, whether they have to do with undermining democracy or anything else. That is a feature to him not a bug.

He likes what Trumpism has done. His words.

He is the enemy.

 

[eelw]

Really though, what results did he achieve that you approve of, specifically? I think operation warp speed is genuinely praiseworthy but other than that he was a miserable failure, including the entire rest of his COVID response.

Like seriously it's hard to think of a more disastrous single term presidency in modern history.

Even though he ignored my disputing the top 3 accomplishments by the orange monkey I already discounted warp speed. Sure it help produce the Moderna and J&J, Pfizer was never part of warp speed. So him willing to basically reduce regulation isn’t really something that should be considered an accomplishment.

 

[fskimospy]

I hope you are starting to see that Greenman is in no way an actual moderate, he likes what Trump has done to this country, just thinks he is a bit distasteful. He will certainly not stand up to Trump-like policies perpetrated by any GQP politician, policies of any kind, whether they have to do with undermining democracy or anything else. That is a feature to him not a bug.

He likes what Trumpism has done. His words.

He is the enemy.

No change in my opinion of him, no.

 

[MrSquished]

No change in my opinion of him, no.

He likes Trump's results. I mean it could not be any clearer. Along with him refusing to answer simple questions that can counter his propaganda. Him just making shit up to defend Trumpism politics.

I mean the writing is on the wall.

But hey, a lot of intellectual Democrats are gonna be surprised when the people they thought weren't that terrible really go along with everything terrible with Trumpism, no matter who the actually GQP leaders are, Trump or not.

You will be surprised like many Germans who never thought that neighbor that seemed kind of reasonable could be a Nazi.

 

[fskimospy]

He likes Trump's results. I mean it could not be any clearer. Along with him refusing to answer simple questions that can counter his propaganda. Him just making shit up to defend Trumpism politics.

I mean the writing is on the wall.

Meh - I think a statement like that is a general approval of Trump's results and doesn't mean he was down with all of it. I do think he refuses to answer simple questions that lead him to places he doesn't like and I think that's annoying, but he's hardly alone in that and I imagine he doesn't want to address them because he (correctly) knows you guys will jump all over any admission.

I'm not saying he's right or you're wrong but it's not exactly the world's most surprising thing.

But hey, a lot of intellectual Democrats are gonna be surprised when the people they thought weren't that terrible really go along with everything terrible with Trumpism, no matter who the actually GQP leaders are, Trump or not.

You will be surprised like many Germans who never thought that neighbor that seemed kind of reasonable could be a Nazi.

No, I just don't see the point. If you want to beat Trump and Trumpism you're going to want the help of people like Greenman.

I don't want to write people like him off precisely because I see the threat that Trumpism represents.

 

[MrSquished]

Meh - I think a statement like that is a general approval of Trump's results and doesn't mean he was down with all of it. I do think he refuses to answer simple questions that lead him to places he doesn't like and I think that's annoying, but he's hardly alone in that and I imagine he doesn't want to address them because he (correctly) knows you guys will jump all over any admission.

I'm not saying he's right or you're wrong but it's not exactly the world's most surprising thing.


No, I just don't see the point. If you want to beat Trump and Trumpism you're going to want the help of people like Greenman.

I don't want to write people like him off precisely because I see the threat that Trumpism represents.

One of Trump's biggest results was undermining democracy and almost overthrowing it - both with the insurrection but even far more via bureaucratic means. Ask him if he understands the threat to democracy Trump's results pose and what are his feelings on what is now one if Trump's biggest accomplishments. Besides that his other biggest accomplishment is probably him literally being such a disgusting man, AND BRINGING THAT OUT IN THE MAJORITY OF THE REPUBLICAN PARTY

Those are Trump's biggest two results. Is he really not down with the biggest results Trump has done?

He'll dance around those questions too Just like he does about the classified documents and a million other issues.

 

[Greenman]

Really though, what results did he achieve that you approve of, specifically? I think operation warp speed is genuinely praiseworthy but other than that he was a miserable failure, including the entire rest of his COVID response.

Like seriously it's hard to think of a more disastrous single term presidency in modern history.

He started to punishing China for dumping products, he greatly slowed illegal immigration, he had a pretty solid goal of energy independence, something that would have really helped us out today (I just put $150 worth of gas in my truck).

I would much prefer a President I could respect, even if I disagreed with them. Trump wasn't that, but neither is Biden. As a nation, we should be able to do a lot better then either of them.

 

[SMOGZINN]

I understand that this is a far left forum and that my opinions will be rejected out of hand, but the anger and resentment are wasted on me. I don't need or seek validation of my opinions, and the same applies to rejection of them.

The sad thing is this is far from a far left forum. This forum tends to the middle of the road politically. You are just so far right you think that the middle is to far to the left. The far left seriously discusses things like banning corporate farms and making making cutting down trees akin to murder. They seriously propose solutions like having a minimum and maximum wage that that are very close to each other (like a 20/hr minimum wage and a 30/hr maximum wage), putting a 100% tax on all wealth over 1 million dollars (and they mean all wealth, not just liquid), and ending all copyright. This forum is mostly hardcore capitalists, old school conservatives, a handful of moderate liberals, with the occasional far left post.

The thing is, you rarely give any support for your opinions. There are some that will dismiss you out of hand because they have already made their mind up, but there are a number of us that will listen and if you have a good argument engage with it in good faith. You just never really put forth a good faith argument. Even when you do put forth some support for your arguments they are almost always trivial to debunk, not just in opinion but factually, like the things you think are facts are actually propaganda that has already been shown to be untrue. That in itself would not be a probably if when shown proof that it misreported you accepted that and either agreed that your support is invalid, or came up with a better argument, but you don't. You either disappear from the argument, or just ignore the evidence that disagrees with you. Then a few weeks later give the same argument offering the same debunked evidence as support.

 

[Fenixgoon]

He started to punishing China for dumping products, he greatly slowed illegal immigration, he had a pretty solid goal of energy independence, something that would have really helped us out today (I just put $150 worth of gas in my truck).

I would much prefer a President I could respect, even if I disagreed with them. Trump wasn't that, but neither is Biden. As a nation, we should be able to do a lot better then either of them.

let's do a point-by-point analysis:

1. the trade war caused a negative economic impact of over $1T and costed hundreds of thousands of jobs. farmers had to be bailed out to the tune of $25B due to products not exported because TPP was torpedoed. some dealmaker.
2. he committed crimes against humanity in doing so. not to mention the whole covid pandemic meant the last year of migrant flow would be low anyway.
3. renewable energy counts for energy independence. what you want to say, but won't, is "supports carbon-polluting industries". even though we could buy out the entire coal industry for a few billion.
3a. your choice of vehicle, unless absolutely needed for your livelihood, is your choice. loving that $150 of freedom?

edit: corrected some figures

 

[MrSquished]

let's do a point-by-point analysis:

1. the trade war caused a negative economic impact of over $1T and costed hundreds of thousands of jobs. farmers had to be bailed out to the tune of $25B due to products not exported because TPP was torpedoed. some dealmaker.
2. he committed crimes against humanity in doing so. not to mention the whole covid pandemic meant the last 2 years of migrant flow would be low anyway.
3. renewable energy counts for energy independence. what you want to say, but won't, is "supports carbon-polluting industries". even though we could buy out the entire coal industry for a few billion.
3a. your choice of vehicle, unless absolutely needed for your livelihood, is your choice. loving that $150 of freedom?

yep. he has zero critical thinking because he loves team GOP and thus has to ignore reality to continue to support them.

Actually he does need a truck for work, he is a contractor, but that still has absolutely nothing to do with Biden. Demand for gas went so low under Trump due to Covid and nothing else. Not only has covid backed off, then you have Russia invading Ukraine, which has raised gas prices all over the world. But to small and dishonest thinkers like Greenman, because he has shown us this time and time again, they just dismiss any actual critical thinking, and thus just give the credit to Trump.

Also to call a president who is so against renewable and alternative energy sources to actually make us energy independent they guy actually FOR energy independence is mind-bogglingly ignorant. This has been brought up before but the willfully ignorant wish to remain that way. And willful ignorance is the best case scenario - in many cases they are just bad hombres.

At this point willful ignorance is basically aiding and abetting the bad hombres. We don't have time to educate the truly willfully ignorant. We need to focus on actual independents who actually might listen to facts and reason.

 

[Fenixgoon]

yep. he has zero critical thinking because he loves team GOP and thus has to ignore reality to continue to support them.

Actually he does need a truck for work, he is a contractor, but that still has absolutely nothing to do with Biden. Demand for gas went so low under Trump due to Covid and nothing else. Not only has covid backed off, then you have Russia invading Ukraine, which has raised gas prices all over the world. But to small and dishonest thinkers like Greenman, because he has shown us this time and time again, they just dismiss any actual critical thinking, and thus just give the credit to Trump.

Also to call a president who is so against renewable and alternative energy sources to actually make us energy independent they guy actually FOR energy independence is mind-bogglingly ignorant. This has been brought up before but the willfully ignorant wish to remain that way. And willful ignorance is the best case scenario - in many cases they are just bad hombres.

At this point willful ignorance is basically aiding and abetting the bad hombres. We don't have time to educate the truly willfully ignorant. We need to focus on actual independents who actually might listen to facts and reason.

shouldn't a contractor be able to write off gas as a business expense?
<-- not an accountant

 

[SMOGZINN]

Seems I posted just a bit too soon in that last post. You at least here show your thought process, and it is not all wrong.

He started to punishing China for dumping products

I agree he was at least trying to do that, but he failed miserably because he does not have a good grasp on how international trade works, and would not listen to anyone that disagreed with him.

I actually support the idea he was going for here, but I can't see that anything was actually accomplished but hurting our own economy at least as much as it hurt China's. And since China is a totalitarian regime it was always going to be less effective against them then us. Simply put China can suffer through more bad times then the US without the people getting pissed off and throwing the leaders out of office.

he greatly slowed illegal immigration

At least he said he did, I don't see any real numbers that would back that up. That is a theme with Trump, he made a lot of claims that he never really produced.

he had a pretty solid goal of energy independence

There is almost no difference in energy independence from the end of Trump's Presidency as there is today.
We have imported oil every year since 1940. We have exported more then we imported every year since 2019, and still export about the same today.
We have exported more energy then we use domestically since 2020, and that number has almost nothing to do with Trump policies since it has been a nearly linear curve leading to that since the around 2010, due mostly to the fracking boom, and has not significantly decreased in the Biden Administration. Overall, Trumps energy policy made almost no impact on America's energy independence, it happened under his administration but was mostly a result of policy made in earlier administrations.
Overall there has been no real significant change in energy independence under Biden, but I think some of Biden's policies could lead to more energy independence in the future, something I can't say for Trump as his policies as they were aimed at propping up old industries and even not really effective at that.

 

[MrSquished]

shouldn't a contractor be able to write off gas as a business expense?
<-- not an accountant

From what I know he should be able to deduct 56 cents per mile which is the standard Federal deduction for independent contractors. So yes, that does include gas and wear and tear.